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BRIAN COWEN MADE his second appearance before the banking inquiry today.
This time the line of questioning focussed on his tenure as Taoiseach from 2008-2011, the bank guarantee and Ireland entering the Troika bailout programme.
Cowen was in less bullish mood than last week, but he still staunchly defended the actions of his government.
Here’s what we learned from today’s meeting:
1. Ireland was “bounced” into the bailout
Cowen told the committee Ireland was essentially “bounced” into a bailout programme with the International Monetary Fund (IMF), European Central Bank (ECB) and European Commission.
He said negotiations on a bailout had only begun when Troika officials began to brief the media.
Cowen went on to say he “underestimated the impact of the IMF coming to town element which immediately sent a message [in November 2010] that this was now a done deal rather than a genuine continuation of existing discussions up to then”.
He said this perception was further reinforced when the Central Bank Governor Patrick Honohan gave his now infamous Morning Ireland interview and revealed Ireland was in bailout negotiations.
This development showed the government in a bad light because of the interpretation given to events that we were keeping what was going on away from people. In fact we were trying to put ourselves in the best position we could, before formally requesting assistance.
“We wanted to know exactly what we were getting into before we agreed to formally apply for any programme,” Cowen said.
He later said that Honohan’s intervention was not damaging to the bailout negotiations, but was “damaging politically”.
2. He played golf with Seán Fitzpatrick, but Anglo didn’t come up
Sinn Féin’s Pearse Doherty asked Cowen about a golf trip he went on with former Anglo director Fintan Drury and former Anglo chairman Seán FitzPatrick at Druids Glen in Co Wicklow in July 2008.
Cowen said he contacted Drury about setting up a meeting to discuss the economy before he went on holidays during the Dáil recess, recalling telling him: “I haven’t had a break in a long time.”
Cowen said when Drury set up an “informal get-together” with FitzPatrick and others at Druids Glen and he had “no problem” with this, adding: “Fair enough, I hadn’t played golf in a long time.”
He noted that some people have drawn “conspiracy theories” from the meeting, but insisted they didn’t discuss Anglo.
As God as my witness … I wasn’t discussing banking, I was discussing the economy.
“I want to assure the Irish people I didn’t do anything untoward.”
Cowen took exception to being repeatedly asked the question, saying it was fair to ask but he had clarified it several times over the course of the meeting.
Really it’s a question of my integrity … it’s not the way I operate.
3. The bank guarantee was the ‘least worst’ option
Cowen said the bank guarantee was ultimately the “least worst” option available to the government at the time and had to be viewed in context.
He compared the economic situation to the great Wall Street crash of 1929, describing it as a “once in a century” dilemma.
Cowen noted that John Hurley, then Central Bank governor, told those present at the late-night meeting on 29 September 2008, Anglo Irish Bank lost €2 billion in deposits that day.
“The issue was going to have to be addressed immediately,” he said.
Eventually I put it to the table that it seemed to me that a full guarantee option provided the best prospects of addressing the urgent liquidity problem and of sending a clear message that Ireland was standing behind the financial system which would be understood by the markets.
4. He sought outside advice
Cowen went into detail about his consultations with economist and then Central Bank board governor Alan Gray on the night of 29 September 2008 saying he was someone whose views he respected.
I phoned him and asked him what he thought of a guarantee option being used. Mr Gray emphasised that providing a guarantee would, obviously, give an advantage to those institutions to whom the guarantee would apply vis-à-vis competitors, since they would have the backing of the Irish Government.
He said that Gray’s advice was that any guarantee should be time-limited. This would help make the case publicly that the guarantee was the best option. Asked by Socialist TD Joe Higgins if he was aware that Gray was a member of the board at Quinn Insurance, Cowen said he was not.
Fine Gael TD John Paul Phelan also probed the Gray issue, asking was he “on the payroll”. Cowen said Gray was giving his views and that he regarded that as the behaviour of “a conscientious member of the board”.
5. But didn’t know who was outside the room
Late on in today’s hearing, under questioning from committee chair Ciarán Lynch, Cowen admitted he was not aware that officials from the NTMA were outside the room on the night the guarantee was being discussed.
He said he did not know who was outside the door until they came in. Lynch pointed out that the agency was “pro-nationalisation” rather than the guarantee, but Cowen insisted that the position of the NTMA was being relayed in the meeting by Kevin Cardiff.
“It wasn’t a question of them being out of the loop, they were in the loop,” he insisted.
6. He doesn’t recall *that* statement about nationalisation
Cowen is famously quoted by journalist Pat Leahy as saying ”We are not f***ing nationalising Anglo” at the bank guarantee meeting. When Labour Senator Susan O’Keeffe questioned if this was true, he said he didn’t recall making the comment.
After some back and forth, committee chair Ciarán Lynch told the pair to “move away from the colour”.
When discussing the same topic at the inquiry last month, former Secretary General at the Department of Finance Kevin Cardiff said: “It’d be a lie to say I never heard the Taoiseach use the F word, but I didn’t hear him use that specific phrase.”
On more than one occasion, Lynch criticised O’Keeffe for asking Cowen questions about documents she didn’t provide him with beforehand.
7. He didn’t overrule Brian Lenihan
Cowen denied overruling the late finance minister at the meeting where the bank guarantee was decided on 29 September 2008. Lenihan had wanted to nationalise Anglo and extend a bank guarantee to the other banks, but he later changed his mind.
Cowen noted that nationalisation “doesn’t solve all the problems” as it would have meant the State permanently taking on Anglo’s liabilities. He said the conversation between the two men wasn’t in any way “adversarial or confrontational”.
He also noted that Lenihan wasn’t present when the decision was made to not burn bondholders as Lenihan “had a very busy schedule to fulfil from early the next morning”.
O’Keeffe asked Cowen why there isn’t a “proper full note” of what happened on the night of the guarantee. The former Fianna Fáil leader said he was sorry this is the case and, as chair of the meeting, he takes responsibility for the lack of a full record.
8. He’s still sorry
Cowen’s widely-reported apology last week was repeated again today. He reiterated that he was sorry for his role in the crash and at one stage said that that he privately asks himself everyday if he could have done something different.
Later, in an exchange with Sinn Féin’s Pearse Doherty, Cowen said:
People will apportion blame and responsibility wherever they will. I am just simply saying that as Taoiseach I take my share of the responsibility in respect of what happened and I do so because I am duty bound to do that. Now, for party political reasons people will apportion a greater amount of blame than maybe is my due. But that’s politics but I have at all times sought to do what was right for the country, to do what was right in a very difficult situation.
9. The big mistake
Fine Gael senator Michael D’Arcy asked him to outline the “single biggest mistake” made between 2000 and 2008.
“A lot of mistakes, I suppose, were made,” Cowen said before going on to outline the difficulties that arose out of entry to the euro and Ireland relinquishing control of interest rates.
When you’re in a new currency and you no longer have control over your interest rates, you’ve got to find other parts of the tool kit to make sure you don’t end up where we ended up.
10. Everyone was happy about getting a toilet break
At one stage shortly before 2pm, Cowen asked how many more questioners would speak before lunch. It was just one, but the former Taoiseach was caught a bit short and Lynch agreed to suspend the meeting for a three-minute toilet break.
Others seemed to be happy Cowen spoke up as several bodies ran for the exit.
11. But did we really learn anything new?
Cowen’s performance today was far more sedate than his bombastic opening salvos last Thursday. That didn’t make for many, if any, particularly interesting exchanges.
But we’ve also been left asking whether anything huge has been uncovered by Cowen’s two days before the inquiry. There’s been lots of interesting detail. But while this phase of the inquiry was billed as its pièce de résistance, many appearances have seen witnesses discuss events and facts that are already common knowledge.
Fellow former taoiseach Bertie Ahern is set to appear next week. One wonders if he will have anything new to say.
- with reporting from Hugh O’Connell
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The irony of it. The 100,000 Euro plus officials marching against cuts that effect those on lower income. Talk about running with the hare and hunting with the hounds.
Those 100,000 euro plus officials refused to take my leaflet Campaing Against Property Tax and Austerity. The irony was not lost on me , But we will show them in the end . They walked past all of us in their blue rain jackets and I have to ask why were they even there. They telling people to join a union to pay subs to pay THEIR wages . BUT What have THEY done for the people who are unemployed and lost their jobs due to this blasted recession . They were not therer to support the ordinary people. SHAME ON THEM.
Hi Eileen,
When I lost my job due to unfair dismissal the Union was there for me and ensured I got what I was due. The Official assigned to me definitely worked for his wages, even accepting my calls on weekends.
Although they didn’t take your leaflet, so I suppose that makes them useless alright.
Chairman Meow
I use my real name . and I see you don’t .
why the smoke screen ? I do not believe you .
Oh and YES that makes them worse than useless , that is my opinion .
The Croke Park Agreement is a Pro-Austerity agreement. Budgets are cut, services diminished and staff numbers reduced. This is why hospitals budgets are bust, Gardai are stretched and classrooms sizes are increasing.
Do more with less that is what the CPA envisages.
If the trade union leaders were serious about protesting, they wouldn’t be protesting on a Saturday! This is nothing more than a charade to try give an impression that union leaders actually give a damn!
Not a big fan of Social media Eileen, just have the account to comment on here. I don’t really care if you believe me, there are legions of people who have taken Payment of Wages, Unfair Dismissals, and other cases through the Union and won. All of that is a matter of Public Record, feel free to educate yourself.
@Chairman Meow. That is what the union are there for, to protect workers rights and I’m glad you got your rights upheld. There are many, many decent union officials who earn more than their crust.
The points being made however at top union brass levels they are as much removed from the plight of ordinary workers as politicians are.
Think about it, five austerity budgets with more to come, and trade unions organise a protest on a Saturday!!
What is wrong with Mon-Fri???
I wouldn’t have been able to go during the week, I have to work…
Meow …..
Meow ….Meow .
I can listen to the wind blow and that is all you are doing .
You’re not a fan of social media ? Then why comment at all.
Say no more…!
Ground level trade unionism..shop stewards etc are there to fight for the welfare of workers and their rights but in the stratosphere where Jack O’Connor,David Begg etc are its highly political and open to corruption.O’Connor hasn’t a leg to stand on…4 years into the greatest depression our nation has ever witnessed and SIPTU have done nothing, the general worker has been fiscally raped…..SIPTU are doing nothing because it is beholden to the Labour party and we’ve seen who their interests have been since election….”Dont rock the boat!” says Labour and SIPTU oblige!By the way my father was a shop steward for 30 odd years and I believe at its heart trade unionism is good but these men in the upper echelons (who make the decisions!) earning €200k aren’t trade unionists…they are politicians without the accountability, keeping hundreds of thousands of workers from striking by a tactic of wait and see…a national 10 day strike is what’s needed..bring the country to a halt!!!
…to elaborate. You can’t protest during the week because you have to work. So to get 20,000 out to protest a strike is needed. But strikes are not allowed under Croke Park. And unions support Croke Park. And Croke Park is about reducing staff numbers, endorsing previous pay cuts and pension levies and increasing productivity with existing resourses or using less resources ie it is a Pro-Austerity agreement.
Because Eileen, I get a bit sick of people who clearly have no idea what Unions actually do, other than what they read in the Sindo, having a go. If it wasn’t for the Union I would have been out on my arse, it’s not like there are any other groups both willing and able to protect our rights.
Boycotting the property tax is all well and good, but at the end of the day workers need someone with teeth; the Union have them.
Actually you don’t need a trade union to uphold your rights under Unfair Dismissals. The Unfair Dismissals Act, 1977 is there for every worker, trade unionist or not.
Chairman Meow
You have a toothless hierarchy in trade unions .
Croke Park was the death knell . The Unions may have had their uses
and may still have into the future But jack o connor et al., needs to get a new set of dentures.
I can’t afford to strike either, no-one in my workplace could. Not only would losing 10 days wages make it difficult for me to pay my bills, but I get the feeling my job wouldn’t be there 10 days later. There are no shortage of Blacklegs available.
O’Conner can’t simply call a strike, one has to be balloted for, and there really doesn’t appear to be any appetite for one among workers, at least from what I can see.
@ Stephen.
I’m not a solicitor, nor can I afford a decent one. My employer had one though, without an Official to take my case I would have lost.
And of course, the Unfair Dismissals act is there because of the Unions and their activism in the first place.
So by the union official accepting your leaflet, did you expect him to have some sort of enlightening and change his ways forever? Most likely your leaflet contained nothing but vitriol and don’t pay any taxes quotes
Niall Hanratty
Actually Niall the leaflets I was handing out was The Campaign Against Property Tax and Austerity. Very informative.
Check us out on facebook Dublin West, Campaign Against Property Tax and Austerity (CAPTA) and CAPTA Dublin West @CAPTADW on twitter .
You might just learn something .
Eileen, I may have once agreed with you but your dismissal of chairman meow is disgraceful. Regardless of people using monikers or real names is not the issue. He is entitled to his opinion about the union he is in. I do feel they have sold out and no longer represent the working classes, but that’s not to say that their are some who do retain some integrity.
Reada
Ed
I heard two words today and reached for the bucket as the retching started immediately and uncontrollably. Those two words were ……..Victory……and …Comrades! If you want wages and Social Protection at the levels that these two words suggest then give free rein to the Trade Unions or The Extreme Left which includes Sinn Fein.
Ehhh, I beg to differ. The dentures need new owners.
Boildyeggs
Each to their own . I use my own name . I do not hide behind false names or pseudonoms.
I stand up to be counted .
The unions have let us all down and I will not apologise for saying so.
This country is in a serious dilemma ,and we must defend it. The government we have voted for
and the unions paid by us are all guilty of treachery.They have not, do not and will not defend the poor , vulnerable, old,sick and young among us. Who is defending victims of Priory Hall, the sick on waiting lists , special needs on waiting lists, students waiting for grants or any body else who are victims of this recession and enforced austerity. I will not sit on the fence nor will I pander to some one who clearly has no other use for commenting other than try to distract and detract.
Meow;
Let’s get one thing straight. Your problems were sorted out and I’m happy for you on that count. But your case is more the exception than the rule. I’ve lost count of how many people like myself have been dropped like a hot snot by the unions. I personally had to fight tooth and nail in the courts for the past seven years in order to receive monies owed to me by my employers after a workplace accident. All those years that I paid Union dues were for nothing. I sent letters, e-mails, left voice mails and even tried to make appointments with my rep but was ignored throughout. My story is NOT by any means an isolated one.
Jack O’Connor and his ilk are about as useful as a fart in a spacesuit. SIPTU have the nerve to accuse today’s organisers of fascism, yet they and their bedfellows Labour are endorsing fascist policies in the name of the EU.
I couldn’t afford a solicitor either but SIPTU left me with no other choice but to seek one.
Sounds like a nasty dose Garry, sounds like Verbal Diahorrea
Tony F
very well said :)
Enda Curtin
Very well said . Hear hear.
Eileen
Sadly you live in a world of delusion. Firstly there were ten thousand people at the march today rather than the exaggeration you prefer to advance. I prefer to trust the Gardai for the calculation rather than the political fantasists who portray a honeyed view of the Utopia that can provide if only we dumped every political Party but the Socialists and their ilk who suck off the hind tit of a modern progressive economy like a tick that can ultimately cause a systemic cancer with their lies and folly.
It’s all right you say for the myriad of workers I mentioned to have the highest salaries in the world because they deserve it . Sure woman on that basis and ideological garbage we should be recruiting staff for the Public Service and increasing Social Protection payments in the Budget next week.
Did you ever wonder why our high levels of emigration in the past few years has been balance by a nett inward flow of 100,000 immigrants who virtually all have jobs? You see the Irish economy is doing for itself what you and your ilk continue to ignore or misunderstand. At one level we have immigrants more qualified in the technology sectors coupled with language skills than the Irish and in the other areas there is a reality of accepting lower levels of pay because these are still higher than their home countries. We see many of these jobs as beneath us!
Then we hear the words …….”victory and Comrades” from your fellow marchers and we see you for the infantile people you are who make more noise than sense but want to pull everyone and everything else down to your level.
What a pathetic scene in modern Oirland.
“There is a great deal of truth in the often heard statement that fascism and national socialism are a sort of middle-class socialism- only that in Italy and Germany the supporters of these new movements were economically hardly a middle class any longer. It was to a large extent a revolt of a new under-privileged class against the labour aristocracy which the industrial labour movement had created….Nor can there be much doubt that in terms of money income the average member of the rank and file of the Nazi movement in its early years was poorer than the average trade unionist or member of the older socialist party-…The conflict between the Fascist or National Socialist and the older socialist parties must indeed very largely be regarded as the kind of conflict which is bound to arise between rival socialist factions.”
F.A. Hayek, The Road to Serfdom
@ Garry
1) I live in IRELAND. not as you call it Oirland …. what is that ?
2) I do not use the word Comrade ,BUT I respect the right of those who do choose to use it.
3)I certainly do not live in a world of delusion …. There were 18,000 people there but this really is not an issue , you can either accept it or reject it . I was there .
4) Victory ??? I did not hear that word today . The people on the march today know that it will be a long road ahead of us ,so it is not a word that any one of us would use .
5)” the Socialists and their ilk who suck off the hind tit of a modern progressive economy like a tick that can ultimately cause a systemic cancer with their lies and folly.” This comment is so funny I laughed out loud .
6) Emigration , is because THERE ARE NO JOBS here.
7) Yes there should be recruitment ,maybe not to the civil service but definitely to the public service,and YES SW should be increased and tax the wealthy. The economy needs to circulate money and the wealthy are not doing it.
8) maybe the Immigrants are earning more than they would earn in their home countries but that does not mean we should be brought down to their level of earnings , because I do not see Your paymasters taking any significant paycuts to come down to their counterparts earnings in Continental European countries.
9)Have you the figures to say that all of these immigrants have full time jobs here ?
10) I reject your comment that said immigrants have better skills in technology / language than we have ,but accept that employers will employ them over Irish workers because they cost less.
11) I have NEVER felt the need to see myself other than as equal to any other man or woman on this planet. There are people differently gifted than I ,BUT We are all EQUAL . I respect the President of Ireland, my GP, the surgeon, the nurse , fireman , garda, officeworker in their job , But I am beneath NO ONE .
You have a nice weekend like a good man
Garry you are out of control and picking on Eileen for no reason, I don’t think you have contributed anything of relevance to this thread other than leaving more space from where the admin have been removing your comments. Your posts create space, thats literally all I can say for you man.
“suck off the hind tit” lol, ok, you give me a laugh as well, it’s like being savaged by a dead sheep who used to read a lot of Shakespeare.
Ed
It is Garry’s job to distract and detract from some commentators on this news site .
Some even have many identities . But they cannot distract or detract from the TRUTH . A great old saying is ” The truth will out ” And I am going nowhere and I can wait.
Ed
Shakespeare was more polished in fairness. I can not see to many people quoting Garry here in 400 years time ! But he gives us all achuckle , bless him. :)
@ Eileen, oh no, while “Oirland” has produced a lot of great writers, it has not as many great readers. I most definitely mean Shakespeare as reflected through the cognitive lens of a sheeps mind, In fairness to Garry he has not came out with unrestrained abuse towards us yet, i’d give him tanother day or so. After all it must be tough to live in his world contstanly having to respond to all those internet morons with no lives!
Ed
You are quite right of course. ‘Garry’ is restrained so far.
Also we all know how cognitive sheep can be.
For now tho I am calling it a day / night . Chat again soon.
Ive actually never seen a troll on this like u eileen the. Stuff coming out of your mouth should be picked up woth a pooper scooper .. Try be realistic with wat you say instead of just spouting populust nonsence
Well said Jay
I’m not sure how chairman was detracting, he merely stated that he found his union represented him on the occasion he needed it.
I do appreciate your vocalising the seething anger pervading this nation. Ireland has been broken, chopped up and sold off to the LOWEST bidders, and the same people who caused this are still smoking Cubans, swilling brandy and having a great laugh at our expense and we are kidding ourselves in thinking the present bunch in the Dail will do anything to change it.
But I am worried that more extreme radicalised groups within our society will take advantage of this apathy and gain momentum. I want serious solutions, not anarchy and rioting.
Oh dear . I must be hitting a lot of nails on the head . I am now being called a liar AND a troll …
Goodness . I answer every accusation and every question . I do not tell lies . If you have a different opinion it does mean it is just that … A different opinion.
Boildyeggs
Rioting ?
What rioting ?
Strange thing to say because I have seen no evidence of rioting . I would never condone violence.
The government know what is happening in this country ,yet they keep pushing people towards the extreme.
Do the government not pay advisors to advise on the mood of the nation?
Eileen have you a political or economics degree … I highly doubt it so in my opinion i should take ur advise on the political system and economic policys just as much as i should take the opinion of my lamp shade on the same issues and thats why ur nothin but a troll that spouts populist nonsence
Jay
and of course you do have a degree ? So you are saying that people who have degrees are the only people
who should comment ? You are a funny man. :)
No but i would sooner take their opinion that the one who only economic and political background is handing out bin tax leaflets
Jay
Oh right ! Well that funny man is your perogative .
I jus dont understand how someone cab have all those views its like your rainwashed ya very rarley mention a solution to any of te countrys problems that isnt laughable or un inforcable
That’s right . Whatever you say :)
Good response ! Maybe if you spent less time sayin what you think people want to hear on this and more time actually looking for a solution besides burn the bondholders and find a money tree then people would take u more serious instead of how i view u a troll who needs a hobbie
Hey Jay
You are so funny , you should do stand up comedy. Have you any others topics or themes you can
make us laugh at ?
Dony believe every thing Jack says he’s a friend of Gilmore and in the goverments pocket.
Exactly.
That’s true, @ Denise.
A pickpocket is all this government is!
Lol at calling such things fascist. If they read their history they would find that social partnership is an anti labour device that was originally used by Italian fascists prior to and during Mussolini s regime.
People like O’Connor and McGlone are always roundly booed at these rallies. Nothing fascist about it; just the rank and file having their voices heard.
@Petr Tarasov
O’Connor was elected to his position, the rank and file had their voices heard.
Ah I see Petr is a confirmed career protester
Petr is against everything and for nothing!
Declan — Have you anything to say on the topic? You have posted yet another comment about me. You really have an unhealthy obsession with me. I know you are unmarried. Do you fancy me?
While declan is for everything and against nothing…thats keeps him smug and trite.
How do you know I’m un-married? Are you somehow checking on my profile somewhere? Is that not stalking?
How so? Where do you get that idea from?
The red thumbs say it all, Declan. Stay on topic. You want to make personal comment about me? Two can play that game.
Well petr, it was you who made a personal comment about me.
20000 people wasting their time in the same place
My time is precious , and I was there in Dublin today and not one of those 20000 people
felt they were wasting their time. The unions however jack o’connor and his ilk are a disgrace
There was more than the unions represented there today. Ruth Coppinger gave a wonderful heartfelt speech and
was NOT booed or shouted down . She spoke to the people and as one of them. The Campaign Against The hhc was well represented there today .
Eileen. For someone who’s time is precious, You’re on Journal commenting on every article 24/7!
And what did you do today, you tool of the establishment
Not a waste ginger…we have to start showing politicians we are finished with them walking all over us and allowing us to be counted with them as Europes lackies…more marches and soon.
* correction
20000 people wasting their time and breath!!
John F ,
….. and your point is ? ?
That’s right John , you don’t have one ,. Fair play to you .
But 24/7 is a bit of an exaggeration and you know it .
”…every article ?” NO> I absolutely know that you are incorrect in your statement on both counts.
But no worries , thanks for noticing.
Wouldn’t be the first time nor the last time SF supporters behaved in an ungentlemanly manner…..
I was there and there was no trouble at the march, just good natured, hard working people. If a bit of booing terrifies Jack O’Connor, god help the workers expecting them to fight for them.
Extraordinary how so many people can be conned into believing that a Country can continue living on other peoples money and pretend that this is simply all right. Sean Quinn junior exemplified exactly the same behavior and attitude on the Late Late last night. In case anyone doesn’t know perhaps we should remind them that we are bankrupt as a Nation but still living beyond our means. While we all know of really awful personal stories the majority of us continue to live as if nothing has happened and nothing should change.
Here are just a couple of facts.
We have the highest paid workers in the world today in the following sectors;
Lawyers,Doctors,Nurses,Teachers,Politicians,Public Servants,Hospital Porters,Care Assistants,Dentists,TrainDrivers etc etc etc.
What was this March about today ???????
Course there wasn’t Reada….there never is….the usual hear no evil, see no evil! I have to say the flares were a nice touch, very Falls Rd/Bogside….
“While we all know of really awful personal stories the majority of us continue to live as if nothing has happened and nothing should change.” Really Garry??? And you’re alright listening to “really awful personal stories” of people suffering from austerity while we continue to pump money into banks and paying unsecured bondholders? Don’t even get me started on the exorbitant wages paid to IBRC, NAMA and our TDs and their supposedly wage capped advisors. Join us Garry or get out of the way!
Lol, are you at it again Garry, you need to take off the pornovision goggles for a while until nasty ol reality creeps back in to your mind, try giving people benefit of doubt they are not as gullable as you think
Because we are worth it?
Reada, “Join us or get out of the way”??? Is that the kind of movement you want people to join?? Really?
Garry
You left out THE HIGHEST PAID POLITICIANS too.
The thing is all the good people you have mentioned deserve their wage unless you can operate on yourself or you can pull people from burning buildings or from car wreckages…. Keep walking . Don’t diss the extra ordinary decent workers of this country. I am glad to see you have acknowledged that Jack O Connor et al are being paid to keep quiet …
We are living beyond our means the government are the ones spending on stupid things us as a people are broke and can bearly get our weekly needs.
Mick
The Italians are not politicians , they are bankers and judges and others put in to replace the lkegally elected politicians of the people . YOU get YOUR facts right.
Legally …. typo
What? That is complete lies again Eileen. Where are you getting that information? What is wrong with you that you have to keep making stuff up???
We’ve also the highest paid people on the dole.
Jack O’Connor is wrong, im not affiliated with any party and i booed him as well.
Same as that. When people are booed their always claim it’s ‘orchestrated’ to make themselves feel better!
It is standard FFG/Labour response to anything that goes against them … Usually it starts with SF and then mentioning ink toner and Gerry Adams, They would rather blame everyone else than face the truth, the people are sick to death of their hypocrisy. They can blame SF and the ULA all they want, but its mainly the average voter who is dislillusioned with them. But it doesnt make good press to admit people are booing them off the stage,so better to blame SF and the ULA.
Hey Labour, your emperor has no clothes, and we can see straight through you.
Who wants to listen to the fat cats making an insincere speech lol?
A group of non-party and non-union INDEPENDENT protesters broke away from the main protest march when they reached College Green by declining to turn back up O’Connell Street to hear the speeches from overpaid people who presume to talk ‘at’ those who have been hardest hit by austerity and pretend to be on our side. Instead the independent protesters continued straight on to march towards the Dail where they attended the underwear photoshoot organised by ‘The Girl Against Fluoride’. That breakaway march, which picked up it’s own garda escort, was at an independently set pace too. And at the end of the march they were greeted by semi-clad ladies and gents at the photoshoot instead of the boring, insincere and downright insulting speeches from fat cats :)
Booing someone you don’t agree with or don’t want to listen to is hardly ‘fascist behaviour’. I’m not saying they were right or wrong, just not fascists, a sound bite if ever I heard one!
Jack O’Connor a voice from the past I suspect.
Well if anyone didn’t want to listen to the speeches then they only had to join the independent protesters. A sizable independent group of non-party and non-union affiliated protestors broke away from the main protest march when they reached College Green by declining to turn back up O’Connell Street to hear the speeches from people who are not so hit by austerity and instead gained their very own garda escort to march down to the Dail where they joined up with ‘The Girl Against Fluoride’ for the ‘Stripped of our Rights’ underwear photo shoot and gained much more exposure for their own messages that way too.
Plus it must have been better craic than listening to boring speeches that are so often lacking in sincerity but usually filled with condescension :)
(not that I heard the speeches today to know that, lol – I must have been looking at the campaigners in their underwear battling fluoridation)
Bloody sick of jack O conner and the unions …
Lefties calling lefties fascists. lol
Jack O’Connor a lefty? lol
Lefties getting called fascists, haha. O’Connor is a muppet and is part of the problem, not the solution.
I think you will find they were people there who never saw themselves as
left or right or central, just people trying to earn a living , look after their families and
play fair. BUT to call the people on the march today in Dublin fascists !!! well that is
just plain silly. Jack O’Connor is as arrogant as Kenny and Gilmore .Proitecting the wealthy
that is all he does.
‘Fascism is not in itself a new order of society. It is the future refusing to be born.’ Aneurin Bevan, 1897-1960.
So I’m a fascist now? Only I’m busy with the farm most of the day and at night I like an auld cup of tea. I wouldn’t be able to dedicate myself to the fascism full time father…
Best comment of the day. lege
Oh right ! Well that funny man is your perogative .
OOPS !
I meant this comment for Jay below .
A lot of people booed him, I booed him. Jack O’Connor is a government puppet, we need a general strike.
Ssssshhhhh…. it was a booing conspiracy by the big evil SF and ULA dontcha know?!
what exactly was his problem? he doesnt say, only that he seemed upset by banners and posters?! I wonder was it the “shame on labour” one that got his goat? 10,000+ people out to demonstrate their anger and frustration…did he expect balloons and candy floss?!
Bigtime..the more I hear SF getting dissed the more I think I’ll break a habit and give them a vote. FF and Labour are bricking the rise and rise….but I’ll be keeping the scepticism on ALL fronts.
What the hell is besmirching anyway … can you buy it in a shop?
When i see the heads of the trade unions, who are paid salaries in excess of 200,000 euro complaining about being besmirched, I must ask what the hell is wrong with them.
Can they please not besmirch the heads of the unions. These guys deserve their 200,000 salary. Look at all the good they have done for the people of Ireland.
Jack O’Conner isn’t paid in excess of 200,000 euros; his Salary is 115,000 euros. That is lower than heads of Organisations of comparable size.
He’s a trade unionist FFS; he should be on a worker’s wage, just like the SF and ULA reps.
No-one with the skill to do that job would do it for the Average Industrial Wage. It’s ridiculously tough; Jack has however called for higher taxes on himself and others on his payscale
Ah yeah. The whole “If you pay peanuts you get monkeys” chestnut. That’s really worked out great in this country hasn’t it. We paid the bankers millions and they did such a great job. Oh, hang on…
Chairman Meow, the skills to do that job are not in short supply. You merely need a selfish gene that causes you to put the narrow interests if one of the most privileged groups in Ireland ahead of the interests of children in poverty, disabled people and destitute pensioners
Put you in charge Petr. Would you go for it?
Luke
Your comments are all pretty dumb. Swiping from the sidelines instead of being part of the solution.
Sinn Féin draws the same salaries for their TDs as normal parties ie it costs the tax payer the same amount per head.
Cal1. if you have to ask what “besmirching” is , why do you ask not to besmirch the heads of Unions? If you do not know the meaning of the word, do not use it.
Petr, SF TD’s are NOT on the average industrial wage. Every month app 7k is paid by the taxpayer into their accounts. What they choose to do with it after that is their business. How can you ever expect these people to run a country when their not even in charge of their own finances is beyond me…and Jack O ‘ Connor is a muppet.
I’d never be involved in your solution. As for calling my comments dumb. I asked you a serious question but you chose to ignore it and got personal. Not exactly a tactic you’d expect from someone preaching solidarity with the common man.
But you’re not the common man, you’re a pampered twit.
Pampered? How?
Jack O’Connor like all the labour union boys cant take some jeering. Well tough shit, Jack. You’re a Labour party man first – like many in the unions – and your Labour party is causing this austerity. You & your Labour pals are hypocrites. You sold out. You Labour people should be run out of the unions with your fat salaries.
For you to call left wing protestors “fascists” says it all.
Labour, Labour, Labour….out, out, out.
Scabour
Some unions come across as feathering the public sector nest egg.
the total hypocrisy of the Unions is why I left.
unions should be done away with. miserable bastards in ivory towers.
If that came to pass, you’d be kissing goodbye holiday pay, sick pay, and just about every other victory that the trade union movement has fought for and won.
We need more radical and genuinely representative unions, not no unions.
I have to agree with Petr. It’s a bit of a “What have the Romans ever done for us?” situation. Even if you are in a job in which you have no union – the working conditions that exist that are accepted as typical are significant;y down to the trade union movement.
In saying that – I’d agree that the representation that exists in unions is not accurate or realistic. Because of that, any genuine issues on which a union now takes a stand are fobbed off far too often.
A couple of years to late. The Damage is done.
the Booing was not planned – I along with various other people booed because ICTU are failing to do the job they were set up to do, He had a right to be heard – he WAS heard, we had a right to let him know what we think of the performanance of his organisation – hence the booing – nothing fascist about it FFS
ps – Jack – what a pathetic response to the strike call
somebody needs to remind jack o connor that siptu donates money to the labour party so the actions of the labour party in government forcing more and more austerity while paying money to bond holders is a political campaign.there again o connor and beggs have been silent since the austerity started
Jack
My dear friend I do believe that Mr O’Connor was simply pointing out the Law of the Land to those who should be given the benefit of the doubt as to their ignorance!
My dear friend I do believe that cliches are a waste of time
Jack should be more vocal against his FGLabour party who are destroying this state and stop whinging about being bood by a few people.
To compare a bit of booing to fascism is absurd.
I just hear on the 6 o clock news that O Connor is quoted as saying that SIPTU “disassociates itself from calls for a general strike by McGlone because that is political campaign and SIPTU has no involvement in political campaigns” or something to that effect. Poor Jack is definitely having a bad day!
If today was bad for him….. It is only the beginning !
Sometime in the future there’ll be plenty of rope and lamp posts for these traitors. Make the most of it while you can Jackie-boy. There’s a lot of angry folks out there…..
If you weren’t there then you don’t know, but I’d say easily 70% were booing & shouting “general strike” all because he’s Labour’s obedient puppy dog.
Jack ocnr you are a complete disgrace!
Please step a side and resign along with David Beggs!
Ocnr calling People at todays march fascist is even worse than Bertie Aherne claiming he was a socialist! Disgraceful!
Ocnr has completely lost the run of himself.
Ocnr and his crew have been getting booed and shouted down regularly for the past few years because they are a waste of time and wont lead the fight against the political elite and bondholders and the rank and file know it.
Oh, come on Journal. This was a PROTEST. It is not news that people at a protest think that SIPTU is on the other side. They support Labour. That is the government. That is the other side. If SIPTU had a backbone, it would disassociate itself from Labour and support the alternative ideas provided by Sin Fein or the ULA (or at least some of the ULA). The Journal just lost its credibility in my opinion. News would have been that someone from SIPTU broke ranks and said they were leaving the LABOUR fold. Not that others booed them because of their complicity.
@Randy
To be fair the indication that the ‘behaviour’ as described by the SIPTU president was a result of the union’s support of Labour is referenced in the article. Also, the most recent update (with details from our reporter at the march) gives more information about the events of the rally.
Thanks for reading and commenting,
Emer
@ Emer, just off topic for a second but nice to see journalists elaborate like this on their articles.
@ Randy, there would seem to be a lot of truth in what you say, I have noticed that the journal are one of the few mediums that carry Fianna Fail propaganda these days, trying to cloud the issue in booing here alright by sounds of it.
@ Emer
Ruth Coppinger made a great speech today . Brid Smith spoke well as did Joan ? (lady speaking on behalf of community groups) and the lady from Spectacle of ??? I APOLOOGise I can not recall these ladies names but they too made great sense and spoke FROM THE HEART and EXPERIENCE .
Emer , where is the report on what these women had to say. They got great response from the crowd . What makes Jack O Connors slanderous comments so special?
Yes THANKKKKK you Eileen, that is exactly what I was trying to say but could not summon up the brain power tonight, Gregg will go to town on me when he reads this lol
Ed
my old brain is a bit tired too , but who is Gregg ?
I’d be VERY interested to see the results if there was a poll taken with rank and file SIPTU members to see if they themselves are happy with the direction that their Union leaders are taking. But that’s only a pipe dream. Jackie & Co would be commiting career suicide if they did it – and Jackie boy knows that all too well.
@ Eileen, ohhhhh dearrrrrrr, Garry not Gregg.
Ed
Lol … He could well be Gregg tomorrow !
Enda
Jack O C ,got the message today .
How many demonstrations have we had in the last few years? Farmers, teachers, the Unions etc, etc, marching up O’Connell st . to the Dail.
What have they achieved? ……. NOTHING!
The politicians and bankers laugh at these protests which grab the headlines for 24 hours and then forget them.
The focus is lost discussing whether or not someone is a fascist, who did what, who didn’t do that, etc etc.
The Austerity measures are WRONG!
SIMPLE SOLUTION! – If everyone just Stop What You Are Doing for 30 min they might, just might listen and make the right decisions?
You have 13 likes on your FB page and have updated it about 10 times in 2 months and have the gall to criticise people? In fairness, I don’t want to criticise your efforts but don’t take a dig at the thousands who came out to make an effort.
IMO, something is happening in Ireland and it’s less and less along party lines. That’s something to be thankful for – ordinary people who may not otherwise come out are actually doing so. The fact that there was significant numbers at this particular protest, I find very encouraging and hope to be at any others that come up (out of the country at the moment so couldn’t be at this one).
@Tony
I was on the march today in support against these Austerity measures.
I have not criticised anyone but simply stated that this type of protest does not work!
I am an individual affiliated to no political party and I put together http://www.swyad.com (in 12 hours) to release my frustration with AIB increasing their interest rates the day after paying over 1BILLION to unsecured bond holders.
Some people “get it” and who knows?
IMO – The only way to bring the country to a standstill and get our inept, spineless government to STOP the austerity measures, is for everyone to Stop What You Are Doing for 30 minutes!
EVERYONE and this can be achieved?
NB – I am glad you took the time to read http://www.swyad.com
I just think what’s pointless is to assume a lack of effect. If one were to take the same attitude about your own effort it would be easy to say “what’s the point in stopping for 30 minutes?” or “fat chance on that happening”.
Every effort has the chance to fail – Ireland has some history of protest – and protest that works, however this is not our recent history. I hope it becomes something that we are identified for again.
Peaceful protest is the only way. Just looking at the reaction from people on Savita’s tragic death – those marches and gatherings have been massively powerful IMO.
What we really need to do is do a real life DDoS – and do it without offering a podium to those who have failed us. If those who have failed us want a podium, let it be in their actions and in their work.
Gather with a point, express that point, don’t roar and shout, don’t engage in anti-social behaviour and disrupt those who need to see the point. Simple, effective and much more accessible to anyone who may fear any potential hassle. It’s a dignified, safe, effective and not criticisable by those who would wish to find ways to pull the rug out from under the point.
At least that’s what I see as the most effective route…..
I’d be with Ken on this one, my experience of peaceful protest i.e the occupy movement was that they had no real direction and could not figure out what to do. I think peaceful protest is ignored anyways and it seems to get diluted by the media who focus on the provocative thing rather than the reason people are there. I think we need something different but not what the Greeks are doing. I am so proud of the protesters that day after day with the odds stacked against them that go out in peace to make our country listen, how dare somebody call that facism.
I agree – you need to stand on clear principle.
but to say that peaceful protest doesn’t work is to ignore so many times that it has.
exactly. this country doesnt need unions. if everyone marched on the dail and enda kennys private residence in castlebar you would get sumwhere instead of lackies like david begg and jack o conner spouting shite..
See this is why the left in Ireland are useless. Always fighting with each other. No wonder the electorate wont let them sniff power.
If Labour and the Union leaders are ‘Left’ then I am sorry, i don’t get it. They are so far right, they are stuck up FFG/FF asses.
Cal
You are as usual hit it in one. There is a propaganda machine at work
against ordinary decent people and it is up to each and every one of us to expose it . The unions are working against the workers . SHAM SHAME SHAME
there is a ground swell and it continues to grow it’s just not behind the unions.
I’m in the market for one of those annonymous masks Tom :-)
Try forbidden planet…..
can we all have the same mask ?
of course we can :) might be confusing when it comes to whoes round is it.
copy and paste to your hearts content but you must ware it in real life too.
hat and hair extra
And that is an excellent other reason for those masks to all be the same
If Jack O’Connor is claiming that it was only the shinners and radicals who gave Eugene Mcglone the bird then he’s talking nonsense. I was standing among union groups at various points in the crowd when Mcglone took the stage and they were giving him tons of grief, it was’nt everyone who heckled him but it was VERY widespread.
Wouldnt be suprised if Jack is trying to manage the headlines for his buddy’s in govt.
Jack O Connor, President of SIPTU calls demonstrators today fascists?… That means approximately – 6,000 of his SIPTU workers there today are fascist…? I think the workers who pay their good hard earned money for support should spend it elsewhere rather than lining Jack OConnors fat pocket.
Masquerading as someone who cares and supports the workers when he just shoots them down for wanting to be heard. I think he has to look hard at himself and his reason for being in SIPTU. I dont think his position is viable after those comments, outrageous statements about his own people and blatant disregard about the seriousness of the situation.
Take note, people, and let Jack’s words sink in. This man is the leader of the country’s biggest Union – and he’s just criticised people for exercising their democratic right to peacefully protest. I think that’s what’s called shooting oneself in the foot? Go to hell, you traitor.
James Connolly will be turning in his grave.
What a tosser, if he and his government/union buddies had spoken out during the Celtic tiger, instead of trying to stuff more cash into already over full pockets, we might not be in the mess that we are.
What bright spark came up with the FAH-HABULOUSLY witty Enda as Hitler banner? The millions of dead Jews, gays, gypsies etc think you’re the coolest MoFo on the planet.
Thumbs up, man… thumbs up to you!!!
I think that was the point of the attempted message. No?
It ‘s repugnant to compare anyone to Hitler. You lose whatever argument you think you’re making.
@Daisy
Agreed. I cringe when I see people with those signs. But each to their own I suppose…
theres always a couple or three of those Nazi comparison themed posters at these events – most inappropriate, I never get close enough to the holder to speak to them but a gentle word might not do any harm, they probably just haven’t thought it through
Hitler was a prominent fascist but his regime was not the only fascist regime. I don’t see anywhere that jack o’connor called anyone hitler??
Prove me wrong
These comments from Jack O’ Connor, while bizarre, makes me wonder if he’s afraid that people are noticing that the mask is slipping. To clarify, SIPTU have received almost half a billion in subscriptions from its members during the last decade. That’s almost 50 million per year, to run a trade union that represents working people. How, in a small country like ours, could it possibly cost that much?. My guess, is that it doesn’t. It only costs a fraction of that amount. My question is, where is the rest of the money going?. A bit off topic perhaps, but under the circumstances still worth asking, I think.
The REGIME in Ireland MUST change! Enough is enough!
SF hijacking things? How totally without precedent.
@ken bryne to be fair every farmers protest is extremely organised and unified with spefic goals. They know how to protest and keep their status quo. This is why they continue to be one of the most previlaged group in europe in terms of subsidies and handouts.
The farmers ”union” is very well off and can afford to have posters and banners etc. We have recycled our posters, banners, placards because we are not so well off . However I agree with you that this is why th farmers remain well looked after .Fair play to them, it is what we need.
Jack O Conner should be on the side of the marchers and take a stand against this Government who are hell bent on robbing the working people of Ireland he should be reminded who’s paying his over size pay packet
Booing someone you don’t agree with or don’t want to listen to is hardly ‘fascist behaviour’. I’m not saying they were right or wrong, just not fascists, a sound bite if ever I heard one!
Imagine though the gall of this man to accuse peaceful protesters of being Facists when the Greeks are burning their own cities for seemingly far less corrupt politics and betrayal by their own politicians.
Oh Ed, u really would want to educate yourself.
I’ll get right on it Mick
These groups couldn’t agree on the colour a shite
Out of touch Union Boss is out of touch. Looks like we’ll have to lump them on the pyre too.
Jack o conniver should just join his fascist blue shirt friends in fine gael get it over with he marriage is working well for them
It appears that the protests today were a success in so far as approx 20,000 people came out.
the unions only came out to stay in political favour and thought that maybe they could quiet the angry crowds.
we all know that the unions are part of what is rotten in the state of ireland.
how can you justify taking salaries of 6 figure sums and claim to rpresent the very who pay their wages & people are losing their jobs their homes and families the latter to suicide and believe me when I say that the unions dont give a damn.
unions are using workers as a tool to keep in favour in order to keep their salaries hugely inflated. and they also use members to threathen the politicians when looking for leaverage to improve their own standing in the upper circles of society.
if you look close enough I am in no doubt the you will find some of these union, I was going to use the word leaders but they are not leaders they are leeches in the thick of the golden circles that exist in ireland today.
these union leeches are very lucky that people only booed them. in other countrys they would have been thorn from limb to limb, they should count themselfs very lucky. and if people are behavimg like facists them thats what they have become and not of their own makingbeing hungry jobless scared and worrying about your families future will do that to a person.
Labour, eh?
Case in point:
Dick Spring – Director of AIB
Neil Kinnock – Member of EU Commision
Eamon Gilmore – Need I say any more?
The next budget will finally break the link between the so-called labour party and the trade unions….there won’t be a labour party TD in sight….they will go the way of the greens?!?!
well im neither a member of sinn fein or any other party for that matter add that to the fact im not a fascist yet i booed today when McGlone was introduced. the union leaders had the chance to show solidarity with the rest of europe on the 14th and disregarded that chance, but it is clear that ordianry people did want that chance and shows that the union leaders are out of touch and prefer to be in the pockets of the government.
The trade unions do not serve the workers,they are just another private company selling a fictions product .
Jack o Connor earns so much money from different income streams it is immoral. As a government appointee to different committees and boards it is astonishing anybody would support him or any trad union march. These people bankrupt the country along with the government and the Croke Park Deal nailed our coffin.
If citizens want examples of fascist behaviour they need look no further than Hogan, Shatter or Noonan and the rest of the so called government. Disdain for human rights, Control of mass media, Corporate power is protected, Labour power is suppressed, Rampant cronyism and corruption. Welcome to the Irish (non) Free state. Fascist to the core!!!!!
While Im sure I may not agree with some of the opinions at this march its good to see democracy alive & well. I say more peaceful marches. While some may say its pointless it proves that we still care for this country & it makes the political elite uncomfortable. Well done to all who attended.
Boo’d ICTU today, not in the ULA or Sinn Féin for what it’s worth. These gombeens have driven our movement into the ground, most rank and file trade unionists are sick of the ICTU approach. A Labour government means that the ICTU dog won’t bark, simple as. Remember the 100,000 on the streets two years ago?
Congrats all. Not on mention , that I can see , of the Bondholders !
Why didn’t you come along and mention them yourself?
No. But we got Hitler. Godwins law is never wrong.
It was great to see independent & community groups at the protest march, not just union banners. Some photos here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/xshayx/sets/72157632087599783
good photos Shay.
The amount of juvenile bullshit on here tonight..
I hope it’s not indicative of the level of intelligence in Ireland or I fear I see why we are where we are…
The journal seem to be trying to distract from the real issues here and insulting the intelligence of it’s readership, the real story here for me is that they have focused on a man with questionable loyalties referring to people fighting for their country and childrens economic survival as fascists, Mr O’ Connor is a fascist and a troublemaker and the journal has put the spotlight on the wrong views.
@Ed,
You are implying that this article endorses Mr O’Connor’s comments, and you are wrong. This comments section gives our readers the opportunity to respond to what the SIPTU president said today, which is quite the opposite of ‘insulting the intelligence’ of those readers. I’d like to think that anyone reading this can make up their own minds.
I would ask you to stay on topic rather than repeatedly accusing TheJournal.ie and its writers of ‘propaganda’. By doing so, you are insulting MY intelligence.
Thanks for reading and commenting,
Emer
I would never have known otherwise unless i tested the water first, i do think the Journal gives far to much coverage to Fianna Fail but I can appreciate why the Journal would draw a line under Mr O’ Connors words if it is unbiased and in no ways portrays the activists there today who are anything but Fascists.
@ Emer, you are incorrect. I was not implying the journal endorses Mr O’ Connors comments, but I was suggesting that the journal was giving them precedent over the 10,000 people today who’s comments and views have gone unrecorded and as a consequence has marginalized their reasons for protesting.
Ed – this story is about specific comments, look elsewhere on today’s news on the journal and you will find a story about the protest itself.
Duely noted Tomy, hadn’t seen anything else about it, apologies, I just hope this guys comments is not detracting the anti austerity movement
As you can probably tell from my Grammar I am not a journalist myself!
Do you have a link for the other articles Tomy? the journal has updated and can’t find anything else about it.
Ed, seriously stop commenting…you are making a bigger fool out of your self each time you post….its cringe!
Very valuable contribution yet again Mick, i’ll get right on it.
@ Mick, lmao, you are the idiot a.k.a Garry as well aren’t you ha ha, he set up another profile Eileen and has only just joined conversation after he got his arse handed to him on a plate as the B.S artist formerly known as Garry, truely the funniest thing i’ve seen in a long time. @ The Journal.ie, is that grounds for banning his I.P for ye?
I also think it’s mad the journal have regurgitated RTE’s massive cockup in wrongly saying McGlone called for a general strike. Unfortunately that’s about as likely as Jack O’Connor doing it. Were ye actually at the march or do ye just copy stories off RTE?
SIPTU have become all that they used to despise.
Does anyone remember that big account that was set up to train union officials that was used to ferry them and their wives to exotic locations
Union leaders over €100,000 a year don’t want a General Strike. Seems like to much of a Fat Cat represent the people to me.
fas·cism/ˈfaSHizəm/
Noun:
1.An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization.
2.(in general use) Extreme right-wing, authoritarian, or intolerant views or practice.
Nothin there anyways about booing dodgy people thank God
All we ever hear from you lefties is burn the bond holders Tax the wealthy and increase SW spending. Firstly lets look at the bond holders secured and non secured. Lets say we did burn them. What do you think would happen when we next went to the market to sell our bonds? Do you you think that those selfsame bond holders would come anywhere near us? And if they wouldn’t buy our who would? The bond fairies?
Secondly, Tax the rich. You must think that country is awash with millionaires. If you increased the taxes for those people that had the millions what is to stop them upping sticks and leaving? I certainly would if I had the means.
And finally increasing SW spending. After buring the bond holders and chasing away those with money where are you going to get the money for these increases? Leave the Euro and start printing Punts again? Ever hear of a thing called Hyper inflation. When the value of the money is worth less than the paper its printed on. Ask the Argentinians what that is like!
But ignore all the above. Isn’t everything wonderful in the Socialist utopia that you lot believe in.
Me me me, take take take, give nothing back… Socialism is great…if you have someone to pay for it. Unfortunately, we don’t guys. Live in the real world people.
Mick,
Ireland has over 33,000 millionaires, but you probably don’t want to hear that.
“ohh, they will all leave if we start taxing them fairly” Good! too many are taking advantage of this country and it’s people, we can not put up with this.
The UNSECURED bond holders should have not been paid & should not be paid, we are not an endless source of money. When you can’t eat how can you pay a landowner?
People only want to live in a Just and Fair society.
Don’t boo, don’t comment, don’t shout, just cancel your SIPTU membership subscription!
Please excuse my spelling errors
Jack O’Connor is a traitor to this country. He and his fellow union bosses had their noses buried in the trough throughout the cletic tiger. He is part of the elite class that have destroyed this country, and who still manage to earn obscene salaries during recession. Go now!
The bigortry of Jack O Connor and senior people in S I P T O to ignor the working class in Ireland is appalling. Its long over due for this regime to go.
The bigorty of Jack O Connor and several people in S I P T O to ignor the working class people of Ireland is appalling. Its long over due for this regime to go.
The unions in Ireland only represent the highly paid public sector workers in their very very secure jobs , while the private sector pays all the wages , whilst living with the fear of losing their jobs or even more paycuts . My wife and I are looking over our shoulders constantly , who protects our interests in the private sector . NO ONE !
This puts me in mind of the vicious booing campaigns of the black and tans alright, not to mention the nazi’s “final solution” of rounding up people they considered undesirable, and booing at them. When will we learn from our history???
nice one random
Don’t forget, this is the same arsehole who suggested that we put a tax on “trophy houses”, he’s a clown who is an embarrassment to the organisation that employs him.
Power to the people !!!! the peoples union is the biggest union of all , with no representatives because we all represent ourselves , no wages paid out and if need be the people pay the wages and are in charge of incomings /outgoings ! To boo somebody does not make you a facist , it simply means you show discontent with someones words or actions ! BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO !! Boooooooooooooooooooo !! The trade unions have sold the members out ! the Government have sold the public out !! The Bankers have sold everyone out !! The powers that be , sit in their comfy thrones , the powers that be live in their huge comfy homes , the powers that be spread fear amongst the people , the powers that be sit higher than any steeple , the powers that be dont really care , the powers that be have no idea how to share , the powers that be can sleep at night , the powers that be watch the innocent people fight , the powers that be must have no conscience , the powers that be cause all this nonsense !
McGlone kicking off a recruitment campaign on the news. FFS…
For once that sounds like the union leaders having a good idea. We need the unions to be as strong as possible right now so we can fight austerity and kick traitors like McGlone and O’Connor out.
The booing was not planned” it Just Came out Naturally Instant When The Fascist themselves were speaking” the Unions that Betrayed us By voting a Yes Vote of The Fiscal Treaty Referendum and Selling us Irish People Out” so people Were Angry by These Mobs who Get high earned Payments To Do a Job, Not Moan about it and tell lies as well” nobody Planned Any Booing it was Provoked By Chair Leaders of The Spokes Union” so They are Fascist not the people that attended.
No union leader should be on more than 3 times the industrial wage, and pay increases should only happen when the average wage goes up for there members, this should the same for politicians to varying degress.
the old argument of you pay peanuts you get monkeys does not apply to Ireland, We having been paying princely sums and we have got morans on all levels, union leaders/politicians bankers etc
As for Mr o Connors remarks re fascism, i doubt he truly understands the meaning of the word,
These so called leaders have failed us, and continue to rleate more to big business than there members.
Bought and paid for!
have your say