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WHEN FINE GAEL and Labour came to power in 2011, a referendum on the abolition of the Seanad was one of the cornerstones of their political reform plans.
However, as the front page of the 21 January, 1933 issue of the Irish Press shows, Enda Kenny was not the first political leader to use the abolition of the country’s upper house of parliament as an election pledge.
Eamon De Valera included what the paper described as an ‘outstanding surprise’ in Fianna Fáil’s manifesto for the 1933 General Election.
In the piece, De Valera also promises to reduce the number of TDs from the 153 that were sitting in Dáil Eireann. The Fianna Fáil leader also said that there were no plans to cut the wages of lower- and middle-waged civil servants, as well as pledges to protect home markets and establish businesses in Gaeltacht areas.
The manifesto worked, with Fianna Fáil retaining power, albeit with one seat less than an overall majority.
Seanad reform would not come for another three years, however, when it was abolished in 1936. The modern Seanad was then established under Bunreacht na hÉireann in 1937.
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Reform not abolish!
The corruptness of this FG/Lab crew was shown perfectly by the fact that the HQ’s of the new regional water boards are in Castlebar ( home town of the Taoiseach ) & Kilkenny (home town of the Min for the environment) #parishpumpFG
I find it absolutely amazing…. Regardless of how much ROI changes…. The more ROI stays the same: 1) White collar crimes run amuck with impunity. 2) Government diverting our (property) tax money from our local needs to their needs to bail them out from their collective f@ck-up. 3) Political deals made with the Catholic Church that will allow them from not paying a cent in damages for any past, present or future indiscretions or illegal actions if found guilty. 4) The government unable to introduce proper Travel & Expense policies to politicians and public sector managers. 5) Refuse support means testing programs for welfare recipients….. The list goes on.
It is the people who are suppose to hold the power. Where democracy stands supreme…. However, we are in a place where systems are manipulated so the people are devoid of democracy.
6) Some people still have a problem with blacks & tans.
6) Some people still have a problem with blacks & tans.
6) Sone people have a Black & Tan problem, blaming all our woes on the immigrant population.
Strong glitch
We don’t have a problem with the “Black & Tans, we kicked their as..s. It’s MI5 now that we have the problem with, the perpetrators of the Dublin/Monaghan bombings!
I feel De Velera had an ulterior motive back then, complete power.
Enda is no different. Make no mistake.
Absolutely Kev, this is a power grab .It is also a means to scapegoat the upper house to appease the peoples anger and to distract from the numerous other issues that are crippling our nation. Where did anglo et al go with the senate goings on and the abortion debate??? Distract and divide tactics are in play here…The Senate has its place , many of its senators are worthy people and work well for the people…they don’t make as good news and we are very unlikely to hear anything good about the senate through the media in the coming months. The current leader wants it gone..good enough reason to vote no without any of the other myriad of reasons why it should be reformed and kept.
At the very least we should be asked if we want it reformed. What are FG afraid of.
The ‘out of date’ parties, want to keep the option of picking their own or not have it at all. We are being hoodwinked again, by a party of conmen/women and they cannot be trusted!
The underclasses Kev.
Abolish it. And reduce number of TDs by half. Less government is good government. And before people mention bank regulation, please bear in mind that if the government hadn’t interfered with the banks, they would be gone now and would have been replaced by new functioning banks.
So giving absolute control of a country to 4 people is your plan. Great idea batman. Don’t turn off the light when you leave.
*forget. Silly me. No oversight you see, it’s so easy to make a mistake.
This is what we have now, the Seanad in its current form can only delay legislation and since they are packed with government appointees they seldom do. They seem to be just proof reading legislation and pointing out minor errors, probably something that could be done by committee.
I agree we need more oversight but I think the Seanad is so flawed we may as well put it out of its misery and start again.
I agree we should be given option to reform but if choice is jobs for failed politicians and party hacks or abolish, I will be glad to see the back of the lines of Norris et al
So do I turn the light off or not?
But Kev
the country is being run (into the ground) by 4 people
, Kenny , Noonan,Gimmemore and howlin ,
Joe, That’s why if it was reformed with proper elections it would be fit for purpose.
And if they won’t ask us (their employers) if we want it reformed then only an idiot would vote yes. Imagine haughy or a future version having complete autonomy. Reform is the only option.
John. Ask FG. They’re already doing your thinking for you. #nannystate.
Sean. Your right. And if they won’t ask us to reform it then ill keep voting no till they do. Or a future gov puts it in their manifesto.
If this is abolished : no matter who or what is in Government they will be able to do as they please & won’t be accountable to anyone or thing….REFORM IS NECESSARY & the only answer, otherwise we’ll be living in a “ditactorial + may as well be communist state”.
Is there much of a difference, we are being dictated to and bullied right now!
How are they held accountable as it is? Oh, are Bertie (et. al.) been held accountable?! The Seanad can delay only. They are powerless, so this perceived “balance and checks” is farcical as it is.
No Stephen, we’re being manipulated. There’s a big difference. However note what Lillian remarked in capital letters…
There’s usually a good rule to follow in my opinion – if your politicians are pressing for it, it’s usually something to be wary of and worth considering what it does for them.
FG government as a communist state? Keep talking Lillian and the like. The more I hear people trying to keep the Seanad the more I believe we should get rid of it.
It’s a useless debating chamber.
The bar flies in my local pub have the same power and influence.
Ah you want your leaders to have power and influence? Then no need for democracy. No need for checks in place to limit the damage that politicians (who rely on a popular vote to gain authority) can do once in power. Should have a dictatorship in no time once someone with balls comes along to win hearts and minds… Just give someone with ambition, drive and motivation the reigns and stand well back… (and don’t catch their eye for any reason)…
Only joking – I’m sure we can trust them. They’ve done right by Ireland so far and they haven’t benefitted themselves in any way.
…
and the lies/spin/bulshit go on , and on and on
A Legal challenge to the State’s decision to pay promissory notes can only be brought by a TD, the President of the High Court, Mr Justice Nicholas Kearns has ruled ….A citizen does not have the legal standing to bring such a challenge …if this is setting the tone for future challenges and if the senate is abolished what recourse does an ordinary joe/ josephine soap have to challenge a decision of the Dail…none. All the power will rest with our 160 or so TDs and/or their leader…and people want to get rid of our 60 senators….
We need to keep our Seanad and then have some reform of it.
Why would we want to give absolute power to this or to any other Government? No way!
Once again for the slow children, the Seanad doesn’t have any power and can’t block legislation for more than 90 days.
I’ve received two thumbs down for a factual, non opinion based statement. Hmmm….let’s try another. The earth revolves around the sun. Lol.
Tom, don’t expect much around here.
On the contrary I expect lies and bile from the keyboard warriors…and I love them.
Out of curiosity Tom, are you familiar with the word reform? I don’t think anyone could argue that the Seanad as it stands is worthwhile, being merely a rubber stamping exercise for legislation, and because of the dominance of government appointees, even that is undermined.
Rather than abolishment, and the subsequent total concentration of power in the Dail, surely a Seaned with actual powers of refusal and referral made up wholly of elected members (no appointees) would be preferable.
The source of all the rot in this state is shown in the Irish Press.
Money that Dev stole from the Republican cause while he was hiding in America during the fighting. Used to set up a paper, shares sold to the public but they weren’t told that his family kept ownership with preferential shares.
Stealing from the IRA and the Republic during a time of war is treason that is punishable by death.
Just imagine how better we all would be if the charlatan Dev had been shot up a lane way in 1919, instead of abusing his status and influence.
Well we’d still have dominion status, we would have had to have joined the allied side in ww2, the treaty ports would belong to Britain, and our officials would have to swear an oath to tge King.
But you’d have the big fella Collins in power. An economically astute realist who knew what he was doing!. Not a religiously brainwashed, ideological freak!
The wrong man was assassinated and the wrong man led Ireland for most of the 20th century!
Collins kept a commitment to the IRA in the North and kept shipping guns up to his death. He was more energetic and committed to the Republican cause and indeed development of Irish society that DeValera was. Dev pretty much locked the country in to a rut for 30 years when he had achieved the power he always craved.
are you a guard?????
Bunreacht na hÉireann was written to protect Dev’s political elite the Catholic Church and civil service (which today is still controlled by the FF faithful). Jobs handed down through families and excluded outsiders.
They cannot be fired or retired, no responsibility , no accountability just bonuses and pensions and no sign of reform because…………….it would mean a referendum change the constitution and all that jazz…….politicians throw up their hands and say they can’t do anything….how convenient!
Bunreacht na hÉireann needs to be binned and rewritten in the interests of the people of this country not just the Politicians, Church and Civil service.
In 2 paragraphs you’ve gotten right to the heart of the matter. The tendency in Ireland has always been to immortalise the past, be it 1916, Dev, etc, woe betide he who questions it. Make no mistake, the constitution was drafted in a very different time, by people with their own agendas, which has mainly served to create and establishment which is rotten to its very core. Despite the fact that the system is evidently broke, and infested with precisely the wrong sort of people, nothing is happening to change it. The time for superficial tweaking is past, a rebuild is required from the bottom up.
Dev did not want to partake in 1916 but had to turn out. He was noted for asking him men not to engage with the British forces in firefights.
The man was a waste of space who threw accidents of history and timing managed to be last leader standing.
Funny that… civil service jobs are handed down from mother to daughter… dont think so
we do not elect the seanad! There is no point in having it!
I believe we should move to a swiss model which is real democracy! no elected officials really. there are committees instead. If the people do not like something all it takes to stop it is gather enough signatures and then it goes to a referendum and the people decide. the people hold the power not any goverment.
the people are much happier.
DeV telling lies and exercising complete control (in his own newspaper)?
Well, I never!
I’d like to know the story about the original paper.. bet there’s a good reason someone held onto it
I like the ad for TEA.
Meanwhile the front page carries a depiction of violence against a woman, and no one remarks on it. Different times.
Um. That’s violence against children I think, a little boy. Quite common at the time – whereas braces on girls was not. Sexist I know, but there you go. Sue the cartoonist.
You might be right there, Beige. It looks a lot like some of the Russian cartoons from around the same period, where the women inexplicably carry hammers. A completely different totalitarian regime.
Lol…pity all the keyboard warriors didn’t run for election and get elected.
I take it we’ll see Tom Neville on the next ballot then?
Nah. I’m actually happy with the govt. But I’ve been out there, canvassed in the cold and rain and still do. Others just spew bile on the internet. Very happy to help out bright people and not whingers or those who pretend to have easy answers.
have your say