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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-m-kiOcKjdU
IF YOU’RE A member of Fine Gael the chances are you’re already totes excited about the party’s Ard Fheis at the RDS in Dublin this weekend.
But this video will get all you blueshirts really psyched up for the big one as things get under way in later today.
It’s called ‘Echoes of Ard Fheiseanna Past’ and features the voices of several previous Fine Gael taoisigh including what’s believed to be the first ever video/voice recording of WT Cosgrave from November 1930, It was, we are told, sourced from Pathé.
With obvious apologies to everyone who is not a member of Fine Gael, but it’s a nice production.
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It’s great to see that both sides have moved on and are looking towards the future rather then the past.
No Irish person should ever bow to that old lady.
I agree with Kilkenny Cat. As a proud Irishman I will never bow to the Queen.
She wore white gloves. I’m surprised he didn’t wear a black pair. He surely has an old pair lying around somewhere
She wears gloves all the time, no matter where she is. Just something I noticed watching articles on news etc. She never shakes hands with anyone without gloves. It’s good ethic-ate.
well said!
My comment referred to Pagan….positive move…
Agreed Irish Patriot! However it seems by the amount of thumbs down you got that there’s an overwhelming amount of Irish grovellers who would bow to the queen which is really pathetic! All men born equal!!
Interesting piece. The lack of a bow is due to the protocol that says British (or Commonwealth) citizens should bow to the monarch, but citizens of other countries shouldn’t. As McGuiness holds Irish citizenship, a bow was always very unlikely. Just like Eamonn Gilmore or Enda Kenny didn’t bow when the Queen visited Dublin last year.
I personally know english people born and bred who, as republicans, have told me that they would never stoop to engage with any member of a monarchy. McGuinness has, by his actions, clearly given recognition to English sovereignty over the six counties He has lost whatever, if any, credibility as an Irish republican that he had remaining. As for this being an exercise in ‘reaching out to unionists’ – who is he trying to kid? I will conclude with a quote from James Connolly. As apt now as it was then:
“What is monarchy? From whence does it derive its sanction? What has been its gift to humanity? Monarchy is a survival of the tyranny imposed by the hand of greed and treachery upon the human race in the darkest and most ignorant days of our history. It derives its only sanction from the sword of the marauder, and the helplessness of the producer, and its gifts to humanity are unknown, save as they can be measured in the pernicious examples of triumphant and shameless iniquities.”
in reply to kevin, maybe mcguinness is respecting the wishes of the majority of the people of ireland or have you forgotten the good friday agreement.
@ Kevin McQ: Connolly’s take on it was more in line with Charles I than Elizabeth II. They granted your wish and got rid of the tyranny one time. Didn’t work out fantastically in Drogheda and Wexford. Monarchs don’t have a monopoly on misery. Plenty of repubs able to dish it out too. For the average taxpayer across the pond, the annual contribution to keep the silly pageantry on the road is about £0.68. It is a not inconsiderable tourism revenue generator. It’ll be there for a while yet.
No, just to the Kaiser!
Fair play to Marty, and fair play to Lizzy, good day for Ireland.
Very brave of the Queen to shake the hands of a man who was actively invoked in the murder of so many of her people. It speaks volumes of her as a person so fair play to her.
I don’t see this as much of a muchness for Sinn Fein, I hope they enjoyed dragging the spotlight on themselves so needlessly but hopefully they’ll vanish back into the shadows of irrelevance shortly enough.
Are you referring to Martin McGuinness being a commander in the Derry Brigade of the Provisional Irish Republican Army, when they were engaged in a war against hostile Unionist and British forces? Or are you referring to Martin McGuinness, Sinn Féin chief negotiator during the peace process that got British Soldiers (that engaged in murder against civilians) off the streets and created a democratic peaceful mechanism of a 32 County Socialist Republic?
Winston a chara, Sinn Féin are going nowhere but up and forward on the Irish political landscape, and all you bitter revisionists can do is just watch, get letters published in the Independent, and learn to accept the inevitability, Sinn Féin ARE the future of this country. Tiocfaidh Ar La.
Is that why support for them dropped in the last polls? Cause they’re only going up? Does not compute, I’m afraid.
Their poor support combined with no partners in opposition mean that they’ll more or less never be a credible threat in this country.
Sorry to burst your bubble, but apart from their core group of supporters (from poor and uneducated areas) and the odd swing voter, they don’t have a lot going for them.
Thankfully.
Well said, Winston. Martin McGuinness was the leader of cowards, murderers and thugs, who disgraced Ireland and Irish nationalism. The heroes of that time were John Hume, Seamus Mallon, Gordon Wilson and all in their mould.
It is a disgrace that the Journal permits a comment suorting the IRA and ending with the terrorists rallying cry/catchphrase “our day will come”. Disgusting.
Its also disgusting that Antoin comments on the deaths on his own side as murder while dismissing the murders carried out by the IRA as “war”.
*supporting
Don’t worry about it, Madeline, SF are rarely attributed with reason and logic.
There’s a rule when reading TheJournal.ie comments that one must always adhere to – “Name translate to Irish? Take opinion with a pinch of salt”. You’ll find the majority of people with Irish-ized names here have nothing of substance to contribute to any of the articles they comment on, just like the party they support.
Look at the vipers Winston and Madeline, excelling in the hatred and vitriol like Brian Hayes at the weekend.
What good is it, she could go on about her 2nd cousin/Husband’s Uncle MountBatten. McGuinness could go on about all his neighbours and friends who were murdered by her forces.
War is always nasty and brutal, and the one in the North was especially brutal on both sides.
People should be glad it is over, not trying to keep fighting the last battle or getting one over on the other side like Hayes, Myers and these 2 doo dah’s here. They can have their bile and bitterness, no one else wants a part of it.
“What is monarchy? From whence does it derive its sanction? What has been its gift to humanity? Monarchy is a survival of the tyranny imposed by the hand of greed and treachery upon the human race in the darkest and most ignorant days of our history. It derives its only sanction from the sword of the marauder, and the helplessness of the producer, and its gifts to humanity are unknown, save as they can be measured in the pernicious examples of triumphant and shameless iniquities.”
James Connelly
@Winston
I don’t know much about sinn fein or martin mc guinness and neither bo you by the sounds of things. I don’t agree with anything he may have done but he was a young man doing what he believed he had to do to survive. He and his people were being suppressed by the british army and he fought back the only way he knew how. If he grew up in Dublin 4 (for example) or anywhere else I guarantee you he wouldn’t have been involved in any of the things that happened in the north. He is a victim of his upbringing and his circumstances. Can you not appreciate that he has changed his ways and has done a lot (although he could do more) for peace in the north? I find your comments highly insulting, you hide behind a fake name trying to rise anger in people, you come across as a very ignorant man.
Not sure what polls Winston C is looking at or what planet he/she is living on. Antoin has it spot on. Sinn Fein are the most progressive force in Irish politics and eventually will become the dominant party throughout the island. There have been many hiccups and bumps along the road, and there will be many more, but when you have a clear vision and a long term strategy, you can achieve just about anything. More importantly, SF is not about putting themselves in power for the sake of having power, influence or money – it’s about making Ireland a true democracy and, to use the cliche, where all the children of our nation are cherished equally. I look forward to 2016 when maybe, just maybe, we will be able to celebrate the 100th anniversary of the Easter Rising in an Ireland that is finally off its knees; where clientelist and gombeen politics has been thrown in the trashbin forever; and where everyone, north and south, can look with confidence to a better future for all.
@Anto O Cinnedee
I find you very aggressive in your writing. You sound like Adolf Hitler on a podium. No harm in dreaming son, Sin Fein may be in politics and have representatives in the Dail, but I can assure you, that they will not be in Government, ever. Your dreams are my nightmares. Thankfully I can wake up and realize it not to be true!
Most people here on the treads today on this story seem fairly respectful towards each other whatever their beliefs are. You on the other hand, I don’t like, I don’t like your aggression, anger and so much hatred. You need to socialize with people. Good luck with that.
The Queen in her many years as the monarch has been complicit in the murder of many of good Irishmen, women and children. The British have been the meanest, most genocidal nation in history and Ireland is where they honed their trade.
Sinn Fein has been instrumental in the negotiation and implementation of,” The Good Friday Agreement”, and no matter what your hope, they will not fade into irrelevance as the UVA, The Red Hand and numerous other Orange Organizations have.
“Winston a chara, Sinn Féin are going nowhere but up and forward on the Irish political landscape, and all you bitter revisionists can do is just watch, get letters published in the Independent, and learn to accept the inevitability, Sinn Féin ARE the future of this country. Tiocfaidh Ar La.”
-And it’s comments like that, Antóin, that will prevent me from ever voting for Sinn Féin. Sounded a bit dictatorial, did it not? Fully agree with Sheila.
Luke and Sheila, you need to take a look in a dictionary. That word dictatorial doesn’t actually refer to people having a different opinion than you.
Winston, your a great man for the stereotypes so you are. Sinn Féin supporters are “uneducated”, hmmmm well considering our membership in colleges and Universities continues to rise exponentially (I myself joined in UCD) that seems to dispel your nonsense. We have of course members from all backgrounds, and indeed a lot from working class areas such as myself, but none of them are “uneducated” a chara, in fact they know more about the realities of political failure than most of the politicians in Leinster House and Stormont.
You also take issue with those who use the Gaelic version of their names, is wanting to embrace your culture such a bad thing “Winston C”?
I understand of course you wish Sinn Féin members were “uneducated” and boorish because that would allow you to continue to stereotype. But let me tell you, our activists are some of the most politically aware, articulate, dedicated and motivated activists on the entire island.
Shelia I have respect for all political opinion, provided its not profoundly and blatantly stupid. And even if I respect a political opinion but disagree with it, I will criticise that opinion, in a coherent and confident manner as I respect those who do the same to my opinions. What I will not tolerate however is my opinion being dismissed on the basis of tautological nonsense (which tends to be the bulk of anti-SF opinion).
Oh by the way Me dictatorial? I actually prefer my representatives to be democratically elected.
censored: You’re right. The word ‘dictatorial” actually has nothing to do with somebody having a different opinion to mine. Hence why I used it.
Dictatorial: ‘Having or showing a tendency to tell people what to do in an autocratic way.’
The paragraph I quoted gave me that kind of impression. I happened to choose my word carefully.
Everybody is entitled to their opinion, and I fully respect that. I did, however, find that particular paragraph, to an extent, dictatorial.
It’s great that Martin McGuinness actually did shake hands with her. It’s time that the past is left where it belongs – in the past. I would be slightly more likely to give Sinn Féin my vote after this.
Poor Patrick had everyone on his side until he mentioned voting for Sinn Féin.
Glad to see the handshake but equally glad he didn’t bow…
Reply to jack leahy: the only reason mcguinness shook her majesty’s hand was to get votes at the next election. Remember ruthless murderers never had nor ever will have principles.
Which one do you mean Bruce, it’s hard to tell?
The welcome that the Queen received last year probably showed SF that the people of Ireland want the troubles behind them. It was a huge step for SF today. Let’s hope they build on it.
More like a huge step for the Queen, SF were only hyping this after been caught out so badly last year
A great day for everyone who wants to look to the future. This can only be a positive, hopeful thing that happened today.
H.M is wearing green,white and plenty of gold.
So the colours of Offaly then
Does she always wear gloves? Does this mean we can have our 6 county’s back or what?
The very last thing the country needs right now is the £7bn liability the North is to the UK and the civil unrest that would come with it switching hands.
@iwantjustice5
Bit childish of you. Unless you live in the 6 counties, I don’t think it’s any of your business. Hopefully if there is ever a referendum on the subject, it will be only in the 6 counties. Their decision, not yours and certainly not mine.
By the way, she wears gloves all the time.
Bit of a condundrum. How does she change her gloves then?
Body language analysis? What a load of complete shite! Every single moment of this encounter will have been choreographed and rehearsed ad nauseam leading up to the event. The difference in handshakes for the Queen and Prince Philip is pure and simple etiquette. This is a hugely significant event which cannot have been easy for those involved. They are to be commended for this gesture and deserve the respect of all. Anything that paves the way for continued peace and reconciliation must be welcomed. I have nothing but the utmost respect for Her Majesty, Martin McGuiness and Prince Philip.
This was not about progress. What was the block to Adams or McGuinness greeting her last year? What “changed” between now and then to make this possible? Actually, nothing other than public opinion. SF underestimated the Irish welcome last year and have simply decided cash in this year. It’s all about marketing and this party does it well, however lacking in substance their motives.
I’m glad ye’ve met and made friends. Must be hard out there in the cold. We are moving on to a better Ireland. A new republic.
@Winston. Actually if u pick up a newspaper or watch the news you’ll see that in the North SF are in power, not in opposition.nYou should educate yourself first before commenting.
Oh yes, Stephen, I’m completely aware of that however I’m referring to the South.
The way they govern in the north, a way that completely contradicts their spiel here, should raise alarm bells for anyone even considering voting for them here. They have shown themselves to be hypocrites and nothing more up North.
Spot on O’Reilly. And Winston. “Empty vessels make the most noise” and SF are empty, cunning, low, murderous and annoyingly noisy. Two countries, two ideologies, what single political party could stand there, brazenly, and claim authority.. They are a joke.
RP, that quote is fantastic, I’ve never heard it before myself. I usually say “he who knows the least shouts the most” myself.
You’re absolutely right though but thankfully its a fact that more than 75% of the electorate here realise and thus don’t even consider voting for SF.
SF used last yr’s visit to guage reactions to her among their own. They overhyped the significance of her veiled admission of wrong doing by her forces. This is politics… I for one am grateful that the goal of this particular game is peace.
The comments page still full of anti-republican sentiment from all the usual suspects. Just shows how scared some people are of Sinn Féin’s rise in popularity that the same old drivel comes out, re murderers, bombers, they can’t be trusted etc. “Give up the gun and seek a united Ireland through peaceful means” they cried. Now that they’ve done just that, they say “Martin was this”, “they’re still the same”. Move on, and stop living in the past.
I think there is a lot to be said for keeping the past in mind; George Santayana put it well when he said that those who will not learn from history are doomed to repeat it. Of course, if your advice were to be taken literally, Sinn Féin might well have to disband, as it seems to draw so much of its own inspiration from our troubled past. If we want to demonstrate our independence as a nation, we should have the courage to condemn in ourselves what we so readily condemn in those who were once our enemies. That is why the people who once made the choice to be murderers must remain so. It was the peacemakers who eventually triumphed.
the peacemakers like the SDLP who triumphed?? lol
what shallow ahistorical rhetoric!
I thought it looked like a bit of a wet fish handshake and he didn’t bow for fear of head butting her. ( a Mr .Bean moment!!)
I dont like Sinn Fein & I wouldnt vote for them, however this little symbol must be welcomed & praise should be given to both sides. Its time to move on.
I agree. It’s about time the British government moved on and left the last part of Ireland that they still occupy
@Lerron,nnThe UK Government has made it very clear that they have ‘no strategic interest’ in N Ireland, and when the majority want change they will respect that.
Typo; @Kerron
The six counties that make up the province of Northern Ireland are under British rule because the majority of people living there wish it to be so. There is no “occupation” here.
an artificial majority Aleo. Read a history book for christ sake :-/
boring
as for no strategic interest: “Cameron’s comments are reminiscent of former British foreign secretary Jack Straw’s assertion that the Britain must remain in Ireland in order to maintain its prominent status in bodies such as NATO, the EU and the UN.”
Cameron “I am prime minister of the United Kingdom, I really mean it. England, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland – we’re weaker apart, stronger together, so together is the way we must always stay.”
http://www.eirigi.org/latest/latest081010.html
I suppose you’ll be telling me they have no interest in Scotland either, despite them launching a massive anti-Scot Independence campaign recently and spewing pro-UK propaganda on a constant basis
open your eyes
While I’ll keep my opinions about this topic largely to myself, I would just point out that there is no ‘province’ of northern ireland. There is the province of Ulster and the country of Northern Ireland and those two things are not the same, nor do they have the same borders, although there is a certain amount of overlap.
/pedantry off
Still a Republican? McGuinness’ and his buddies brand of provo-ism only sullies the word with their semtex, blood and ink.
True Republicanism stresses liberty and inalienable rights as central values, something the Provos denied to the thousands they murdered during their pointless and illegal terror campaign.
McGuinness claims he left the IRA in 1974, however duringt his failed campaign for president the Irish Independent reported the assertion by the former Garda Commissioner, Pat Byrne — who spent much of his career in anti-subversive units until his retirement in 2003 — that Mr McGuinness was a senior figure in the Army Council of the IRA up to 2003 (http://tinyurl.com/Provo4President)
Stephen your a trouble maker. For Gods sake give PEACE a chance .
Why dont you kearon admit the truth about your web hosting service for roche??? Yawn yawn yawn
Stephen. Did the Provo’s stop you from getting a nixer from the FF Govt. last time, did they stop you charging 3250 to host a website.
Didn’t you do well enough out of the last govt. Stop being such a bitter man, and be thankful peace is here. You’ll get another chance at the trough when FF are in coalition with FG in 2016, that is all that matters to you.
Worried that SF will stop the gravy train Stephen?
The funny thing about that photo is thousands of people over the years voted for Mc Guinness but the Queen of England never got a vote. I think its a great thing to happen for peace.
Two people shook hands? This changes nothing in about the situation in Northern Ireland, where bomb threats occur daily and more walls are going up between communities so much so that you barely hear it in the media anymore. Symbolic or not, there is real work to be done in Northern Ireland. Martin McGuiness and the Queen of England’s hand, symbolic as it is, merely covers up the fact that there is still restlessness in Northern Ireland.
I have to disagree with you Caire. Not exactly daily bomb threats its not Syria/Afghanistan… things have a moved on and in time things will be sorted through politics like any normal society. It maybe symbolic the handshake but its a tad better than what might have happened a few years ago. Bu personally I would have loved to see the Martin do a Mr Bean on her :)
I think the body language of prince philip legging it when he found mmg behind him about to engage after pphilip asked a question spoke volumes!
Ken Reid, the political editor tweeted “Martin McGuinness chatting away to the Duke of Edinburgh. Whatever are they talking about” Seems that they got on OK and that speaks volumes.
Hardly surprising, as the IRA murdered his uncle in Sligo in 1979, along with an elderly lady and two children.
My comment above was in response to Disildoforus.
A lot of people cursing Martin for “murdering” innocents during the troubles. Does no one consider the murder that took place at the hands of the British establishment which no doubt escalated the issue to what it was at it’s height. When a human being is considered less and treated as such simply because of their sense of national identity then objection, requests for consideration and rebellion will take place. The British carried out untold chaos and mayhem much of which we will never learn, so we can be thankful we live in relative peace today and look forward to a more prosperous unified future that’s inclusive to all. Both sides suffered, both sides created suffering, so it might be more appropriate to draw the line on a high.
I’m afraid no amount of inverted commas can minimise murder. If it was wrong for the British to murder, it was equally wrong for the Irish. When we can accept that, we will have gained our independence. The peacemakers, not the murderers, were the heroes.
Oh god, I suppose you also subscribe to the nonsense that the only “bad” people on the Unionist “side” were the nasty paramilitant loyalist?
No thought for the bigots who stoked the flames? The Hugh Hannas, the Dr. Cookes and the Ian Paisleys are just as responsible for sectarian murder as the Billy Wright’s and Shankill Butchers. They legitimised the notion that the the taigs were dangerous and dirt, that needed to be wiped clean
Very true Aleo. Hopefully the history books will restore Hume etc. to their rightful place as the true proponents of peace in NI. SF and DUP have spun so many stories that people forget what happened, that the SDLP worked tirelessly for decades to bring peace, and that SF/DUP (Trimble had done his part for UUP) had followed public opinion. The SDLP never changed their tune, but constantly pushed for peace. It’s such a pity that the Nobel Peace Prize winner should be suffering from Alzheimer’s at a time when his life’s work is bearing fruit like this.
Incredible negativity from the begrudgers..So you would prefer cold wars to continue?
Keep these positive gestures coming and we will start looking forward not backwards….
In fairness though…I had a pizza earlier & it was delicious.
Ba chóir a bheith béasach le daoine ach is dóigh liom nach bhfuil monarcacht oiriúnach a thuilleadh, má bhí riamh.
Bhi an smaoineamh ceart ag na Francaigh sa bhliain 1789!
Tá sé oiriúnach doibh siúd sa U.K.
Agus tá Tuaisceart na h-Éireann sa U.K. fós.
Ni hionann ‘oiriunach’ agus ‘riachtanach’, ‘usaideach’ no ‘CEART’ !
Body language bullshit.
Amazes me how so many of you are scared of an 86 year old granny.
I was hoping someone would do a Mr Bean style headbutt
“liberalism rejects ideological struggle and stands for unprincipled peace, thus giving rise to a decadent, Philistine attitude and bringing about political degeneration in certain units and individuals in the Party and the revolutionary organizations”
What this unprincipled peace means now is as clear as day in both the Six and Twenty Six Counties. More people have (and especially today due to the recession) suffered north and south because of the foul system of Capitalism that could have been done away with if the injustice of British Imperialism in the north was defeated.
Instead we have poverty, unemployment, emigration, addiction: SYSTEMATIC violence, in the form of people dying in hospital corridors, crimes of poverty, drug and alcohol abuse, suicide and familicide due to financial pressures and other reasons…..
and yet we have the liberals who only like to see what suits them, what’s in front of them. Liberals see the violence used by physical force Republicans (that was ultimately to do away with all these social ills and build a better society, an socialist Republic). Do these same liberals ever complain of the systematic violence as noted by Zizek and others? Do the West-Brits ever complain of the State violence inflicted by the Westminster mandarins to consolidate this sick society that protects only a minority??
I always taught it was an insult to curtsy or bow to a monarch if you were not of that culture,
i remember working in a hotel in dublin when monarchy visited and we were told they would take it as insult as we were not their subjects…all we had to speak correctly and act in a professional manner.
However anyone working in the hotel whom were from their country were expected to continue as they would normally in their home country.
who gives a fiddlers? why would you grovel in front of a monarch? what century is this?
The shinnerbots are working overtime tonight !!!
He should of bowed …… And then head butted her!!!!lol
As long as Britain will own part of Ireland there can never be peace nor justice.The Queen shook M M G’s hand because Ireland gave up terrotorial claim over the 6 Counties in the ’90′s.
Things I never thought I’d hear. Paisley say ‘We with Sinn Fein…(2007): a British PM say of the actions of HM Forces that they were ‘unjustified and unjustifiable’(2010) and now an IRA leader describe seeing Her Majesty as ‘nice’. (2012) One more needed…. That same IRA leader following the example of that British PM and admit without ambiguity some of what the IRA did was ‘unjustified and unjustifiable’. He’s implied as much … Go on Martin just say it… I did wrong…
Without getting too bogged down in rhetoric and ideology, SF held a principled stand against monarchy in general. It was not just the British royals that they refused to meet with. Whether you agree with such a stance or not, that was the line they took. This is not uncommon amongst Republican and anti-inequality parties and groups the world over. An example from our near neighbours would be the Plaid Cymru party in Wales. They have refused to meet with the British queen, or engage in royal functions on principle. Yesterdays move should alert the southern electorate (for whose benefit the stunt was most likely pulled) that no principle or promise is sacred.
In terms of Irish Republican principle and ideology, Martin has strayed so far from it both now and in the past that while he may joke that he is still a Republican, the joke is getting quite old. It is obvious that SF have moved away from traditional Republicanism and are concentrating more on reformism and social equality. There is nothing in the world wrong with concentrating on such worthy matters, if the party were willing to be more honest about it and stop trying to dine out on a Republican legacy to keep a often sceptical grass roots in place.
From reading these comments I am glad to be living the other side of the world, nWe are all the same, human beings that should respect care and protect each other. We have come along way since mindless murder from both sides. nIgnorance and lack of intelligence is the only reason people still go on like this. There is no excuse for it.nWe cannot change the past but we can mould the future. Think of our children and the world we want for themnPeace and humanity
Your calls for peace and humanity are quite noble Mark, I would love to see that come to fruition. I would disagree with your comment about “mindless murder” in reference to the war however. When a country or Guerrilla army or paramilitary organisation engage in violence its always for an end. When Britain engaged this country, it wasn’t mindless at all, it was to fulfill their imperial interests. When Republicans fought back it was a stalwart against that imperialism, when Loyalist’s engaged in sectarian murder, it wasn’t mindless it was coldly calculated to break the spirit of the Nationalist community.
I would unfortunately subscribe to the neo-realist school of thought when it comes to conflict, if it is in a country’s or guerrilla movement’s interest engage in war they will, if peace benefits them then that is what will happen. When war benefited Britain they engaged in it, when it benefited Republicans to fight back they did. Peace only occurs when their is mutual benefit or unilateral benefit for one side (the other side surrender).
In the 6 counties the nature of the conflict ensured that mutual benefit would come from peace. That mutual benefit would not have existed however had Irish Republicanism not fought back, the peace would have been unilateral which would have perpetuated continuous unrest (as the very real issues facing nationalists would not have been addressed under an Unionist or British controlled administration supported unreservedly by the British war machine, as was the case from the 20s up until the GFA). When Britain said they had no strategic interests in Ireland, that was a calculated move, as the interests they did have were outweighed by the cost of conflict, which is one of the main reasons an equitable peace was viable, as Republicans had made themselves formidable opponents
Its great talking about humanity et al but thats all it really is, talk. Three players had interests in Ireland, two of those players were not going to relinquish any part of their interests to the other player out of goodwill, the other player had to change the rules of the game to get the others to play fair. Thats just the reality of the situation
The guerilla war was wound down. Any basic analysis will show that. For what reasons are debatable. But the notion that a stalemate was brought about because the Brits realised (at a point when the armed campaign was not intense at all) that the IRA were formidable is bogus and illogical
Seems the Shinners are out in force voting for their own comments! Good thing there is only one vote each!
Just like FFG and Labour so
I am 57 Engishman. I served in the army in northern Ireland in the 1980′s.
As far as I’m concerned the Queen has committed treason.
she has chosen to forget all the servicemen and women who fought in her name.
she has chosen to forget the murder of Lord Mountbatten.
she has betrayed her citizens in favour of some current politically correct nonsense.
may she rot in hell
she’s still awarding medals to those with blood soaked hands in Afghanistan, Iraq and Libya. Is that not enough for you Imperialists??
Maybe if Britain would keep its troops/nose out of other countries business in the first place we could avoid the bloodshed!
Phillip, the way I looked at British soldiers growing up was the same way you would have looked at the Luftwaffe bombing your towns 70 years ago. They never have and never will belong on the streets of Ireland and their presence here only prolonged the conflict.
Testing
have your say