We need your help now
Support from readers like you keeps The Journal open.
You are visiting us because we have something you value. Independent, unbiased news that tells the truth. Advertising revenue goes some way to support our mission, but this year it has not been enough.
If you've seen value in our reporting, please contribute what you can, so we can continue to produce accurate and meaningful journalism. For everyone who needs it.
Sign in. It’s quick, free and it’s up to you.
An account is an optional way to support the work we do. Find out more.
By continuing, you are indicating that you accept our Terms of Service and Privacy Policy.
FIANNA FÁIL WILL hear from an expert in gender politics today ahead of gender quotas coming in for the 2016 General Election.
Political parties will be required to ensure that at least 30% of their candidates are women – any party that fails to reach the target will have its state funding cut by 50%.
Just 27 of Ireland’s 166 TDs are female with Fianna Fáil senator Averil Power describing Leinster House as a “really weird” place to work due to the lack of women.
So today we’re asking, Do you think we need more women in politics?
To embed this post, copy the code below on your site
Gender quotas would be the worst possible thing for women in politics. Any woman in the Dail will be assumed to be there because of her sex rather than on merit.
Blonde jokes, will be doing the rounds and wine sales will rocket!
West coast cooler sales more like
“Lap-gate” already shows how women are looked upon in the Dail. A female TD is someone to pull onto your lap and smack on the ass when you are drunk at work.
Parachuting more women in is not going to increase their standing or reputation.
Yeah… Though I hardly think it involves pointing at a random woman in the street and saying “You! You have a vagina. You’ll do.” I really don’t think just ANY woman can get a place in politics.
I think some people have a misunderstanding of the way gender quotas will work here. It just means that if a party is standing two people for election in a constituency then one will have to be a woman. They will still have to be voted for, nobody is parachuting anyone in anywhere!
No, Reg. We understand it.
Politics is a demanding job and has very little job security in the long term. At present only very committed people are willing to run and more men than women are that committed to that job. It’s a job that comes with lots of power and responsibility and yet doesn’t pay particularly well. Many people who become TDs take a pay cut in doing so. To do that you need to value power quite a lot. in my experience men value power much more than women do.
Gender quotas will put candidates in place who are less committed and/or less qualified than the people who are pushed out. Pure and simple.
Reg if you control who gets on the ballot you don’t need to control the vote because the result is already fixed
Joanna, that’s the only qualification required
I’m in two minds about this, gender quotas seem to be a ‘band aid’ solution to the problem – but maybe it will turn out to be a good start and many more women in the future will get into politics and gender quotas will not be needed then
Also the women who take advantage of a gender quota to gain selection could well turn out to be a whole lot better than the current bunch of self entitled gombeens in politics
And politcal parties don’t already control who they choose to represent them on the ballot Silver Planet?
You think political parties won’t select women?
At the last General Election FF & FG both had around 15% female candidates, Labour had 27%
Amongst independents, where there is no selection process, women comprised 8%. So the three biggest parties’ selection processes are putting women forward at 2-3 times the rate they put themselves forward
No I don’t think that at all. But now they will have to select more female candidates.
Surely lap gate teaches us lessons about MEN’s standing in Dáil Éireann and in politics, not women’s
Luke nothing is ever that pure and simple
Sorry ‘Jake’, not Luke
Eilis. if you are going to tarnish the entire male political population as a result of an isolated incident, some introspection may not go astray on your behalf.
As I’ve pointed out, Reg, they were already doing that
There are a lot of “Vaginas” in the Dail already!
It says more about the TD then Leinster House.
We need better people in the Dail regardless of gender
I was looking for that option on the list
Gender quotas are simply undemocratic there’s nothing else that needs to be said
The measure is undemocratic on parties but no more undemocratic than the geography quotas imposed for decades by parties themselves.
Don’t forget that voters in the ballot boxes still have the final say on which candidates get elected. There is no quota on voters.
Besides, the Irish system allows men aggrieved by not being selected by their party to run as an independent if they truly believe they have something to offer – thus potentially increasing the choice for voters. This was already seen in the local elections.
How is geography a quota? Surely one represents ones own area as you have a vested interest in promoting and furthering it, therefore doing your job as a representative properly and getting reelected.
It is more difficult to get elected as an independent than with the support of a party machine behind you as the structure is already in place. We elected more independents than ever in the last election as people were disillusioned with the previous government and distrustful of the alternative. Such a high showing is unlikely again.
gender quota is a ridiculous idea it’s completely undemocratic , it’s like the bbc saying amy comedy panel show has to have at least 1 woman on the panels and it’s just led to those women be ridiculed as the quota token
If gender quotas happen, I will never again vote for a woman.
Why?
Because I believe that gender quotas are a load of arse, that’s why. Basically what they are saying is that every political party must put enough women forward solely because they are women. Not because they might be the best person for the job or the most knowledgable in their field but because they are a woman. It means that more suitable male politicians could be left out in the cold because they were born male. It’s ridiculous
I agree. The last vote I gave was to Mary Moran in dundalk. I voted for her because I thought she would do a good job. Not because she was a woman. Anybody who votes based on gender is an idiot.
@ Brandon:
By refusing to vote for ANY woman regardless of her suitability, you are being just as bad as the parties you decry. I am sure you have the tools necessary at your disposal to assess whether the female candidates are up to scratch or not.
And what about the geography quotas already placed on candidate selection in many areas e.g. three candidates are to be selected – one from the north of the county, one from the south and one from the east. Quotas of different types have been in place since the foundation of the state.
Maybe so ryan, but the way I see it is, if gender quotas happen, any woman who does get elected to office will be seen as only achieving this because of her sex which is also very unfair.
My boss, a female entrepreneur, often gets invited to rallys and conferences based on females in the workplace. Her business was also offered a grant SOLELY to boast about her business because she was a girl. It was part of a females in IT campaign earlier this year. She never accepted the grant and hates attending these rallys as it just highlights the fact that she is not a man. She finds it degrading.
If you vote for someone simply because they are a woman, then you’re a sexist. It’s that simple.
The Person for the Job ,
Man or Woman
Let the voters decide
Who pick’s the woman, for the job and it will be men. So they’ll pick the one, who won’t challenge them and will sit on their lap!
Gender quotas are a very insulting proposal.
What about winning an election on merit?
I suppose we need gender quotas for all occupations now then ? bin men, plumbers, farmers, bus drivers
No we don’t.
But when a group that makes up approx 50% of our population makes up only 15% our supposedly “representative” parliament, something needs to be done to change that.
Why? It’s more important that a range of ideas are heard in the Dáil than a range genitals are in place
Everyone is represented by the people they elect. Their sex is no more important than their skin colour
For me, it’s more important that a range of experiences – including female experiences.
Individual women, like individual men, have different experiences to go with their different opinions and different policies.
Bobo the clown
We need better politicians regardless of their gender. If the people want more women let them vote them in
As a card carrying feminist, I give an emphatic no to gender quotas. I despise the damn things !!
The best person should get the job, then gender can’t be blamed.
Equal opportunities are important but they don’t guarantee an equal result. Manipulating elections to get a result you like isn’t equality.
The numbers of I dependent candidates indicate that fewer women than men are interested in a political career.
‘The numbers of I dependent candidates indicate that fewer women than men are interested in a political career.”
And why is that? Are they put off by the lack of female role models already in politics? Or the way of working which was designed by men?
Wow they seem really easily put off. I wouldn’t want someone that callow speaking for me
Two consecutive, two term presidents… They might be role models.
Mary Harney, founding member and leader of her party, Tanaiste.
Joan Burton, leader of her party and Tanaiste.
Mary Lou McDonald, Deputy Leader of her Party, former MEP.
Not exactly an extensive list but they are undeniably political role models (whether you agree with them or not) and shockingly, women.
I don’t like this “we need more women in politics” thing that gets chucked out, we need the right people in politics, irrespective of gender.
For instance, if a party believes the two strongest candidates in a constituency are men, then they should be run by the party, if they are women, then of course the same applies.
Seán – Mary Robinson left office before the end of her first term. Harney was leader of an always small and now defunct party. Burton is newly elected as leader of a party in crisis while McDonald is a former MEP (so what) who has achieved …. eh nothing really.
Only thing I’ll concede there is that I misspoke,
I had meant to write 2 consecutive and 1 two term presidents.
Harney’s party allowed her the balance of power. Small yes, but most definitely powerful.
How long does a woman need to be in a job to show people that women can attain that job, also I’d point out that she only got there by virtue of her popularity, which kinda makes her a role model, no?
Equally, McDonald is Deputy Leader of her party, a very visible and well thought of (although that part irks me). As well as being a former MEP, Having run and lost once she kept things moving, by going to Europe and returned and successfully won a seat in the Dáil.
I don’t like her party politics, but if you wanna take a look at women in politics, she is undeniably deserving of a mention.
As Chris Rock once said “If women ruled the world, there would be no wars…. Just a bunch of countries not talking to each other”
Power should keep her mouth shut and quit the sensationalism – after all FF have zero female TD’s. Then again that means no Coughlan, Hanafin or Mary O Rourke in the Dail and that is certainly a good thing.
What, women like Joan Burton, Lucinda Creighton, Frances Fitzgerald, Regina Doherty, Michelle Mulherin, Ciara Conway, Kathleen Lynch?
While a better gender balance would be welcome, we need TDs looking after the interests of Women OUTSIDE the Dail rather than more women inside the dail for the sake of it, who will continue to hammer women and children while protecting the wealthy.
Look at Roisin Shortall. She should be leading Labour right now.
Jaysus no! 27 is more than enough.
I want to get into politics, whose with me?
If that is your best English, I’m afraid not and good luck anyway!
You play your violin and I’ll do the rap
What party you join I wouldn’t give a crap
The four seasons I must say is a really nice tune
But to show off my vocal skill I would sing you “Song to the moon”
Be careful of the creeps though especially the FG guys who use the journal app.
Interesting that majority of people commenting on this are men. As a woman who considered politics but was put off by the behind the back envelopes and men’s club ideas, its nice to see that there is a desire to have more women fairly placed in positions of power (ie. no gender quotas, but elected on hard work). More women are needed in politics.
Oh for gods sake here we go again with the passive-aggressive “it’s interesting that the majority of commentators are men” line
The majority of comments in general on this site are from men so it’s just a continuation of the norm. It’s open to anyone to comment and more men CHOOSE to get involved, kinda like politics. It’s choice in action.
There’s no conspiracy, no sexism. If anything, this site has a pronounced feminist bias.
Yes certainly …and younger! who would be in tune with today’s problems and get rid of all the old fashioned so called politicians !!
Currently the women in politics are as irritating as the men. Could we maybe give transexual politicians a try, or better still bloody eunachs, at least they wont create useless political dynasties.
We don’t need more women just less men! We have a ridiculous number of TDs! With the whip system their opinions don’t count a small group in the executive introduce and decide on the legislation
Gender balance is important but not as much as TD’s in the Dail for 30+ years. We need a max time a person can be a TD, they loose perspective after too long
Interesting that those who protest most about this measure are men…
…interesting that those who protest most are more interest in quality than a forced non-democratic arrangement you mean.
As someone said, the majority of comments here are male – this isn’t mandated either. Nothing to stop women participating.
Lets say 50% of candidates are mandated to be women in an election, for argument purposes. What if the electorate don’t vote for them (in sufficient numbers), even as a sign of protest, and they fail to meet election quotas. Will they still get seats in the Dáil then ? So they’d be the parliament, on the back of no votes at all ? And that’s democracy is it ?
No. No gender quotas, but no barriers either, simples.
Maybe that’s because it’s men who will be unfairly penalised through the implementation of gender quotas.
so true daffy, when for example has ‘gender quoting’ ever resulted in anything other than an increase in costs for all ? same in car insurance, the law was changed so that women were given equality, did the price of mens car insurance drop? no womens insurance increased to bring it level .
could care less , can we have a constitution that protects us from politicians?
Gender quotas are not unfair. That’s a fact. Quotas will actually go some way towards alleviating the systemic discrimination that exists in our politics towards women. Old boys club parties such as FG and FF will never change unless they are obligated to do so.
And all this talk of merit, you’d swear that we’ve a Dail full of top class politicians. It wasn’t for women’s presence in the Dail that Ireland got itself into a huge financial crisis. Considering the parochial nature of our political system, it is so designed to attract individuals of rather self-serving intentions. Least quotas can ensure that half of the incompetent TDs we’ll have in the future will be female. And numerous studies have reflected upon the benefits of a gender balance at senior levels in all kinds of environments.
“Gender quotas are not unfair. That’s a fact”
Fact ?? Proof please, or your post is complete BS.
It wasn’t women’s presence that caused the crash? 3/4 of the budget was being controlled by women at the time, as the then-Táiniste pointed out.
I’m not saying women caused it but they didn’t stop it either
John, I won’t even bother dropping a knowledge bomb on you here but instead ask you to prove the reverse. Show us how exactly men are doing a sterling job of running things.
I’ll bet everything I own that the building you’re in now was designed & built by men, the lighting & heating was done by men, the device you’re reading this on was designed by a man and I know for a fact the Internet itself was designed by a man
Silver Planet, apart from that meaning nothing. I’m so happy you said that. I’m actually in a building designed by my girlfriends mother and interior designed by my girlfriend. The bricks and mortar laid by men as one should rightly expect.
I’ll further state that everything but electrical, plumming and kitchen was fitted by her
“The bricks and mortar laid by men as one should rightly expect”
Know your place, men!
And it doesn’t mean nothing. You live in a world built by men. Your standard of living is only maintained by the sweat of men (which you seem to think is their responsibility merely by being born male) you have men to think for the technology that cushions your existence from cradle to grave and the blanket of security you live under. So yeah, men have done a sterling job
Ehh yeah, that’s how the two sex species works you clown, the both perform different functions in order to gain mutual advantage. If we were the same we wouldn’t have gone anywhere because we’d be performing the same tasks. Clown.
It doesn’t matter how often you re-use the word “clown”, men still built the world for you
No, you’re just a clown. Do do doo do do do
We need less politicians in Ireland
There should definitely be more women in politics but there are far better ways to bring that about than gender quotas. There’s all kinds of barriers to women getting involved and these should be removed first and foremost.
In the immortal words of John Giles, you have to take them on their merits.
Gender quotas are undemocratic!
its not more women we need in irish politics its more honesty, more openness and more transparency ! a corrupt ,lying and self serving politician is the same no matter what their gender !
Vote for the best candidate regardless of quota’s.
Maybe theres some very intelligent woman out there and men in the dail might find that a threat? ..
They need to get elected, who’ll select them and will they be selected for their intelligence?
Well done, a star for your effort!
Can we have this introduced into education/customer service/childcare/manual labour/entrance into tertiary education/CEO roles/mechanics/carpenter/electrician/stone mason/and a lot more things where the genders are all unbalanced!?
So we replace the problem of not having a certain percentage of women in the Dail with a perception problem that women who are in the Dail by merit will be forever tainted by the ”only there by quota” argument?
Gender quotas are unfair? So the fact that women only make up 27 of 166 TD’s means what – women are inherently inferior? Less able for the job? In an ideal world we wouldn’t need quotas – but here we are.
That’s a monumentally poor argument.
For a start, who is saying that TDs are superior beings?
Aine, nobody’s saying that. Less women put themselves forward so less are elected. There are gender disparities in other occupations but there’s no outcry for more female brickies. We should be trying to find common ground, not always seeking ways of division. Anyone who votes a candidate purely on gender (either way) doesn’t deserve a vote.
we need to look at why the main parties never put women forward instead of simple box ticking exercises like gender quotas
this is all completely irrelevant. We need trustworthy politicians who wont sell us down the river. Gender doesn’t make a blind bit of difference. Jesus i would vote for ET if he came and did a better job than the shower there now
I don’t think it is a gender issue, sure we could do with more women in politics, but even more crucially we need people from more varied backgrounds. There are too many school teachers and solicitors in the Dail, not to mention the nepotism that seems to be rife in Ireland. I have no interest in a female candidate, if she only got a chance at running just because she is, (a) a dead or ex-politician’s daughter/sister or (b) she was picked because she was the only woman in the party/area willing to run.
we need intelligent honest people gender is irrelevent
The majority of people who want to lead, probably shouldn’t. Second there is a stark difference between how men and women do things. I don’t know when this notion of ‘we are the same’ came about but it’s not really correct. We do things very differently as per our role. Men tend to take what they want where as women work together to get it. It’s dominance versus cooperative advancement. I’ll cover that by saying men and women often don’t work all that well together but that’s just how biology works. The World is dominated by politics which is dominated by males and I don’t think anyone can argue that it’s working out well. Now don’t start throwing examples at me of how Joan Burton is a wench or how your office works really well or whatever your personal experience is, there’s 7 billion people in the world so it means nothing and there are varying breadths of exception to every rule. As far as I can discern for myself, the closet thing to an absolute rule is that there is always an exception so it’s rubbish. We’re talking big picture here. Ireland could use far more women making decisions.
Men can’t handle co-operation? So the panama dam, d-day landings and team sport; that was all women, was it?
No one said men can’t handle cooperation Bobo but anywayyy. D-day was necessary because a man was looking to dominate Europe, team sport is about dominating the opponent, Panama Canal I think you’re referring to was built so as that the US could dominate trade in the region after a failed attempt by the French to built it and operate the route first. You really don’t think about these things do you.
And women participate in team sport?
Each sex has the perfect ability to be cooperative or dominant, it is just a biologically preferred function. Not that they would teach you any of this in clown college.
Quotas are always a disaster; for a very good example look at what has happened in South Africa where every government influenced appointment is based on race and sex. Instead of growing at 5% – 10% per year as possible when the best people available regardless of race or sex are placed in all positions of responsibility, South Africa now has a stagnant economy and increasing youth unemployment as the wives, daughters and mistresses of ANC party members get richer and fatter in well-paid jobs for which they have very limited ability.
During the last local election, there was a female politician whose goals were to increase the amount of women in politics and stand up for women of the area. That’s all fine and dandy but, the area isn’t just full with women, there’s men there too. As with most of the comments in this section are stating: if someone can do the job properly, then let them do it, regardless of gender, race, religious background, or if they live on a different planet.
The problem is, of all the female politicians that are currently in the Oireachtas, with the exception of Lucinda Creighton and Fidelma Healy Eames, there are none with real intellect or guts.
This suggests to me that the answer has to be No, because until we get better quality female Oireachtas members from among the numbers that are already going into politics, then we don’t need to fill the Oireachtas with more just for the sake of it. We need better quality people going into politics, regardless of their gender. Where are the Irish Margaret Thatchers, for example? They don’t exist sadly, and that’s why I’m opposed to bringing in more mediocre people just because they happen to be “women”.
Roisin Shortall would get my vote any day of the week, were she in my constituency.
We just need good politicians, doesnt matter if they’re male or female.
What we need is less politicians in politics! The majority are dead weight the minority are stifled underneath the gelatinous mound of over paid numties!
What woman in her right mind would want to play in the Dail daily.
Listen to long winded speeches and follow rules and more rules.
Democracy is an illusion of freedom anyway.Its all decided long before we sheeple vote.
also how is it undemocratic, it doesn’t matter who the party stand as they have to follow party policy anyway
We need more women in the kitchen.. Get back in there you!!
Seriously?who gives a Donald duck?
Tired old argument about how the lack of women in politics is some how a fault of society, not that women are not joining the political parties in the same numbers. Plus its not women hating to point out there are no barriers to joining or standing. This whining about the odd and it is odd late night is an excuse as nurses have late nights. So maybe the question should be asked why they don’t get involved and maybe they should just get out there and join in.
have your say