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AFTER TONIGHT, THERE’S just one more day on the airwaves for politicians. ’Thank God’, says you.
It means that tonight’s RTÉ Prime Time debate is one of the last chances the four main party leaders have to put their case forward before Friday’s general election.
In short, if the gloves are going to come off, tonight’s the night to start swinging.
Miriam O’Callaghan is the woman in the middle.
Evening all! Welcome to TheJournal.ie’s coverage of tonight’s big four-way debate from Montrose. Rónán Duffy here for the evening to give you the blow-by-blow of what’s going on and what people are talking about.
Political Editor Hugh O’Connell is in the bowels of RTÉ to see what’s going on behind the scenes, catch him at @TJ_Politics.
Our resident QI Elf-wannabe Dan McGuill will be testing statements by all four leaders to see if anyone’s telling porkies. It’s part of our GE16 FactCheck series that you can check out here.
If you want to get in touch, leave a comment or tweet myself @ronaduffy_ or our News Editor @SineadOCarroll.
Tonight’s the big one.
The leaders have been arriving at RTÉ ahead of tonight’s 9.35pm start-time.
Eager to get going, Labour leader Joan Burton was the first to arrive, saying she expects a ‘fair and tough debate’.
Fianna Fáil’s Micheál Martin was next, saying he is ready to lead the next government.
Third, Taoiseach Enda Kenny came along and looked like he was going to bypass the media.
He changed his mind though for a quick word, saying he’s done more debates than any other sitting Taoiseach.
Gerry Adams arrived at RTÉ by bus the last time out. No sign of such an entrance this time as he arrived last of the leaders.
He says he’s enjoyed been out and about listening to voters over the last few weeks, sore back aside.
The all-important standing positions.
From left to right (physically not politically) we have Gerry Adams, Enda Kenny, Micheál Martin and Joan Burton.
A lovely set up for Enda and Micheál to get nice and cosy with one another, they might have to soon enough.
It’s worth noting of course that were are missing some leaders tonight.
At last week’s Claire Byrne moderated debate, AAA/PBP, The Social Democrats and Renua were all represented. They’re not here tonight.
Neither are the Green Party, who’ve been left out of three debates now.
Enda’s Twitter account means business, the sleeves are rolled up.
The polls have been coming even thicker and faster in this election compared to previous years, but there’s certainly been a pattern.
Fine Gael have been roundabout the 30% or higher mark for the last year or so.
Now, after some wobbles in the last week, they look to have steadied to the ship a tad.
Fianna Fáil will be happy with with how things went in the last two debates and another strong performance from Micheal Martin tonight would make things very interesting.
Gerry Adams and Joan Burton might feel as if they’ve some work to do tonight.
So if you want to know tonight’s state of play according to the pollsters, a Paddy Power/Red C poll published today placed them on the following.
In fairness to RTÉ, very few do a better slow-mo montage.
Prime Time kick-off tonight with some dramatics.
Miriam, ready to boss proceeding, tells leaders to debate but ‘not talk over each other’.
She begins by asking Enda Kenny was there some ‘arrogance’ in their Keep The Recovery going slogan.
It’s a good observation, they’ve stopped saying it in the last few days.
Kenny says he accepts that every household isn’t feeling a recovery yet.
To the point, from the wannabe Taoiseach.
The Tánaiste pushed on rent supplements says that they plan to spend €4 billion on social housing.
Adams is getting a number of follow-up questions from Miriam, presenter says he is ‘all at sea’ with finances.
He rejects this.
Our first FactCheck of the evening.
1,000 families left homelessness last year – Joan Burton
Verdict: Half TRUE, number was 2,000 individuals.
The Department of the Environment’s Social Housing Report for 2015 found that 2,000 people had left homelessness last year.
There is no breakdown of how many of those are families, and 1,000 probably overstates the case.
Gerry is having a bit of a ‘mare here.
When Enda Kenny accused him of not protecting ‘Senator Cahill’, he asked the Taoiseach,
Who’s Senator Cahill?
The Taoiseach was of course talking about abuse victim and Labour Senator Mairia Cahill.
It’s all been very quiet so far, little or no interaction between the leaders.
Gerry has a bit of a stumble while trying to outline his party’s policies on health.
Speaking about consultants, he follows it up by asking Miriam if she earns over €100,000. She nods.
He made the same ploy against Brian Dobson last week too, it didn’t really come of this time either.
The debate has turned to mental illness.
Miriam asks Tánaiste how the government has only spent 6% of the health budget on mental health given the problem of suicide.
Tánaiste defends by saying people want schools for their children, she then turns to Adams accusing him of going abroad for healthcare.
Adams was ready for this, says he’s answered a ‘million times before’ and that the procedure he needed wasn’t available on the island of Ireland.
‘It didn’t cost the taxpayer anything,” he adds.
FACT CHECK:
The number on trolleys and in wards today is highest on record – Micheál Martin.
Verdict: FALSE
The number today was 511, the number on 9 February was 539. We’re not sure how literally Martin was speaking, though.
According to the INMO, the numbers on trolleys and in wards is up by 8% since 2011, 40% since 2012, 37% since 2013, and 21% since 2014.
They’re onto USC.
Miriam asks the Taoiseach directly whether it’s fair that a couple earning €150,000 will benefit from their proposed USC cut three times more than a couple earning €40,000.
Kenny repeatedly says, ‘everyone will benefit’.
Frustrated, Miriam tells that Taoiseach that he’s obviously ‘not going to answer’
There’s a creak in the studio, and it’s not their policies. Twitter is now distracted.
Can you hear it?
Miriam is now going all Stateside by accusing the Taoiseach of that unforgivable sin of ‘flip-flopping’ on the USC.
Sinn Féin have ‘flip-flopped’ too she adds.
Enda Kenny, who’s been very quiet so far, has now turned his attention to jobs.
He says his party ‘know how to create 100,000 jobs and they now want to create 200,000 jobs’.
FACT CHECK
Michael Noonan once said USC was never intended to be temporary – Miriam O’ Callaghan
Verdict: TRUE
On 16 December 2014, Noonan wrote, in response to a PQ from Fine Gael TD Brendan Griffin:
I should point out that it was never intended that the USC would be a temporary measure. The USC was designed and incorporated in to the Irish taxation system as part of its permanent structure and the revenues collected play a vital part in meeting the many expenditure demands placed on the Exchequer.
We’re onto a break. Miriam suggests we should all go away for a cup of tea.
Something stronger might go down well, is it just us or is this pretty boring so far?
Creakgate aside of course.
Homelessness kicking-off part two. Miriam puts it to Tánaiste that just 28 social houses were built last year.
Burton says this is unfair and not completely correct, that more people have been homed through increased building, and 13,000 through ‘social renting’.
Burton adds that 1,000 families left homelessness last year.
FACT CHECK:
Sinn Féin introduced a bill to abolish the USC – Miriam O’ Callaghan
Verdict: TRUE
On 29 March 2011, Sinn Féin TD Pearse Doherty introduced a private member’s motion to “abolish the Universal Social Charge,” and added:
The universal social charge, therefore, is little more than a working poor tax. The new charge disproportionately affects certain sections of society. It hits low income workers by significantly shifting the tax burden away from high earners and onto those on lower pay.
Enda Kenny on homelessness:
Supply is the key issue here. The more you can build, the more you can house people.
Oh, and in case you didn’t notice. The creak is gone. But not forgotten.
FACT CHECK:
More than 1,000 social housing units were built by local authorities last year – Joan Burton.
Verdict: Very, very FALSE.
Miriam O’Callaghan was right to say 28 social housing units were built by local authorities last year, but figures are only available for the first nine months of the year. Including voluntary and cooperative houses, there were 246.
She was also right to say social housing construction by local authorities more than halved between 2008-2010.
For full details on this issue, check out this article:
Quick poll, Who is winning the debate so far?
Enda Kenny is defending the Central Bank’s mortgage rules (kind of):
The intention is right but at the wrong time.
He says he hope it is reviewed.
They’re talking about cronyism. Miriam brings up McNultygate to the Taoiseach.
Enda: It’s all changed.
“What I did was make an appointment that didn’t need to be made.”
‘You may have a scoop here.’
Adams correctly points out that this is the first time Enda Kenny has admitted that he had a hand in the appointment of John McNulty to the board of the Irish Museum of Modern Art.
FACT CHECK
13,000 families were placed in social housing in 2015 – Burton.
Verdict: Half-TRUE, 13,000 is the number of tenancies agreed.
The Tánaiste appears to be using “families” liberally again.
The Department of the Environment’s 2015 report found that 13,141 tenancies had been agreed on social housing units.
No breakdown of families or individuals was offered, so we can’t provide a number of families, but they did not make up 100% of the tenancies.
For the first time in three debates, leaders are talking about climate change.
The question is whether there is a battle between our dairy herd and our CO2 emissions.
It’s fair to say everyone is being light on specifics.
A final question, interview style. What is your biggest regret?
Martin says it’s being part of the ‘consensus’ in the previous Fianna Fáil government.
Joan Burton talks for a minute but didn’t answer on her biggest regret.
Enda Kenny says it’s being ‘slow’ on some issues like the Magdalene Laundries.
Gerry’s final thought:
‘We’ve a chance of a real peaceful Rising this Friday.’
Joan Burton speaks to the wrong camera and that’s pretty much the most exciting part of each of their final thoughts.
Well that’s that.
It was pretty low key for the final debate of the election, they didn’t really go for each other and perhaps just wanted to make sure they didn’t make any mistakes.
Did they succeed?
We’ll have a summary of exactly what went down coming up on the site soon, but if you can’t wait RTÉ is in the ‘Spin Room’. Our Hugh O’Connell among them.
Good night from me and I hope tonight helped make up your mind a little.
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Instead of criticising him, how about we applaud the fact he made such an embarrassing admission and is taking steps to correct it. There are many bigots who say things like “AIDS is god punishing the gays”. If you’re in that bubble it’s not surprising that you don’t have all the facts. There is nothing wrong with his proposal to raise general awareness instead of just awareness for most vulnerable groups. The campaign could do both.
Yes, I agree, however he represents those who vote for him?
Does he also know that men cant get pregnant ?
They can’t? My belly has been slowly getting bigger for years. What the hell could it be?
@Dessie Curley: Have you seen the film ‘Alien’?
The DUP ladies and gentlemen.
@Cillian McCormick: If this is indicative of the DUP, we could do with some of that down south!
When was the last time you saw any politician or political party admit their flaws and humbly acknowledge their mistakes?
Stubborn ignorance has been a prevailing mentality for far too long and people throwing stones at his former ignorance, well, their glass houses must be pretty drafty at this point.
In this day and age this is quite amazing but fair play. Hopefully it will start a conversation about HIV and sexual persuasions.
He must be from the Healy Rae school of scientific thought
Does he know the Earth isn’t flat?
Wow just wow
Waterford whispers news must be kicking themselves having missed such a gem of a headline. The mind truly boggles.
What rock was this guy under the last 20 year…..you can be sure he wasent stuck for company under that rock…….we have the biggest rock in the world looks like in the cabbage patch
Wow! More Brains in a Turnip
Ignorance personified
Their party only knows bigotry. So of course he didn’t, not even news.
Some truth in that very few heterosexual men will get hiv
@joe Do you have a link for that claim?
There’s millions of infected heterosexual men infected in the developing world
It does effect gays disproportionately
Your comment makes u as ignorant as him
From the article above: “He argued against an amendment to the proposal put forward by People Before Profit MLA Eamonn McCann. McCann had proposed that the campaign stressed the disproportionate impact of HIV on gay and bisexual men.”
*affect
@Colm O’Connor: maybe colm but they didn’t contract it by having sex with women.
@Anthony Healy Poroloniczak: ignorance is a lack of knowledge. So I will pass on some knowledge to you. Men very rarely contract HIV by having sex with women, that is a fact. Feel free to show your ignorance by denying this.
@joe please show a link to where you got that information.
@Maurice: It isn’t an attack on homosexuals to say that. It’s a fact. 46% of new HIV cases in Europe are in the set of MSM. Men that have sex with men. https://www.google.ie/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=http://www.drugs.ie/resourcesfiles/ResearchDocs/Ireland/2015/HSE_HIV_2014.pdf&ved=0ahUKEwjxyJCIodDQAhWmKMAKHXQuD4MQFggnMAE&usg=AFQjCNE_grIWQLI2YghrRU1-XLLF_pEdgA&sig2=BTXDDmc4647hBS8Ssfo4bw
49% of new cases in Ireland are in the MSM group. Gay men should already know this. It’s not gay bashing to say this. If you are gay and don’t believe this then you are in denial.
@Maurice Bourke:
There’s lots of studies with but the numbers seem to support the view that there’s less risk for the man in a hetro relationship
http://www.catie.ca/en/pif/summer-2012/putting-number-it-risk-exposure-hiv
@hugh @joe. I wasn’t going to accuse anyone of gay bashing. I like to ask for links when someone makes a claim that sounds dubious, nothing more.
They do Joe. Any kind of abrasion or damage to skin or mucus membranes is an entry point for for the virus and while it’s less likely that a man will be infected by a woman it can and does happen. Mouth ulcers, STIs, BDSM practices are all additional risk factors.
No you wouldn’t and no she wouldn’t. Be careful out there.
BREAKING NEWS: DUP politician admits to being an ignorant thick.
Oh, dear. Deary dear oh dear..
HIV is a disease?
I thought it was a trucker license.
In the developed world it is predominantly a gay disease. Lets not ignore the statistics and treat the disease like the common cold, it has made a comeback among younger gay men in recent years.
Whenever I hear the word sodomy I get this song stuck in my head for days. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Ulb0pLBgRCw
What the…..?
The film is Meet the Feebles. It was directed by none other than Peter Jackson before he hit the big time.
https://youtu.be/fH_4Zt6kokk The horrors of war and drug addiction.
@jumperoo: Bet you it’s in your head now.
@Hugh Mannatee: Your doing it wrong if it starts playing music?
S#!t kicker
The importance of sex education
To me this confirms one of my theories. There is a substantial portion of the Irish Population (and possible other populations) and their politicians who are a thick as planks. (more in keeping with the intelect of a crow than a person). They can get to comprehend comflex matters, but it takes them 30 to 40 times as long as me. If there is a particular emergency pushed on them, they will try to figure it out and this can abridge the time womewhat.
Their financial management system is “hold on to everything with a death’s grip” and try to persuade their relations to leave them goodies in their wills. This DUP one believes the AIDS virus is sexually sellective. I experience the same effect when I try to tell people wind energy is a scam and does not work at all. Its just an illegal subsidy racket. See valmartinireland you tube and the Irish Energy Blog (where I contribute)
The same in advising people not to buy newpapers and note to vote in elections. Its a fact of life, better get used to it.
@Val Martin: Yeah Val, I know someone who has the same issue when no one listens to him about Dinosaurs existing along side Humans.. It must be frustrating.
Shhh leave him alone and he’ll go back to telling NASA how stupid they are
I heard crows were quite smart Val.
Interesting off topic contribution there Val. But as you have raised it Denmark fares pretty well with wind energy.
Proposing an awareness campaign now he knows straight people can get it too. Ok for the gays to get sick though coz God hates fags.
It is almost impossible for a man to contract hiv from a woman since there is no transfer of fluid from woman to man. magic Johnson became hiv positive in 1991. since he said he was having sex with different women 3 or 4 times a day he said he got hiv from a women. cut to an expert. “impossible” the expert says. “statistically you’d have to have sex with over a million women to contract hiv” then magic Johnson admitted he had sex with men.
@Patrick Gough: No transfer of fluid from woman to man? What dried up women are you having sex with???
@Donal Martin: I’d say one of the highlights of Patrick’s sex life was when he go an inflatable sex doll for his birthday and immediately fell in love with it.
Don’t you put it in the belly button?
Not almost impossible Patrick. Just more difficult. See my comment in response to Joe O Hair
@ Patrick. I would say something but the stupidity of that comment speaks for itself.
@Patrick Gough: Patrick that is a dangerous thing to believe…
The birds and the bees Bible lesson???
have your say