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AN INDEPENDENT IRISH grocery store received threatening hate mail over a Yes poster it put up in its window.
Country Choice in Nenagh, Co Tipperary, which is owned by Peter and Mary Ward, has been running for over 33 years.
Recently a Yes poster was put in its window to show support for the upcoming same-sex marriage referendum.
Though the store had been advised to remove the poster by a few customers, the owners refused.
This morning, they received this letter:
Peter Ward said that the letter was accompanied by a number of newspaper cuttings about same-sex marriage and homosexuality.
“It’s like someone put a huge amount of work into this,” he said of the package, which was posted to the store. On the back of the letter was a “very offensive piece” about gay relationships, he said.
“When I opened it, I must say it was very surprising,” said Ward of the letter. “It wasn’t threatening and I didn’t feel threatened.”
“Country Choice is an independent business owned by independent-minded people,” said Ward, who intends on putting up more posters.
“I wouldn’t think that many of my neighbours would be surprised to see a Yes poster up in Country Choice,” he added.
We would have progressive thought in the business forever. We’re the sort of business that would have had readings and poetry readings and different views very openly expressed over the years. We’re expressive people and this is very much part of life.
He said they believe same-sex marriage is not a political issue, and that if passed, the move would improve the lives of many of their friends and Country Choice customers.
Though he described it as containing “surprising venom”, he will not be contacting the gardaí about the letter as he feels “they probably have enough to do to protect our streets”.
He added that he believes if something does happen, the town’s new camera system will capture it.
It’s not enough for me to take down a poster. We’re strong minded.
But he added:
“I really hope that [the sender] is not someone I know. And I hope it’s not someone I spend time socialising with or spending time having a cup of tea with. I suspect it’s not.”
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This sort of hatred is the reason to vote yes
Vote Yes because it’s the right thing to do.
The yes vote will be passed in two weeks time which will be the crowning glory for the Fine Gael/Labour government – they will be forever fondly remembered for this lasting positive social change.
…that every party was in favor of.
I’ve not seen a single FG or Lab canvasser bttw ..or FF one…has anyone else?
@Sean Mac
I’m gay. Since all political parties supported marriage equality I will decide which party to support by other criteria.
This was most likely a ‘yes agitator’ in keeping with their modus operandi – to stir up outrage.
Yeah, well, that’s just, like, your opinion, man.
@The Dude.
Quite possibly another “friends’ friend is the cousin twice removed of the nanny of the parents in the photo of ‘yes’ campaign. And he knows that family supports gay movement”. However the family could not be bothered to come forward.
They could have sent the letter themselves.
Vote no because this side of the referendum, it is crystal clear that, gay couples and straight couple’s are not the same.
If you have children of your own, whether they are gay or straight, just imagine for a moment that they are in a position of adoption, and they have the option of choosing between a gay couple and a straight couple, now given all being equal between these couples.!
Which couple would you wish your children to choose and which set of couples would your children choose.
David, with all due respect, you are not an adoption agency. They will always put the best interests of the child first. They are professionals and they know best. Not you, me or any other person without the qualifications (for the record, gay people can and do already adopt and regardless of the result, will continue to do so).
This is not an adoption referendum, it’s about extending the right of civil marriage.
Vote yes for love, vote yes for commitment.
I for one would chose any parent gay or straight before I would chose you David. For the record David children are not born bigots and neither were you. Bigotry is learned behavior. So it would be wrong to assume that a child would choose straight parents over gay parents. Children don’t think about the sexual orientation of their parents. If yours do you are one f….. up parent.
David, I would chose the parents that would be able to give my daughter the most stable & loving life, that could be 2 men, 2 women, 1 of each or just 1.
Joseph bigotry is a learned behaviour, how do you know that?
I read recently about a gay primary school teacher who spent, time with the pupals telling them how great being gay is, she even managed to humiliate a new child into the class when he displayed his disagreement with ssm.
Indoctrination if that is what society likes,to call it,is bad from some parts of society, but who is saying which is bad and which is good.
I would say the teacher, is really not in the position of clarification on these matters, parents should take the lead there always, teachers and education should have boundries.
http://m.huffpost.com/uk/entry/6759362
Even dawkings thinks parents are unsuitable for making decisions about their children.
David Nolan there is nothing wrong with gay couples adopting.
Irishdruid, by which set of good and bad parameters are you, placing childrens best interests in.
What set of standards are you placing your confidence in, are you suggesting that a gay relationship is biologically compatible with a straight couples?
Gay people by their very nature, are not suppose to have children.
Has the mechanisms of conceiving naturally, become subordinate to surrogacy and other treatments outside the natural way.
The yes side appear to have convinced people to vote yes, by way of emotional appeals.
Gay people, ‘by their very nature’, are just as well able to procreate as heterosexual people. The clue is that they’re equipped with organs that allow for procreation. Sexual preferences and a desire/capacity to parenting are distinct urges/matters, just as they are in the heterosexual domain.
“my empty wine bottle”
As if that’s a normal thing to have of a weeknight!
Id say its an empty “tonic wine” bottle.
If you’re gonna throw a wine bottle, you may as well go with buckie.
My empty bottle of wine is since the weekend. How is that possible? Because I am lazy (or busy). I will take it eventually to the recycle centre.
Or hurl it through a window. Six of one…
Bringing decent winos into disrepute…
The problem with No campaigners is that they quite simply do no see gay people as their equals. That in itself makes them very pitiful characters.
What is the actual evidence that this was done by a NO voter?
Bogus threats are the oldest trick in the political book.
Let’s all shop there as a mark of support
If I’m ever down that way, I’ll shop there just to shake their hands.
I wonder if the No voters who complained about their posters being ripped down will complain about this too? At least the shop owner’s poster actually has some relevance to the referendum.
Why would they? It’s up to the shop owner who received the letter to complain. The difference now is that given that the Gardai are a politicised police force actively campaigning in this referendum we know they will investigate this. The same level of trust of a full and proper investigation cannot be said of the thugs who are ripping down electoral posters for the No side in clear violation of the law.
They’re ripping down ‘yes’ posters too.
I wonder will the Yes supporters that initially questioned whether it really was Yes supporters taking down the No posters, now be questioning whether this was the actions of a No supporter at all…!!
@Stephen Duffy
Nobody from the “Yes” campaign(official campaign) said that the “No” campaign should be blamed for that. Someone who hate gay and equality, yes. But you should remember, that the “No” campaign(official campaign) said about the “Yes” campaign. They said that the “Yes” campaign is removing “No” posters. That’s the difference.
Of course they won’t. The No side can do no wrong. The Yes side on the other hand are all bullies! … cough cough…
To be fair there were yes supporters taking down no posters, but I don’t think that’s quite on the same level as sending people threats!
Did they take down posters using violence …I don’t think so. “Thug” is the wrong word to use . No need to thank me for correcting your English comprehension.
John Deegan. No, the gardai have not advocated one way or the other. GRA have advocated a yes vote, they are a representative body and are concerned about equality for their LGBT members. That is all.
@ John Deegan “The same level of trust of a full and proper investigation cannot be said of the thugs who are ripping down electoral posters for the No side in clear violation of the law.” Is the misinformation and blatant lies that are on the no posters not a blatant violation of the law. If not it should be.
The No campaign is having a bad hair day.
To be honest there will be a lot of silent No votes so anything could happen. I think it will be 55/45 in favor of yet but by no means a landslide.
yet=yes
What a thumb-dick beta male coward, writing an anonymous note to some poor innocent shopkeeper.
Afraid to confront those of us capable of standing up to you? My face is right there, I’m sure you’d recognize me if you saw me around the city, come up to me with your bottle, see what happens.
And unfortunately political voters, the ones that will vote no because the politicians want us to vote yes
Politics and referendums don’t mix
@Ryan
I hope you don’t mind if I come up to you with a bottle on the 23rd, either to celebrate or to get desperately and hopelessly pished, but fingers and toes crossed, we’ll be celebrating on the 23rd.
Let us hope that the Yes side will be celebrating a victory for us all, gay and straight, and a further significant step on the long road to the eventual extinction of homophobia.
I honestly believe the No will win. The Yes side are not having a good campaign and the No have managed to switch the debate to their ground and are winning the debate. Also expect the Church to demonstrate it actually has power over the Irish people that many reckon they had lost long ago.
It would be a travesty if the institution of the Roman Catholic Church were to be permitted by the voting citizens in Ireland on the topic of same sex civil marriage to get away again with abusing a sector in Irish society. We need to be aware that religion has a very negative influence on the reform of the Constitution.
As for the result, the actual outcome result will be the result. Often prediction is just a matter of wishful thinking.
What has the church to do with the above article? Honestly Anthony, get a grip! You’re letting the yes side down!
Condorcanqui, It was a response to Stephen Duffy, who brought the Church into the matter.
The RC Archbishops of Armagh and Dublin are pushing hard for a No vote and most Priests, with honourable exceptions, are preaching No on civil marriage from the Sunday pulpits.
My Yes vote on the 22nd May is far more important that any comment I post here.
Out of the mouth of Pontius Pilatus and these are really his words
“It’s all about painting a picture in the minds of people. A post family apocalypse scenario is easy to paint. Fear and doubt are easily sown.”
This is the core tactic of the No side. This represents the approach of the No side.
It was tactical blunder to admit these tactics if fear and doubt but that is the approach of the No side.
Your tactics define you.
I am surprised that you would have been so transparent about your unethical, manipulative and cynical approach.
Oh dear, Pontius Pilatus, I doubt that even you can “wash you hands” of that disclosure.
My bad puns are encouraged by your poor wit.
“It’s all about painting a picture in the minds of people. A post family apocalypse scenario is easy to paint. Fear and doubt are easily sown.”
That truly reveals you and your supporters for who and what you are.
Pontius Pilatus, you confuse my contempt for arrogance.
Pontius Pilatus, it gives added motivation to me to do more to resist your dishonest and base approach to the negative and destructive emotions of fear, doubt and hate. The wolf under the sheeps clothing is revealed.
You are confirming why Noel Whelan feels disdain for the tactics of the No side.
“It’s all about painting a picture in the minds of people. A post family apocalypse scenario is easy to paint. Fear and doubt are easily sown.” – Your own words!
– Heavy stuff, Pontius Pilatus. You truly live down to your name.
You have him on the ropes Pontius!
Pontus, no misquote.
Which words are incorrect? Which meaning is incorrect? I cut and pasted in your own words.
There is no paranoia when I refer to your own expressed sentiments and now you are too dishonest to admit it.
Fear and doubt is what you and your kind seel to exploit. There were no repercussions in other countries. Refer to Larry Donnelly’s article.
No is to do with abusing the sector in Irish society which comprises people who happen to be homosexual by refusing to acknowledge that they should have access to civil marriage. No is to do with sowing fear and doubt. No is to do with homophobia and seeking to deny the validity and worth of same sex love.
I can’t imagine that my views will influence anyone either to a yes or a no. The people who post here already know their position on the subject and I have no public profile.
By attacking me, you fail to address the substantive issues at stake in the Referendum.
Pontius how does my hypothetical marriage ‘threaten’ a straight persons marriage? Could you explain that to me please? I keep hearing no campaigners spout that nonsense
Gahaha what a pathetic laughing stock who wrote that? Hahaha an absolute nothing in society!
Today a video was shared on social media of a gay man in New York who was out in a restaurant with his partner. A man started on them out of nowhere and smacked him over the head with a chair.
Here we see a part of the No side, official or not, making their POV clear. I don’t know about you, but I class this psychological behaviour and threats in the same category as physical violence. It all comes from a place, the same place within someone. Vote Yes
This is what a No advocate, Pontius Pilatus, posted earlier.
“It’s all about painting a picture in the minds of people. A post family apocalypse scenario is easy to paint. Fear and doubt are easily sown.”
Pontius can speak for himself, but he’s stated that he wants to see a Yes vote.
Disliking the Yes campaign strategy, having reservations about the Children and Family Relationships Act and pointing out illogical arguments does not put you in the No camp.
No voters..I’ve been thinking, you care about the kids right? That’s what this is all about? Saving kids from dodgy parents?
I challenge you to go into darndale, jobstown, fettercairn, fatama mansions, Fassaroe and whatnot and go up to the tracksuit brigade. Give them lectures on ..well you can’t tell them to use condoms so you have to tell them to not have sex at all, because that leads to them (being s_umbags and all) being bad parents who have to live off the state , who say things to their 2 year old kids in the CC like “hearrrr get down off dat ye little bollix will ye? ye little f____n baaaaaaaasstard ye”.
Do that, and I’ll believe you really care about saving kids from bad parents. That would be far braver than stomping on some respectable inoffensive commuter belt gay couple who work in Microsoft, pay 52% taxes and wouldn’t dream of not paying a parking ticket.
So now you would like to choose who can and cannot have children. You cannot beat a good old fashioned eugenics rant from an LGBT activist. You would have lived the nazis circa 1935 if you weren’t gay.
@ Ryan Anth … Nice Red Herring, Nice ad hominem nice straw-man argument. It’s a pity it’s illogical, then you top it off with a Racist, Stereotypical view, on people because of their address. Yet looking back on your posts with regards to this referendum you preach equality YES vote ideals. Any chance you could practice what you preach ? or is equality & anti-racist attacks only a one-way street whenever you decide it’s the right time to scream it, or when its against your political ideological world view ? or just when it’s plain made up in your head like in you’re previous post.
Wow
John and Philip are FB accounts set up very recently, with no other photos etc.
Most likely the same person trolling….
Afraid to use your REAL details are we.
You should be ashamed, certainly not Christian.
@ Mark O Donohoe. How is correcting somebody on illogical B.S trolling ? just pointing out the bleeding obvious. No mark, you should be ashamed for trying to divert attention away from any of the points i made to Ryan & then trying to jump to conclusions about my religious preferences ? Maybe it’s you who is the troll, not I.
The cowards can’t even put their name to their homophobic mail. That to me says it all, hide behind the pen/ keyboard, how brave of them…!!
Ann, deep down, they know that they are totally wrong and they feel ashamed. Anonymity is the favourite cloak of the homophobe.
This is what a typical No advocated posted on this article
” It’s all about painting a picture in the minds of people. A post family apocalypse scenario is easy to paint. Fear and doubt are easily sown.”
Anthony you can assume that nothing will happen if a yes vote is carried, but what makes you so sure there will be no negative outcomes?
Lately ive seen a lot of forward thinking from you and it’s, been based on assumptions.
I can tell you this that no matter what the outcome of the referendum, ssm will not even be a patch on a straight marriage.
Same sex marriage will be the equal of heterosexual marriage, if the Referendum is passed, because both will be marriage.
Civil marriage is not being redefined. It is merely the case that we will be viting on widening the scope of eligibility for civil marriage.
Only on paper with ink on it, will it be forced to look the same, but in reality it will not change the real meaning.
A man and a woman
The hate mail is just a more extremely expressive version of the average mentality of a No supporter.
Most No supporters are context5 in invent fictions, red herrings, distortion and fake sources for their hateful position but a small minority feel emboldened by the hostility of the No voters to the yes cause and just got that bit further than the mainstream No supporters would be entirely comfortable with.
It’s the members of No side that are quiet and sinister that you need to be careful of. They act and they don’t threaten.
I should have included the significant group of No voters who will have been misled and panicked into voting No because of being fearful of snatch squads of adoption agencies lifting young children from perfect heterosexual parents for the purpose of filling quota orders for same sex parents.
I also omitted the No voters who will vote out of irrational hatred and the peevish No voters who will vote no because they feel aggrieved that their biological paternity relationships are not given primacy.
I may have left out a few other sub groups.
And you also will have the loonies, religious extremists, extreme right wing types, neo-Nazis and fundamentalists.
As they say, “it’s a mixed church” of opposition.
Martin, the limit of my liberal tolerance is your illiberal intolerance.
Are we just going to publish every idiots hate mail that’s sent to a shop cafe hairdresser etc, their will always be people that disagree but to publish it is like scare mongering now at this stage
Wondering Nigel when the Journal posted up the No posters being taken down by some folk were you annoyed that they published that?
No side descending into a swamp of bigotry
Such a sinister thing to send a hateful note anonymously, says it all really.Big RESPECT to the shop owners & their reaction.
Well done Peter Ward. Lovely shop and a huge supporter of local people supporting their local producers which is vital in rural areas. He spoke at a course I organised years ago and was inspirational to the students. He’s probably done already more the town of Nenagh (and plenty more places) than whoever was brave enough to post that unsigned letter.
What has happened to Nenagh since I knew it?
Wine bottles? Independent artisan delicatessen-coffee bars?
Sure compared to that sort of change, letting gays marry isn’t much of a social revolution at all.
Anyway, I’m not too surprised to hear of this sillyness because Nenagh is in Tipperary. And that county is probably the only one in Ireland to feature in a song known all over the world – “It’s a Long Way to Tipperary”.
And when you look at what that song’s about, it seems there’s a long tradition of Tipp men screaming out loud to let people know they’re not gay, and then writing an embarrassing, mistaken letters to prove it.
Up to mighty London
Came an Irishman one day.
As the streets are paved with gold
Sure, everyone was gay,
Singing songs of Piccadilly,
Strand and Leicester Square,
Till Paddy got excited,
Then he shouted to them there:
It’s a long way to Tipperary,
It’s a long way to go.
It’s a long way to Tipperary
To the sweetest girl I know!
Goodbye, Piccadilly,
Farewell, Leicester Square!
It’s a long long way to Tipperary,
But my heart’s right there.
Paddy wrote a letter
To his Irish Molly-O,
Saying, “Should you not receive it,
Write and let me know!”
“If I make mistakes in spelling,
Molly, dear,” said he,
“Remember, it’s the pen that’s bad,
Don’t lay the blame on me!
It’s a long way
Not sure it was appropriate to have it in the window nor to receive hate mail.
But balance Ronan!
Its an independent shop, they’re entitled to express their support and they’re not refusing to serve people who disagree with them so what’s the problem?
I’m expressing an opinion like everyone else here. Do you understand that? YES or NO?
Don’t give in. Please vote YES!
This man plus any woman in the world make up the ideal place to raise children
This article teaches us that the people who advocate a No vote are very unreasonable people. I would be remiss in my duty as a citizen if I did not take notice of the Journal’s unbiased reporting on this issue.
The Journal is a private organisation and can have whatever bias they wish. They report on what interests their readers going by how often articles are read and how many comments they get. If you don’t like certain articles then stop reading and commenting on them. Besides, there has been plenty of reporting of what the no side are saying and opinion pieces also, just search the site.
Irish Times are biased in the other direction, maybe you should check it out for good balance.
What are you on about?
Imagine if someone on the Yes side sent the message to make the No side look bad.
Just saying is all…
Niall the no side are doing a great job of making themselves look bad all by themselves.
It amazes me people actually think the Gardai are politicised because the GRA came out in favour of a yes vote? Why shouldn’t they? This referendum is about the right to the same institutions of marriage heterosexuals have, how is that political? Morons!!! Vote Yes because it’s the RIGHT thing to do!
Possible too for an enthusiastic Yes person to send such a letter knowing the negative result to the No side .
Ludicrous logic.
Or they sent it themselves since the No voters gave up long time ago arguing. They’re just going to vote.
By voting Yes to Love on the 22nd May, I will get the bonus of voting No to hate.
I am going to give you a “Like” even if I am going to vote NO. This is a nice comment. A comment that would win votes. But unfortunately I have been so disappointed by the many other comments.
Sometime after the 22nd when votes are counted and common sense prevails, it will be acknowledged that one of the YES sides greatest campaigners was (thanks to actions like this) the NO side!
This story is non event.
It’s the Journal trying to find an angle to keep running the topic.
This letter was clearly from a crank but there are plenty of them on both sides.
Nothing to discuss here.
Letter shouldn’t have been sent.
It was.
That’s the story over.
Same as the stories about the no posters being pulled down then, yeah? Funny how that was so important and this isn’t Tom.
I think the countryside is about 40 years behind Dublin .s
Really Karl? I live in ‘that rural’ and I don’t know anyone who is voting no so maybe try travelling outside of Dublin before making assumptions. You might even find that its not all countryside and that there are other urban areas!
They even have cars, color tellies, electricity, running water and even Chinese food nowadays.
Interwebs and everything!
It’s surely not shocking that people in rural areas are more conservative is it?
We should be careful not to turn that into a stereotype
The stereotype of the dumb hick knuckle dragging blacks and gays hating farmer is as offensive as the limp wristed skinny scream queen with his pack of female friends who calls himself one of the girls.
If one caricature is offensive to you they all should be, there is too much of ‘it’s ok to mock your people just not my people’. We should not there are out GAA players and refs now but how many of the Gay or Bi (and they’re there, believe me) Leinster players are out? They are from not just Dublin but uberliberal d4 where if you said casually “I’m just back from the gay sex orgy” they’d respond, not looking up from their phone, with “hmm? how was that?”…yet no out players, so maybe we can cut the culchies some slack on this one
Liberals are found everywhere but there can be overall regional and locational biases in Referenda outcomes. It will be interesting to see the Referenda results analysed according to geographical trends.
In smaller villages and rural areas, there can be more pressure to social conformity with a more conservative outlook. It is a feature of the lives of many gay people that they leave their home places and move to urban environments where more anonymity is possible.
The Valley of the Squinting Windows still exists in places in Ireland.
That said, they are many brave straight people everywhere in Ireland who will openly express their vote for the Yes side regardless of social opprobrium and even hostility.
Anthony, you’re correct to a large extent but I’ve found that among my peers at least, here in the sticks, I haven’t come across anyone who has said they will vote no, my dad is 76, he’s not an Irish citizen but would vote yes if he could.
One of my friends is a farmer and is voting yes, of course there can be more pressure to conform in areas with small populations but rural folk are often portrayed as backward which is just not true in many cases, we all have access to education and information.
The older demographic may be more likely to vote no in general but even so, the polls show that most over 60s would vote yes.
Remember that many young people who have migrated to cities and are voting yes, grew up in rural areas. I actually grew up in a suburb myself and had preconceived notions about country folk until I actually moved to the countryside 10 years ago. Nothing is ever black and white. Its not all an intellectual wasteland of banjo players lol.
Kelly, you speak from direct and actual experience and I believe that you may be right. I’m an old man and I’m voting yes. So, I’m voting against stereotype and many others are voting against the notion that we may have of them. I may have generalised too much.
Good for your Dad!
These are the very types of individuals that a certain subset of No campaigners stoke up . I’m sure ordinary decent No voters are ashamed of their actions as sharing a caucus which such bigots must be uncomfortable . This referendum must pass , we need to rise above this bigotry and realise everyone is the same , love is the same and they are our neighbour friend family
“Stop trying to SILENCE ME!!!”
Nobody is really capable to silence you… You scream too loud. And you are so aggressive and arrogant while you do it.
That much that I ended up voting NO.
I said to myself, arrogance and discrimination against the existing NO voters can not come from a true seeker of equality and anti-discrimination.
Only if they would seek compassion. But never felt that.
check out the notes…they are written by the same person….are the a..holes going spare here really that silly to be taken by this?
When you say notes, do you mean the note in the picture and the addressed envelope that it was sent in immediately behind it? Because if you do then.. Duuuhhhhhh
That’s red necks for you.
New Amarach research poll today from RTE . 78% yes 16% no 8% dk http://analysis.rte.ie/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/Poll_Results_06.04.15_3.jpg
Thank you Irish Druid, it’s a real morale booster but I’m going to continue to assume that every Yes vote is crucial.
Many of the Yes advocates have been really good, even magnificent.
Fingers crossed!
This is what Pontius Pilatus a No voter is advocating as the tactics for the next two week
” It’s all about painting a picture in the minds of people. A post family apocalypse scenario is easy to paint. Fear and doubt are easily sown.” – Strong stuff. The Yes side are up against cynical and exploitative manipulators of fear and dislike”
Martin, it is the No side which uses fear and doubt.
Your invective is quite good but yiu make no substantive point. Irrational prejudice can undermine the willingness of the No side to attempt to make rationally expressed points.
Criticise me all you wish but that does not make an argument.
And of course nobody who supports the no side has received any form of abuse whatsoever. Interesting that no Irish celebrity or sports person has come out in support of the no campaign.
Pontius Pilatus, and I can see that you intend more nastiness from the No side.
” It’s all about painting a picture in the minds of people. A post family apocalypse scenario is easy to paint. Fear and doubt are easily sown.” – You own cynical words revealing the manipulative agenda of the No side.
It will be very interesting if the no vote wins. Another Lisbon treaty situation?
yawn yawn yawn
*Condescending
No idea why my comment appeared here!
At least the letter and stamp had DNA and finger prints on them…
have your say