The main point is the proposal to reduce salaries. The headline is a silly quote that seems to be grabbing peoples attention on this thread. Well done pearse on the issue

I suppose he has a point – we don’t attract talent to the Dail anyway despite the high wages, rediculously long holidays, pensions, teachers pay etc – so why don’t we bring the wages down so it attracts those that are patriotic and servants to the state?

Perhaps a more relevant point is not the purchase of cars or holidays, but how many TDs were/are invested in the property bubble. Or how many have private business interests which the office & hours of a TD can easily facilitate or even give advantage to.

Add to this of course the very lucrative pensions for TDs and especially ministers and they can near all expect to retire early and live off their accumulated wealth, not their labour.

By definition, the majority in society cannot do this (no one to do the work!) and also by definition this places TDs and Ministers’ own financial interests quite opposite to those of the majority citizens they purport to represent.

I say ‘purport’ because what we have seen, when put to a clear test in the economic mess of the last 5 years, is that these so called ‘representatives’ of the public interest have done little but side with their fellow travellers in the top few percent club.

This is at the heart of why there has been no accountability & why absolutely nothing has been done to prevent the slow train wreck being led by Greece, followed by Portugal, Spain, etc. (Ireland firmly attached behind) from continuing.

Why is it there is no difference in policies offered by all the main parties, FF, FG & Labour?

Because there is no personal incentive for any of them to take an innovative position or combative stance toward the ruinous (austerity) policies coming from the EU Commission & ECB.

In fact, as every situation that demands new thinking, following what is the systemic failure of decades of economics & public policy thinking, the system itself works against any such innovation.

The bigger the systemic failure, the less incentive for any of the incumbent institutions – all themselves well insulated from personal consequences – to change anything.

This is exactly what we are seeing. The (banking failure) Nyberg report’s ‘Groupthink’ continues uncontested in the mainstream public discourse. On the part of TDs, that is no accident.

Regardless of SF’s perceived ‘baggage’, their position on TDs salaries (with reduced pensions to match), is exactly the right way to go to change mainstream politicians response to this whole & ongoing crisis.

Their personal financial interests need to be aligned with those of the majority they are supposed to represent, not the top few percent elites who are also responsible for the mess itself and the economics deception under pinning it.

Lets see a P60 and put this average industrial wage nonsense to bed.

Yes please – sources thx

@DesBod: …allowed to “peddle” this nonsense.

The average industrial myth was exposed on Vincent Browne last month by a FF TD.

Des in my constituency of Dublin South West, despite having three out of four government TD’s and two ministers, Sinn Fein is the only party to open a fulltime constituency office in the area. The staffing of this is paid for from the TD’s wages. It deals with dozens of constituency based casses a week, it is actually overwhelmed with issues at the minute. Now this is a choice, people can spend thier wages how they see fit. One of my TD’s spends his salary this way, no idea what the two ministers do with thier €170k.

@Desbod, you are “sick of this”? Our country has been driven in to the worst Economic depression since the thirties, when a party propose change for the benefit of us all they are ostracised and condemned for proposing that change. Jesus Christ what is wrong with ye people? You are so entrenched with hatred that has been imbedded with propaganda into your sponge brains for decades by those that have brought our Economy to its knees and many of our people to point that suicide was their only way out! Your sick!

……You’re sick

imagine having a dislike of a party that spent most of the last century more concerned with murder , bombings and other illegal activity outside of the the south of ireland . now they come along after years of inaction in the south of ireland expecting people to fall at there feet with joy because they consider themselves as the saviours of us !! most people don’t have memories as short as the brain washed SF supporter

Eeeeh theres an office allowance in tds expenses so it’s not all coming from their own pocket! Constitutency offices arent just a sf thing either so come off the high horse of being the only servant of the people!

Regarding the actual pay of tds SF are just as expensive as every other party or non party and claim full wage and least we forget aegnus o’snodaighs printing farce. All of which is available for those who would actually like to get the truth on the oireachtas website

€50,000 on ink cartridges in 2yrs !! If this was any other party Pearce and Mary Lou would be balling like banshees about it , seen as it SF the shinner bots accept it’s ok ..

Gordon, you do realise the real scandal is the price per unit that public service departments are paying per unit for printer conumables, don’t you?? I’d love to know how much the owners of the suppliers in question stuffed into FFs coffers prior to being awarded the contract.

Pearse receives this money but rather that buy new car, holidays or shares he and Sinn Fein employ 2 people in his constituency for the betterment of the electorate in that area.

@brendan are you claiming that your local SF office pay for their staff out of their own wages and for a FACT are NOT using the allowance available to hire these people like all parties.

SF are no better than the rest, they claim max everything. They believe their own bull sh!t with their massaged figures. They probably had genuine intentions at the start but power has corrupted them!

I am stating this for an absolute fact. The allowance for running an office is €13.k and cannot be used to employ staff, instead this is used to pay rent, electricity, insurance etc. What most TD’s do is they have a part-time office that is manned at the weekend by the TD or his Dail PA, although as I have said in my area only one out of four has opened any kind of office.
So to recap Sinn Fein TD’s run full-time offices and these are paid as above with €13.k used for rent and other expenses (which is a challenge in Dublin), then the TD’s own wages are used to pay salary which would usually be about €20.k or more, it can’t be done unless you do it this way or drag the PA away from LH which might be an option for Govt backbenchers but not for SF TD’s who are all covering a portfolio.

so deflect away from the fact he took / spent €50,000 worth of cartridges by mud slinging at FF by alledging there was a back hander for this contract ?? any concrete proof of this or are you mud slinging to deflect away from the original point made of 1 SF TD using 50,000 worth of tax payers money on INK !!!

surely Pearces expenses for running his constituency office shud be used to cover this cost ? and where the 2 people in question paying tax on the monies paid to them , Is this SF cronyism ??

Nah he pays them with money his mates give him and what he wins on the horses LOL!

hahaha or money extorted from some businessman ;)

I think it would be more honest to say that he is employing them to help him get re-elected and not for the betterment of the electorate. Also is he suggesting that he has no car and never goes anywhere? I think not.

Maybe I am wrong but did fianna fail and fianna gaol not originate from sinn fein? Develara and collins for example two men who would never put a gun in their hands.

Bobby you’re delusional. If SF were in government and kept to all the promise they’ve made eg no cuts to education, civil service pay, roads budget, health, social welfare ect and no increase to tax for the average joe we’d be driven into the worst economic disaster ever witnessed in the history of the planet! Wake up! I’d rather have someone tell me that the proverbial has hit the fan and that they can realistically fix it but we’ll all have to take a hit. Not try to fill me with utter hogwash and populist spin.

Also lets not forget the new car that Pearse himself tried to peddle off to expenses and the fuel expenses that would have had him driving from Donegal to Dublin and back more often than the house and committees were even in session… Yeah they’re all real pillars of accountability.

I live in his area AND he gets expenses to cover the price of his office. His choosing to employ 2 staff was also part of his expenses row last year. Also all of the other 5 TDs in Donegal employ at least 2 staff on a full time basis as do most other TDs in general so that point is moot.

97 yrs ago … This is modern times :)

@Jason Bourne. “They take the full salary, and in Pearse’s case he chooses to spend the portion > avg salary on hiring 2 staff members- ie he RECEIVES it and SPENDS it.” A source to back up this statement.. What were you reading?!

He receives all his wage, there is no other way for him to do it. The Dept of Finance came out right at the start of this “we only get paid the average industrial wage” issue to say that there is no TDs getting paid less than the wage set for a TD.
The fact that he can hire two people for his office also backs up the claim that he gets his full TD salary, and also the fact that he says it in the article.
I would also be interested in the background of the people hired by those SF TDs who use their wage to do so. I wonder how often it happens that their children, or wives, or cousins, or friends just happened to be “the best candidate for the job.”

In future pensions will only be paid once they reach retirement age so it is not true that should Phil Hogan be appointed as European Commissioner that he will also be in receipt of a pension. Máire Geoghegan-Quinn had a freeze put on her pension while she is the commissioner.

However when this government came inthey should have capped all public pensions at 75k as an emergency measure for five years. I think it was a huge failure that they didn’t do so.

Maire Geoghegan Quinn voluntarily gave up her Oireachtas and ministerial pension for the duration of her time as EU Commissioner. This was only after coming under intense pressure to do so.

When she steps down next year she’ll claim all three.

State pensions should not exceed the average industrial wage ; why would a retired person need more than the average worker ?

Of course Charlie Haughey was entitled to buy an Island, a yacht as well as ordering expensive shirts from France…….GOD DAMIT WHAT IS THE MATTER WITH YOU BEGRUDGERS….he was entitled to it? As Phil Hogan would say we gave Charlie a “MANDATE”
How dare Pearse Doherty criticise our politicians and make an issue out of their private life’s, who cares?

I could be wrong here but I thought Howlin said the new rules applied to anyone elected in the future. Ie 2016 onwards. This was under the pretext of not being “unfair” to those already in receipt of a ministerial pension who would have seen that taken from them (like Ivan Yates) but he worded it to slyly include the current 2011 crop as “previously elected”

Bobby, taxing the rich and giving it to the poor is not a solution in a modern economy. Easy to be in opposition but we need more realistic ideas than this to be taken seriously !

We will be proposing a fully costed set of proposals in the next week’s. The current polices are not working. In the last CSO figures we returned to recession. That’s five austerity budgets on.

@David, you fail to understand the message because you choose to shot the messenger too. Pearce is commenting on the overpaid Dàil members, to show the unnecessary need for such big salaries he is pointing out the trappings of such fraudulent wealth.
This show of wealth at a time we are being taxed for anything that comes to the mind of those that display such lucrative unnecessary trappings?
IT IS OBSCENE.

I totally agree. Other have had their chance and made a total mess out of it.
It’s time to get Sinn Fein in to see what they can do.
The SF were the only ones talking sense from the start and had some good ideas of how to get out of the recession without pushing us all into poverty.

Bobby, stop that talk about “shooting” messengers

Dumbfound and concerned that the only electable option for us to the pathetic shower in FG, FF, Lab is SF. This country is in a dreadful place as a direct result of gombeen politics, listening to Phil Hogan only yesterday, reassures us that the gombeens are everywhere.
Where is hope and honesty to come from, surely not from a bunch of former bombers and bank robbers.

@Dubliner, I was waiting for that one ha ha…..I’m always up for a laugh I’m able to take it as well as give it ;-)

Didn’t give up their seats in Westminster before claiming in excess of £1 Million in expenses though, did they Bobby? I hear Gerry’s Holiday home is lovely this time of year.

And Deputy Doherty has some cheek to talk about others buying cars, and him only taking home “an average industrial wage” (A misleading and vague statement) when he himself claimed €22,000 in car expenses.

Please learn how to spell his name if you admire him so much. It’s Pearse with an ‘s’ not a ‘c’.

The same Paddy Murray from the garbage Sunday World a wannabe journalist with useless meaningless articles of tripe

Bobby ; do you know what ink cartriges are good for ; if you do we’ll stay shtum; if not just ask me and I’ll tell you what I heard!

In fairness that is a bit of a silly comment, it was the British Government who chose to extend expenses to abstention MP’s in recognition that that although they don’t set foot in the physical environs of the commons they do the same work as any other MP. So they claim the same constituency expenses as any other MP as they have the same expenses as any other MP. They do not collect a salary as they do not sit at West Minister. Why would they forgo an allowance that allows them to represent their constituents in the same manner as any other member and put themselves at a disadvantage with their political opponents?

He is also an accomplished writer, so this is how he is able to own one house & mortgage the other house.

He lives in Donegal with his wife & children.

Malachy ; if you are referring to Gerry Adams , he has claimed that he is struggling to afford the holiday home !

Typical blue shirt fg ff labour supporter you are the reason this country will never change you stupid person

A smell a fg ff labour fan here a regular blue shirter

I am referring to Deputy Doherty as Deputy Adams kids have long since flown the nest. In the case of Deputy Adams, that a look at the returns on Members interests. It will highlight that Deputy Adams is also a writer.

Alot of Deputies ; who’s the Sherriff? The Queen of England perhaps ?

Very amusing but nothing substantial to bring to the debate!
Typical establishment guff!

@ Maria

It’s clear the SF have hijacked this article if you have more red thumbs. Your comment is 100% proven fact.

SF extract the same amount per TD as FF/FG/Lab etc. what they do with it is their business, all I care about as a tax payer is the true cost, not the massaged SF cost!

Thought he represented Louth.. But then he is very good at running from place to place when he was NOT a prominent member of the IRA

living expenses was the issue wasn’t it

Gerry Adams didn’t forfeit his Westminister benefits – remember the expenses scandal? Bear in mind too that he wasn’t just claiming expenses for a job he was doing. As an abstentionist MP, he was claiming them for a job he wasn’t doing.

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/gerry-adams-claimed-1m-as-mp-but-never-took-seat-26799526.html

This is hardly leading by example is it?

With the backhanders FF and FG have they must be well set up to so it’s a natural conclusion – give them the average wage – we don’t attract the best in the industry anyway – so lets attract those that simply want to serve.

Your some fool. Wake up sleepy.

What is wrong with more price rise to our gas bill, what is wrong that elderly have to go to bed early this winter, just to keep warm. What is wrong with Labours Kathleen Lynch being transported to hospital in Cork by…HELICOPTER….while a two year old who fell form an upstairs window in Co Cork had to be driven to hospital by a passing motorist because and ambulance would be not available for two hours. The child died!
What is wrong with our country has manifested itself with the hypocritical comments by many on here!

Egg, you wouldn’t come out from behind the curtain yesterday after you read Phil Hogans comment on the journal that the people gave him “a mandate” to tax us! You supported Phil Hogans lies by your chosen silence. Egg McMuffin you are just another Fine Gael hypocrite supporting a fellow Fine Gael ministers contemptuous lie!

@Jim, your comments are like swiss cheese and like many others on her with comments like you.
I am not a member of any party or group,I am a voter who found a way of making a protest where it matters, street protesting is not a effective. When I see supporters of corruption I.e FF,FG,Lb, fuming over my comments and Sinn Fein’s integrity, then it is job well done!!!
Thanks for your reply it is really very, very much appreciated, JIMMY.

Sandra it works like this, they draw down the same as any other TD and pay all of the taxes, PRSI etc. that is paid by any other TD. They then pay about €6.k to the party which the allowable amount under the rules. They then draw a salary of €550.00 per week which is about €28,600.00 (This would be the take home pay for a person on the AIW at €35.k). The balance of the wage is then used to pay staff to man fulltime offices and do constituency work such as dealing with state agencies etc. on behalf of voters (It is not used for elections or any party political activities as this is not allowed under the guidelines). Under the expenses rules TD’s are entitled to an allowance of €13.k if they open an office. This can be used to pay expenses not associated with hiring staff so is used for rent etc. the expense of hiring staff comes directly from the TD. It’s a matter for the voter to decide how they view Sinn Fein’s position on this matter and they choice they make in the usage of their salary, in my own constituency it seems to be viewed very well by them. Hope this clarifies matters for you.

As person with a single standard tax credit would get €27,700 on a AIW of €35,000. The standard wage paid to TD’s in Sinn Fein is about €550.00 per week and most have partners.

He employed two people to benefit his organisation, they are after all not state employees or volunteers, they are employees of SF.

Funny, you leave out the fact that the Labour councillors are the ones who proposed this and also participate in it.

Sorry, not intentional. I apologise for this. I have a lot of respect for the Labour members on SDCC. Both they and my party have worked very well together over the last four years.