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THERE IS NO evidence that unemployed people who take part in the Back to Education Allowance scheme will improve their chances of finding a job.
A review of the government-backed scheme reveals those who avail of the scheme are less likely to have found a job four years later when compared to other jobseekers, according to an Economic and Social Research Institute (ESRI) report, published today.
It shows that unemployed people who signed up the the Back to Education Allowance scheme in 2008 had lower levels of employment in 2012 and 2014 than those who did not take up these options.
The Back to Education Allowance was set up in 1996 to allow people on welfare continue to receive income support while they return to full-time education, either second level or third level.
‘Very stark’ results
The report, which was commissioned by the Department of Social Protection, states that while the results are “very stark” they are similar to international research results, which indicate the benefits of returning to further education only come to fruition over the medium to long term rather than the short to medium term.
Tánaiste and Minister for Social Protection, Joan Burton said it’s important to have an independent evaluation of schemes such as the Back to Education Allowance as it is taxpayers’ money that goes to provide the funding for these schemes.
It’s essential that the department gets value for the money spent on these schemes and, most important of all that unemployed jobseekers benefit from these schemes by getting a job.
She said a number of changes have already been made to the scheme following recommendations from the Labour Market Council.
These include having case officers vetting all applications for labour market relevance an intended course of education someone wants to do. Payment rates have also been standardised with Jobseeker payments.
Burton said that as a result, the number of participants to the scheme has fallen from 25,000 to 18,000.
She said plans are underway to link up the welfare and education sector with an IT systems which will allow better tracking of progression.
JoBbridge
The evaluation of PLC courses by SOLAS should also be a priority, said that Labour Market Council, as these make up a significant number of the courses undertaken under the scheme.
The department said this evaluation is already underway by SOLAS (formerly FÁS).
The review of the Back to Education Allowance scheme is just the first review of a number of education and welfare initiatives.
The department said a detailed evaluation plan of the Intreo activation process and the JobBridge scheme are about to commence.
These will be followed with evaluations of the BTWEA, CE and TÚS.
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Maybe they should replace it with a Celtic cross or a similar symbol which would maintain the Christian ethos of the cross but it would also act as a symbol of our Irish culture that us non Christians could also relate to.
Very good idea Kevin. I would hope most people would agree also.
Do they even have planning permission?
Actually why should they accomadate you and your beliefs? This was erected by the local community on private land. The decision lies with them.
Is the top of that mountain privately owned?
If so I agree than can erect what they like…
But if it is public lands then why erect a cross?
CitizenSmith© It would imagine it would be a retention order in this case.
Play with your toys and imaginary beings in your own house and places of
Worship. This does not public places, ie. Mountains
The mountain itself is private land.
Is planning permission required to erect a cross on top of the mountain?
I suspect it wouldn’t be if the cross is a replica of what was installed in 1976, which I very much doubt had permission!
However I suspect the cross might require permission if it’s much bigger than what was there!
a structure that exists for 7 years is deemed to have gained its own planning – as it were !
It is very unclear whether it is private land, probably, it isn’t. Some farmers have grazing rights, but that does not extend to ownership and a right to decide what structures get built on it
The ethos of the cross is not Christian, but it has been demonised by the RC religion.
If you look at Bru Na Boinne you will see the actual meaning of the cross and no Jesus on it either.
The cross symbolism is the divine feminine in original times.
The cross symbol is the symbol of womb – creation and not death as shown by Patriarchal religious cult.
http://www.newgrange.com/newgrange-plans.htm
http://www.newgrange.com/description.htm
Maybe put lights on it to warn low flying aircraft……
Owned by who
Should it not read “resurrected”??? ☺️
The mountains are millions of years old Christianity is only 2000 years old.
Leave these cross eye sores off the top of our beautiful mountains so all can enjoy. Without reminders of the horrors of organised religion.
http://www.google.ie/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CDMQFjAC&url=http%3A%2F%2Fgbgm-umc.org%2FUMW%2Fbible%2Fjcart.stm&ei=hw13VN-tAoXP7QbZpYFQ&usg=AFQjCNHXCdBXYXGhgGWODGB8vulFo4f9aQ&sig2=WdRIkam4_G_QDXpoKo2M1g…………………………………. A BIT OF EDUCATION FOR YE ON THE CROSS – THE OLDER THE IMAGE THE CLOSER TO THE TTRUTH !
The article is clearly telling lies as a huge number of people don’t want it up there. Just look at the comments
Perhaps the Journal could do a poll to put your argument to a test Barry Ryan.
Sean thats for the locals to decide. And if we all had that attitude, every structure ever built on a mountain would be destroyed.
Yes, the hoards of Journal trolls are a fair reflection of the mood of the nation.
Yes….Yes….be intolerant…yess let it flow through you!
Who ever cut it down certainly crossed the line
Hopefully someone will have the good sense to cut it down again. It’s a blight on the landscape.
That would be an ecumenical matter!
Do people really think jesus ever wants to see a cross again, well that is if he ever existed at all.
Jake, only those who make the 6 hour hike- trek to the top get to see it. I am assuming it will remain abstract to you in your lifetime. Let’s rather have a poll whether to keep the cross including only those non lard-asses who have actually seen it.
I was up there last year, in fairness it is such an eyesore in such a beautiful part of the country. If people are so crazy to see a cross they should go to a church!
Okay mate. Anybody who doesn’t agree with you can’t have been anywhere near there. I see now.
I’ve heard it all now. CCTV on the top of Carrauntoohil to mind a cross? Surely if God wanted it there he could use lightening?
They don’t need CCTV.
“The eyes of the LORD are everywhere, keeping watch on the wicked and the good”. Proverbs 15:3
He keeps watch but doesn’t do anything about it. Sounds like a sadistic voyeur.
He takes care of it in the next life
“The wicked shall be turned into hell, and all the nations that forget God”. Psalms 9:17
Hell will be wonderland of science reason and logic with fantastic air con…. why? It will be full of highly educated people and scientist’s
Frank
You do get quoting the bible doesn’t actually mean anything or indicates future outcome?
It isn’t a matter of faith it is a matter of learning about the bible at its history. Revelations isn’t about the end of the world, it was a warning about political issues of the time.
Meanwhile Frank, millions suffer from disease, hunger, cancer etc. and your ‘god’ chooses not to intervene. Sounds to me like your ‘all powerful’ god is either impotent or he just does not exist.
LOL Yes, and maybe George Carlin would have a few words to say on the matter.
My son was born with a rare metabloic condition. A few hours after diagnosis a chaplin approached us with a leaflet and advice. We were told that god had chosen our son to have this condition as he knew that we were strong enough to cope. My response was that if he could choose why would he not choose for my son to be healthy. Religions are superstition that hold back the progress of mankind.
If I saw a child being raped I would stop it. That’s the difference between me and your god.
How would painting it a bright colour protect it Keith?
Not that the Journal comments section is the best place to debate philosophy and theology, but Pat, what would be the point of existence if God prevented all evils?
Eel, victims of persecution, those in the concentration camps etc are the ones who must have asked that question: What is the point of existence?
Any manmade object up there spoils the landscape.
To a point I’d agree as I would hate to see 100m+ wind turbines put up. But a 5m cross is hardly spoiling the landscape there.
Better than giving in to scuzz that cut it down.
Go across the alps in europe and you’ll crosses on many of the highest peaks. In countries more atheistic the ours.
Apart from a spliff, of course. That’s one man-made object that would only heighten the experience…I could even make it in the shape of a cross.
I’m building a minaret on top of the sugar loaf
I’m sure you’ll do a wonderful job there. Looking forward to seeing it.
God willing it will be a handsome job.
A great tourist draw for jihadist tourists…..those great Oirish citizens that frequent the Clonskeag mosque could act as tourist guides.
If the mountain won’t come to Mohammad…
Make sure you point it in the direction of Mecca.
The sinister element within the water protesters (I.S.I.S) will be thrilled with you.
A handsome cross you have there Jesus…
Good to see our Christian Heritage being upheld.
Ireland has a Christian heritage?
How far back are you referring as In think there were people on this island many years before Christianity landed here.
Earliest mention is St Patrick who landed here around 1,550 years ago.
Youv obviously never done Irish history you tool. The Irish race has has Christianity entwined with it since the days of the Druids. I’m not very religious, but if the people of that area want a cross there then leave them to it. Poxy liberals
I don’t see any child abuse?
The Irish were the standard bearers for Christianity across these islands. It was Irish monks who converted the Anglo Saxon kingdoms in England and the Picts in Scotland.
Fozz “Ireland has a Christian heritage?”
Did you go to school in North Korea? Only someone who has been in a bonkers educational system could possibly come out with such a thick-headed statement as yours.
Its quite clear this country has a Christian heritage. And a pre-Christian heritage. Of maybe you believe George Lucas constructed the beehive huts on the Skelligs?
You do get the Christians wrote the history so of course they corrupted the information. They added Christianity to everything as the did everywhere they went.
You are completely kidding yourself if you think they travelled the world to enlighten locals. It was always power and trade.
Whats your point? Are you still denying this country has a Christian heritage?
The point is the Christian heritage isn’t as old as people claim and the history was corrupted by Christians.
It doesn’t really matter either way just because of the past power they shouldn’t get to dictate in a secular society. You can be pretty sure the other religions of the time weren’t impressed with crosses being put on their religious sites and the Christians didn’t care.
The Christian of this country spans about 1500 years. Old enough.
Heritage
So what if it is old it doesn’t mean Christianity symbols must be forced on others.
Prostitution, slavery, contraception, abortion, drug taking, capital punishment, homosexuality etc. .. Are all older. Why should the church deride or condone such behaviour and be listened to. Secular society now and the present counts.
Maybe you haven’t been following the thread, but I was responding to the point that Ireland has no Christiian heritage , when it quite clearly does.
You aren’t following the point. It doesn’t matter we have secular society now! Don’t ever forget the Christians destroyed many older artefacts including their own. We clearly have an older heritage too
Roman bishop Palladius was here a few years before Patrick……
I object to the cross on the grounds that some “group” feel entitled to impose their symbol over everyone else. It’s a form of bullying actually. They feel righteous and supported by prevailing and common opinion. This fundamentalism is a problem all over the world.
William Willis
That ‘group’ is actually 84% of the population, – so you’ll have to like it or lump it.
84% of the Irish population are reverent Catholics who estole the values of the church?
Or 84% go through a school system that gives you little alternative but become a Catholic ? Furthermore condom sales would suggest by your point that 16% of the population buy all the condoms in the country.
Big difference between being a confirmed member at 13-15 after your education guided you into it and being a practising believing member of the church.
84% lol
OK Francie statistically speaking, the probability is that it was actually Catholic’s who did this based on your 84%.
None of your business,the decision is that of the local people in Kerry .
Perhaps it was a sign for God that felled the cross…….
I’d suggest making the new cross in wood.
Just as Pfizers is nearby.
This is like something out of Father Ted. People on both sides of the argument getting their knickers in a twist about a chunk of metal in the shape of an ancient torture device. You’d swear there weren’t other things going on in the world.
Why not plant it in the grounds of a church, that’s exactly where it belongs, instead of on top of the hill as a beaming symbol of Catholicism, reminding ALL of the suffering of Catholics. Let’s be honest it’s the most recognizable religious icon that exists.
The Cross is a symbol of Christianity, not exclusively Catholicism.
A sign of roman(1st reich) oppression ….now that the nazis are back in guise of the EU(4TH REICH) they will have us erect one on every mountain and Post Office…….
Yes in christianity it is, but also in Ireland it’s a symbol used to enforce the Catholic church, I was referring to Ireland
Anyway I’m sure it will be resurrected again, only for someone to do a Madonna on it
Christianity was long in Ireland before Catholicism Hugh. In fact the Catholic church only took a strong hold here in the past 200 years or so.
Also remember, the leaders of 1916 were by and large Protestant – if they had not been executed the Catholic Church would have been held at bay – imagine what the country would be like today. If only.
The cross was a symbol of Christianity in Ireland long before the Irish church was controlled by Rome.
I’m talking about NOW not then, bloody histrionics
So great to see church dominance and mind control still alive and well among the culchie sheep. Maybe they could get the priests back raping kids as well?
It’s that kind of complicity and lack of free thinking that led to the problems in the first place.
What will we put on top of the mountain? I dunno, a sculpture or simple cairn perhaps? ..Nah, stick a cross on it…let’s go back to the pub…
The vast majority of priests did not rape kids.
Marko Burns think can be summed up as “Cross=Catholics=Child Rape”
Sad really.
But the church shielded abuser priests.
The vast majority of priests/bishops KNEW that kids were being abused though and did nothing and that is just as bad.
The vast majority of Catholics now know what happened and still support an organisation that covered up crimes which in their sheer scale could rightly be catorgised as ‘crimes against humanity’.
Why don’t they stand around it in a circle and pray it back into place?
Pat sadly prays on work to help finding your cars keys or winning on the bingo.
God seems to be really obsessed about the small things whilst millions of children needlessly die every year.
That’s such a relief
All the atheists will be going nuts
ALL the atheists are
I think you are misunderstanding atheists agnostics and secularists.
From an atheist point of view it’s some metal associated with a fictitious religion. To an agnostic it’s perhaps salvation but they are not sure. But to a secularist state aid / intervention should not be used in a religious context. I.e separation of church and state.
Thus not all atheists are secularists and vice versa. From a secular point of view, the state should not support it financially. However if on private land and paid for by locals then fair game. That’s the proper way of examining it not insinuating secularists are atheists nor their logic is false.
Yippee, just before Jesus unwraps his gifts from Santa!
Wear a cross around your neck. Dont push your religion onto others. Im sure every catholic church abuse victim that climbs there is delighted its gone.
Have your church and enjoy your religion but dont think it has right of place in mother natures Gardens.There is nothing natural about religion.
I’m not a religious person. But your comment is forcing your non beliefs upon others. In a demographic society you can’t please everyone. So stop trying to force your views on others. Each to their own, how does a piece of metal offend you?
What it symbolises is disgusting.
What does it symbolise Susan??
A crucifix, a torture device that the christians “took back”, on top of a beautiful mountain, erected without permission and now a bunch of bible clutchers want to re-erect it, again, without proper permission.
Why don’t we stick the symbol of the House of El, to remind us that Jor-El sent his only begotten son to save us…from Brainiac and other intergalactic threats.
I hope, that if it’s erected again, that it’ll be cut down within days.
How very “tolerant” of you Oisin.
Thank you. SOMEBODY has to stick up for Kryptonians.
Frankly I find it offensive that society ignores them and acts as if they aren’t even real.
Your point is moot. The mountain is private land.
How would you feel if there was a McDonalds sign up there?
But back to the Kryptonians. Jor-El hoped his son could guide us and help us to become better, and then he died saving us from Doomsday. He then resurrected, with a sweet mullet, and continued to fight for us and teach us that a man can fly.
Its private land. My feelings are irrelevant.
Great contribution.
Really, gripping stuff.
If land is private then secularist reasonable arguments need not apply beyond the remit.
Otherwise the issue becomes religion bashing which makes those with faith the victims of the non religious argumentative stance.
If you want to praise your faith on private lands or a private place of worship then more power to you. This is coming from a faith based secularist.
It is not private land.
its Mother Eire land and not private – unless the occupier has a receipt from Her to show She sold her land to them.
Satisfaction with every erection !
A waste of good steel.
http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/doctor-first-saw-very-urgent-aande-patient-when-he-was-found-dead-on-a-trolley-299775.html .Look at what happened this poor bloke in one of our hospitals. If he was a woman who was 6 months pregnant and she was looking for a termination because of her condition the Liberal corwd including the Labour party with Ivana Bacik would be jumpimg all over the place about it. But no …he just happens to be a normal person who does not matter to them..shameful country we live in
As an atheist I don’t really care what religion people believe in each to your own, but try and push your beliefs on me and I’ll argue my point, now I have read many books on religion and know that the cross was used as an instrument of punishment, the internal layout of newgrange has to do with circle of life which predates Christ by about 4 thousand years, the Christian belief has taken certain stories and other beliefs and claimed them as their own. If a private group want to put a method of punishment up on a hill and worship it, then they have a load more questions they should be asking themselves… Welcome to the 2nd coming of Christ ohhh by the way we killed you first time with icon, and we worship it as a false god, we waste thousands of euro on buildings that are used for an hour a week but won’t do a christian thing and allow others to use it… Religious followers are a funny bunch of people chastising anyone who don’t follow their book but turn a blind eye to their fellow flock members and their actions
They should not put that monstrously offensive thing back up!
How about placing one of the large carved stones from elsewhere in the country on top of the mountain? At least that would represent the history of the country more than some religious tat!
Fergus, unfortunately for you, you are in a Christian country were the overwhelming majority of the the population are Roman Catholics. Nobody cares what you think of it.
This is not a Christian Country and the majority of people over 65 are probably superstitious. The rest of us have a bit more cop on.
Ha ! Another arrogant, foaming at the mouth atheist ! I hate to break it to you but this certainly is a Christian country with over 85 % of the population stating they were RC in the last census. That’s a fairly overwhelming majority. Are 85 % of the country over 65 ? I don’t think so…. So that leaves you in a group that is at most 15% of the population and yet you think you have the ” cop on ” ! I’m afraid not but you know you and any other in your minority group are always free to leave this Christian country anytime you want to. Have a nice Christmas, oh wait, you won’t be celebrating that will you ? Lol…
Ha ! Another arrogant, foaming at the mouth atheist ! I hate to break it to you but this certainly is a Christian country with over 85 % of the population stating they were RC in the last census. That’s a fairly overwhelming majority. Are 85 % of the country over 65 ? I don’t think so…. So that leaves you in a group that is at most 15% of the population and yet you think you have the ” cop on ” ! I’m afraid not but you know you and any other in your minority group are always free to leave this Christian country anytime you want to. Have a nice Christmas, oh wait, you won’t be celebrating that will you ? Lol…
Not foaming at the mouth at all. In the past few months I’ve noticed you commenting a lot on the Journal. Always on the wrong side of things too. I feel sorry for your kind as they slowly but surely die off. But they will disappear and leave the planet a much nicer place to live. Just because a majority subscribes to something doesn’t make it a christian country. This is a republic and a secular state. I could ask 85% of my friends and colleagues if they believe in a god and most of them will say no.. However they all put Catholic on the census because technically they are on account the church blocked people from leaving because of the mass exodus. The number of actually believers in this country is probably the reverse of your 85%. A catholic by tradition is not a catholic. Let the dead rest. And I will celebrate Christmas. It was here long before the christians came along.
Not sure why I’m wasting time on the likes of yourself but I’ll address a few of your points.
Just because you don’t like my opinion on anything doesn’t make me ” on the wrong side of things” , it just makes you look like an arrogant fool who can’t accept that others might have a different opinion.
I am nowhere near dying off yet ! You have no idea how old I am but I would hazard a guess that you are a wet behind the ears kid, not a wet weekend out of college ?
Your figures are hardly worth mentioning other than saying they are made up rubbish. The stats don’t lie.
If you celebrate Christ’s Mass you are a hypocrite who hasn’t got the balls to stand up for what you claim to believe.
Grow up, accept that others have faith even if you don’t.
Loop de Loop – by all means argue the RC dominance still in Ireland today , but if you’re going to be so militant and tar all atheists with the same brush (‘another arrogant, foaming at the mouth atheist), don’t forget you didnt originally ever have a choice but to be Catholic – none of did because we were involuntarily indoctrinated and by the way, how do your views not make you an ‘arrogant, foaming at the mouth’ religious person?
*none of us did
ps Loop – Christmas was hijacked by the Christians. It is pagan in origin.
They don’t like facts Sean. And loop I wish I was just out of college but I finished University 20 years ago. And there is a wrong side of things. Denying other people something because you find it icky or against your beliefs is wrong. End of story.
Ah Rob, so now we know what your hatred of the church is really about ! Surprise, surprise ! Again I will state that me having a different opinion to you doesn’t mean I’m on the ” wrong side” it just means you are an arrogant fool for thinking that. If you’re 20 years out of uni it’s about time you grew up and accepted others have different opinions.
Sean,
For starters I’m not Catholic and secondly I’m not very religious either. I have stated this numerous times on the journal so maybe next time you will think before you make silly assumptions.
My hatred for the church is about them ruining the country I live in for the past Century and covering up the raping of small children. It’s hardly a well kept secret. Add to that the fact it’s all made up. And I can understand Sean thinking you are religious. IF you walks like a duck and quacks it’s usually a duck. You align yourself with the other lunatics on the journal a bit to often to be different from them.
They’ve hardly ruined the country as you say and the raping of small children was carried out by your lot using the church as cover was it not ? You don’t seem to realise that most of the religious in this country are good people, who take comfort from their faith but you can’t see past your red mist because some of them disagree with you wanting to marry another bloke. Personally I don’t give a monkeys who or what you marry by the way.
Who are you to say it’s all made up anyway ? Your arrogance has no limits does it ? As regard me being a lunatic you need to look at yourself some more before you brand others, you are being blinded by your hatred.
I don’t really care if they put it back up or not. But if they do I hope they do it in a way that doesn’t damage the surroundings. There is no way you are going to be able to drag machinery up there without having a detrimental effect. And if they decide that they are going to put CCTV cameras up there, and other infrastructure to power them, damaging it even more, then frankly it isn’t worth it. They will probably not be required to get planning permission for the cross (or if they do I can’t imagine it being refused), given the circumstances it was cut down under, but I hope their planning is refused for whatever other stuff they plan on putting up there.
I don’t know if you noticed this Finbarr, but my comment was actually longer than a single sentence. I don’t care if they put up the cross, but I do care if they damage the mountaintop in doing so. I’d elaborate further but I doubt you have the attention span to even get this far.
Finbarr what is your problem with educate together? Why does not believing in man made hocus pocus threaten you so much?
Soory John for not having the same aptitude as your goodself
Not a problem Finbarr, and I apologize in turn if my reply seemed needlessly disdainful.
I heard that ISIS took a day off from water protesting and headed down to Kerry the same day as the cross was cut down. Coincidence, I don’t think so.
Jesus!
Someone should open a powertool shop at the summit. There should be good business in the hire or sale of angle grinders and welders. Save people the trouble of hauling them up the mountain.
It’s kind of hard to believe that the perpetrators weren’t seen by someone, because it’s a 4-hour round trip, on foot, and the actual cutting with a grinder would be very noisy.
When people reached the summit, they would usually have their photo taken near the cross, – if only to verify what they had achieved.
God saw them he knows their names!!!???????
Who?? There is no actual God as most people now know.
Catherine – that statement completely flies in the face of all the possibilities that anti-matter suggests….
VATILEAKS – The noose tightens !
I wonder when our atheist buddies will start tearing down minarets, or would that conflict with their gospel of Political Correctness? Very safe target, Christians.
They think they’ll have it up by Christmas?
How can they get it through the planning process that quickly? Surely Easter would be a better target date, for all kinds of reasons?
Oh goody. Christian supremacists cocking their leg against a mountain.
Let’s play moving statues.
Quick set up a Quango !
well… if it is just an iconic point, rather than a religious symbol… and it doesn’t actually require planning permission to erect iconic points at the top of a mountain, then I have a sculpture I would like to see commissioned. Perhaps an artistic model of Satan, nailed to a cross of equal (or greater) height beside it?
It’s been up there nearly 40 years and only because someone cut it down are all these arguments going on.
So the removal was distasteful, but I dont personally see the rush to reinstate it given it represents a former not a current Catholic hegemony. Lack of separation of church and state isnt something to be proud of.
If they are putting it up again can we nail Enda Kenny to it, to be sure it’s working correctly?
Why put that ugly eyesore back up, the mountain is something that belongs to all people not just the religious nuts, why spoil a good view with a tacky piece of metal. If anyone else tried that they would be done for not having planning permission or even defacing a national monument and i don’t mean the hideous cross!
being completely pedantic here so no offence intended …but a mountain is not a monument – in law it is merely land ..
Jebediah Springfield comes to mind.”Thanks Bart”
Someone get that mountain some Viagra.
Who’ll pay for this to be erected?
Down with this type of thing.
Down with this sorta thing.
Surely in an open tolerant society, a cross on a mountaintop hurts no one?
Do “motion censors” stop you from walking on particular mountains, or just stop you from telling anyone about it?
have your say