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A ROW IS brewing over an email response from the public relations representative for the Bon Secours sisters, Terry Prone, about the Tuam babies site.
The email was sent in response to a request for an interview with Sr Marie Ryan of the Bon Secours nuns by documentary maker Saskia Weber. She is making a documentary for France 2 about the Tuam babies and mother and baby homes in Ireland.
In response to Weber’s interview request, the high profile Irish PR representative responded with the following email:
Terry Prone
Bon SecoursYour letter was sent on to me by the Provincial of the Irish Bon Secours congregation with instructions that I should help you. I’m not sure how I can. Let me explain.When the “O My God – mass grave in West of Ireland” broke in an English-owned paper (the Mail) it surprised the hell out of everybody, not least the Sisters of Bon Secours in Ireland, none of whom had ever worked in Tuam and most of whom had never heard of it.If you come here, you’ll find no mass grave, no evidence that children were ever so buried, and a local police force casting their eyes to heaven and saying “Yeah, a few bones were found – but this was an area where Famine victims were buried. So?”Several international TV stations have aborted their plans to make documentaries, because essentially all that can be said is “Ireland in the first half of the twentieth century was a moralistic, inward-looking, anti-feminist country of exagerrated religiousity.”Which most of us knew already.The overwhelming majority of the surviving Sisters of Bon Secours in Ireland are over eighty. The handful (literally) still in active ministry are in their seventies. None of them is an historian or sociologist or theologian and so wouldn’t have the competence to be good on your programme.If you’d like me to point you at a few reputable historians who might be good, I’ll certainly do that.
Terry Prone (Ms)
Chairman
The Communications Clinic
Speaking to TheJournal.ie, Prone confirmed she had sent the email, but said there was “absolutely no difference” between the substance of it, and public pronouncements made by the Bon Secours sisters.
“The sisters never knew anything about it,” she added.
The email in question first emerged last week, when Kevin Higgins, a solicitor who is helping women who stayed in the home, shared it on his Twitter account.
[image alt="terry prone letter saskia" src="http://cdn.thejournal.ie/media/2014/10/terry-prone-letter-saskia-369x500.jpg" width="369" height="500" credit-url="https%3A%2F%2Ftwitter.com%2FBoglawyer%2F" credit-source="Kevin%20Higgins" class="alignnone" /end]
“I was very, very shocked when I received it,” Weber told TheJournal.ie in relation to the tone of the email. “I couldn’t believe it.”
Weber said she had contacted the nuns of the Bon Secours with a request to interview Sr Marie Ryan, the country leader of the Bon Secours.
The woman who she spoke to “was very open”, said Weber. The filmmaker was instructed, she said, to send her request by email to Prone, who was looking after public relations for the religious organisation.
“I thought oh my God, something was going to happen. I sent my email with my request, it was a very, very formal request.”
Weber received the response, published in full above, within five days. She has not responded to Ms Prone’s email.
“I could have just insisted [on getting the interview] but I don’t think [anything] is going to happen,” she said. She added that she had received a negative response from all the dioceses she wrote to when setting up interviews for the documentary.
A previous letter from the Bon Secours order shows that the sisters were aware of a grave site at the Tuam home, and a child being buried there.
In 2012, Country Leader of the order, Sister Marie Ryan, wrote to a unnamed woman whose brother, John Desmond Dolan, is listed on the death register at the home. The letter was posted on Twitter by Daily Mail journalist Alison O’Reilly in September.
I note that [John Desmond] unfortunately died on 11 June 1947 and the death certificate seems to indicate that the place of death was at the Home. As I understand it there would therefore be a very good possibility that his remains were buried at the small cemetery at the Home itself. This is located at the back of the Home and was operated as a general grave.
Speaking on RTÉ’s Drivetime this evening, researcher Catherine Corless said the Bon Secours order had recently told her they had no awareness of a grave “in the area” of the home.
She was therefore “astonished” to hear that Sister Ryan had mentioned, in 2012, the burial of a child at the rear of the home.
The government established a Commission of Investigation into the home in July.
- Additional reporting Dan MacGuill
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That has to be one of the worst examples of so called professorial writing I have ever seen! A junior cert student would have been more polished. And don’t get me started on the content….an absolute disgrace.
Can she sink any lower? OMFG
Terry Prone – Exhibit A in the Trial of her parents and teachers.
It surely has to be a crime to turn out someone like that on to society.
Few Junior Cert students would pen a piece of prose as poor as that.
yes, she could sink to your level OM?G but she won’t
Aisling — I’m just a normal person trying to do my best. I could go down the list of what Prone is responsible for but my comment would be deleted.
Kate, in 1960 my brother was already buried before the nuns told my mother casually that her baby had died. They had no compassion as all. Even by their standards a baptised baby is entitled to a proper burial. This is not history to me and my family; it is our present. I should have a brother with me now. My mother mourns her beautiful baby boy every single day.
Carmel, sorry to hear of the trauma your mother and you also must have gone through at your brother’s death. And yes, as a carefully brought up Catholic (lapsed now) I was astonished to think that baptised children would be buried in unconsecrated ground never mind what was actually found at the site.
Apart from the obvious issue of whether or not the Bons Secours Sisters worked in Tuam, I find the tone of Ms Prone’s email utterly derisory. When she says the ‘O My God- mass grave in Tuam’, she attempts to belittle, dismiss and mock the finding of remains at the burial site in Tuam. Ms Prone may find this finding amusing, those of us who were born in institutions do not. Neither do the women who were forced to give birth in the most appalling conditions, physically, emotionally, and medically. Above all, Ms Prone’s letter is denigrating to those women whose babies died in those institutions, and their families. Shame on Ms Prone and her supporters.
As distasteful as that email is it has let one important bit of information slip. People who might be responsible for this ARE still alive. Now there is a potential crime scene and suspects. Time to excavate the site and question those who were present at the time.
“This is located at the back of the Home and was operated as a general grave.”
so basically what they mean is they put the body in a mass unmarked hole in the ground, not even good enough for a proper “catholic” burial
“Prone confirmed she had sent the email, but said there was “absolutely no difference” between the substance of it, and public pronouncements made by the Bon Secours sisters.”
Well, quite. Since she represents the Bon Secours sisters it’s hardly a shock that their public pronouncements are the same.
She does have a point which also struck me very earlier in the life of this story, there’s one key element missing from it all…material evidence.
If bones were found in the garden of a house and they could be dated to when a particular person lived in the house that person would have serious questions to answer.
Does Terry Crone control the Journal too because my comment about her seems to have been deleted.
Mine too (previous one, unless the second one is gone too by now). I think she makes people nervous.
Im expecting mine to be now
The Government would rather not investigate because the Irish State was also involved in these disgusting inhumane acts of Religious barbarity.
This censorship of comments is a farce. What does Prone have on The Journal?
Why did the parents and grandparents not give their own flesh and blood a proper burial ?
@Kate. They’re lies the inconvenient truth – Society in general during these times are every as much to blame as the church and the state, but people prefer to point fingers
Kate and John – oh dear, the church forcibly removed many of these babies from poor, vulnerable women who were often not notified that their children were dead.
Everyone deserted them John X ,the local politicians, Gardai, Teachers ,the legal profession, the local doctors and yet blame is all dumped on the nuns ,,should be shared out equally among the lot of them …
Expect to see the whole article disappear soon.
The tentacles of prone extend to all corners of Irish media
And lets not forget Irish society at large Kate Ellen. Most people acquiesced with what was evident in Irish society at the time, some, maybe a majority approved of the vilification of young people, girls in particular; who fell foul of the prevailing moral standards but of course no one wanted to stand out from the moral consensus. Of course it has parallels today, where people are forced to keep silent for fear of becoming victims of the moral or political correct simultaneity.
Still so many apologists, defenders and deflectors.
Jeez. To phrase this in a manner that seems befitting of her compositional capacity: that writing is fair shite.
The content of the email is also remarkably blunt considering it was sent by a PR pro on such a sensitive topic. Mudder a Gad.
Well if there’s noting in that field the sisters and the church should have nothing to fear from an investigation then. They’re not acting like an innocent party at all.
Why is anyone surprised?
This attitude is typical of all the orders of nuns who ran Mother & Baby homes. Lie, deny, blame the victims, down play the issue, refuse to pay redress, etc. Standard response at this stage. Boycott the entire church and don’t give them a cent ever again. Turn their love of money against them. Money is their only God..
With prone handling most of irelands PR,and her husband tom savage a bigwig at rte they really did/do tell us what we need to know!
You forgot good little Antoine on Today FM aswell. Denis looking after his own. I turn th radio off after what happened with that young lady some years ago. Disgusting.
In relation to the above event. If you search for Communications clinic /Irish times apology, you will find an article written by the journal.ie about the event. Now surely this post can’t be deleted?? I am merely pointing to The Journals own article.
Sheik are your posts being deleted?
Yes indeed. Any mention of CC / certain music station100.9 FM,will result in deletion. Think thats my 5th post deleted. If there is nothing wrong in what TP & the organistion does why is censorship necessary?
It’s fantastic that we get to blame the Catholic Church and not the Irish people who sent them there.
Irish people are incredibly hypocritical and love to blame other people.
I can’t wait to see Irish people blaming the staff of the direct provision centres.
The Irish people were terrified of the catholic church, some still are, you under estimate the brainwashing that people were forced to live through in schools and every aspect of Irish Life until recently. The Catholic Church is a very domineering oppressive sect that many people still find it very hard to leave. They still control most of our Primary schools. Everybody is aware of the child rape and how the church fed pedophile priests new victims. If it was any other organization it would be outlawed…..but they are masters in brainwashing and deception they still have the very attentive ear of the Government.
The people who took those girls there assumed they were being properly looked after and not being dropped to the gates of hell. The religious orders were paid the the same as the average industrial wage to do so per child. I wouldn’t completly clear them of blame but going against the local parish priest could result in you and the rest of your family being boycotted by the community through their own fear of the same happening to them.
The religious orders lied as to how these girls and their babies were treated. They made huge amounts of money through from the government and through using these girls as slave labour.These were industrial laundries where everything was washed by hand. They serviced some of the biggest hotels and hospitals in the country.
Healthy children were often sold to the US and other countries.’Defective’ children were often left alone to let ‘nature take its course’.
The church controlled the population through fear including the politicans and judges.They could literally destroy a politican from the pulpit.Look at what they did to Noel Browne.Imagine what they could have done to the man on the street or his family.Alot of the female commentators on this site would have quite possibly sent to these places for standing up to them up as far as the 1970′s.The church ruled this country with an iron grip through fear backed with massive wealth made on the backs of the most vunerable.Now they are trying desperatly to cover these crimes.
The Irish people were ruled with a rod of iron by the Church. The parish priest was the supreme authority. What he said went. People were afraid to go against him and many were brainwashed into sincerely believing everything the priest said. I can remember when the be-all and end-all of mothers in particular was to have a son a priest and a daughter a nun. With better education and a window to the outside world we can now make up our own minds rather than being said and lead by narrow minded bigots
“The people who took those girls there assumed they were being properly looked after and not being dropped to the gates of hell.”
Yeah and I’m the Queen of Sheeba.
We didn’t care and we didn’t want to know.
Different times David.
The church set the parameters then. Not now. And that I say as someone who has respect for and believe only a small percentage of people are responsible but protected. A bit like politics really.
seen her on tv a good few times and heard her on radio i always classed her a chancer and a pain in the hole.
She ( prune) could of wrote it better. (spelling mistake intended,)
to which spelling mistake do you refer? there are more than one. And your grammar is not good either.
Wow. Ironically though, after that show of PR form I’d bet her phone wont stop ringing…..
I’m quite sure the good sisters have been to confession and that makes everything just fine ….
Communications clinic AKA Terry Prone – the official mouthpiece for a certain political party…yes Enda i can help u with ur state of the nation speech!
What’s the chance this will be covered on Sunday morning radio by that host whose name slips my mind?
P.
And maybe when he is on TodayFM as stand-in some afternoon’s/evening’s? Isn’t it coincidental how Communicorp and Communications Clinic have a similar ring to them?
Mine too.it appears we cant mention what happened at the communications clinic a few years back
Grand so the RCC have nothing to worry about from a full and frank investigation. Too little so far heard from this case
I think Terry Prone is absolutely spot-on in what she wrote.
Explain how?
I think what she said was disgusting and unconscionable. I never had much time for her after her last few appearances on the Late Late. I have none now.
In response to TheTruth: because if there’s physical evidence it hasn’t been found yet, if there’s evidence let’s set up a judicial inquiry and find it. Until then this story is classic example of trial-by-media.
This is about Terry Prone and her lack of professionality, not about the nuns . Keep the comments on her
That was my first thought too…what a horrendously infantile piece of writing from a supposed communications guru.
I’d imagine the PR guru will need a PR guru.
*What in the hell is a PR guru anyway? I got the PR part but ‘guru’?*
She’s got a point, Foxy
I think Saskia, for balance and historical context, might consider producing a series of film documentaries covering all of Europe’s Catholic countries, during the era in question, on this very sensitive subject.
Looking back through the prism of 2014 societal values, while tragic and shameful, it’s all a bit ridiculous.
Terry is right! It’s one for the historians.
It never ok to do this.Not in 2014 or 1954 or 1854. People are still alive that experienced this.Mothers whose children who were burried in a septic tank or sold abroad.There is a fairly good chance those responsible are still alive too.Saying that we are now moralising through the eyes of a different time is insulting.
By no means is this one for the historians. Many of the women who suffered in these institutions (my own birth mother included) and children who witnessed or experienced some of the events; abuse, forced labour and mental, physical and sexual abuse are still alive. The last mother and baby home and Magdalene laundry were only closed down about twenty five or so years ago. Not very long ago at all.
I suggest you read Camel ‘ s comment above. Then come back and tell us how “ridiculous ” it can be.
To clarify. I have no idea whether my birth mother is alive or not. I was including her in those who suffered in a mother and babies home. I tried to trace her but was stonewalled with lies even down to being told my date of birth had been made up
the stock answer sure it was different times back then bollix.
Instead of pointing fingers in every direction it would be much more worthwhile to seek the truth I ask anyone to express their personal acceptance of not wishing to know how they died where they died and whom had. Such authority to bury them surely as a member of the human race you would so much want to know in order to right any wrong this is not about religions this is about the value we place on one single human life because even one liFe lost through wrong doing is for me one too many .
Very Prone.
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