As a 5″9 scrawny ginger, I’m glad to hear that I won’t be abused in prison because I’m straight.

You tried to imply the focus on LGBTQ prisoners wasn’t warranted, the research proves you wrong. If there’s an increased risk of violence against a marginalised group of people it’s logical to assume it’s being motivated by prejudice. Therefore focusing on confronting violence motivated by prejudice is completely rational.

America has much larger prison population so therefore the sample size is much better, meaning we can make better extrapolations from the data, and unlike in Ireland the scourge of LGBTQ violence has been studied to a larger degree.

It was inevitable that you would try to portray a study that undermined your point as ‘biased’ which is typical of people who try to downplay LGBTQ violence. That’s one of many studies, which just solidifies my view that you really haven’t a clue what you’re talking about.

http://www.blackandpink.org/survey/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_people_in_prison

The money spent ‘Studying’ prisoners of whatever hue and their feelings could surely be better spent treating cancer patients or cutting A&E queues,

Just saying…….

Why have they added a Q onto lgbt? Isn’t queer a defamatory term? Can’t I get in trouble for using it? And more to the point doesn’t queer just just mean gay/lesbian?? Aren’t you just adding an acronym that it doesn’t need??

I said it was biased because there are no stated controls. You cannot automatically assume you can extrapolate info from the US to Ireland without justification. You’re leading with conclusions and finding supporting material that agrees with preconceptions. Most importantly, an uncontrolled survey is not, and never will be, a study!

Small people, shy people, women, fat people children etc get bullied all the time.
I’ve never seen the law that states that LGBT are banned from training themselves in methods of self defence like the rest of us.

Liam: I never posited that a study in Ireland would necessarily lead to the exact same results. But if you’ve read the article you’ll see that conducting research on the extent of LGBTQ violence in Ireland is extremely difficult because the IPS does not collect information on the sexuality or gender identify of the prison population.

Therefore I’m looking at the US, which in terms of culture has a lot of similarities to Ireland including a homophobic history. They also have a much better set of data. We know definitively that LGBTQ people in the United States do suffer from a much higher rate of sexual violence, even the Department Of Justice acknowledge this.

Perhaps Ireland is an exception and our LGBTQ prisoners aren’t at increased risk of non-sexual or sexual violence, but the global data indicates that is improbable.

“Which in terms of culture has a lot of similarities to Ireland, including a homophobic history”. Nope!
Every country has a homophobic history. That is not a reason to draw parallels. Ireland strangely has incredibly low incidents of sexual violence in prison environments, presumed to be due to cultural differences to other western nations.
That leaves your only justification for extrapolation being a large sample size, however unrepresentative that may be. Sure why not go for China of that’s the only qualification you require?

If China has information on the abuse of LGBTQ prisoners I’d be happy to include that too. Oppression and abuse of LGBTQ people is a global phenomenon, China has a large prison population but we’re not privy to the same data we have in the United States. Sexual violence may be relatively rare in Ireland compared to other Western nations, but it still may disproportionately affect LGBTQ people.
Because of the failure of the IPS it’s difficult to gauge to what extent.

http://www.acjrd.ie/files/LGBT_Prisoners_-_An_issue_in_need_of_reform.pdf

They’re trying to use the same methodology of using it like black people taking back the n word. To destigmatize or take away the power of the word. To some they use it as a label to identify with others which is fine for them like myself still see it as an insult. It really is just down to people’s personal view on the word.

@Neal their criminals, whatever paltry sentence they got from the state is likely a slap on the wrist, giving them a bonus punishment is bonus. Also their total handbags, a few baddies called them batty boy outside their cell and they start crying.

Live Long: You may not be a criminal but you’re morally reprehensible.

@ Monty sorry i have zero sympathy for criminals whatever their sexuality, it’s pretty hard to get a custodial sentence as is so its safe to assume they werent done for littering. Prison is a punishment not another soap box the equality agenda.

Live:

http://www.iprt.ie/prison-facts-2
http://www.iprt.ie/alternatives-to-custody

@LiveLong: think about what you’re saying. You essentially condone rape as a punishment. If you are unhappy with the kinds of sentences given out to criminals (I am too!), then the imminent election gives you plenty of opportunity raise the matter with canvassers. As for me, I don’t think “well his sentence for those burglaries wasn’t half long enough, so he should be raped and not complain about it.”

So Live Long, you so morally stalwart, you’be never broken any rules , have you? You disgusting excuse for a human being

@Larissa Yeah their such renegades, playing by their own rules. Im such a square arent I.

Live Long, what you are saying is that anyone in prison doesn’t deserve basic human rights, and that makes you a disgusting excuse for a human being, fact.

“Hyper-masculinity” ???

Whoever misused that phrase must have a very toxic view of masculinity. Hyper masculinity is what you’d see at a rugby match or any physical sports game.

@Larissa Caroline Nikolaus

You brand ‘Live Long’ a disgusting human being for having an opinion you disagree with but blithely ignore the fact that it as all bar impossible for any half normal human being to actually get sentenced to prison in this morally corrupt judicial system we have in Ireland???
If anyone spends longer than one week in an Irish Prison then they are a seriously bad person.

PS J-Walking and Murder a breaking the rules do you consider them equal when you ask about rule breaking?

@John, where do you get the impression that I consider Jay walking and murder as being equal, but I still see prisoners as human beings and just because they may have committed crimes that put them behind bars, doesn’t mean that we as society are free to let them be raped, murdered, or driven to suicide, if you fail to understand that, then I pity you.

Larissa Caroline Nikolaus

I understand plenty but you are being rude to someone who has given an opinion you disagree with and that seems acceptable to you.
Why not use your sympathy for the poor victims and your considerable ire for the criminals???

So John, let me ask you, are you okay with prisoners being raped, murdered, abused, or being driven into suicide, do you think they don’t deserve the human rights, do you think they’re not human any more?

Larissa Caroline Nikolaus

I couldn’t care less about any prisoners, my only concern is for the victims, young, old, gay, straight,rich or poor.
If you are sent to prison as far as I’m concerned you should have absolutely no rights until you have paid your debt to society.
When you decided to break the criminal laws of Ireland and our society then you also decided to give up your rights of that society.
Remember every single convict had a choice to make but not every single victim did.

That’s your problem John. You generalise all prisoners without taking into account the context of their life. Edward Snowden broke the law so according to your logic he has no rights and the United States has the authority to assassinate him. Do you not see the danger of your kind of thinking? You trust governments to exercise their power fairly?

@Monty Wuggy

Why do you insist on quoting other countries in your arguments and not Ireland when this is about Ireland?

The fact remains that it is all bar impossible for someone in Ireland to end up in prison for a first offence and there is NO EXCUSE for breaking the law regardless of whatever perceived slight you have or chip on your shoulder about society.
Every citizen in Ireland is resourced by the state from birth, so don’t blame the state for your poor decisions if you end up in prison, blame your family, your friends yourself but not some abstract entity.
Personal responsibility please.

@John, no-one is denying that prisoners have personal responsibility for their actions, and no-one is saying their victims don’t deserve compassion.

However, this article is about the prisoners themselves, and if you can’t understand why even prisoners are entitled to basic human rights and aren’t to be subjected to rape, murder, or any other form of abuse just because they’re in prison, then sorry, I think you’re lacking intelligence, or have a very selective understanding of what human rights mean

Larissa Caroline Nikolaus

Why do you insist on being rude to people who disagree with you? I disagree with your assertion that prisoners should have rights but I do not question your motives or your intelligence while doing so.
Perhaps you might reflect on your persuasion technique.

@Barnsy, yes, you might be incarcerated, but that still doesn’t mean you have to agree to being raped, murdered, or otherwise abused, don’t you understand this?

@John, okay, let’s say for arguments sake you are being incarcerated because you committed an armed robbery, you did not kill or injure anyone, but you are being sentenced to let’s say two years in prison, while in prison you will be raped,, you will be beaten, and abused by both the other prisoners and the wardens, just because they feel like it, and you think that is an ok treatment for prisoners? Then sorry, my opinion stands, you are a disgusting excuse for a human being.

“It was mentioned earlier in the thread that you have to commit some fairly hefty crime, generally, to get jail time in Ireland.”

And then later debunked by actual evidence.

@Larissa Caroline Nikolaus

You are incredible. You have continually used emotive language like rape & murder but this was not mentioned in the article and there is no evidence it is any worse in prison than in general society DESPITE having a greater proportion of lawbreakers than law-abiding citizens on the ‘inside’. If I commit an armed robbery then i have decided I am a despicable human being and deserve whatever I get because I KNOW there is a possibility however remote that I could end up in PRISON. Armed robbery is not a victimless crime. It would appear that it is you rather than I that is a disgusting human being but hey who am I to judge.

@Monty Wuggy

Can’t see and debunking of the evidence, and could you name me a person who has served more than one week in prison for a first offence that wasn’t murder?

@Barnsy & John

You just don’t get it, do you? Even prisoners deserve human rights, and have considered the remote possibility that some prisoners are innocent and have been incarcerated by an error of the justice system?

If you deny prisoners basic human rights you are no better than those that you condemn yourself

Barnsy, so it is perfectly alright for you that prisoners are being sexually abused by other inmates, are being subject to beatings, and maybe even murder?

You are truly ‘compassionate’ and an example for all that’s wrong with society

Larissa

Yep, the man who rapes your mother and myself who thinks he should have no rights are the same,

Get a grip will you…,

@John, yes you are, because you see other people of not deserving human rights

@Barns, so advocating that prisoners should still be treated as human beings is being shallow? That’s an interesting point of view to have, I seriously hope you never end up in prison for whatever reason.

@Barnsy, it is true, if I were the victim of a crime, I probably would feel very vengeful towards whoever wronged me, but that’s the reason we have a justice system and don’t just resort to good old fashioned an eye for an eye, because two wrongs don’t make one right, and that’s why I’m arguing that prisoners even though they a in prison shouldn’t have to fear for their live, or bodily integrity, putting criminals in prison is as much about protecting the criminal from society as it is about protecting society from the criminal, and yes, the Irish justice system definitely needs an overhaul, but that doesn’t mitigate the issue about the human rights of criminals, and yes I even find murderers and rapists deserving of human rights, even though i believe they should be locked away for life, and life should mean life.

I don’t feel bad for criminals. I don’t care who they want to fcuk. Sticking up for them because they are gay is just pathetic. Stick for the the decent law abiding citizens.

@Barnsy, yes, they deserve human rights, but should be locked away for good, I would not advocate their murder or anything, even though they’ve committed horrible crimes, and I don’t want to lower myself on their level and deny them the right to live, take away their freedom, lock them away from society, give them the most basic of means to survive, yes, but it is still the duty of a functioning justice system to protect even vile humans as these from rape, or murder, or abuse by other inmates or wardens, as horrible as you may feel about this, that is the price we pay for living in a modern civilization, and I wouldn’t want to live in any other kind of civilization

@Barnsy, we’ll have to agree to disagree then.

When the ‘what is consent’ course kicks off in TCD we can get the students to head into Mountjoy and Cloverhill and pass it on to the prisoners. That’ll put a stop to all this

This is the kind of casual homophobia gay, bisexual and pansexual people have to deal with on a daily basis. Still lingers.

Johnneary is just a troll. Best to ignore.

Sorry I’m not a Troll.
What heterosexual man would not enjoy being in an environment full of Women?