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THE DECISION MADE by Taoiseach Enda Kenny this week to support the recognition of Traveller ethnicity has been described as “historic” by the Irish Human Rights and Equality Commission.
Kenny has asked Minister of State at the Department of Justice David Stanton to prepare a report for the social affairs committee on the question of recognising Traveller ethnicity.
The report is due back in a few weeks and it’s expected there will be cross-party support for the move.
The Taoiseach said there are no constitutional barriers to the initiative, stating that the government is looking to the examples of what was done in Northern Ireland, Wales and Scotland.
For over twenty years, there has been pressure placed on the government to take steps to recognise Traveller ethnicity.
In October 2015, the Irish Human Rights and Equality Commission told the United Nations Human Rights Council that Travellers should be recognised by the Irish government as an ethnic minority.
Last month the United Nations called on Ireland “to conduct and finalise a timely review of the request for recognition of the Travellers as an ethnic group”, as well as “give special emphasis to employment, access to health care and the right to housing in the application of the national strategy on the inclusion of Travellers and Roma”.
After the long-fought campaign for Traveller ethnicity to be recognised, there was positive feedback following the announcement.
Chief Commissioner Irish Human Rights and Equality Commission Emily Logan tweeted that it was “great to see political consensus” on the issue and welcomed Enda Kenny publically stating his support.
She stated:
The logic of the Irish State’s ongoing refusal to recognise Traveller ethnicity was questioned only this week by the Council of Europe’s Human Rights Commissioner in our meeting with him, but has also been consistently challenged by UN bodies.
Cross-party support for recognition of Traveller ethnicity was confirmed in the Oireachtas report on this issue from 2014, now we must ensure cross party support combined with the Taoiseach’s personal commitment sees Travellers given the recognition the community deserves.
“These words from An Taoiseach, show that in this centenary year of equality, that this State is now moving to recognise the ethnicity of our own indigenous community, and shows Ireland’s determination in protecting and respecting human rights and equality,” she added.
Pavee Point – who represent the advocate on behalf of the Travelling community – have called for Travellers to be recognised as a minority ethnic group for many years stating that it would help Travellers attain human rights and improve living conditions.
The issue was recently discussed at a Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice and Equality, where a number of members of the community made representations as to what it would mean for them.
Bernard Joyce of Irish Traveller Movement told the committee earlier this month that the recognition of Traveller ethnicity would not be a “silver bullet” to end discrimination but would be “part of the process”.
Acknowledging the delay in successive governments in addressing the issue, chair of the committee Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin TD told members at the time that he had felt “a repeat sense of shame” when hearing about the treatment of Travellers.
Shame on the tragedy of Carrickmines and the fact, as has just been recorded, that it could happen again. Shame at the evictions in Dundalk, not once but repeated, shame at the closure of school doors and shame at the media who continue to label.
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I know lots of traveler families and have nothing against any of them,
But if travelers want to be treated like equals I think they should start acting like equals and stop using the race card all the time
Same could be said for 50+ years of regressive state policy. If you want travellers to act as equals then you treat them as such, two to tango. I’d say it’s hard not to expect a kickback from a community you’ve treated poorly for decades
Stephen what about respect from travellers towards settled people. It would be nice too if they actually contributed to society instead of taking all the time
Who has treated them badly? You don’t see settled people breaking into travellers caravans, beating and robbing them? Travellers make up 4% of the population yet they make up 40% of the prison population, explain that! They abuse our welfare system, don’t contribute to society. They expect to be housed, fed and expect the state to fund their children and lifestyle! There are some good travellers, but a large majority have no interest in contributing whatsoever, and until their mentality changes, neither will mine.
So Stephen , bare knuckle fighting and indifference to education is a kickback against society . Their is a mistaken belief that a culture and all of the elements dressed up as culture should be respected this of course is nonsense . It used to be our culture thought it wax ok to smoke in restaurant and office , that priest could do no wrong , that beating a child in school wax ok . But we learn and grow as a society , god knows we still need to improve a lot in many area but we are growing . We voted for same Sex marriage . I don’t see that growth in the travelling community , why should the rest of us tolerate a lot of what we see a regressive and anti society because it’s dressed up as culture .please do tell me in your opinion if the travelling community has issues in relation to mass littering , fighting , disproportionate involvement in all forms of crime ( including organised )terrible attitude to women’s rights to education and careers etc.
I don’t for one minute think that there aren’t issues within the Travelling community. But you can’t deal with those issues without dealing with the question of recognition. I’ve had plenty of dealings with them, some were positive and others were negative. Like people in general. And yes the state has isolated them through laws in the 50s/60s with their own “final solution” check on the records from the time
Same people on here condemning travellers that are freaking out about Trump winning, acting like they care about peoples rights and anti muslim sentiment; spewing vitriol about travellers seems to be ok though. Liberals my arse. Hypocrites and liars. You are basically saying we should not respect traveller culture but we should welcome and respect a culture where female genital mutilation is accepted ?
@frash:
What about those of us that condemn travellers, but also detest the cult of Islam?
@Stephen Todd:
Stephen, I’d love to hear about your positive experiences. Keep in mind, an experience that wasn’t negative isn’t automatically positive, but possibly just neutral.
I dated a traveller girl for roughly a year. The fact we broke up because she done my head in isn’t necessarily positive but it wasn’t limited to just that relationship either
Travellers not looking to convert anyone or spread their cult throughout the world
There’s a tangent huh frash
@stephen Were you openly welcomed into the traveller community with open while you dated this girl?
Simple solution but will take a little effort on the part of the people who think it a coat of old cobblers, me included. Write a letter (or emal) to the few TDs in your local constituency, let know how you feel , reminding them that they will be looking for your vote in a few years. Keep any response you get stuck to the fridge for future reference. Next (click bait) article on this subject people can answer if they did contact their TD? (I doubt most will!)
@Stephen Todd: Stephen , exactly right, that report was a disgrace, but we have moved on. Thankfully, very little in Ireland is as it was then .Certainly, one massive change has been the increase of benefits and social welfare which have improved immensely in that time, something the traveller community have again disproportionately benefited from. On that basis, if we removed passion and bias I wonder what a fact check would show in terms of the average amount the state spends on a Traveller as opposed just about any other segment you would care to pick in society .I hazard to guess it would show that a narrative about state discrimination is totally and wholly false . On another point, There is a real sense of frustration and palpable fear by many about living near Travellers . Is it all totally irrational , are all the stories of robbery ( ask any Gard in any station) , the violence , the illegal dumping all just imagined , made up by haters and bigots . As we know, Travellers are white Irish Catholics just like , well , just about everyone else .Of course, the real Irony is that they, the apparently beset upon are the most homogenous of all Irish communities. Where is their integration , how many black travellers are their now? What is their own attitude toward homosexuality? Come on now , the truth is they are among the MOST inward looking and possibly racist groups in society . True or not?
How are they treated poorly? Provided with everything for free including health care, accommodation, accommodation for their horses, social welfare and the majority have never worked a day in their lives. I know travellers locally who were but into a fully refurbished site and a year later were complaining it was not fit for purpose and inhumane. Why because they destroyed it over the course of the year. They also tormented a number of elderly residents in the area. Drove past the same halting site and I counted 8 141 upwards cars parked up. They are not that badly off. I guess these human rights activists and of course Enda Kenny have never encountered travellers in the real world
How did they treat those poor refugees.
What are you talking about?
Travellers are already recognised in Ireland, I think that’s their problem.
They want to be treated as different but if you treat them differently you are breaking the law ??? I’m confused
@frash: The Irony is that it is the like of YOU that lead directly to the rise of the like of Trump . You remain oblivious to the real concerns of ordinary people that time and time again are telling you they do not want to accommodate the anti-social and regressive attitudes that unfortunately are more prevalent amongst this community . Ordinary people are sick of the all crap in our society , not just behaviour of some travellers , they are sick of weakness on crime in general . So , How many time do people have to tell you ? They have had enough ,Look at the reaction here , anywhere ? That is why people get fed up and turn to the likes of Trump , le Pen etc . That is why people are calling for integration and assimilation , so what , the rest of us are governed by the law of the land , its how society works . Travellers should be encouraged to express and celebrate their culture in any way they want , have their language and special events , know their history be proud of it as long as it does not negatively impact the rest of us . People want fairness , accountability and for everyone to be a contributor to wider society , Why should we tolerate any group , traveller or any other group for that matter to be exempt from responsibility. The majority know full well that the ethnicity rubbish will lead to spurious claims and law suits against buiness owners for “discriminating”, even if it is based on past experience of behaviour. I suggest you visit Rathkeale during christmas. Have a game of count the range rover
They contribute absolutely nothing to society however there’s not a politician or a TD in the country with the balls to say it even though the know it and believe it
Phil Hogan was always quite forthcoming with his views on the community not always to his benefit.
They’ll burn their tax clearance certs in protest!!!!
I wonder how you qualify to be a” traveller” is it by name? can’t be because we all know people with names that are sonanomus with “travellers” who are clearly hard working decent people. Maybe I’d you live in a caravan? Nope, the vastajoeity of so called “travellers” live in (taxpayer paid for) accommodation, maybe if you own a horse? Lots of people own horses, so can’t be that. I do wonder what the cryteria to gain access to that ethnic group is??? I can with much certainty say what it isn’t, to ba hard working, taxpaying, honest law abiding citizen of Ireland won’t get you in the pearly money encrusted gates, this is certain! !!
Maybe their contribution is asserting the right to national mobility, though? When you think about it, that’s a right we could improve on and all benefit from. Does the GAA discriminate against people moving from one county to another? How easy is it to vote if you move? Are many of our laws not derived from the exclusive rights of landowners? Maybe our systems should be more streamlined and less parochial. There again, maybe the political plan is to house our homeless in caravans for all I know!
Where can you apply to be a traveller? They seem to have more rights than anyone, are above the law (if you look at the ones camping out in Naas) and live great stress free lives. Will there be an interview?
Let me know if you find out pal, would love to pay no taxes and get a free house!
Same place you apply to be a black man
Just say you “identify” as a traveller and you should be sorted…
@Stephen Todd: “Shame at the media who continue to label” did it ever cross the mind of the traveller community that its their own dispicable behaviour that brings the shame on themselves?.
indigenous community?, does that mean that the rest of the Irish people are not indigenous?.
@Curragh Bill:
She’s just mixed up indigenous with disingenuous.
No she mixed up indigenous with inbred
@Piotrek Król: Certainly a much more accurate description.
Im from Wexford,i want ethnicity too.we speak differently from Wicklow people and have different cultures than our neighbours in Carlow and Waterford……..
Off you go. Please apply for your passport and visa in the usual way…
@Jimmy Burn: True, there have been groups speaking “Klingon” from star trek for years , if they stay at it long enough and start to worship a shovel over time it will become a religion and a culture , and they rest of will be called racist and bigots for saying they’re mad . BTW way google says the Klingon for Hello is “nuqneH”, you couldn’t make it up .
No that it’s any of your business Phil, but Ye I was
@stephen your the one bringing your personal life into this forum, so Stephen it is my business if you post it here.
I suspect you sir are talking big old porky pies
Peronally , I believe the move to a defined ethnicity is premature . The travelling community have all the same rights and obligations as every other citizen in this state . In respect of the obligations piece many in the rest of the community believe is not taken seriously if acknowledged at all By the majority of travellers . I understand the community does have unique challenges particularly around health and education which does lead to disadvantage . However , the insistence that a nomadic lifestyle can be maintained is totally had odds with the provision of theses fundamental services . How can formal education be delivered to those who are mobile and where the choice of accommodation to facilitate their lifestyle is totally unsuitable for young kids to progress in modern society . Let’s be clear we should never discriminate on the basis of background and so I’d call pavee point and the travelling community to really be honest and work on all the issues within their community that drive so much distrust . I.e. Attitude to violence as a form of dispute resolution amongst young men , girls education, littering etc
With Rights come responsibilities, such as living by the same rules as the rest of us. And it also means actually contributing something to society , and an understanding that the rest of us who do so, do not “owe” them a free gratis, cosy, idle life on welfare, from cradle to grave, courtesy of our Taxes. And that the property & things we work so hard to pay for are not theirs to pillage, despite their obvious belief otherwise. Have these fundamental laws been clearly explained to Travellers?
They are not ethnically different to the rest of us. So it’s a political spin
If they become a separate ethnic group can they be deported?
Didn’t you call some of us extreme right wing because we agreed with tighter border controls and less immigration ? Now you’re talking about deporting travellers. Typical liberal hypocrisy, disrespecting travellers rights is ok but shout out about protecting other immigrant groups. All bullshit and hypocrisy
They are Irish, like the rest of us. This ethnic minority business is a cod.
In hospital with my daughter. Travellers were in the room next door. When leaving decided to clear out all of the aptamil milk bottles. Thats what you get for “its my culture boss” !!!
Any comment from pavee point about some of their members disgracefully protesting outside a house for Syrian refugees (an ACTUAL ethnic minority)?
They’re probably all in jail like their colleagues from Limerick.. http://m.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/irish-gang-face-jail-over-73m-plot-to-steal-rhino-horn-and-artefacts-34499162.html
The right to trespass, invade and destroy whatever car park or field they wish? The right to cause mayhem wherever they appear? The right to incite trouble, steal and terrorise towns, villages and neighbourhoods?! An offshore sanctuary is where they belong, preferably a sinking one.
Great news, hopefully this will provide greater access to bigger and better free housing in the future.
@Jim Brady: Free
What they can all do is f#ck off and take their culture/ethnicity somehwere else
I’m all for travellers having their traditions respected but they have to respect the rest of the community as well.It works both ways.Everyone is struggling to survive and are paying their taxes.There are a lot of incidents where travellers won’t pay Taxi fares, And the gardai are regularly called to pubs to break up fights.So Pavee point,it’s up to you to make sure your people who you are representing behave themselves in a civilised manner.You are not a law onto yourselves. Your members protesting at a Syrian refugee family being housed was disgraceful. You have no special status in this country.behave yourselves and do what the rest of us do.
What are the precise characteristics of a separate, distinct and different Traveller ethnicity?
I thougt that travellers were of the same ethnicity as other fellow Irish people.
The ultra rich are different. Should they have a separate ethnicity? Should artists and creative people have a different ethnicity? Should problem drinkers have a separate ethinicity? Should those Roman Catholics who are fundamentalist in outlook have a separate ethnicity? Should paedophiles have a separate ethnicity? Should bankers have a separate ethnicity.
Why should we make travellers different and reinforce the difference?
I have yet to be convinced by any argument that Irish travellers are of a different ethnicity to settled Irish people.
Additionally, why would a group of people want to become a ethnic minority in their own country of birth.
I’m not trying to cause an argument, I legitimately don’t understand the issue.
@ads20101: I’m in the same boat. I keep asking but I don’t get answers.
Stop will ye lads….net thing Healy Rae will be looking for “Island” status for Kerry.
About time. Let’s give them another welfare allowance. Call it persecuted minority allowance. Throw in a free house too
Travellers certainly get a hard time from society. The suicide and depression rates are terrifying. Having said that, there are serious issues in traveller “culture” that do them no favours either.
Does that mean that if a traveller commits a crime against a settled person then it can be regarded as a hate-crime against the settled person based on their ethnicity, and will result in longer prison sentences for the traveller?
Is prison party of their culcha boss?
Wouldent it be great if travellers actually travelled, preferably abroad for acre
DNA says they are as Irish as the rest of us
Sure he supports this while giving preference to “Syrian” Refugees allowing them to skip Irish families on the housing list.
Stupid comment
By choice
There already is equality for all. But travellers would like to think they are being taken against. Anyone can go get a job. Anyone can pay taxes. Anyone can send their kids to school. Anyone can save some money and buy a house. Anyone can contribute to society in a positive way should they so wish. Unfortunately alot of travellers feel these social norms shouldn’t apply to them.
Recognizing them as an ethnic minority doesn’t go far enough – They should be recognized as an entirely different species.
In my local centra other day mother grandmother in pyjamas teenagers and younger kids ran riot around the shop .the teenagers went behind the tills the whole lot Id them shouting goin up and down different ailes etc etc etc . The shop owner was really p off. Another day three kids not strapped in sitting in the front seat!
Nothing against “the traveling community” but let’s face their not really anymore….the majority of them live in a permanent “halting site” and stay there until they die therefore they are settled. Another thing they are irish if said they weren’t they’ve ould be up in arms over that too, they are not a different race of people than us and they don’t come from different countries so of they want the “race equality” I want the govt to give me the same as they get…after all I was born and raised in the exact same country as them and don’t anyone give me hell about their circumstances. …because in that case we could the same about upper middle and lower class circumstances!
Why would fellow Irish people who think they are not treated equally, and say they subjected to racism want to be treated as a separate race, it would be like Donegal of Tipperary people wanting to be classified as a different race, go figure?
Not before time. People are afraid ethnicity will somehow allow Travellers a free reign? Like in the north where they have it years and are now ruling the place? Cop on. A massive part of this is an identity for younger travellers growing up.
@Stephen Todd: Sulky racing on busy roads? Not a care in the world for other road users. Interfering with the Gardai called to the scene? They already have free reign.
Interesting that thus has cross party support in the Dail
Any politician who would go against if would be labelled as a racist by the mainstream media
@John003: Yep any debate is closed down, with one word , `racist`.
Will ” can’t” be on the school curriculum?
Cant
Jaysus I look deadly in that photo at the Traveller men’s health event in Pavee Point. I love you all!
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