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Everything you wanted to know about grief but were too afraid to ask

An expert tells us what we can do to support bereaved people, how to talk to children about loss, and if there’s a good alternative to mass cards.

MOST OF US have probably been in a situation where we wanted to say something supportive to a person who has recently been bereaved.

Many of us will have also avoided a bereaved person for fear of not knowing what to say – or put our foot in it by saying the wrong thing.

There are many aspects of grief and bereavement that people feel uncomfortable with and shy away from.

Dr Susan Delaney is a clinical psychologist and the bereavement services manager with the Irish Hospice Foundation. She recently sat down with TheJournal.ie to discuss grief and give advice on topics such as what to say to a bereaved person, how to show them support, and how people can acknowledge significant dates such as anniversaries.

Here’s what we talked about:

Are the five stages of grief real?

Video TheJournal.ie / YouTube

Susan says there’s “an appeal” to five stages that gives us a way “to get a handle on grief”, but there are no hard and fast rules.

It’s true that for many people there’s an initial shock and numbness, and people can get angry and sad and most people finally come to some resignation – that’s true. But I think we must be very cautious that we’re not prescribing a certain way to grieve and then people feeling they’re not doing it right or they haven’t ‘done’ anger yet.

She notes that there’s a “normal trajectory” for grief, but everyone is different.

Most people come to terms with the grief by about six months, but she added that people never “get over” significant grief.

What do you say to a friend or colleague who is recently bereaved?

Video TheJournal.ie / YouTube

Susan thinks the old-fashioned ‘I’m sorry for your trouble’ is actually quite hard to improve on.

She says that the awkwardness people often feel when around someone who is recently bereaved “comes from a good place” because “we don’t want to make things worse for people”.

We’re afraid we’ll say the wrong thing, but unfortunately what we all do out of our fear of saying the wrong thing … we say nothing and it leaves bereaved people feeling unsupported – and they do notice when you hop into a shop door to avoid them, or cross the street. Those are the hurtful things that people in bereavement talk about.

Susan says people should keep it simple and acknowledge the grief as this will let the person know you care.

So what about the worst things people can say? Susan thinks anything that starts with the phrase ‘At least’ should be banned or anything along the lines of ‘I know a fella who had it much worse…’

She also gives some practical advice for how you can support people, and why you sometimes need to just ‘show up and shut up’.

What do you say to someone who has lost a loved one through suicide?

Video TheJournal.ie / YouTube

Susan says that when people are in this type of situation they often try to put themselves in the shoes of the person who is bereaved.

She recalls that bereaved people have told her that people often ask inappropriate questions like: ‘Did you not notice that she was very low?’, ‘Did he leave a note?’

Susan says she understands where this line of questioning comes from but adds: “It’s not your business.”

What do I do if I missed the funeral or forgot a significant anniversary?

Video TheJournal.ie / YouTube

People have told Susan that when they’re lying awake at night they often think about who did and didn’t attend a funeral, adding that friendships and relationships are often “made and broken over those things”. However, she notes that people sometimes have valid reasons for not being able to attend a funeral or memorial service.

Susan advises people to make a note of important anniversaries, but adds that it’s never too late to let someone know you’re thinking about them.

Is there a good alternative to mass cards?

Video TheJournal.ie / YouTube

Susan says that while mass cards are wholly appropriate for a certain demographic, sometimes other tokens would be appreciated.

She advises people to ‘think outside the box’ in this regard.

Again, simplicity is key here with Susan favouring a blank card with a handwritten message.

What does a person mean when they say they’re ‘fine’? Should we keep asking?

Video TheJournal.ie / YouTube

Susan has recently started to compare asking a person if they’re fine to asking someone if they want a cup of tea.

She notes that Irish people are usually pretty good at knowing whether or not ‘I’m fine’ means just that, or if we should ask someone again.

Susan says bereaved people will have days where they are sick of talking – or they might choose to open up to someone other than you.

“You know what, we’ll get it wrong and that’s okay,” she advises.

Should bereaved people get counselling?

Video TheJournal.ie / YouTube

Susan notes that grieving ”isn’t an illness” as “it’s normal to be bereaved and it’s normal to be upset”.

She says most of the healing takes place in a bereaved person’s “natural network”.

However, this might not be available to some people. In certain cases, counselling or a support group could help the person. She states that grief can become disabling for about 10% of people, when professional intervention could help them get back on track.

Susan adds that it’s important to let the bereaved person lead the ‘dance’ of grief.

Good support means offering the other person what feels like support to them, not what we decide feels like help.

Sometimes they’ll want to talk, sometimes they won’t. Sometimes they’ll cry or shout or be cranky. Let them be how they need to be.

Do men and women grieve differently?

Video TheJournal.ie / YouTube

Susan notes that there are masculine and feminine grieving styles, rather than male and female.

She thinks people should avoid giving others advice on how to grieve, asking: “What makes us think that we should know what someone else should do?”

Often, people need to take a step back and look at what a bereaved person actually needs, rather than what we think they need.

In some situations (usually where you know the person well), Susan thinks humour can help to a degree, but it’s not something she’d recommend.

How should you support bereaved children?

Video TheJournal.ie / YouTube

“We can learn so much from children across the board, but particularly around bereavement,” Susan notes.

She says children will want information after a person dies and if they don’t get it from a parent or guardian, they will seek it elsewhere.

She thinks it’s not possible to “shield” children from death so we must include them in a way that’s age-appropriate.

Video: Órla Ryan/Aoife Barry

bereaved

For more information on dealing with bereavement, visit bereaved.ie.

The Irish Hospice Foundation has recently launched Never Forgotten – a Christmas appeal which asks people to remember a loved one and make a donation in support of the organisation’s end-of-life work. More information can be found here

last_rites_image

Read: ‘Then everyone died’: I lost four people I loved in 14 months

Read: Advice: What to say – and not say – to a friend who is recently bereaved

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    Mute SilexFlint
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:09 PM

    Micheál Martin becoming taoiseach is a bit of a joke, as he’s basically lost 3 elections in a row.

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    Mute guineon
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:17 PM

    @SilexFlint: well, if your looking at this technically then he actually won this election? He got the most seats for his party? How else can you decide on a winner/loser?
    Judging by that comment sinn féin have lost every election for the last 80 years including this one

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    Mute Matthew O'Kane
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:22 PM

    @SilexFlint: my bet is on ff sf greens in gov there wont be much change they wont even get rid of the carbon tax propping up irish water remember ff promise to abolish that

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    Mute Brax Braxton
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:24 PM

    @SilexFlint: he’s been elected himself everytime and has actually increased seats from 2011 to now so I’d say he does

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    Mute SilexFlint
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:25 PM

    @guineon: Popular vote and since ceann comhairle was automatically reinstated you could argue it’s a tie. He’s been consistently the worst FF leader in history.

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    Mute Natalka Mayo
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:31 PM

    @guineon: he didn’t get the most seats. The had the CC automatically elected so won same amount as Sinn Fein but ran twice as many candidates

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    Mute Simon McGrath
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:39 PM

    @guineon: not forgetting one seat was automatically awarded.

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    Mute The Risen
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:48 PM

    @Simon McGrath: Correct. SF and FF won the same amount of seats. FF had one extra gifted by default. SF still carried the popular vote.

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    Mute Nuala Mc Namara
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:50 PM

    @guineon: Technically 37 FF candidates were vote in as Dail’s last Ceann Comhairle (FF) automatically gets a seat!

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    Mute Nuala Mc Namara
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:51 PM

    @The Risen: &88% of their candidates elected!

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    Mute Connoroconner
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    Feb 11th 2020, 1:00 PM

    @Matthew O’Kane: no party will get rid of carbon tax and no party will get rid of USC

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    Mute Paul O'Sullivan
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    Feb 11th 2020, 1:14 PM

    @SilexFlint: well he was never going to win the 2011/2016 elections now was he? And he didn’t lose this one or win.

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    Mute SilexFlint
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    Feb 11th 2020, 1:52 PM

    @Paul O’Sullivan: You could argue FF should have done better in 16 but to lose seats this election is woeful.

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    Mute MickN
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    Feb 11th 2020, 2:00 PM

    @SilexFlint: and crashed the economy…

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    Mute John Mulligan
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    Feb 11th 2020, 2:12 PM

    @The Risen: the popular vote is irrelevant in the context of PR though.

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    Mute Sean Fahey
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    Feb 11th 2020, 2:39 PM

    @guineon: if you’re looking at seats, FF had one automatic seat that wasn’t contested by election so they won the same number of seats as SF in the election but got less of the 1st preference votes which is effectively the popular vote.

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    Mute Tommy Roche
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    Feb 11th 2020, 2:41 PM

    @MickN: Never voted for FF, and never will. But as a country we need to get past this myth that a political party singlehandedly brought down our economy. Sure, they played their part with poor oversight of what was happening, but the citizens of this country need to start accepting the truth. The world economy tanked but WE were the main reason it was much worse in Ireland than most countries. WE borrowed billions from the bank’s to then throw at property developers. WE borrowed vast amounts to have new cars and decking outside our councils houses. And WE couldn’t pay the Piper when the shlt hit the fan. WE need to take personal responsibility and get over this thing of blaming someone else because they did not hold our hands tightly enough. As a nation we went on the lash, climbed on the swing and swung as high as we could go. We eventually fell off and now, years later, we are still blaming the people who built the swing.

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    Mute Kevin Lonergan
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    Feb 11th 2020, 3:55 PM

    @guineon: He had the second worst FF election performance in the history of the state and only has more seats because of the automatic return of the Ceann Comhairle. FF finished second to SF in the first preference vote stats so they actually lost the election. Every FF figure interviewed has admitted that the election was a very bad one for the party.

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    Mute The Risen
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:19 PM

    Just a quick comment in relation to all the party hacks on here who have been fainting in the aisles over David Cullinanes ‘Up the Ra’ comment.

    If you’ve been posting here about how offended you are by it (well, pretending to be), but didn’t post how offended you were by the photo of a child eating their dinner in the street off a piece of cardboard, or a homeless man nearly killed when his tent was demolished by a digger, you need to re-calibrate your moral compass.

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    Mute Seamus Murphy
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:27 PM

    @The Risen: that’s all grand if Sinn Fein can sort all those problems, which is anything but guaranteed. And no , we’re not fainting in the aisles, we’re horrified. This is a party that claims to have matured and fit for government. There’s no place for that rhetoric in the Ireland of 2020.

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    Mute Kate Flaherty
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:32 PM

    @Seamus Murphy: exactly!…

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    Mute Dermo Adams
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:32 PM

    @Pád: Its EXACTLY the time and place for him to make that comment. Ive been listening to the radio all morning and not a single mention of the fact that the provisional IRA came about as a result of loyalist murder gangs and atrocities by the british army and RUC. Youd swear there was only one side in the conflict if all you had was RTE and newstalk

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    Mute The Risen
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:35 PM

    @Seamus Murphy: Are you a party hack?

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    Mute Pádraic Ó Braonáin
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:44 PM

    @Pád: Yes Pád you may be correct there but some people are deliberately >cherry-picking< the shocking events.

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    Mute Dermo Adams
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:45 PM

    @Sim0n: You really need to grow up and accept the new political landscape, despite your little anti sinn fein tirades

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    Mute Sim0n
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:50 PM

    @Dermo Adams: Ah its just great to see you back after all this time to only support a comment made by Risen. Just like Katamari. With friends like you who needs a second account? :)

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    Mute Will
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:51 PM

    @Dermo Adams: It’s not how the IRA came about that’s the problem. It’s what they became in a very short space of time afterwards that disgusts people.
    From defending innocent Catholics to cold blooded murder of innocents in no time at all.

    “Youd swear there was only one side in the conflict”

    That’s a pointless deflection. If you must have an answer then how about we didn’t have any UVF paramilitary/terrorist supporters on the ballot.
    If we get any in the future I’ll make sure to condemn them.

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    Mute David Garland
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:59 PM

    @Will: What happened after the Civil War in this Country? Men and Boys from the Anti Treaty side rounded up and murdered in fields all over the Countryside. Men abducted from the street and found hacked to death up the Dublin Mountains. This was all done by the very people who founded the Irish Free State, Men who are celebrated in this Country today.. Also never forget that there were more people disappeared in Cork alone during the Civil War by the Free Staters than in the whole of the troubles..

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    Mute The Risen
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    Feb 11th 2020, 1:06 PM

    @David Garland: Sssshhh David. Do you not know that Irelands bloody past only started in the 1960s, only had one group involved and only happened in 6 of the 32 counties?

    23
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    Mute Matt Dillon
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    Feb 11th 2020, 1:27 PM

    @Sim0n: The British establishment killed a lot of innocent people.Who stood up to them.For a so called democracy,they had a separate education system for Protestants and Cathollics in a small part of so called UK.B Specials,UDR,Loyalists para groups all to keep nationalists/republicans under their thumb.Irish Governments turned a blind eye!

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    Mute Declan Foley
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    Feb 11th 2020, 1:36 PM

    @The Risen: outrage is not mutually exclusive. The majority of people who voted for SF, including myself, did so with the expectation that SF were going to be a mature, intelligent party dedicated to left leaning policies. This guy was akin to a teenager who listened to a rebel song for the 1st time. Mary Lou and Co deserve better than this guy.

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    Mute Seamus Murphy
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    Feb 11th 2020, 3:55 PM

    @The Risen: no. I’m a realist. Unlike you I might add. I’ve seen a lot of your comments on the journal and I’ve yet to see anything sensible.

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    Mute Helena Lefever
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    Feb 11th 2020, 4:41 PM

    @The Risen: well said.

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    Mute Skybloo
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    Feb 11th 2020, 4:52 PM

    @Seamus Murphy: Are you a troll? Or a bigger snowflake than what’s falling outside?? (“horrified”… oh please lol). Your comments are anything but real or sensible. More like shi’t stirring nonsense.
    I didn’t vote for Sinn Fein as first preference, I voted for Catherine Murphy, Soc Dems. But I’m looking forward to seeing how Sinn Fein make the much needed changes. With good will, let’s see how they get on.

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    Mute Mark O'Donovan
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    Feb 11th 2020, 7:05 PM

    @The Risen: Can we not be offended by both. Is it moral to offer support to terrorists?

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    Mute Peter Kelly
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    Feb 12th 2020, 7:31 AM

    @The Risen: why would we need to do.it ourselves when you are clearly doing it for us?

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    Mute Seamus Murphy
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:23 PM

    If Sinn Fein are left in opposition again because of a Fianna Fáil/ Fine Gael coalition it’ll be carnage at the next election. I think the way to go is let Sinn Fein form a government and when people see that they aren’t the magic formula then they’ll pay for that in the next election.

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    Mute Shirley Hollingsworth
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:41 PM

    Let the 3 main parties make a government..3 ministers for each roll on TDS wages.one of each..to make sure good decisions are made.so 3 minister of transport health tourism and so fourth.thats the change the people wanted.even 2 on certain jobs.and Harris on picking furniture.in a charity shop.sorry if this is impossible..it’s just housekeeping .

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    Mute Nuala Mc Namara
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    Feb 11th 2020, 1:33 PM

    @Seamus Murphy: Seamus,what this GE has shown us is that many people feel they haven’t been listened to for years but now it’s time to listen.
    The Exit Poll re why people voted the way they did,asked very important questions:’Whch one of these was most important to you in deciding how to vote’s:32% said health & 26% said housing/homelessness=58% of why people voted.(pension age came next @8%, climate change@6%,etc
    The Exit Poll Q’Does the following statement apply to you personally or not-for-profit”I have benefited from the improvement in the economy in recent years:63% said ‘does not apply’& 37% said ‘applies’When that question is put to FF,FG&SF voters,the results are surprising!:68% of FF voters answers were “does not apply”,77% of SF voters answers were “does not apply” whereas 41% of FG voters answers were “does not apply”.
    So FF as well as SF must listen to these voters and put workable solutions on the table especially re health, homelessness and housing,etc

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    Mute Larry Doherty
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    Feb 11th 2020, 4:22 PM

    @Seamus Murphy: hey Seamus, Fianna Fáil are in need of a strategist. You seem to excellent material for the vacancy. If not, they can always find you a job spreading slurry ,given the amount you produce.

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    Mute Seamus Murphy
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    Feb 12th 2020, 12:52 PM

    @Larry Doherty: I can tell you’re a Sinn Fein voter by reading your empty comment. All criticism but no point to make. Well done.

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    Mute Tricia G
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:08 PM

    I foresee another election with SF fielding far more candidates.

    Their current crop better make sure they don’t screw up in the meantime…… Maybe dial back the stupid “Up the ‘Ra” sh!te.

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    Mute Peter Cavey
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:10 PM

    @Tricia G: that UP THE RA comment has left a horrible taste in my mouth. How can people like that take the country into the future when their feet are firmly planted in the past.

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    Mute Ross
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:14 PM

    @Peter Cavey: it wasn’t that deep..

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    Mute The Risen
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:24 PM

    @Peter Cavey: Did you miss ‘come out ye black and tans’ topping the chart a few weeks back?

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    Mute Pádraic Ó Braonáin
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:37 PM

    @The Risen: Yeah Peter…why did that not leave a ‘bad taste in yer mouth’?

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    Mute Peter Cavey
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:49 PM

    @Pádraic Ó Braonáin: how do you know that it didn’t? Whataboutery at it’s finest. You need to take a class in debating.

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    Mute The Risen
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:49 PM

    @Will: ‘That song topped the charts as a collective Brexit joke’

    LOL!

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    Mute Paul Quinlan
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    Feb 11th 2020, 1:18 PM

    @Will: It actually topped the charts in response to the government’s plan to commemorate the Royal Irish Constabulary (aka the Black and Tans).

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    Mute This Guy
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    Feb 11th 2020, 1:52 PM

    @Peter Cavey: They love some whataboutery, do those Shinner bots.

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    Mute John fitzpatrick
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    Feb 11th 2020, 5:25 PM

    @The Risen: how many sales does it take to top the Irish charts these days? A couple of thousand. ?

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    Mute Pat O Neill
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:44 PM

    SF did not win the election. They always say that FF and FG are “the same”. Fair enough they mostly are, but then you can’t deny that twice as many voted for FF/FG than did for SF. So it’s up to FF/FG to run the county as per the majority vote. That’s democracy folks.

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    Mute Simon Connolly
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    Feb 11th 2020, 1:57 PM

    @Pat O Neill: No, that’s contradiction folks!!

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    Mute James B
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    Feb 11th 2020, 2:50 PM

    @Pat O Neill: 73 is less than half of 160!! They do not resent the majority of the vote!

    That’s basic maths folks!

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    Mute Seamus Murphy
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    Feb 11th 2020, 4:01 PM

    @James B: he didn’t claim it was a majority, he said it was double what Sinn Fein got in votes. He’s not far out.

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    Mute Kevin Lonergan
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    Feb 11th 2020, 4:02 PM

    @Pat O Neill: What a ridiculous statement. You are saying that FF and FG are the one party so. Take each party individually and SF clearly won the popular vote (Even FF and FG reps have stated that on TV and radio), and elected the same number as FF and more than FG. The only reason that FF have ended up with more seats is due to the Ceann Comhairle being automatically returned to the Dail. The person who finished first in a race is usually called the winner.

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    Mute Mark O'Donovan
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    Feb 11th 2020, 7:07 PM

    @Kevin Lonergan: it is SF say FF and FG are the same.

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    Mute Shane Connolly
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:40 PM

    If I were in Mary Lou’s shoes, I’d hold out for a second election and double the number of SF candidates running. She’ll get closer to an overall majority and can tell Mickey & Leo where to go

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    Mute The Risen
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    Feb 11th 2020, 1:00 PM

    @Shane Connolly: Agreed, she’s a rerun away from being the first female Taoiseach, leading a broad left coalition.

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    Mute MickN
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    Feb 11th 2020, 1:57 PM

    @Shane Connolly: It the only decent option imo, anything else is too short term…

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    Mute Martin McFly
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    Feb 11th 2020, 3:04 PM

    @Shane Connolly: what is she going to pick up the phone and get the likes of Paddy the hooligan Hoolahan to run next time? I know we took the Mick sending Dustin to Eurovision, but we can’t have eejits like some of what SF put forward running the country.

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    Mute Feardorcha Ó Maolomhnaigh
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    Feb 11th 2020, 4:11 PM

    @Shane Connolly: You wont get close to an overall majority with 24.5% of the first preference vote, no matter how many candidates you field. They may have been able to get 4 more at a push on that percentage.

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    Mute John fitzpatrick
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    Feb 11th 2020, 5:29 PM

    @Shane Connolly: was listening to their party spokesman the other day. He said they would run only 6 or 7 more only. But then again I’m sure theres a bunch of failed councillors that lost their seat in the locals looking for a job.

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    Mute John Madden
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:07 PM

    If SF and FF *can’t agree, then it’s back to poll we go..
    *edit from first post.. oops

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    Mute Matthew O'Kane
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:18 PM

    @John Madden: it will be ff sf greens and there wont be much change even the carbon tax will hang around

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    Mute Matthew O'Kane
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:20 PM

    @Matthew O’Kane: and sf do better with a high turnout another election turnout will suffer

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    Mute John Madden
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:30 PM

    @Matthew O’Kane: looks like it, I just can’t see any other workable solutions at all..
    Question is.. is it a workable solution?

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    Mute Sean
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    Feb 11th 2020, 1:10 PM

    @Matthew O’Kane: no they don’t we just had the 4th lowest turnout in the history of the state and it’s the best Sinn Fein ever did.

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    Mute Pád
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:21 PM

    If SF go into government with FF, MLM should become Taoiseach as she won the popular vote.
    If Mehole cannot swallow that maybe a rotating Taoiseach would be the way to go! Just some thought for food.

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    Mute Pádraic Ó Braonáin
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:47 PM

    @Pád: That would be fair I think.

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    Mute John Mulligan
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    Feb 11th 2020, 3:54 PM

    @Pád: the ‘popular vote’ concept isn’t part of the PR system, which is the constitutional method by which we elect government. So it can’t be part of the debate. FF have the edge on this one, anything else is wishful thinking.

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    Mute John fitzpatrick
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    Feb 11th 2020, 5:32 PM

    @Pád: by that logic we should have had President H Clinton in the US or president Al Gore? They both won the popular vote.

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    Mute pat seery
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:32 PM

    FF FG GREENS A GOVERNMENT FOR THE NEXT FIVE YEARS The only stable one to last the distance

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    Mute Kevin Lonergan
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    Feb 11th 2020, 4:05 PM

    @pat seery: and there would be protests all over the country.

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    Mute Maggie May
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:31 PM

    It’s a disaster already…

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    Mute Keith Twamley
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:15 PM

    Why not put all these options in a poll?

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    Mute SkylineSi
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:42 PM

    Anything stopping FF/FG/GP forming a majority?

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    Mute Sal Paradise
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    Feb 11th 2020, 1:04 PM

    @SkylineSi: Not at all. The majority want a centre right government

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    Mute MickN
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    Feb 11th 2020, 1:55 PM

    @SkylineSi: Further wipe out in the next election id imagine…

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    Mute Divad Nayr
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:59 PM

    It will be FF, FG and the Greens , makes sense.

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    Mute MickN
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    Feb 11th 2020, 1:54 PM

    @Divad Nayr: For the richest in society maybe…

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    Mute John Madden
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:06 PM

    If FF and Sf can agree, then back to polls we go..

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    Mute Kath Noonan
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    Feb 11th 2020, 2:47 PM

    Confidence and supply agreements should surely be illegal. What is the point of an ‘opposition ‘ party if they agree to turn a blind eye to govt dirty deeds?

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    Mute Sal Paradise
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    Feb 11th 2020, 12:58 PM

    If FF go into government with SF then MM has to step down as leader as he would lose all credibility. They need someone who wasn’t TD during the 00′s.

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    Mute Nuala Mc Namara
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    Feb 11th 2020, 1:55 PM

    1)My guess is that Greens, Labour and SDs will form their own bloc and ?agree policies and bring that negotiating bloc to SF&FF as they will want to be recognized as having influence in their own right& strength in numbers.
    2)SF said they’d talk to everyone,but prefer to talk to left parties first.Left parties have benefited by transfers from SF.If talks don’t work out,SF will get credit from trying.
    3)FF then having the same votes as SF(not including Ceann Comhairle) would be obliged by their mandate to enter talks with SF because I can’t see another Confidence and Supply alliance again or official FF/FG Government.FF will get credit for that because they will be honouring their mandate and listening to voters and respecting democracy.
    So added into the mix could be eg the greens or greens,SDs

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    Mute MickN
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    Feb 11th 2020, 1:53 PM

    2nd election FFG are hurlers in the ditch…

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    Mute Paul O'Sullivan
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    Feb 11th 2020, 1:26 PM

    Option 1.

    FF/LAB/SD/GRNS =62 with confidence and supply supported by FG. That is the only stable government that can be formed in my opinion. That would last 5 years to fix the Housing /Health crisis.

    Option 2.

    I do think SF should be allowed the oppurtunity to form a government with Lab/SD/SOLPBP/ GRNS WHICH = 67 THEY could get the backing of 13 independents but a lot of those independents would make it an unstable government…

    Option 3.

    The alternative of FF/SF/LAB/SD = 87 is possible too but I think SF would collapse that goverment early forcing an election. That’s why I think my first opition is best.

    FG have no mandate for government.

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    Mute MickN
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    Feb 11th 2020, 1:55 PM

    @Paul O’Sullivan: Option 2 is not a runner unfortunately, 2nd election and it might be…

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    Mute Feardorcha Ó Maolomhnaigh
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    Feb 11th 2020, 4:12 PM

    @MickN: FG have more of a mandate than Lab the Greens or the SDs.

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    Mute Feardorcha Ó Maolomhnaigh
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    Feb 11th 2020, 4:14 PM

    @Paul O’Sullivan: previous post was in reply to yours. Also they have more of a mandate than SOLPBP

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    Mute Paul O'Sullivan
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    Feb 11th 2020, 4:48 PM

    @Feardorcha Ó Maolomhnaigh: FG were in Government it is their mess the others have to clean up.

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    Mute Patrick O Connell
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    Feb 11th 2020, 9:00 PM

    @Paul O’Sullivan: it’s FG turn in opposition, the shinners went straight there in 2016. The country has been booming the last few years just hope FF and SF don’t drive it off the cliff

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    Mute Angry_Man41
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    Feb 11th 2020, 10:30 PM

    FF/FG and a few gene Pool independents will do the job (Lowry, Naughton etc). Give Ceann Comhairle job to a long serving member of opposition, and job done. Ireland needs strong Gov for next few years to deal with challenges such as housing, health, Brexit , and a myriad other matters.
    An inexperienced SF not recommended at this point in time. Maybe a few years running Stormont on an ongoing basis would help them develop the experience needed for Gov

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    Mute Gary Kearney
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    Feb 11th 2020, 7:38 PM

    The big question for me is this
    Are they going to play party politics or do what’s best for the country
    Are they more interested in themselves than the people of the country.
    We live in “Interesting Times”

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