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IT WAS ALL grins and grimaces from Sinn Féin this morning as Leader’s Questions descended into little more than a slagging match between Gerry Adams and Taoiseach Enda Kenny.
Today’s session — the morning after the night before — offered another opportunity for the opposition to lambast the Government over yesterday’s Budget.
At least, that’s the way things have played out in the last few years.
But, unfortunately for Gerry and Micheál — with a generally positive reaction last evening to the measures announced by Noonan and Howlin, there really wasn’t all that much for the two men to get their teeth into.
Both persisted anyway — attempting broadsides at what they maintained was wholly unfair series of measures, which they said gave higher earners far more of a benefit, compared to those in the ‘squeezed middle’.
Oireachtas.ie
However, the Taoiseach simply stuck to the coalition’s talking points, saying the package of USC and tax cuts was merely the first step in a three year plan — insisting, by way of example, that the average saving for a married couple of middle-income civil servants would be around €100 per month.
A sample quote:
What we’ve said here is that the changes in the tax system are designed over three years to create 15,000 extra jobs.
As the back-and-forth continued, the Taoiseach decided to return to what’s been a favourite topic of his in recent weeks — Gerry Adams’ pre-Budget proposals.
“You have come in here time and again with your Budgetary proposals, with a €550 million hole in it,” Kenny accused the the Sinn Féin leader.
You have no proposition on how these services should be paid for.
Picking up steam, he trained his sights on two of the party’s highest profile personalities…
Oireachtas.ie
Finance spokesman Pearse Doherty was a “very articulate young man,” the Taoiseach said.
While he maintained Mary Lou McDonald, who was expelled from the Dáil last night mid-speech, had simply ”had to evacuate the house because the script wasn’t long enough”.
“Anything for an excuse to get out of the place,” he added, to guffaws from his own backbenchers, and tortured smiles from Adams & co.
Oireachtas.ie
A slightly hurt sounding Gerry had told the Taoiseach that rubbishing his proposals “in the dismissive way that you do doesn’t convince anybody”.
They were “thoughtful, costed proposals” he insisted.
The reason you disagree with them is that you come from a different political and ideological position.
But, after consulting his notes, and rattling off a range of figures from the SF plan, the Taoiseach had the final word…
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So, last week the Taoiseach claimed that SF water charge abolition would leave an €850 million gap, this week it’s €550 million. Methinks inda’s speechwriters aren’t worth breaching the pay ceiling for.
It’s all academic anyways, this budget will leave the VAST majority of people worse off come January if they decide to pay twice for their water.
And thats a big IF, consideing the level of resistence out there.
NO CONTRACT – NO CONSENT. Don’t fall for the divide and conquer tactic.
Mary Lou said on tv lastnigh they would not go into government with any party unless property and water charges are abolished let’s see how that works out.
Really?
Epic, in that case I now fully support water charges and hope all major parties continue to do so!
Given the other partys record on lying their way to power and corruption, I’m happy to give SF a chance to keep their promises. I’d even be happy with a promise to see water charges and property tax phased out over the term of government.
I still won’t be paying the water charge mind.
so give the shinners a chance to lie is that what your saying?
SF have never lied?
Their plans are fudged, their history is murkier than a swamp…
Sinn Fein are lying their way to power too. They light get rid of water and property charges but their lie of omission is that they won’t tell you how they’ll pay for it b
she made the comment then Vincent Browne made her repeat it I thought that’s a big call Mary Lou, might come back to haunt you.
That is a big hostage to fortune from Mary Lou, abolishing Property tax is going to be easier said that done now that it is in
yes it was a surprise remark alright pat rabbite was right sure everyone talks bollix for votes.
What a dope you are.
how so Sean?
why am I a dope?
because SF have for years suborned illegal acts then not come forward with relevant information about those crimes.
Before they even became a force (albeit minor one) in the Dáil, their card was marked and will be until Adams and his ilk are gone.
I think we have wires crossed here Sean I totally agree with you.
Sinn Fein aren’t the only party with a so-called ‘murky’ history. Fine Gael supported the Nazis and agitated for a fascist Ireland. Fianna Fail were at one time engaged in a war with the British state identical to the one Sinn Fein were supporting in the 70s, 80s and 90s. Many high-ranking members of the labour party including Gilmore and Rabbitte were ardent communists who supported North Korea and engaged in economic espionage on their behalf. Just because Sinn Feins history is so well publicised doesnt mean the other parties dont have closets packed with skeletons.
No Paul labour do and have done
I get it your a dope cause I said you is.
Ah you meant other Sean, I getcha :)
At last..someone speaking sense! All and sundry like to conveniently forget the history of other parties with all the mud slinging ..just what they want ..nice deflection techniques which imo are getting a little tiresome
Not a SF voter, but she has more balls than enda et al. The CC was biased and should be taken to account.
Denis, Like you not a SF voter.
But that being said, I see it a little differently, The CC has always (from what I’ve seen), enforced the standing orders.
He asked MLMcD to address him in her speech as per the standing orders, which is absolutely what he should have done. McDonald then proceeded to accuse him of bias for enforcing the rules of the house (which he has already said the Dáil is always welcome to change if they don’t like him).
In accusing him of bias, she overstepped the boundary, given that it was totally baseless and inflammatory.
What would you have done in that situation?
I expect the CC to act as a neutral entity. I this instance he clearly was not. He did not bring any other party member to account before MLMcD spoke out. Did you watch it or read about it?
Yup and I didn’t see any other TD addressing the the other side of the aisle, they were addressing the Chair as is appropriate.
The CC acted neutrally in so far as he enforced the rules set out by the house, by which they all agree to abide.
(For the record, not a FG supporter either, so this isn’t me being pro-government)
Ceann chomhairle are always biased, if he was from FF or Sf it would be the very same.
Sean Gallagher he asked her twenty three minutes into her speech…have a look at the footage
The CC my arse it,s about time this government was told what really going on in the real world and if the CC pull his head out off endas arse for long enough to allow the public’s opinion to be heard
Caomhin,
I’m curious how that translates to bias.
He let her go on for 23 minutes before pulling her up. He’d have been within his rights to do it much sooner than that.
But then bias would have been called as well. So it seems the only way he could prevent being labelled as having a bias is to ignore the rules that it’s his job to enforce, is that correct?
Mary lue was saying it as she saw it. I do not think that the water problem has gone away.Many people did not benefit from yesterdays budget. If they did it is all swallowed up on Water Tax. So they are really no better off.It was certainly an Election Budget to by votes but the people are not that Naive .
Water tax will increase if people sign up and it’s a tax that will be there forever
re Francis Stokes, Most people are essentially stupid and ill-informed. That’s what politicians rely on.
I’d like to think that is changing??a lot of keyboard warriors are finding they have feet as well as fingers.its taken 6 years but it’s never to late roll on November 1st
This water tax is for paying the troika back, no more than a troika answer to a troika problem
Can’t believe people have forgotten this fact already. Don’t mind ff or sf or labour they all signed up or as Gerry Adams says in part sign up what ever that means
Stop moaning at each other and get out November 1st and tell Europe to get back in their box enough is enough
Can we also get a chat going about not bothering with politicians and find a better way to govern eg.mad example voters using their atms or phones etc to vote through legislation instead of governing party who ram it through so they won’t be embrassed if they lose
That way we don’t have to wait years for proper laws and protection of our property……
Discuss…….
Really classy stuff from our illustrious leader…..not!
Isn’t it ironic that Herr Enda was recorded as having audibly interrupted Pearse Doherty on Ten separate occasions during his speech .
Yet, An Ceann Comhairle , Sean Barrett, utterly failed to call An Taoiseach to order , during that time !
I think that it would be most appropriate if Sean Barrett should be obliged to see his disgraceful video footage , which compares with John O’Donoghues , of a few years ago ?
Then, Mr. Barrett must resign , on the basis of utter bias and very poor judgement , as well as bringing the House into disrepute !
Suck it up Shinner you got your answers in the bye-bye- election!
Flash Gordon the political scientist here. A bye-bye election? So I guess after getting over 30% of the vote and beating out both establishment parties Sinn Fein should just pack it in?…. fool
What answer is that spaceman
an increase of 13% in dublin
and 8% in Roscommon South Leitrim…….
perhaps you may like to tell us how your lot FGlab did ?
your right the vote in both by elections increased but loosing out in Dublin was a disaster .
Paddy Power had your Shinner at 1/25 to win – he LOST !! A 1/25 shot lost in a 2 horse race – that’s embarrassing but I love it !!!
In fairness losing the dublin election was embarrassing.
But not as embarrassing as FG Losing the Seanad election when they had a majority.
Flash – You shouldn’t be backing at odds of 1/25 – don’t you know that the bookmaker always wins .
I feel sorry for you . Could you afford to lose all that money at such a skimpy price ?
You won’t have enough to pay The Water Rates Bill in January , if you keep having silly bets like that !
I had a great bet – that the combined votes of FG / Lab / FF , wouldn’t exceed 40% and I won my bet , hands down at 11/2 – Yippppeeeeee !!!!!!
Those Parties couldn’t raise a gallop in either Constituency .
Kerryboy you’re at the wrong end of the country – you
should be up north with your Shinner pals! As for backing a Shinner – I’d prefer to iron my sack !
Not worried about the water charge sure didn’t I get an extra €777.00 Sunshine!
Bye-Bye Shinner Election – 1/25 in a 2 horse race and well beaten LOL !!!
No Enda. It was the first time you were caught without your protection. Then like any good fg bully boy Barrett came to your aid. Democracy my hoop
I thought Barrett was a disgrace and he deliberately stopped Mary Lou in full flow. Also thought it was disrespectful that all the ministers left the debate. Disillusioned with politics at this stage
Also Barrett sjpuld resign
Nah.
The overall reporting of the Budget on the Journal.ie seems biased in favour of the Government- like Headmistress Barrett. The Journalists here don’t appear to read the comments they evoke.
Or maybe they aren’t swayed by a vocal minority?
Again the F G Budget designed to look after the well off members in this “society ” while the people that really need a break are screwed again.. “3 year plan more tax breaks” will only serve the wealthiest people in this country..
What I’d like to know is what does Sinn Fein propose for those of us who’ve been paying for their own water for ever?
If they’re going to abolish water charges, I presume that means that they’re going to provide me with free water too.
Or am I dreaming?
Someone on Vinnie B last night pointed the largest sectors in Ireland that use water are the industrial and farming sectors yet the people who will pay most, if IW goes ahead, are the ordinary workers. Interesting point, I thought!
To be fair Larry, If you are indeed paying for your own water i am going to assume you are in rural ireland. which means you prob have small amount of neighbours. Look around you, do you think counties like lets say Leitrim for example would be able to afford the roads up to your door (not saying you live in leitrim just using population density as example) with the taxes collected from lower density areas such as the one you live in. Facts are rural are heavily reliant on subsidies in tax from Large Urban Centres. Cork Galway Dublin. you have a lower property tax, you may even have a higher quality of life living in the countryside. So paying for your own well is minor in terms of the subsidies received from the Urban tax pool. Versus what you would be able to afford with just the local tax take. Yes you are dreaming.
Rural has positives , Urban has positives but you accepted the negative when you bought / built your house there. People did not and do not accept a brand new charge that wasnt there for them before.
Larry – we have all been paying for Water since the VAT bill was enacted in 1997 , which added 2% to VAT to pay for water supplies , repairs to infrastructure and waste water disposal – FACTS .
I have sourced the act concerned and will happily supply it to the Editor !
How much does that 2% raise? Just wondering. Does it cover the 1.2bill
You assume an awful lot James. My road has not been maintained in over twenty years, I don’t have refuse collection and I don’t have broadband, water, sewerage, TV service and a plethora of other services people seem to take for granted. What you seem to be saying esentially is that it’s my tough luck that I live where I live, fair enough. But if that’s your point, the corollorary would be that everybody complaining about water charges should take the same lumps.
And speaking of brand new charges that were never there before, there are similar ones for rural dwellers as well.
btw, only some rural counties are getting a leg up from the bigger more urban centred counties.
Do you think that businesses don’t pay for water Cowenwatch? You’re very sadly mistaken if you do.
what a load of waffle
Oh shit Reg, no, I had no idea businesses paid for water too, just like everybody already does and have done for years, it appears. You’re a god send – thanks for that!
Can you tell me one person or group of people in this great little nation that are not paying for water in some way or other and have been doing for years?
Not a Sinn Fein fan and can’t stomach Fine Gael but have to say Enda’s the winner here
@thomas
Winner of what?
And the people of Ireland are the losers so.
@ruairi
The pr competition
Sadly your o so right Roland
I notice no coverage on the journal of serious accusations made against Gerry Adams in a SpotlightNI programme last night. If they’re true it proves once again the contempt Adams has for victims of sexual assault. Hope to see the Journal give it coverage.
Seems as if for the red-thumbing Shinnerbots even rape victims can be thrown under the bus if it means protecting dear leader Gerry.
Sinn Fein have become mimics of the Catholic Church. It’s about protecting the primacy of the institution above the welfare of the state individuals.
@ Adam, 40 mins from you’r first post and the only reply is from yourself. I dont think anybody wants to play badger with you
“Seems as if for the red-thumbing Shinnerbots even rape victims can be thrown under the bus if it means protecting dear leader Gerry.”
First off I have no affiliation with Sinn Fein or Gerry Adams, secondly I red thumbed your comment because it was obvious, your comment was purely political point scoring from a Labour supporter. You have no empathy for the victims of sexual abuse, you just used them to bash Sinn Fein. Your comment was despicable.
Here here Denis. I was going to tell him what i thought of his comments but then thought whats the point because people like that dont care or listen.
Yes I hope the Spotlight programme which aired last night doesn’t get lost in the coverage from the budget. Too important an issue to be ignored. Come on Journal do your job.
Adam labour party hack and Journal.ie labour bounce pageboy that you are you should be well used to your accumulation of Red-thumbs….
there may be other reasons why people red thumb you outside of they been SF supporters as you allege like perhaps :
They do not like you been a Labour party apologist….
or that you make accusations about a programme that you obviously did not watch given what you post…
and perhaps they see you having a fake concern and the only basis of that concern is oh I may be able to attack sinn Fein over this you saddo
Fukn bawbag
The only rubbish in the Dail is Enda and his mates, his sneering could just as easily be applied to his party. Voting for Fine Gael and Laobour will be like indulging in nechrophlia.
Sinn Fein will say anything to get the votes, abolish water charges and property tax? I don’t know how Sinn Fein would work in a coalition and don’t want to know at the moment. Any debate I see on the TV is full of Sinn Fein and Independent candidates talking absolute nonsense. Get rid of Gerry Adams and then move forward with some realistic proposals. Maybe then I might start to listen.
Says John Pidgeon from Swinford. In what part of Ireland is Swinford again?
John pigeon
You’ll find that was a labour tactic, and it worked, they got into power and didn’t do anything
Good man Ciaran. You think I like Enda because he is from Mayo. I think he has the personality of a plank. What has that got to do with my opinions on Sinn Fein and certain Independants who the mood of the public to make false promises? Just like Labour, they will do anything to get into government. I see you are wearing a Dublin jersey, should I make assumptions about your political views based on that? Sad.
I’ve become quite fond of Mary Lou
have your say