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ABOUT ONE MILLION people will have to work without pay, hundreds of thousands of others have been placed on temporary, unpaid leave and a multitude of agencies and services will have closed their doors.
On top of all that, rubbish collections will not be completed so piles of trash could start building up.
No wonder people are angry. And that anger could be summed up in this no-holds-barred front page from the New York Daily News.
That caption reads:
House Speaker John Boehner and Tea Party factions he can’t seem to control have nothing on Kevin Spacey’s diabolical ‘House of Cards’ character, as the GOP holds the country hostages.
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Potential FFG voters should take note of this blatant and long term and anti-constitutional disregard for the Irish democratic process.
@Denis McClean: And taxpayers should note the reckless fiscal approach of parties of the “shure someone else will foot the bill for it” loonie left.
@Terry Larkin: ahahaha it’s hilarious you saying that when ff and fg are building the most expensive children’s hospital in the world which won’t even have a helipad
@Terry Larkin: like the EU and FFG cartel saying ah sure we allowed the bankers and their mates spend and borrow and crash the country and set us back socially and economically for decades…….sure them loyal clowns we call supporters will peddle the we all are at fault excuse that will be thrown out and clueless gimps will pay along with future generations for someone else mess……hmmmm sounds familiar to your logic and argument
@The Risen: He is in complete and total denial.
@The Risen: genuine question. do you think these other parties would have stood up to the EU IMF etc?
I think no matter who was in office, the spineless Irish politicians would have accepted the deal and footed the bill.
@Terry Larkin: Yes, It’s the “lefties” that have created “JobPath” – something that has a 93% failure rate at the cost of now €180+ Million Euro of public money.
No wait, it wasn’t the “Lefties”, it was the usual Dail mafia! …But we not to supposed to mention that national scandal either (never mind the law breaking in it and the many abuses)…
@Terry Larkin: Perhaps you and F.G. should take note of the amount of money flowing out of the economy to repay for the gangsterism of the banks and developers facilitated F.F. who now keep in power the blueshirts who only made matters worse.
@Kevin Finnegan: for the record the NCH will have a helipad. The Air Corps aircraft provided to the National Ambulance sercice will be able to land there but the coast guard aircraft will not
https://www.oireachtas.ie/en/debates/question/2019-02-27/101/speech/341/
@Terry Larkin: Reckless fiscal approach? Have you seen how much money was sunk into Irish Water and how much the children’s hospital is costing.
@Aidan: Never mind the €3.5 BILLION Euro of public money being exported out of Ireland this year alone of an EU army – while our own army at home go without or way under funded.
…But we’re not supposed to kop that either or mention it. Yea… it’s easy for FG and their enablers to attack others. They don’t like to look in the mirror.
@Kevin Finnegan: the children’s hospital is not the only hospital being built that is going over budget along with the fact that there are not enough staff it run them with well in excess of a thousand nursing vacancies in the country these white elephants will lye vacant for years without being opened
@Denis McClean: what part of the Constitution is being breached ? The majority voted for a particular group to rule ! The rest go to the other side of the house. Almost no one wants those four head bangers legislating
@Unitedpeople: where you get these facts about 93% failure rate ? God forbid forcing work shy louts actually work for their welfare payments
@Terry Larkin:
Correct, these tds always chasing “ The scrote Vote “ constantly espousing their leftist ussues, Homelessness, Direct Provision, Welfare increases, Vulture funds etc.
Give me strength.
@Christy Dolan: “The majority voted for a particular group to rule !”
Except, FG don’t have a majority. They are a minority government with support from FF. The measures that were being blocked by FG, had majority support in the Dail. It’s a cynical ploy to use this “money message” to block the bills passed by a majority vote.
@Denis McClean: is it not the case that the FF part of FFG are in fact supportive of the opposition motive, or are you so clouded by your biases that you fail to recognise that?
@Terry Larkin: Wow you’re actually deluded.
@Terry Larkin: look at us… we’re Fine Gael and we care for the environment (thanks for the donations lads, keep drilling and fracking for oil).
@Christy Dolan: Don’t think so, 75% of voters did not vote for FG, that’s 3 out of every 4 voters, even less voted for the Independent Alliance, FF and Lowery. How is that a majority?
@Terry Larkin: The left parties weren’t in charge of the country &Ireland is now the 3rd most indepted per capita country in the World!!!!
@Christy Dolan: Those 50 Bills had received majority support in the Dail ,part of the Oireachtas with the Seanad which has a main function passing legislation and the Government is answerable to the Dail.
@Christy Dolan: Clandestine agendas are anathema to any democracy and the FFG ‘Confidence and supply’ ‘arrangement’ negotiated behind closed doors is a prime example. You don’t have a mandate when no-one knows what you are doing …
@Colonel Grant: Amazing you fail to mention the billions that the ordinary people of Ireland were forced to repay which will include our grandchildren who will also have to pay for the gangsterism of the banks and developers. Do not for a second condone social welfare fraud, which is miniscule compared to the economic destruction of this country ..Looney left? Since the foundation of this so called Republic two right-wing parties have governed..look where that has led us too.
If a bill is approved by a majority of our elected TD’s then it is by implication ‘The Will of The People’ ..No?
@Peter lee: Yes. But as we know, FG don’t give a crap about democratic votes in our outside the Dail. One easy example: They completely ignored the JobPath majority passed motion (to curtail it) – and that came via majority Dail representatives of the public.
@Peter lee: have you seen the voting patterns in the Dail , absolutely disgraceful. One that springs to mind is the no confidence vote in Harris , Donnelly (F/F) spent ten minutes criticising him then voted for him, look where we are now.
Ah shuh why would the Government want too save the taxpayers money, it’s not an inconvenience for them or what they earn.
Good to see this case being taken.
@ObsidianShine: Great, The State pays either way and where does the State get the money ? ? ?
Well done,Top of the Class. How much will it cost the Four Amigos, NOTHING, Top of the Class again, and they will probably get traveling expenses for their trip to the Courthouse.
Would hope democracy is answered and the FFG cartel are held accountable..
@Willy Mc Bride: FF are supporting the motion though
So it’s procedure that the Government need to know how much an opposition bill is going to cost & if the Government deem it is too costly then they can block it. I don’t see a problem with that. The alternative would be say populist parties putting up bill’s for free houses for all and damn the expense!
@John McG: it’s not the government that decides, it’s up to Leo (or his advisers) he can block it by just declaring it too costly it’s a rule that has been used multiple times during the last few years to curtail the democratic process. No proof is required to stop the process just Leo’s decision.
@John McG: Better than the Elitist parties sell off public land to a developer so he can make millions in profit.
@John McG: the problem is they use it to also block legislation that isn’t too expensive but does have some financial implications.
@John McG: where are the free houses do tell
@John McG: Only if those TD’s voting for such are the majority. Also they are representing the will of the people who elected them, which would be the majority.
It’s ok that’s they seek a High Court decision because then they know if their claim is constitutional.
@Hans Vos: I think only the Supreme Court can definitively decide upon constitutionality, to which it will no doubt be appealed regardless
@Hans Vos: The judiciary are quick to call foul if anyone mentions the ludicrously lenient sentencing; but are happy to completely trample on the separation of powers when it suits them. The courts have nothing to do with parliamentary procedure just as parliament has nothing to do with judicial procedure.
About time action was taken.
We are paying for it as taxpayers. They get representation allowances which are significant and can be vouched or not. They get more if vouched.
You can be sure its not their own money.
A small bunch of socialists/Trotskyists cant decide to spend public money on pet projects. They all oppose water charges but feel they can decide on laws costing money and recurring expenditure.
Tail wagging dog territory.
@David Glynn: you have no clue what you are waffling about, it’s a constitutional issue so much so,it is their duty to get clarification.
@Michael Sage: Your posting belies your surname if it’s real. Not a lot of wisdom here.
Money Bills involve taxation or expenditure. That’s a Government prerogative.Otherwise chaos.
These TDs are grandstanding at our expense.
Even if their Bills were declassified as money Bills they would still need majority support. Fat chance the Oireachtas will support these clowns none of whom have a track record in any sphere, other than falling out with each other on policy.
@David Glynn: “Even if their Bills were declassified as money Bills they would still need majority support.”
The bills they are talking about got majority support in the Dail, but FG (a minority goverment) blocked them.
@David Glynn: If you can’t see that the Democratic process is being torn to shreds by this C&S agreement says a whole lot more about you than me. If PB4P feel that there is a constitutional issue, they are entitled to seek clarification and by the way it is
@David Glynn: you’re grossely mistaken – not only did these bills get majority support but they dont require public money. The government is only saying they do to block them – undemocratically.
@Shazam37: They do and will. Eviction Bill needs money to police. PRTB cant cope at present. Climate Bill obviously needs funding. Medicinal cannabis Bill requires HSE funding if its to be made available to people on prescription.
@Michael Sage: We’ll see on constitutional issue. Court has already refused to grant an injunction sought.
As to s and c, might I point out that we live in a democracy and these type of agreements and also coalitions are the norm.
These four jackasses refused to accept the law setting up Irish Water and charges despite the fact that it was passed by the Oireachtas and a majority of people paid up.
A la carte democracy for them.
Hope they apologise to the taxpayer when they lose the relief sought in Court. Also to those on boil water notices and for the lies about privatisation. Last time I looked Irish Water was still a State body.
@David Glynn: Minor sums – that’s not what the money message system was designed For.
It’s being used to block legitimate legislation. Which is frankly borderline corrupt.
@Shazam37: How do you know what it was designed for. Nowhere are figures laid down for a money message.
@David Glynn: 1)One of the primary causes of family homelessness is families losing their private rented accommodation.
The following are shocking facts about escalation of families with children experiencing homelessness in Ireland:
:From 2011-2019 there has been a 605% increase in homeless families with children &a 677.7% increased in homeless children in family units!
So it’s important to take emergency measures to prevent homelessness!
2) Ireland will incur fines of €500m+++ if Ireland fails to achieve Climate action targets.
3) Nobody’s health especially children’s health should be comprised due to lack of treatment which is known to be effective!
@Nuala Mc Namara: Forgot to mention re point 3) if patients cant get these meds that will improve their conditions then logically those people/children will need additional healthcare costs.
So these Bills you mention will actually not only give security of tenure,more actions re climate action targets ,improving the health of those people/children that need these drugs but will actually save the State&tax payers money!
@Nuala Mc Namara:
If you ban evictions you need to ban landlords selling up. Solution to homeless problem is to build more houses.
I am all for climate change solutions.
I am all for medicinal cannabis being made available..
But this is not the issue. The Government is in charge of the public purse not a tiny coterie of independents.
@David Glynn: it’s a ridiculous argument David. Completely showing your lack of objectivity. Cursory reading or listening will show you this procedure is being abused to subvert the votes in the Dail.
And your comparison with water charges is daft.
@David Glynn: I agree with you that an obvious solution to the National emergencies in homelessness and housing would be to act urgently to increase social housing stock and affordable housing stock but unfortunately there’s no sence of URGENCY to ADEQUATELY achieve this!
Rising rents are over 34% higher than boom in Dublin and I think 23% higher than boom nationwide…..it’s crazy!
This is a Minority Government supported by FF but these 50 Bills have majority support in the Dail.
@David Glynn: unlike you I do my research,, what the F/G party is doing is unconstitutional ,by the way I am what it says on the tin,but I have more friends than you lol
@Michael Sage: You don’t know whether its constitutional or not. Fact.
But in this debate we will know the outcome when the court decides. Hope you will be posting then.
Delighted to hear you have a lot of friends. Hope they stick with you when you are proven wrong. And if you are right it should topple the Govt.
We’ll see.
@Nuala Mc Namara: In theory yes. But watch FF change tack if money message control is unconstitutional.
The lack of urgency in dealing with the housing problem is disgusting.10,000 homeless people is discounted by politicians in terms of votes. That’s the reality.
@David Glynn: The reality is that the ‘official’ homeless figures are just the tip of the iceberg as Ireland only uses 3 Catergories of ETHOS typology out of 13 Catergories of ETHOS typology!
@Nuala Mc Namara: This is the Sinn Fein argument to defend their participation in Stormont.
I accept that the real figure of people without their own home is a multiple. Say ten times.
Still does not get over the fact that demonising landlords is the solution or part of.
I am a reluctant landlord. Once the tenants get beyond 6 months they can stay for 6 years. I have to sell to get them out. They can pay a small portion of rent and the judge will say they are trying.
Ptsb are useless for decent landlords.
Insurance, maintenance, management ,service charges, tax , usc and property tax plus paying the mortgage means it costs me money every month.
Cant wait to exit.
@David Glynn: So sell the property. Another home in the market to be bought. This notion that landlords have it hard at a time when rents are the highest they’ve ever been and homelessness is a record breaking – you appreciate why the general public find this hard to swallow?
People supoorting the usage of the money message – and opposing the court motion – in these comments are missing the point. Yes, the constitution gives the executive the right to veto bills which involve “the appropriation of state funds”. What the current minority government is doing, however, is using a ridiculous interpretation of that constitutional provision to suggest that any bill which might have an *indirect* cost to the state, also requires a money message. For example, creating a new criminal offense – because it might result in more people going to jail and thus more funding being required. Or, in a current and relevant stalled bill, that boycotting goods from the Occupied Territories in Palestine *could* result in trade issues with the United States or with FDI from US based companies, and ergo *could* result in a loss of exchequer funding.
This is clearly a massive stretch and is simply being used by the government to block bills they don’t ideologically agree with. And that’s why everyone, left or right, should be supporting the move to put an end to this clear and obvious abuse of power through dodgy interpretations of well-intentioned consititutional provisions.
@Patrick FitzGerald: that sir is it in a nutshell BRAVO
@Patrick FitzGerald: Would you drive a car without brakes, methinks you would.
@James Keogh: I honestly have no idea what you’re trying to analogise with this remark? If you’re implying that preventing the Oireachtas from legislating through extremely dodgy interpretations of the constitution is some kind of necessary ‘safety measure’, I would suggest that you are simply somebody who does not believe in representative democracy.
the sooner we bring in first past the post in elections .the sooner we get rid off them attention seeking fools out off the dail.whos going to pay for these court cases.i bet dare not.
@John Gleeson: how’s that going in the UK?
Remember the sugar tax ….. what happens to that money ?… is leo just renovating with it ???
Cause from what I can see FAT kids are still fat
I blame the cyclists
have your say