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THE SOCIALIST PARTY is mixing things up with a name change.
It wants to be called “Stop the Water Tax – Socialist Party” and has applied for the change.
It would mean that the anti-water charge slogan would be on ballot papers for the European elections.
Socialist Party MEP Paul Murphy said, “We want to bring the war against austerity and the water tax into the heart of our campaign.
“It also sets us up for a big non-payment campaign down the road.
The idea to stop the water tax featured heavily in our campaign and it should be a key issue so we’re using it in our election campaign to build awareness.
Murphy told TheJournal.ie that:
People might say that we lost on the property tax but the revenue was involved in that and they could bully it out of people. This will be a charge as opposed to a tax.
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I can’t believe its not Butter – Socialist Party.
Take two bottles into the shower? Not me- The Socialist Party.
What would Trotsky say?
Take a bow griska! Think that’s the first comment I’ve ever seen on here that has genuinely cracked me up!
I reckon he would say something like Конец может оправдывать средства, пока есть некоторые конец.
Or something like: Пожалуйста, не бейте меня с этим ледорубом
Endut! Hoch Hech!
Don’t other socialists in Euro elections favour house and water charges
We already pay for water
Our socialists are the only ones against tax.
A unique breed of socialist.
I think you’ll find that all Socialists are opposed to taxing people to live in their homes and the double taxation on water in order to pay for the failure of speculative financial capitalism.
Actually, Coddler, most socialists would be in favour of property taxes as they’re a form of wealth distribution seeing as property is a major source of wealth. Indeed, proper hardcore socialists are against the basic concept of private property.
Pete, saying you already pay for water because of existing taxes is a gross over-simplification because:
(1) Not everybody pays income tax.
(2) Not everybody pays the same amount of tax.
(3) Not everybody uses the same amount of services so we don’t have a pay as you go taxation system.
(4)You’re assuming you already pay enough in taxes to cover your water usage. Maybe you’re not. Maybe that’s why the current water infrastructure is completely inadequate.
(5) Not all taxes are used for the provision of services. Some are used for wealth distribution by providing a safety net for others, e.g. the disabled. Some are also used to control inflation by curtailing the money supply etc.
So in conclusion, saying taxes are only for services and that you already pay the requisite amount of tax for the exact amount of services you avail of is grossly over-simplistic and therefore wrong.
So if socialists are all for new taxes, what does that make Fine Gael ?
@Ignoreland,
To follow on with your fantasy word of facts, Is the same as paying to get into hospital and then paying to get out. We have one of the wettest country in the world and so called “intellectuals” are happy to pay for water twice soon to be three times when they start to charge for waste water disposal.
Another Socialist party with a split/name change – who could have predicted that?
Genius, if you are to live up to your name you would explain why my previous comment was wrong. But you haven’t; you’ve just said something incredibly confusing instead that has no relation to my comment so I don’t know why you’re addressing it to me.
Likewise – Evian all the way.
I think they’d be for FAIR tax. It was my understanding that water was paid for as part of your income tax (from which certain CEOs are exempt, thanks to the party that is being hammered today).
You can tell when a crypto-FG guy is posting because he’s the one telling you what other people are thinking. They claim they can read minds. I invite them to read the newspaper on Monday morning.
Good to see their not just a one issue party?
It will be hilarious if they ever end up supporting water charges in the future. “Vote YES on water charges!” – A message brought to you by Stop the Water Tax – Socialist Party
They don’t do themselves any favours do they?
SP, PBP, ULA, STWTSP; the party with more names than members!
Used they be called the People’s Front of Judea at one stage?
People Before Profit is the Socialist Workers Party’s front, not the SP.
The Anti-Austerity Alliance and Stop the Water Tax Coalition are fronts for the Socialist Party.
People Before Profit Alliance is a front for the Socialist Workers Party.
They tried the joint campaign of the United Left Alliance, but then Higgins and Boyd Barrett stopped talking to each other, and had to pass messages through Shane Ross within the Technical Group, so that fell apart.
So lads do we out together costed well thought out polices or do we just stick a populist phrase in front of our name??
If Paul Murphy wants to be considered a serious politician he needs to start engaging in politics instead of populist rubbish
Nonsense. In every other country people have to pay for water. It’s an utility and finite resource that we need to conserve and the only way to achieve that is by charging for it. People are using too much and water will be the next resource crisis. Property tax is morally wrong but how people expect free water and free bins is beyond me. No-one expects free oil.
Sounds like you have taken to many punches to the head
TYPO
* too
You already pay for water; there was a 2% VAT increase in the 1970s and that was the reason given.
I am sure there has not been a single cost increase since the 70′s in the production of water
There is plenty of water and food for everybody in the world. It’s just not distributed evenly.
Vat gos up every time the price of something gos up
Didn’t they effectively rebrand as the AAA the other week? So are they now the SP, the AAA, or the StWT-SP? Nonetheless, their efforts to woo the schizophrenic vote must be commended I guess.
Next week they will be the WTF party.
Is that ‘W’ for who or what?
Ha, why stop there. Why not the “Stop the Water Tax and the Austerity carry on – Socialist Party”
Populist ploy to try and squeeze out a few votes.
Or the “down with this sort of thing”party.
I have my own swimming pool. Do you know how much these water charges are going to cost me? This is why I lobby these political parties like the socialist party. The rich pay enough taxes in this country.
Only messing of course.
But seriously, I think people waste a lot of water and I think the more you use the more they should pay. If I did have a swimming pool, why should I expect free water to fill it?
I agree, do you know how much it cost to run 3? You should try it some time!
Catchy
It was either that – or ‘The Monster Raving Looney Party of Ireland’!
So now Paul Murhpy is the ex-ULA, now AAA STWT-SP MEP … just roles off the tongue!
You forgot CO for co-opted
Idiot is a title that will never leave him
The Government are setting up the billing infrastructure in order to privatize the Water industry and sell it off.
Can you point to a document if website stating that as fact?
No.
Oh i see, it looked like you were stating a fact as opposed to speculative rubbish.
Talkingsense,
Here’s a documented policy for you which turned out to be utter rubbish:
Extract from Page 59 of the pre election 2011 Fine Gael manifesto below:
“Funding Local Government: Fianna Fail’s proposal, now endorsed by the Labour Party, to introduce by 2014 an annual, recurring residential property tax on the family home is unfair. But as we tackle the fiscal crisis, we will have to cut central exchequer funding for local authorities, and we recognise that local authorities will have to find more sustainable sources of revenue appropriate to local circumstances. What will be viewed as fair in South Dublin might be viewed as unworkable in rural Clare. In this context, we will empower local authorities to put in place, following the 2014 local elections, fairer alternatives to Fianna Fail’s and Labour’s recurring annual tax on the family home. The options would include:
• No extra local taxes, forcing local authorities to close non-priority services and / or to deliver increased efficiencies;
• Increased local user charges for waste etc.; or
• The option of a local “site sale profits tax”. Such a tax would be levied on the profit made from the site value on the sale of a residence (sales proceeds, less cost indexed by inflation, less stamp duty paid and less home improvements)
The final measure might be considered as both fairer and more economically sensible than an annual
recurring property tax.”
- No tax
– Ever increasing spending.
Socialism rocks!!
I fail to see the relevance of that to my comment? I simply asked for direction to where it states Irish water will be privatised.
It is not speculative rubbish I’m just going by their track record. They have sold off everything else, the only thing left of value is our water and they will take that away from us as well. We can carry on this conversation after the next general election and see if this is speculative rubbish.
Forgive my ignorance but what’s is the “everything else” they sold off?
Because it would completely out of character for the government to sell off a public utility.
Stupid name all the same.
This will certainly sink them for sure
In water that they hopefully won’t have paid tax on!!!
People might say that we lost on the property tax but the revenue was involved in that and they could bully it out of people. This will be a charge as opposed to a tax. That’s why we’re using the strapline “Stop The Water Tax”. Everybody clear?
So, Mr Murphy, answer me this:
If “this will be a charge, as opposed to a tax” (which you are quoted as saying), then why are you changing the name to “Stop the Water Tax – Socialist Party”?
Where do I mark my X….great name!
Next to the SF candidate.
Glenn, we’re talking about elections, not mug shot photos.
Are those my feet – Socialist Party
Looks like you’d need a mirror to see them, Kris…
Doesn’t matter where you put your X – that is a spoiled vote.
Save the crosshair for the SF candidate.
Not really Paul, pull in my folds and there they are…
Lol nice one lads. Still wouldn’t vote for ye – ya bunch of anarchists
I might vote for proper anarchists, but these are not the droids you are looking for. If this crowd ever got elected, we would have carefully micromanaged anarchy, or else. At least for the half an hour before some breakaway faction emerged and they spent the next five years denouncing each other as traitors.
Anarchists don’t stand in parliamentary elections.
The purpose of Irish Water is to create an attractive entity for future privatisation continuing the neo liberal economic agenda which is tearing the social fabric of the country apart.
It cost €85 million for consultants to advise Irish Water on how to install water meters so that they can charge us again for the water supply we already pay for through general taxation.
The remarkably remunerated consultants and the numerous well equipped meter installation crews are paid from the National Pension Reserve Fund and the Property/Home tax which was allegedly destined to fund local services but that promise turned out to be another transparent FG & Labour lie.
Our water infrastructure will be sold to private operators within a decade to generate another lump sum to pay for the bank bailout which is also the reason that we are now being taxed simply to live in our own homes.
From that point on, the free market privateers will charge the citizens handsomely for our water and will have that glorious opportunity because of the initial failure of the free market in the banking sector. It’s an ingenious neo liberal Catch 22 and we are the chumps.
It’s time for the people to stand up now and refuse to allow the ransacking of the country to continue. Boycott the Water charge. Can’t pay. Won’t pay.
The Anti Austerity Alliance are building a boycott campaign against the water charges and are running 42 candidates in the local elections next May.
http://antiausterityalliance.ie/
That’s great but how are they going to find Job creation measures, infrastructure developments and the running of the country!
I would rather hear what political parties are going to do rather than what they are going to object too.
Well said Codder. fact is that we are paying for these infrastructure services and facilities already.
A bit wet.
Plenty people already pay for their water supply through group water schemes and their own wells. Will the stop the water tax socialist party payed for these people too?
Can they get any more irrelevant and pathetic? You can only laugh
And finally, there are people who will see that name on the ballot sheet and vote for them because of it. I’m Nick Ross, don’t have nightmares.
This is embarrassing. I cannot believe that the socialist party has reduced itself to a single issue. What the f**k are you thinking socialist party.
They aren’t exactly the cream of the crop.
It was long enough already…..would have thought they’d have watered it down….not up!
Only anti-tax socialists in the world. Leave it to the Irish to get things backwards.
Lolololol
Why not just call it The Paul Murphy Political Advancement Support Group. That’s essentially what it is
I must say I totally agree with this. Good call SP, I’m going to give joining ye some serious consideration. It was a good start shouting at people from your newspaper, your posters, your leaflets and your megaphones, but clearly not enough for these desperate times. When the party’s name itself shouts, when we roar a demand at every door, when our every thought is a central committee authorised slogan, the working class will finally be convinced of the need to expropriate the capitalists and organise production democratically on the basis of human needs and desires, and we will together march in tight formation to the socialist utopia singing songs about Connolly and Larkin. Venceremos Comrades!!
There is plenty of water. It just needs proper infrastructure to ensure that it is of drinkable quality. Anyone remember a few years ago Galway City’s water supply was contaminated for months. Ironically, the mayor of Galway at the time was a member of the Green Party.
WTF? AAA, SP, STWTSP, ROTFL.
The dash in “Stop the Water Tax – Socialist Party” is incredibly important. “Stop the Water Tax Socialist Party” would be a completely different message…
Well they have been know as the one liner party so the name should be a one liner. Funny the one liners always seem to contain the word “no”
a cynical attempt to gain non SWP voters votes
99.9999% of all votes are non-SWP votes
Such a stupid name
This isn’t a change in the Party’s name, its availing of the opportunity to put a slogan before our name for the Euro ballot paper only.
Absurd spin on this… Water charges should reflect costs and the long term management & welfare of the resource. Not a left/right issue but a green one. Privatization should be met with rage in the street. But I believe in reality with so many vigorous young people gone they might pull it off for their German overlords. Third world stuff privatizing a national resource like that.
I don’t think you can have a green agenda without it being an anti- capitalist agenda though. If the bottom line is going to be about profit then other factors are going to be secondary. Water charges being brought to Ireland are nothing to do with effective management or conservation- it is just another public service that will be privatized and run for the profit of the few.
have your say