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The government has lost another Seanad vote - and it could delay free GP care for children

Senator John Crown’s amendment to free GP care legislation has been passed – against the government’s wishes.

Updated 6.15pm 

Hugh O'Connell / YouTube

THE GOVERNMENT HAS suffered another defeat in the Seanad on an amendment to legislation that will give free GP care to children under six.

An amendment proposed by independent senator and consultant oncologist John Crown was passed against the government’s attempts to block it.

The amendment to the Health (General Practitioner Service) Bill 2014, which is currently at committee stage in the upper house, effectively bans the gagging of doctors who speak out against the health service.

Unless the amendment is removed in the Seanad at report stage next week, the passage of the Bill could be delayed as it must go back to the Dáil - meaning a mandatory three-month delay in passing the legislation.

Screen Shot 2014-07-09 at 17.32.23 Senator John Crown pushed for a walk-through vote on his amendment - ensuring a government defeat.

The government had intended to have free GP care for under sixes in place by the autumn but the scheme could now be delayed until later this year as a result of today’s vote.

The amendment was defeated by the government on an electronic vote by 25 votes to 24 but was passed by 27 votes to 26 when a walk-through vote was requested by Crown.

Even though Labour’s Susan O’Keeffe arrived in the Seanad for the walk-through vote, the opposition managed to secure a victory after Sinn Féin senators Trevor Ó Clochartaigh – who was paired with O’Keeffe – and David Cullinane as well as Fianna Fáil’s Averil Power arrived in the chamber.

It is the latest vote that the government has lost in the upper house as it grapples with the loss of its majority following the election of Fine Gael’s Deirdre Clune to the European Parliament in May.

The current numbers in the Seanad see the government with 29 votes when all Labour and Fine Gael senators are included, along with the casting vote of cathaoirleach Paddy Burke.

However Sinn Féin, Fianna Fáil, independents and three senators who have lost the government whip make up a total of 30 votes.

The coalition can normally rely on the support of some independents such as Jillian Van Turnhout and Marie Louise O’Donnell, but it has lost a number of votes in recent months, including on a bill to ban upward only rent reviews.

The government is introducing legislation that will help it to elect Clune’s replacement and restore its Seanad majority in the Dáil this Friday.

Read: The government doesn’t have a majority in the Seanad and has to change the law to get it back

Background: Why the government doesn’t enjoy a super majority in the Seanad like it does in the Dáil>

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29 Comments
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    Mute The CFC Standard
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    Jan 6th 2022, 8:42 AM

    Sure it’s only temporary lmao

    520
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    Mute SquintEastwood
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    Jan 6th 2022, 8:44 AM

    @The CFC Standard: sure Ireland won’t be using them unless for travel

    171
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    Mute Eamonn Martin
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    Jan 6th 2022, 8:47 AM

    @The CFC Standard: Leo said months back that is was only for a few weeks and please don’t find it discriminatory.
    More lies but hardly a shock.
    Passports that good we are now at over 20 times the cases.

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    Mute Rob
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    Jan 6th 2022, 9:08 AM

    @Eamonn Martin: Micheal Martin also said recently they had no plans to make the booster jab a requirement for hospitality! Another spectacular u-turn, they are stringing people along with ‘it’s only for a few weeks’ since March 2020 ffs

    247
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    Mute Peter
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    Jan 6th 2022, 9:10 AM

    @Eamonn Martin:

    Why can’t he just have been wrong instead of being called a liar?

    79
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    Mute Hear me now
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    Jan 6th 2022, 9:17 AM

    @Peter: He’s both!

    149
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    Mute Eamonn Martin
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    Jan 6th 2022, 9:32 AM

    @Peter: Sorry Peter, I forgot lies are for common folk and politicians are misunderstood or mistaken.
    Just like the time when only the politicians and the AG knew the correct rules around hospitality.

    129
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    Mute Cowboy Ted
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    Jan 6th 2022, 9:53 AM

    @Eamonn Martin:
    Someone said something months back, again this is Pandemic, rule change all the time

    48
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    Mute John Rock
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    Jan 6th 2022, 9:56 AM

    @Rob: follow the science not the politics..tics.

    21
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    Mute Eamonn Martin
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    Jan 6th 2022, 9:59 AM

    @Cowboy Ted: Very good Ted. Rules do change based on circumstances. Why then in nearly 2 years is our health service not better, why no actual health advise in this time.
    The public just keep paying the price for incompetence.

    90
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    Mute Gary Kearney
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    Jan 6th 2022, 11:23 AM

    @Eamonn Martin: |Restricting movement is not fascist it is control mechanism used by many different types of authoritarian systems.
    The Berlin Wall and the demilitarised zone in Korea being two perfect examples.
    Neither were controlled or installed by fascist. governments.
    China restricts movement very strongly in the pandemic
    I really thing you might want to apologise for not knowing what a fascist actually is..

    14
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    Mute Gary Kearney
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    Jan 6th 2022, 11:26 AM

    @Eamonn Martin: It is going to take a lot of work to get the health service into shape and they have been rather busy the last two years.

    6
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    Mute Gary Kearney
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    Jan 6th 2022, 11:29 AM

    @Aileen Lawlor: They are telling you what they know and they are following the current advice fro the medical experts, most of the time. Christmas 12 months they did not and we all saw what happened.
    If they say nothing it is a cover up and and the tin foil brigade are off and running.
    They say something and have to go back on it they are slaughtered over it. So it is a no win situation.

    9
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    Mute Eamonn Martin
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    Jan 6th 2022, 11:32 AM

    @Gary Kearney: It was your taoiceach that made that comment.

    50
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    Mute Tomo
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    Jan 6th 2022, 12:15 PM

    @John Rock: COVID vaccine passports have nothing to do with epidemiology or what people are now calling “the science”. It’s all political and psychological. Their basis may have originated loosely on science but their continuation has nothing to do with “the science”.

    71
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    Mute Bitcoin Buddy
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    Jan 6th 2022, 8:46 AM

    Where does it leave those who couldn’t get a PCR for the last fortnight (no recovery cert) and so now can’t get a Booster for the next 3 months ?

    330
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    Mute Keith Fay
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    Jan 6th 2022, 8:53 AM

    @Bitcoin Buddy: in limbo

    104
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    Mute Sam Harms
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    Jan 6th 2022, 9:05 AM

    @Bitcoin Buddy: if there is no official proof of you having covid just get your booster. The pharmacy where I had mine just ask if you have been diagnosed with covid in the last four weeks.

    76
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    Mute Niamh Brady
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    Jan 6th 2022, 9:19 AM

    @Bitcoin Buddy: If no record just get booster, my husband had it but didn’t do PCR (2 positive antigen tests) so got booster 6 weeks after that. No issues.

    35
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    Mute ChadChaderson
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    Jan 6th 2022, 9:24 AM

    @Bitcoin Buddy: countries like Australia are now not accepting recovery certs for those that use that instead of jabs .

    21
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    Mute Jacqueline berry
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    Jan 6th 2022, 11:08 AM

    @Sam Harms: having the vaccine so soon after covid increases the risk of side affects from the vaccine.

    55
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    Mute Niamh Brady
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    Jan 6th 2022, 11:17 AM

    @Jacqueline berry: No it doesn’t, it’s perfectly safe to have it once symptoms have gone.

    21
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    Mute Bitcoin Buddy
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    Jan 6th 2022, 11:20 AM

    @Niamh Brady: is that why the HSE say to wait 3 months ? ??

    53
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    Mute Niamh Brady
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    Jan 6th 2022, 11:26 AM

    @Bitcoin Buddy: No, believe me I read loads about getting it after Covid. CDC says 10 days after positive test, UK says 28 days. I also checked with doctor and said get it when offered it. He just happened to be 6 weeks, he had no side effects other than sore arm. He got Moderna and previously had Pfizer.

    14
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    Mute Gary Kearney
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    Jan 6th 2022, 11:30 AM

    @Jacqueline berry: Incorrect.

    10
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    Mute Gary Kearney
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    Jan 6th 2022, 11:31 AM

    @Bitcoin Buddy: Because you body has the antibodies that cleared the virus and you should not catch it for at least 3 months, it was 6 months bit they brought it in to be safer.

    8
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    Mute J
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    Jan 6th 2022, 12:00 PM

    @Bitcoin Buddy: If you haven’t had a positive PCR result then just ignore the 3 month thing. It’s not a medical reason. Waiting a month after you’ve had it should be fine according to CDC.

    8
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    Mute Sam Harms
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    Jan 6th 2022, 1:15 PM

    @Jacqueline berry: no it doesn’t. Some countries say you can have it as soon as you stop having symptoms.

    5
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    Mute JMcG
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    Jan 6th 2022, 1:23 PM

    @Jacqueline berry: That’s not true…

    4
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    Mute Jammy Mcgovern
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    Jan 6th 2022, 1:47 PM

    @Niamh Brady: why would I get a booster when I’ve already recovered from covid? Natural antibodies are proven to be far better protection than a booster vaccine.
    I’m in favour of vaccination but there has to come a point when it is a personal choice and people who choose not to be vaccinated are not discriminated against, especially when vaccine status has very little impact on someone’s ability to spread the virus.

    35
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    Mute Tina Kelly
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    Jan 6th 2022, 1:52 PM

    @Jacqueline berry: can you post a source for that claim please?

    1
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    Mute Niamh Brady
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    Jan 6th 2022, 2:19 PM

    @Jammy Mcgovern: mainly because previous Delta infection does not protect you from Omicron. Yes he would be fine if caught it again but he got it for me as I am high risk.

    3
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    Mute J
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    Jan 6th 2022, 2:59 PM

    @Jammy Mcgovern: To travel. Natural immunity is not better than a booster.

    3
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    Mute Koukliahills
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    Jan 6th 2022, 3:15 PM

    @Jacqueline berry: no it doesn’t DrJacqueline

    1
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    Mute David
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    Jan 6th 2022, 5:54 PM

    @Jammy Mcgovern: To be able to go for lovely creamy pints. Had Covid last week and that is the only reason I will be getting the booster if the pass is extended into the summer.

    1
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    Mute Bobbymerrigano
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    Jan 6th 2022, 8:46 AM

    Stick it up your hoop

    360
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    Mute Josepi
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    Jan 6th 2022, 9:24 AM

    @Bobbymerrigano: I second this!

    150
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    Mute Ian McDonald
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    Jan 6th 2022, 9:38 AM

    @Bobbymerrigano: good idea! That would work for those who don’t like needles.

    79
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    Mute Josepi
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    Jan 6th 2022, 12:32 PM

    @Ian McDonald: up the bum no harm done?

    8
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    Mute john doe
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    Jan 6th 2022, 10:54 AM

    Disgraceful chip chip chipping away at our rights. What is even more appalling is the way that they manipulate the population using half truths and promises of temporary measures that never go away. This is the most contemptuous attempt at leadership. Come out and tell us the truth not false promises of temporary measures.
    Civil liberties and freedoms being eroded every day and a propaganda campaign that Gobels would be proud of manipulating the public’s behaviour.

    I have a covid cert but have never and will never use it within my own country. It is shameful.

    278
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    Mute Sara McS
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    Jan 6th 2022, 11:14 AM

    @john doe: based on the phrasing of your second last sentence, will you use it in another country if you travel?

    23
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    Mute Gary Kearney
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    Jan 6th 2022, 11:35 AM

    @john doe: Some amount of Facebook and Youtube following you do.
    We are in a pandemic which means change and fast.

    21
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    Mute john doe
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    Jan 6th 2022, 11:45 AM

    @Sara McS: I would of course use a medical certificate to travel to another country if that is a requirement of entry. However I expect all citizens of my own country to have bodily autonomy and no additional rights based on medical status. The fact that this is even something else have to debate shows how well prop

    57
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    Mute Teresa O'Halloran
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    Jan 6th 2022, 11:52 AM

    @john doe: oh grow up!

    15
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    Mute john doe
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    Jan 6th 2022, 11:52 AM

    @Gary Kearney: excuse me, what? I don’t have an account with either do you?? I could reasonably assume that you spend too much time scrolling social media and this has reinforced the views you have been told to have.

    Or maybe you don’t. I don’t know anything about you nor you I. So let’s not waste time speculating on the type of person the other is and discuss the issues instead.

    53
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    Mute john doe
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    Jan 6th 2022, 11:57 AM

    @Teresa O’Halloran: how childish of me having principles that I am prepared to stand over.
    Everyone should just grow up, do what they are told and not bother speaking up for what they believe in.
    That would be a far easier world for you.

    55
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    Mute Hear me now
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    Jan 6th 2022, 12:47 PM

    @Teresa O’Halloran: is what he says not in accordance with everything you have read & believe about covid…shocking isn’t it…another point of view…what has the world come to!

    31
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    Mute Margaret
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    Jan 6th 2022, 3:02 PM

    @Teresa O’Halloran:

    if that’s your only argument against another person’s balanced, articulate and well thought out viewpoint, then its you who needs to “grow up”

    16
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    Mute JMcG
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    Jan 6th 2022, 4:21 PM

    @Gary Kearney: Nah..probably banned from both..parler I’d say.

    1
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    Mute Sara McS
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    Jan 6th 2022, 9:11 PM

    @john doe: you said “I will never use it within my own country” and that is what my question referred to – will you use it within another country to access hospitality etc?

    1
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    Mute Peter O'Muiri
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    Jan 8th 2022, 7:54 PM

    @john doe: You have “bodily autonomy” whatever that might have to do with covid certs. No one is interfering with your right to refuse any medical treatment. Moreover, there are many things you cannot do on medical grounds. Like driving if you fail the eyesight test.
    The vast majority who having seen the scientific evidence and social arguments have accepted the reasons why covid certs should be required for entry to certain social gatherings. You have a different view. You are entitled to it. You are also entitled to the view that people should be allowed decide for themselves whether they are fit to drive.

    1
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    Mute alan nolan
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    Jan 6th 2022, 12:10 PM

    I heard this was going to happen last year , I didn’t believe it at the time because most people just passed it off as tinfoil hat stuff

    122
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    Mute David Van-Standen
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    Jan 6th 2022, 12:34 PM

    @alan nolan: That’s the entire purpose of the tin foil hat or conspiracy theorist label, it is used as a catch all defence, to negate every single critic of a current government policy or its response to a set of circumstances, by placing them in a single group of ridicule.

    The majority of people get so caught up in laughing at the so called conspiracy theorists as a group, that they often miss the point at which, and are still laughing when it later become conspiracy fact and continue to regurgitate the same ridicule even after that point, because unable to process the new information, they develop a mental blind spot to it.

    131
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    Mute John Egan
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    Jan 6th 2022, 1:53 PM

    @David Van-Standen: exatcly. Like the anti-vax phrase. A BS slogan designed by Goverments and Media to slander anyone who’s apprehensive about a rushed trialed vaccine.

    66
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    Mute Peter O'Muiri
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    Jan 8th 2022, 8:07 PM

    @John Egan: Ah yes, another graduate from the Facebook Medical College. Thankfully, the vast majority have seen the scientific evidence and assessed the arguments put forward by the alumni of more run of the mill universities and have come to a different conclusion from you. But you of course know from Twitter that the evidence that supports your view has been suppressed by a huge international conspiracy of scientists, media, and politicians.

    1
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    Mute SquintEastwood
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    Jan 6th 2022, 10:23 AM

    Will this cert be required for 5yr olds up ?
    Will unvaccinated children be discriminated against now too if they wanted to somewhere

    125
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    Mute Brian Burns
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    Jan 6th 2022, 10:32 AM

    @SquintEastwood: soon as they get 90+% kids vaccinated- vaccine Certs for them too.

    52
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    Mute Éamonn ÓGallchobhair
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    Jan 6th 2022, 10:41 AM

    @SquintEastwood: Already happened for teens looking access to the cinema at Christmas.

    66
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    Mute Gary Kearney
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    Jan 6th 2022, 11:39 AM

    @SquintEastwood: discrimination meaning the unjust or prejudicial treatment of different categories of people, especially on the grounds of race, age, sex, or disability.
    None of that is happening.
    Wanting to know the vaccination status of people in the middle of a pandemic is considered best practise in Public Health practises.

    11
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    Mute David Van-Standen
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    Jan 6th 2022, 12:12 PM

    @Gary Kearney: This current legally definition of discrimination is held up as “proof” that anyone saying that treating people differently because of vaccination status is discriminatory, is legally incorrect.

    But this legal definition is from the pre covid19 vaccination world, so clearly it could not envison that our entire society would now be divided into two previously undetermined societal groups of vaccinated or unvaccinated.

    Excluding a group of people from fully participating in society or from have the same rights as everyone else, is morally wrong, regardless of the legal definition at any point in time.

    In the past discrimination against women and the LGBTQ were both perfectly legal and supported by the government, looking back now we can see it was obviously discrimination.

    72
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    Mute SquintEastwood
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    Jan 6th 2022, 2:05 PM

    @Gary Kearney: knowing somebody’s vaccine status means nothing when vaccinated people still transmit the virus,would you feel safe sitting in a room unmasked with only fully vaccinated and boosted people ?
    if not why not ?
    …Although the European Commission has admitted that there are no studies “expressly addressing” the effectiveness of boosters on the transmission of Covid-19…how can you justify this and still think it is not discrimination..it is more do as your told and not science..covid cert is more of a health hazard than a tool to stop spread of covid by allowing people spread freely once vaccinated..it was not people without certs that caused pubs and restaurants to shut early,if vaccine stopped transmission they would have some benefits but they don’t,so you would be happy seeing young unvaccinated kids pushed out of society just to make you feel a little safer(but no safer),i must tell my 10yr old GARY KEARNEY is to blame when she can’t go anywhere

    26
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    Mute SquintEastwood
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    Jan 6th 2022, 2:36 PM

    @Gary Kearney: you should know better if you believe what you say..”I speak up for disabled people like myself because I can and not all of us can. Not about me its about all of us.”…nobody should be treated differently for any reason,your sooo full of poo and selfishness you can’t see it

    15
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    Mute Locutus Of Borg
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    Jan 6th 2022, 12:22 PM

    What about the hoardes of people who had it lately and couldn’t get a PCR test to get confirmation. Are they now expected to get a booster for something they have just recovered from.

    49
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    Mute Kp Gumbo
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    Jan 6th 2022, 9:52 AM

    If someone can’t get vaccinated for medical reasons, is there an exemption ?

    38
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    Mute FactCheck Ireland
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    Jan 6th 2022, 9:57 AM

    @Kp Gumbo: A negative test or recovery cert also applies and entitles a person to the EU Digital Covid Certificate

    14
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    Mute Brian Burns
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    Jan 6th 2022, 10:01 AM

    @FactCheck Ireland: a negative doesn’t get you one

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    Mute Kp Gumbo
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    Jan 6th 2022, 10:12 AM

    @FactCheck Ireland: I was think more about eating out and the cinema ECT, thanks

    5
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    Mute Jacqueline berry
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    Jan 6th 2022, 11:21 AM

    @Brian Burns: you can get a 48hr covid pass if you pay €50 for an antigen test in participating chemists.

    7
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    Mute Gary Kearney
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    Jan 6th 2022, 11:40 AM

    @Kp Gumbo: Yes and this has been stated from the very start of the vaccine campaign

    4
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    Mute Stop the Lights
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    Jan 6th 2022, 11:58 AM

    @Kp Gumbo: I don’t believe there is in Ireland. But there’s plenty in the same situation, so surely they’ll have to stay using them here. I believe similar exist in other countries, like Poland, as far as i know

    2
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    Mute lelookcoco
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    Jan 6th 2022, 9:24 AM

    Good news for people travelling in EU countries who already deem those vaccinated early or with Janssen to be unvacinnated until their booster jab is included on the cert.

    26
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    Mute Jonathan
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    Jan 6th 2022, 8:41 AM

    I want a digital one.

    25
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    Mute Dave Hammond
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    Jan 6th 2022, 12:23 PM

    The very same people that pontificate about the W.H.O and point to them as giving advice that should be followed are all the same people who want to ignore the WHO specific request for the first world countries moving onto 3rd and 4th doses of vaccines when so much of the world hadn’t had one shot and the whole lot of them are hypocrites – people who have had covid do not need booster shots – but its grand let’s wait til the next contentious issue arises and same people will point to what the WHO suggest to suit their narrative – hypocrites

    49
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    Mute Colum Quinn
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    Jan 6th 2022, 8:55 PM

    This has nothing to do with health anymore.

    This is your digital ID.
    In the future everything will be linked to it…………………….your academic results, your financial information, medical records, your social welfare, your criminal record, your driving license, your passport.
    You will need it to access every gov service.
    Oh…..and your very own “carbon credits” will be linked to it.

    Wait and see.
    Its already in the works and you can read about it on the World economic forums website.

    16
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute J
    Favourite J
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    Jan 6th 2022, 11:59 AM

    If you haven’t had a positive PCR result then just ignore the 3 month thing. It’s not a medical reason. Waiting a month after you’ve had it should be fine according to CDC.

    5
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute James Johnson
    Favourite James Johnson
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    Jan 6th 2022, 8:55 PM

    Seriously..
    This actually shows how bad we are as a country when it comes to these type of things.
    Too many depts and not one talking to one another..
    In France you get your Booster etc and within 2 or 3 hrs you have your cert.
    I am waiting weeks for mine go figure.

    2
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