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NEW FIGURES FROM the Central Statistics Office have confirmed what has become apparent in recent months – property prices are rising again in parts of the country.
Demand is increasing in places like Dublin – where prices are up a massive 12 per cent compared to last year – as the number of houses for sale remains low.
So today we’re asking: what do you think about house prices rising?
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Why don’t journalists publish the volume of houses these figures are based on
The media had a lot of questions to answer for their part in the property boom, it seems as if they havent learned their lesson
My thoughts are that its all based on BS, thats why “real” figures cannot be obtained. Powerful vested interests are, once again,fiddling figures to try and create a buying frenzy from those waiting for the bottoming out of the market.
Exactly, just like they are cooking the dole figures and the suicide figures in the country.
All to keep the population out of the loop and off the streets
Correct.
It should be known that this site is owned by the same people who own let.ie, rent.ie, property.ie and Daft.ie.
You can draw your own conclusions from that.
Good question.. Also, the Daft Property Price Register should have “Date” search parameters to allow for exactly this type of question. It would make it much more useful and allow trend analysis by location.
Property price rise = more property tax so even if your in negative equality it’s a double edge sword
The tax is fixed for 4 years.
Have we, as a nation learned nothing!
Is it “fixed” the same way the low emissions car tax was “fixed” Matt.
Quick quick get on the property ladder. You can’t go wrong with bricks and mortar!
A lot of these houses being bought by investors with cash. There is no mad flow of credit from the banks like before.
I need a 1000% percent mortgage with sprinkles on top please Mr Bank manager… No problem pal… Just repay us over 199 years @ 2grand a month and you’ll be grand…. I stack shelves in tesco on job bridge so is that alright? … Not to worry bud.. We’ll just add another 30 years onto your repayments…. Just sign here…!
Ashley that’s not far from what happened but people still signed…..but it’s still everyone else’s fault!!
Pyrite houses, hmm sinking walls and flood plains, houses with ‘unpredictable’ neighbours….houses on ghost estates worth getting into more debt for!
Go through a mortgage broker Ashley
He will get you a far “better” deal than that.
But beware!!!
If you can’t pay the reckless mortgage that he sold you,
he is likely to take to the media and proclaim that you are an
“non cooperative borrower”
or a
“strategic defaulter”
and that you get everything you deserve.
Like Karl Deeter on Pravda/RTE?
Careful Brian.
Deeter writes for the Mein Journal.
Ok i’m only going to post this once. Listen to me people of ireland. House prices will never, i repeat NEVER, return to the highs of the celtic tiger. It is economically IMPOSSIBLE. For a peripheral island with a small population of semi skilled workers with an average salary of 30k, the MOST an average house should cost is 120k (in a commercial hub) . Anything more than that is inflated. End this obsession with mortgages now.
Well said.
Fact!
People are climbing over each other every weekend at open viewings for 3 bed semi family homes in Dublin with bidding wars getting out of control! These types of houses could get back to the boom time prices but forget about the likes of the 1 bed apartment in Longford which were going for 200k!
Bidding with money they dont have for an overpriced house they cant afford.
Wrong steve. That is exactly what will happen. Fact. Your price range is so undervalued you clearly have no clue. You could not even build one yourself on your parents land for that money never mind in a HUB. CHAPEST PRICE TO BUILD PER SQ METER IS 100 EURO FOR ANYTHING DECENT. it’s not an obsession to want control over where you live. Renter can be refused new contracts etc.
Check out the property price register Steve
@ Jason “bought for an apple or maybe a euro” Take a bow sir – brilliant!
Correct Steve.
@ Sacha Compared to other western european countries that use REAL fundamentals (not spin) to value their houses, Irish houses are still very much artificially overinflated.
Wait for the mortgage default Tsunami. Then you’ll be able to pick up a decent 3 bed semi, anywhere you like, for 75k.
Nail on head Steve.Its a false surge at d moment due to the shortage of properties..and there is a shortage as there is yet to be large scale repossessions.Once the government gives the banks free reign to repossess then there will be lots of properties on the market and prices will drop again
Capital cities. Real fundamentals. Like where. Edinburgh. London. Paris. Madrid. To name but a tiny few. This country is so different anyway. What percentage of population live in this city. It’s way higher than 12% like most western countries.
Steve. Come on. Are you really that naive. 75k. Anywhere. I think I’m leaving this with you here. This is a wind up now. I can only agree with a repossession tsunami. But that’s about it. You are wrong. Very wrong. But as always. Only time will tell.
well said steve the more they talk about house prices going up the more fear you can sense ,
Wrong Steve. My father bought a 4 bed semi in dublin in 1971 for 7775 pounds. The price of a pint and a gallon of petrol was pennies in those days..
My point being that prices dont remain the same over the long term. House prices will match and exceed celtic tiger values at some point in the future. By then a pint of beer will probably cost €15.
“some point in the future”
Hmmm
Yep.. i was replying to steve. He seems to think we live in a groundhog day world where house prices stay the same and NEVER increase EVER. despite the fact history would prove otherwise
http://www.thepropertypin.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=2631&start=15
b-b-b-but B–b-bertie said talking down the market was bad and we should go and commit Suicide:
Did your Dads house really increase in value Frank.
Or did inflation increase its price and the price of everything else?
@ Sacha.
Edinburgh, London, Paris, Madrid.
Uk, France, Spain.
100′s of functioning banks.
Multi Generational Economies.
Multi generational regulated property markets.
1000′s of Billions in savings and eternal international appeal.
Etc
Vs
Dublin
Ireland
10 banks, the native ones bust, the foreign ones receiving billions in bailouts from their parent bank.
Economy consists of a few foreign companies using the place as a tax haven.
Craps shoot, snake oil “property market” with no/unenforced regulations.
A 100 billion (if that) of scared vulnerable diminishing savings heading for places like Edinburgh, London, Paris, Madrid on a daily basis.
If you
agree with the repo tsunami then why is steve wrong? You think that this won’t affect supply?
Ask yourself this question – if the price rises are because of the low supply in a capital city where all the jobs are and where a large chunk of the population is – why are they not building more?
Building more where in the capital city. Is there loads of land left here to build on that I have not seen. But when they do build it will hardly keep up with the population growth so no actual impact on supply/demand. Just so everyone is sure with my point it is this. Apts will take twice as long to come back to tiger levels but they will. Good quality houses in good areas close to good schools shops and transport will always do well. Even 3 years ago they were selling. The law of buying property ‘location location will always be apply. To suggest you can buy a 3 bed for 75k is a complete joke. Yes it will get nasty if you don’t pay your mortgage but what do people expect. Take a loan and pay it back. Simple. If you can’t pay you loose it. That’s it. Why is it nasty. And all the talk about a bubble. It’s gone up 12 %from a 54% drop. Get over yourself. Bubble. That’s a blip.
Average prices fell by over 50% – in order to get “back” to what they were in 2006 this will mean a 100% increase in house prices.
The average national house price is back to about 1999/2000, it took six years of a boom then a bubble for them to get to 2006 prices.
In the 90′s we had rising incomes, falling taxes, falling unemployment, cheap available credit, multiple tax incentives to buy property and falling interest rates
Realistically looking into the next 5 years we see rising property taxes, water charges, static or falling income, little or no change in unemployment (or the cost of it) rising interest rates, rising taxes, restricted/expensive credit.
Population growth? Babies don’t buy property do they?
The “blip” was the bubble which peaked in 2006. House prices will eventually increase – but first
the arrears crisis has to wash through the system,
Only then will we see a normal functioning property market.
Your argument is mute now. Besides it sounds like its straight out of economics 101. Population growth is not a new or Irish phenomenon. It’s been happening about well let’s think. The whole of human evolution. Except for Japan which is in decline. So save for one. Every countries population is increasing. And has been for ever essentially. Of course interest rates are going to go up. .5% is practically zero. Taxes always go up. Always will. Do you think landlords will not pass that on to renters. No one can hide from it.
“Population growth is not a new or Irish phenomenon.”
Who said it was? You did say though that when they start building that it still won’t meet the demand because of population growth – I asked you whether babies buy houses?
The demographic we need to buy houses have left or are in the process of leaving the country – those in the 20′s and 30′s. So your assertion here that population growth = demand for property is ridiculous.
“Of course interest rates are going to go up. .5% is practically zero.”
And the consequence of rises to those only managing to repay their mortgages because of trackers?
“Taxes always go up”
No they don’t. They fell for years here and this added fuel to the fire.
“Do you think landlords will not pass that on to renters.”
And these renters aren’t affected by falling incomes and higher taxes/costs of living? Landlords can and are trying but there is only so much renters can give and then remember they can always move.
It said on the news last night that mortgage lending was the lowest since 1971.
There are 39,000 properties who are in arrears of more than two years.
How about some journalism on the massive supply constriction, instead of articles that wouldnt be amiss in a comic book.
Lack of repossessions of those 39,000 help create this new bubble.
Lack of REAL insolvency legislation to allow these 39,000 Irish families to move on and contribute to the economy again is a bigger issue Joey.
Your property tax will now go up.
Ta-dah! The reason in a nutshell, Alan!
It will certainly help the emigration of the youth.
The only thing stopping most from leaving now is the money to do so!
I suggest a new poll.
Do you think that the journal continually hyping up property prices is
(1) A good thing
(2) A bad thing
(3) I’m not sure/ it depends (on a myriad of unknown unquantifiable variables)
OMG just everyone go out and by a house in Dublin !
Its where its at ! !
I just drove past a house and 25 people were queuing up to visit it. Get in now before its too late !!!
Yours sincerely,
Anonymous financially insolvent estate agent
It’s helping thousands of people come out of negative equity and will help NAMA (taxpayers) and bank balance sheets also.
May God help you Tom.
The only people who benefit are the banks – we have already bust ourselves bailing them out once and now we want to crucify future buyers by forcing them to borrow more money for over inflated property in a highly manipulated property market – well done us!!
its a fake market an we havnt had the “blood in the streets” yet , get back to me when Nama are run out of town and the bank forecloses on all defaulters and interest rates go up to 6% or 8%
Silver harp. We are not in control of our interest rates. 39000 you say is a mere blip on a screen as far as Europe goes. As is 90000. And Nama run out of town. Ha. !!! Ha ha. That’s funny. Who will run them. They are the only show in town. Who do you think is selling 50% of the properties. The higher the property value the higher recouped by Nama. And it’s a huge volume of foreign investment buying propert this time. Not part time workers renting out bedrooms.
Its going to get very nasty in the few years, the bond market is going to run everyone out of town when they refuse to lend to dodgy European states and will not lend a cent to banks in those dodgy countries , or the banks implode when all their dodgy “assets” collapse in value. Every 1% rise in interest rates knocks ~7% of asset values. The ECB will not be able to keep their rates low if nobody else in the market believes them.
“it’s a huge volume of foreign investment buying propert this time.”
Hmm…who they are hoping to let or sell these properties to?
Germany are in control of our interest rates. They want their savers to benefit and they will insist on rates rising in the future.
FTB’s are given a “property tax\” holiday until 2016. So people buying homes today at 3% (example) will find themselves in 3 years time looking at higher interest rates and a property tax.
Silver Harp is on the money – it’ is going to get very nasty in the next few years. I wouldn’t touch property in this country because it is toxic.
Previously (before bubble) when you bought a home as the years progressed the price of the asset increased while the debt on it decreased.
We are going the opposite way now, the debt is increasing while the asset will fall or stay static.
The only way to counter this is massive income increases – that is not going to happen.
Anyone who thinks that high house prices are a good thing for society is sadly deluded.
Here’s what the so-called expertswer saying before the crash:http://www.thepropertypin.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=2631&start=15
Of course the poll is leaning on “it’s a bad thing”!! This f**king country doesn’t know how to see positives and embrace them. Im sick of this place, people are too miserable and do nothing but complain about EVERYTHING but do nothing about it.
I’m sure you were explaining to all of us alongside Bertie Ahern, the positives of house prices throughout the “boom” (bubble).
Anyway, where is the volume of the houses being sold? What about the amount of cash buyers? Is it the top end of the market that is pushing prices up? Quality of houses, supply is an issue in Dublin – yes but I would rather all the facts displayed instead of the usual lazy standard we now expect from our media – a 12% increase. Slow clap.
Don’t be like that my friend.
I am very positive on the fact that Irish property prices are still overvalued and falsely overinflated.
I’ll (positively) pass thank you.
Irony ?
You are moaning. Ironic isn’t it/
False bubble IMO. Cash buyers and housing shortage to blame. We’ll see it come back down in 24 months when TRS is done.
Amen
And when the interest rates go up.
And when 142 thousand homes are repossessed. http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2013071000047
And the water charges come in.
And the property tax is increased.
And capital gains tax is increased.
I don’t see any increase in prices in the south east. I have seen flats sold for 30K and 3 bed houses sold for 80K even though the estate agent list price was much higher. Reality vs the estate agent
It’s all about Dublin. Demand for the city is high. Prices in the rest of the country will continue to fall.
Agreed. I know people earning 21k in Dublin and they are finding it hard to afford the rent. More affordable rental property is needed to meet the lower paid or else they will slip back into the welfare trap.
The paddy obsession with owning a gaff rears its head again. Will he/she learn what happened only a few years ago?
Probably not. “Ah sure it won’t happen this time”
Christine Bohan to be honest you should actually show some proof of your findings before you write utter spoof, tbh I could do a better job than you if you call that journalism, where are your facts? Your poll doesn’t agree with you? Your story is utter Shiite
And that it is Tom, pure spoof..and utter spin.
So is it fair to assume those voting “it’s a bad thing” were delighted with the property crash?
Yes.
If you want to buy some essential shelter to house your family.
Wouldn’t you prefer if it were cheaper (and the price of it had crashed)?
The many, many people who already owned property 5 years ago certainly weren’t happy to see the values of their homes plummet.
What the banks did during the boom was criminal,
Is allowing them to reoffend going to solve the problem?
Really ? I thinks it’s all hyped up and it’s certain people all the time !
What is with the Irish obsession with buying property? Here we go again lads the party is back on.
It’s not a good or a bad thing, it is exactly what was planned. So now the new property that the rich people bought will go up in value and the rich will be even richer. A well orchestrated smash and grab. Falsely inflate the market to give the illusion that what we own is worth more then it is actually worth. Crash the market. Buy up all the cheap property that comes available. Allow the economy to stabilise and now the rich control more money and power then ever did before. Consolidation of power to the ruling class and their money masters. And we went along with it. The only way to fix our world is to open our eyes, educate ourselves and take back what is ours from the people who have brought us to this place in life. And that will be an epic fight, but a fight worth fighting. So house prices going up looks good from the general public who believe ever word the government tell them but it’s not gonna change anything except the price of rent.
jesus thats a depressing post, true nonetheless.
Like most other posters I’m amazed at the coverage of this. I read a respected economist yesterday stating ‘he is glad that there is now a recovery in the housing market’.
It is anything but, in fact it’s a perfect storm. Firstly, it is Dublin (and surrounds) only. Secondly there is a chronic shortage of properties in Dublin, to buy or to let, hence the basic rule of demand & supply applies.
The reason prices are going up is because of that shortage, not because of a ‘recovery’. For the past two years there has been a huge amount of cash purchases by investors, that has nothing to do with a recovery – again investors take property from home buyers and that is not good for the economy.
Recovery? The residential property construction activity index is still static, as is the number of planning applications. The lead time from planning to ownership is a minimum of two years, so there is no end to this shortage in sight.
On top of that, there is no cadre of developers left (with access to funds) to build the houses we need for new entrants to the market, or for those trading up or down.
And the banks have sat on the troubled mortgages issue and therefore don’t have the mortgage cash to lend. In a perverse way that is a good thing – if there was access to funds the demand would be much higher and would raise prices further.
This is not new – see article from last May – http://www.propertyforpeople.ie/article.html/id/3693031770
The only thing that is certain is that the government needs to take action to ensure that our citizens have access to a home purchase and not be forced to pay inflated prices or to suffer the hardships of a long commute.
We’ve had enough of that.
This is another load of Bull Poll,
It’s about time that house prices started to go up,
It’s not realistic to be able to buy a house for less than the cost of the materials to build it
Do you want to buy some building materials Pat?
Most houses for sale were built years ago so it is of no consequence whatsoever of how much they cost to build. In fact, many of the dumps for sale need more spending on them than what they cost to build.
Why can’t there be a move to long term leases and more stability for families renting? The Government own a huge amount of empty houses and apartments. Why not get hard working people into them on long term leases with a view to owning them sometime in the future?
I’m rich !! Riches beyond my wildest dreams !!
I have a one bedroom shed going for €300k – castleknock region – get bidding now – I even put on a new roof recently – lovely view of the wall and where I put the dustbins !!
As long as the government reigns in any over heating of the property market them it might be ok. If Dublin house prices rise the hope would be that the rest of the country will follow and people in the misery of negative equity might see some relief.
I don’t care what my house is worth.
I bought it to live in.
All well and good for you Gathering but for people who bought a house that they now can’t afford and the house is no longer worth anywhere near what they paid for it they have no chance. If house prices were to start to increase it might give people a chance to sell the houses they can no longer afford and get out of this poverty trap they’re caught in.
@Ted
So you are saying that houses prices should be artificially overinflated again to solve the problem.
Artificial overinflation of prices was the problem Ted.
Banks stupidly recklessly over-lent
maybe its time the wrote down their ponzi mortgages and allow things to move on.
The banks are currently in the process of selling their distressed mortgage loanbooks to foreign vulture investors.
Why wouldn’t they cut a deal for the Irish people who bailed them out instead?
They are offering their distressed mortgage books for cents in the Euro/ a fraction of their previous value.
What’s wrong with selling them to the people who live in these distressed homes, namely the people who paid the mortgages for many years when they could??
So Ted, when you’re in a hole you shouldn’t stop digging, you should just dig upwards?
That’s the spirit gathering. “I don’t care”. True colours shining through. The me feinn brigade from the very people who expect expect expect. I’m alright jack so sod off. You will care when circumstances change and you need to move or get a loan and the bank says. Eh eh. No. Your in negative equity so you don’t qualify for nothing. Then you go looking from sympathy but guess what. The me feinn brigade don’t sell that elixir. No sir. Not a drop.
I’m sorry Sacha but aren’t Banks supposed to be regulated, conservative, secure entities where you can safely store your hard earned savings and get the occasional modest loan.
Not property manipulators that destroy economies and sentence generations to debt slavery.
Our local (very solvent) credit union which is ran by volunteers will do me fine thank you.
Or am I missing something?
we are on our way for another crash if prices keep going up,a lot of house purchase customers are very greedy and will not pay any attention to the asking price or maybe go for a less expensive house lots of them just like to keep up with the trend
Your right Alan. Not even out of the last crash and heading straight for another. Of course your right. It’s just a matter of time. I will give this predicting a go. Here it is. It will rain again. Probably this week. Tax will rise. Probably every year. It will get cold in January. Some politicians will get caught lying. The rest will get away with it. House prices will continue to rise. Until they start to fall. Kids will knock on my door tomorrow night looking for sweets and when they do I will try to frighten the life out of them then give them sweets until the next batch arrive. And do it over again. And again. Much like boom bust boom. It’s cyclical. That’s it. Cyclical.
Yes Sacha just when and where is it going to stop
Is what going to stop. People buying houses. People speculating. Trying to better themselves. Greed. Hunger desire. It’s a serious question though. When is what going to stop.
Rent is dead moeny. Your mad if u don’t get onto the property ladder bla bla bla. Let it all begin again. Shur ,what can go wrong?
The problem is that there aren’t enough family homes being built, nobody want to raise a family in an apartment, so there will always be a demand for semi d.
Sell, Sell, Sell………….
I have never understood the logic behind paying for an address rather than a building as in buying rubbish in D16 when the same money buys quality in D14 and so on for other cities and locations.
Here you go if address is not too important but price Is. 314 Larkin Drive, O’ Malley Park, Co. Limerick
Second-Hand Dwelling house /Apartment
€10,000
on 16 Nov 2012
Its a good thing if you’re looking to sell.
Its a bad thing if you’re looking to buy.
Im not doing either so im not sure.
Rise on because I certainly won’t be buying or offering any of those silly asking prices anyway, the day I do commit to buy I will be making the most insulting offers, to knock these vendors who have been brainwashed by auctioneers back to reality
Not a good poll question, your answer obviously depends on your personal position. If you’re selling or in negative equity you want the price to increase, and vice versa if buying. The poll results do not really tell us anything.
Hence the large proportion of “it depends” answers.
But the question was only asked to excite debate and increase circulation. Not to lead to inform or any such noble motive
@christine bohan – would you care to show further figures into claims the prices are rising. As a journalist maybe contact CSO and ask what the figures are based on. Although considering estate agents generally control sales prices is that not a conflict to a stable market. And would that not skew the figures
I was viewing houses and apartments in Dublin over the last year. I couldn’t get over the amount of people coming to these viewings.
There was a house in D8 advertised for €195,000 but by the time I went to view it, a week after coming on the market, there was an offer for €270,000 with six under bidders. (3 bed semi. 1930′s former corporation house) Hoards of people at every viewing.
Sort out the rent prices while there so high investors will swallow up all dublin homes an let them out to them pay for them selfs
Could have been a good thing if it was genuine, but for a variety of reasons covered in this comments section, it is yet another parlour trick that will fool few but the naive. Given the bubble we created in property through excessive levels of easy credit, property prices must crash, not just correct. At the moment we haven’t yet even reached a point of correction, so the idea that we would already be entering a recovery is ridiculous. Someday we will have a government and senior civil service who know that they are beholden to economic principles, and no amount of massaging figures and cheap parlour tricks will allow them to avoid the economic realities we all face. Pretty sure next week’s vote on cannabis legalisation will serve as yet another indicator that we are still a long way from that point though unfortunately.
If there is a rise in house prices it is only in Dublin..the rest of the country has had a massive decrease in prices…even beyond what houses are actually worth. Again if true we are creating a two tier Ireland again. House prices and rentals are again overpriced in Dublin where a lot of people need to live for work. The rest of the country has undervalued houses…Mostly investors buying in Dublin
It’s about time too many he’s in negative equity, which in turn is holding people from moving on. Anyway at this point houses prices have gone to the opposite end of the spectrum Too Low
What happens when this balloon bursts?
it must be a fake recovery in the housing market, because it doesn’t make any sense – the true reality could be masked by gambling speculators or/and inflation… I mean, who has the money to buy new houses? If it’s not the ordinary public, it must be someone else driving the prices up (10% is a huge jump)
If all the said information is true, the banks would be making deals with home owner with mortgage arrears so they can sell these houses rather than not getting any money. Until the mortgage arrears/repossessions are tackled the housing market would not stabilise.
For crying out loud, stop talking up the housing market. This is the same bs that preceded the feeding frenzy at the start of the previous decade.
1- unless we havent learned any lessons, this should not be something we are fixated on
2- house prices or the creation of a house price rise myth by the media can only be good for property tax revenues..thus I am extremely suspicious of these reports
Their at it again. Greed. false ratings. False everything.
It just increases the amount I pay in property tax
This does indicate a change in people somewhat choosing, or more realistically requiring, the need to live an urban area over rural/suburban areas like before. The issue is that the city councillors will never allow the densification on the inner canal areas to allow more people to live inter city, which is rules out the opportunity to achieve the critical mass needed to improve the economy.
Is this how ireland became broke with the banks lending on properties over priced and people thinking they had a job for life only to join the dole lines
Who would want to buy an over estimated home only to be refused a mortgage and pay higher property taxes.who are people who put up the prices of these house in crime capital.:-Q
Mortar invented in 1794 by Joseph Aspdin.
Sand cement and water … NO PLATINUM in it!
…. will the Irish ever learn?
Ahh cr@p neauvile. May as well throw away my platinum detector now. More money wasted on amazon. Damn amazon.
Like everything else in life it will profit some people, while others say we need higher prices like a hole in the head.
Another false boom……….be careful what you wish for !! Your property tax is about to go through the roof if you own a house in Dublin…
have your say