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Leah Farrell/Rollingnews.ie

Irish Rail and Dublin Bus could face delays as Bus Éireann strike comes to Leinster House

It has not yet been confirmed if rail and Dublin bus workers will attend today’s protest.

Updated 7.50am

THE NATIONAL BUS and Rail Union has accused Bus Éireann of “using massaged figures” when reporting on the ailing finances of the company, ahead of a protest at Leinster House today which could see Irish Rail and Dublin Bus services facing delays.

Today’s protest by Bus Éireann workers is set to coincide with the appearance of Minister for Transport Shane Ross before an Oireachtas committee to explain his department’s take and reaction to the strike. Ross has repeatedly refused all calls to intervene in the industrial dispute.

The protest comes on day six of the Bus Éireann strike, with workers refusing to accept cost-cutting measures put forward by the company which says it is in a dire financial situation.

If Irish Rail and Dublin Bus workers turn up to show their support in solidarity with the Bus Éireann workers, it will likely affect services from around midday to early afternoon, before the evening rush hour.

However, Irish Rail indicated this morning that there is no disruption to services confirmed as of yet, and promised to inform customers if the situation changed.

Dublin Bus and Irish Rail workers are set to be balloted next week for industrial action, in the wake of the Bus Éireann strike.

Ahead of the protest today, NBRU general secretary Dermot O’Leary said that Bus Éireann’s increases in financial losses last year is due to “an increase in the depreciation of the fleet, an increase in unexplained professional fees, along with a change to the methodology of projecting the potential cost of third-party insurance claims”.

He added that, for the day that’s in it, that the company’s actual losses were nearer the €6 million mark.

A spokesperson for Bus Éireann told TheJournal.ie that its “accounts have been audited and showed losses of €9.4 million in 2016″.

“That is on the record,” the spokesperson added.

At today’s Oireachtas committee hearing, Shane Ross is expected to reiterate the position that neither he nor the government will intervene directly in an attempt to solve the dispute.

On numerous occasions under questioning from Committee members in the past, Ross rejected calls for him to personally intervene in the dispute, saying that he “wouldn’t get involved” and wouldn’t “take sides”.

School buses

Yesterday, Fianna Fáil spokesperson on education, Thomas Byrne, warned that that students could be left without a bus service from next week due to the ongoing strike at Bus Éireann.

As of now, the school service offered by Bus Éireann is not affected by the strike.

Byrne said that he had seen a letter sent by the company to private operators operating under the scheme that payments these operators are due to receive this Friday would be delayed.

The TD said that there were no administrative staff to process the payment and that private operators had indicated they may withdraw the service should they not receive these payments.

The Bus Éireann spokesperson said: “A technical solution is being put in place which will see contractors being paid next week, who would normally have been paid this week.

The contract agreement which each contractor sets out that payment will be made within 30 days of a correctly completed invoice being received by Bus Éireann. Payments made next week are well within this range.

The spokesperson added that school bus services are continuing to run as normal during the strike.

Read: Over half of people don’t support the Bus Éireann strike

Read: Dublin Bus and Irish Rail workers to ballot for industrial action

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118 Comments
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    Mute Darren Moore
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:30 AM

    A minister for transport that won’t get involved with any transport disputes that effects huge portions of the population yet will fly to Brazil if someone gets arrested for scalping tickets that effects hardly anyone .

    483
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    Mute Deborah Behan
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:40 AM

    @Darren Moore: he was representing the Irish Olympic committee and fraudulent behaviour. Why should the tax payer pay for this? The company wants take steps against going to the wall and the workers won’t work with them.

    160
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    Mute Benjy Dooley
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:51 AM

    Inspiring solidarity from the transport workers who will refuse to let the Bus Eireann workers stand alone against the government of the vulture funds, bondholders and corporate tax dodgers and corrupt cops.

    96
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    Mute Awkward Seal
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:03 AM

    My train is running fine this morning Wally. Solidarity isn’t just a word you flippantly throw around. Sometimes you have to follow through with action to show your solidarity is genuine and not just lip service

    54
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    Mute Awkward Seal
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:06 AM

    What can Shane Ross do that the labour court can’t do? Give them more money so they can squander that too on an inefficient service and overinflated wages for menial labour? He’s right to keep out of it.

    77
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    Mute Benjy Dooley
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:10 AM

    @Awkward Seal:
    Who claimed the trains wouldn’t be running this morning? There may be some stoppages later today as the Rail and Dublin Bus workers join with BE workers outside the Dail in protest.

    More importantly, Siptu are balloting their members in Iarnroid Eireann and Dublin Bus to decide if they will engage in solidarity industrial action in support of the BE workers. A yes vote looks likely and when the democratic process is complete the solidarity action will begin.

    18
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    Mute Benjy Dooley
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:12 AM

    @Awkward Seal:
    Shane Ross can stop pretending that public transport is a profit making enterprise and restore the subvention which has been slashed since 2008 to pay for the banker’s debts.

    “Unite’s Michael Taft told the committee that Ireland fared badly when compared with other EU countries in terms of subvention. CIÉ’s subvention from the State was reduced from €321m in 2008 to €189m in 2015, a reduction of 41pc. Payroll costs were reduced by 12.6pc.”

    http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/allout-transport-strike-inevitable-if-expressway-plan-goes-ahead-35145592.html

    23
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    Mute Sean @114
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:24 AM

    @Benjy Dooley: SIPTU members must spend more time off work attending union meetings, casting votes, going out in ‘solidarity’ with other SIPTU workers than they do actually carrying out the duties of their job. Is it any wonder that the public and civil service is a mess?

    69
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    Mute Honeybadger197
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:25 AM

    @Benjy Dooley: So what youre saying is: solidarity with the workers who are causing major disruption to the workers who pay the wages of the workers who want more money from those disrupted workers.

    70
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    Mute Benjy Dooley
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    Mar 29th 2017, 9:03 AM

    @Honeybadger197:
    I’m saying solidarity all workers who struggle against the system and neoliberal state which exploits them. That includes the Bus drivers and those travelling on the bus like the Tesco workers.
    P.S. In most countries, taxes are not required to fund government spending on public services like transport, health, education etc.

    11
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    Mute Larissa Caroline Nikolaus
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    Mar 29th 2017, 9:47 AM

    @Benjy Dooley: Are you living in La La Land? Name one country where public transport, health, and education isn’t funded through taxation

    33
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    Mute CeannairBlue
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    Mar 29th 2017, 9:47 AM

    @Benjy Dooley: Idiot.

    31
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    Mute CeannairBlue
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    Mar 29th 2017, 9:48 AM

    @Benjy Dooley: You’re making **** up again aren’t you ???

    27
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    Mute Jimmy jones
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    Mar 29th 2017, 11:33 AM

    @Benjy Dooley: Its the neoliberals and “banksters” that did it ? Should you not be getting back to teaching the class?

    7
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    Mute Benjy Dooley
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    Mar 29th 2017, 11:44 AM

    @Larissa Caroline Nikolaus:

    I thought you had me muted Larissa? Couldn’t help yourself eh? :)

    The answer is every country that issues it’s own floating currency including the U.K, U.S, Japan, Australia, New Zealand, Canada etc etc. Those nations spend by simply crediting bank accounts as they need to. They don’t need to obtain taxation in order to spend. And indeed cannot take taxes back out of circulation unless they have spent the currency into circulation in the first place. You can read about it here:

    “For most people, the greatest challenge to near-and-dear convictions is MMT’s claim that a sovereign government’s finances are nothing like those of households and firms. While we hear all the time the statement that “if I ran my household budget the way that the Federal Government runs its budget, I’d go broke”, followed by the claim “therefore, we need to get the government deficit under control”, MMT argues this is a false analogy. A sovereign, currency-issuing government is NOTHING like a currency-using household or firm. The sovereign government cannot become insolvent in its own currency; it can always make all payments as they come due in its own currency.
    Indeed, if government spends currency into existence, it clearly does not need tax revenue before it can spend. Further, if taxpayers pay their taxes using currency, then government must first spend before taxes can be paid. Again, all of this was obvious two hundred years ago when kings literally stamped coins in order to spend, and then received their own coins in tax payment.
    Another shocking truth is that a sovereign government does not need to “borrow” its own currency in order to spend. Indeed, it cannot borrow currency that it has not already spent! This is why MMT sees the sale of government bonds as something quite different from borrowing………………
    You don’t need to understand all of that to get the main point: sovereign governments don’t need to borrow their own currency in order to spend! They offer interest-paying treasury securities as an instrument on which banks, firms, households, and foreigners can earn interest. This is a policy choice, not a necessity. Government never needs to sell bonds before spending, and indeed cannot sell bonds unless it has first provided the currency and reserves that banks need to buy the bonds……”

    http://neweconomicperspectives.org/2014/06/modern-money-theory-basics.html

    4
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    Mute 8bitplebian
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    Mar 29th 2017, 11:51 AM

    @Benjy Dooley: Hahaha. What total drivel. Countries that have their own currencies, print shedloads of it and tax everything to death go rapidly bankrupt. Examples: Britain in the 70s, Zimbabwe, Weimar Republic. The first example led to 17 years of the Torres and we know what happened with the others.

    17
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    Mute iMoan Brutal
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    Mar 29th 2017, 12:06 PM

    @Benjy Dooley: ” In most countries, taxes are not required to fund government spending on public services like transport, health, education etc” Do they have money trees in these mythical countries?

    10
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    Mute 8bitplebian
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    Mar 29th 2017, 12:08 PM

    Having said that, there is a possibility this drivel might have only reduced us to subsistence level existence rather than total obliteration if it was implemented around a hundred years ago.

    4
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    Mute Ger Murphy
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    Mar 29th 2017, 12:08 PM

    @Darren Moore: why should he? Failed company with a culture of dubious allowances. The BE guys have been laughing at the taxpayer for years. Their game is up. No doubt now that Dublin commuters might be impacted we might see heads been knocked together.

    As for all the Solidarity waffle from Benjy – time the spongers in semi state orgs were made face reality like tens of thousands of private sector workers had to: loss making companies can’t survive.

    I want to keep more of my pay instead of propping up failed welfare policies that is bleeding ordinary decent private sector workers.

    10
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    Mute Benjy Dooley
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    Mar 29th 2017, 12:52 PM

    @8bitplebian:
    Nonsense. As explained above it’s not possible for a currency issuer to go bankrupt in the currency they issue. The U.S. cannot go bankrupt in the dollar. The U.K cannot go bankrupt in sterling. Japan cannot go bankrupt in the yen. You cannot run out of the currency that you are the sole creator of. It’s not a difficult concept to grasp and it shouldn’t be beyond you.

    2
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    Mute Stiofán Ó Cearnaigh
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    Mar 29th 2017, 12:52 PM

    @Benjy Dooley: still at it ? Day in day out! Fight the power lad!

    4
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    Mute Benjy Dooley
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    Mar 29th 2017, 12:53 PM

    @iMoan Brutal: They don’t need trees. They have computer keyboards where most of the money is created.

    2
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    Mute Nick Allen
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    Mar 29th 2017, 6:30 PM

    @Benjy Dooley:

    If those countries with their own currency can simply deposit money that doesn’t exist then why do they bother with any income tax?

    1
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    Mute Matt Connolly
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:32 AM

    It’s not appreciate for a politician to intervene. They make policy. If bus eireann and the unions can’t agree the labour courts are the appropriate next step. Also, it is wrong for employees of unaffected companies to get involved. It indicates the unions are not confident of their argument before a court.

    206
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    Mute Matt Connolly
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:33 AM

    @Matt Connolly: * appropriate

    40
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    Mute Benjy Dooley
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:54 AM

    @Matt Connolly: Ross had no problem intervening to back the Apple tax dodgers and vulture funds. This is an ideological dispute about the future of public transport and will require a political intervention to resolve.

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    Mute John Byrne
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:55 AM

    @Matt Connolly: .Government policy under the guise of the NTA oversaturating some major routes is one of the main reasons why Expressway is losing money. Bus Eireann Expressway routes are glorified PSO routes while the privates go city to city non-stop, whilst not accepting DSP passes. Add in the fact that BE funding from DSP to carry pass holders is from 1970′s data(also hugely underfunded) and subvention is at a fraction of 2009 levels. So Ross should most definitly get involved, this “nothing to do with me” attitude does not wash with the informed people.

    30
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    Mute Gulliver Foyle
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:08 AM

    @John Byrne: it off interest, both of large private operators in Donegal stop in nearly every town in Donegal, and in the case of the Galway route, every town along the way.

    23
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    Mute John Sheehy
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:09 AM

    @Benjy Dooley: Tax payers do not want to subsidise the transport system with additional taxation, especially given they actually earn far above the average salary in the private sector.
    Bus Eireaann workers should only be paid for the hours they work, not these incredible number of overtime hours that they do not actually work.

    60
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    Mute 8bitplebian
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:19 AM

    I don’t want my taxes to fund an inefficient and overpaid transport system. There are better uses the money can be put to. The nearly ten year old bailout is not a valid excuse for continuing to waste money until we go bankrupt again.

    This is probably less of a concern if the only tax you contribute is the VAT and excise on your Dutch Gold, isn’t that right Wally?

    52
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    Mute Benjy Dooley
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:20 AM

    @John Sheehy:
    You don’t speak for all tax payers. While you are subsidizing the Apple tax dodgers to the tune of €19 billion and the bondholders to the tune of €100+ billion and receive precisely nothing in return. The Bus Eireann deficit is tiny at €9 million and supports a vital public service. Public transport is not a profit making activity. It’s subvention has been slashed since 2008 to pay for the banker’s debts and this has resulted in the manufactured crisis today. Solidarity with the BE workers in their struggle against the neoliberal state’s privatization agenda.

    18
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    Mute lavbeer
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:27 AM

    @John Byrne: I thought the NTA only had 2 operators on each route. And that BE never applied for city to city licenses?

    What do the informed people say?

    14
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    Mute Ben McArthur
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:55 AM

    @Matt Connolly: They’ve already been to the labour court. The unions didn’t like the answer, so here we are.

    27
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    Mute John Byrne
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    Mar 29th 2017, 9:14 AM

    @Gulliver Foyle: BE Dub/Galway route 20 stops has approx 18/19 towns. BE Dub/Cork route X8 has 5 towns. BE Dub/Limerick route X12 has 4 towns. BE Dub/Waterford/New Ross X4 route has 8 towns. BE Dub/Belfast route X1 has 3 towns. All these routes have competition and have non-stop city to city services on them, how can BE compete when majority of passengers going direct?. Add in the fact that most of these private operators do not take DSP passes(some through no fault of their own( ie.Goverment Policy/Scheme). Bus Eireann left with very little, DSP passes for which they are hugely underfunded and have being for years and has being recently acknowledged by Leo and Ross. So in a nutshell and back to my original point Government policy through oversatuation, subvention underfunding and DSP underfunding has led to this perfect storm (conspiracy theorists could call it manufactured) for an opportunity to raid workers terms and conditions. These are the main reasons Ross should be getting involved, and stop referring to it as an ordinary industrial dispute.

    5
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    Mute Linda Nolan
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    Mar 29th 2017, 9:15 AM

    @lavbeer: Check out politics.ie – there’s a great thread there explaining the problem in great detail.

    6
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    Mute Ben Sheridan
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    Mar 29th 2017, 9:18 AM

    @Benjy Dooley: how exactly do we subsidise Apple? I think that the use of a domicile for favourable corporate tax rates is very different from a jurisdiction ‘subsidising’ that corporate?

    21
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    Mute John Weldon
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    Mar 29th 2017, 9:23 AM

    @Benjy Dooley: Expressway is not a “vital public service”. It is the commercial arm of Bus Eireann. It cannot be subsidized (you keep harping on about subventions) by the government as it would be breaking EU anti-competition laws and the EU could issue massive fines for it, as well as leaving the government open to litigation from the private companies who tendered for these routes. The PSO routes run by Bus Eireann all pretty much run at break-even point and some even make a small profit.

    Secondly, Apple is 100% tax compliant in Ireland, any profits it made in Ireland was taxed at 12.5% which is the corporate tax rate in Ireland. If you haven’t got a clue what you are talking about then its better to say nothing, lest you make yourself look an idiot.

    25
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    Mute John Byrne
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    Mar 29th 2017, 9:36 AM

    @lavbeer: Dub/Galway BE/Citylink/Go Bus. Dub/Cork – Aircoach/GoBe/BE . Dub/Limerick BE/Dub Coach/JJ Kav/Eire Eagle(Citylink). Dub/Waterford BE/JJ Kav/Dub Coach. Dub/Belfast BE/Aircoach/ Dub Coach. Am sure you can add up each route and come to the conclusion that not just 2 on each route? You somehow missed my original point which was oversaturation of these routes and the fact that BE dont do City to City direct (through years of government interference and a so called Social conscience) , I would call it mis-management.
    Consider yourself informed, anything else I could teach you?

    5
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    Mute Linda Nolan
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    Mar 29th 2017, 9:48 AM

    @John Byrne: I would suggest you check out this link here:

    http://www.politics.ie/forum/transport/254480-example-what-wrong-bus-eireann-17.html

    It might explain a lot that you don’t appear to understand.

    5
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    Mute CeannairBlue
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    Mar 29th 2017, 9:49 AM

    @John Weldon: The ship has sailed on that one sadly!!!!

    2
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    Mute Linda Nolan
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    Mar 29th 2017, 9:50 AM

    @John Byrne: Plus, if the market is “over saturated” then you might explain the Union asking Shane Ross to issue them with a licence and if you read the link I posted you might realise that it wasn’t due to “government” interference – rather it was due to a management failure.

    4
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    Mute John Byrne
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    Mar 29th 2017, 10:06 AM

    @Linda Nolan: perfectly aware of what the whole dispute is about, thank you.It is commentators such as yourself who get their information from websites/ newspapers that dont see the full picture. For what its worth, I have already mentioned mis management in a previous comment. If you want to be truly informed of whats happening, I suggest you ask a Bus Eireann worker and maybe not take everything that you read on an internet opinion site ( most likely a disgruntled/former BE worker)as fact. Please re read all my comments on here, you might learn something.

    4
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    Mute Linda Nolan
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    Mar 29th 2017, 10:15 AM

    @John Byrne: No actually, you’re not and like many others you refuse to see the full picture, re “mismanagement” – this is what you said:

    “You somehow missed my original point which was oversaturation of these routes and the fact that BE dont do City to City direct (through years of government interference and a so called Social conscience) , I would call it mis-management.”

    You also said:

    “So in a nutshell and back to my original point Government policy through oversatuation, subvention underfunding and DSP underfunding has led to this perfect storm (conspiracy theorists could call it manufactured) for an opportunity to raid workers terms and conditions.”

    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/ross-urged-to-grant-bus-%C3%A9ireann-non-stop-express-licences-1.2966903

    How can you claim that the routes are “over saturated” when the Unions themselves say:

    “Minister for Transport Shane Ross has been urged to introduce regulations that would grant Bus Éireann non-stop express licences similar to those available to private operators.”

    The licences are and were available to all commercial companies and BE is classed as one such company – they did not apply for these licences and only two are issued (if you read the link I posted you might see that there are two different licences per route) on a first come first served basis.

    Why would I ask a BE worker when I can inform myself using ALL information available – not just one side.

    Please inform yourself and be civil to those you don’t agree with.

    6
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    Mute John Byrne
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    Mar 29th 2017, 11:02 AM

    @Linda Nolan: I was being civil, it was yourself who suggested first that I was misinformed thus my reply to yourself bout misinformation. You then put up a link by a former BE worker regarding what the actual strike was about. I would agree with some of the points,they are actual in line with whats going on , BUT there was several MAJOR points left out which, at this stage I will not go over again. So I mentioned maybe a former disgruntled worker who maybe working for a rival now.
    On your last point about mismanagement, that link is from last month.My point regarding mismanagement and their failures was over the last 10-15, when lets call a spade a spade, they were neither pro active and in most causes neither re active to changes in the market. So i’m not sure what relavance that link has. Of course the unions are onto the minister now, my point being that the previous management were too slow.
    The unions now are looking for point to point purely to compete with private operators, ie keeping BE route going thus saving job losses.

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    Mute Benjy Dooley
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    Mar 29th 2017, 11:48 AM

    @Ben Sheridan: You and the rest of us pay taxes so that the likes of Apple don’t have to. That’s how you subsidize the corporate tax dodgers.

    1
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    Mute Gulliver Foyle
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    Mar 29th 2017, 12:09 PM

    @John Byrne: Out of interest, Nestor’s airport link stops at 20 towns from Dublin to Galway, Kavanagh’s stop at the main towns between Clonmel and Dublin, with feeder buses to smaller towns; not sure why you think that Bus Eireann are the only ones who provide local services with slow intercity buses – they are the only ones who make a balls out of running them efficiently, though. And I though the big problem is they can’t run their fast expressway service either.

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    Mute lavbeer
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    Mar 29th 2017, 2:17 PM

    @John Byrne: So what my informed self is reading that there is more than 2 operators – fair play for that. So what you are saying is the BE management didn’t apply for licenses and now want one because they realise that people do want them. So you want the rules changed for expressway.

    Since you are so well informed- tell me what percentage of BE business is expressway?

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    Mute lavbeer
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    Mar 29th 2017, 2:20 PM

    @lavbeer: as

    1
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    Mute John Byrne
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    Mar 29th 2017, 5:04 PM

    @lavbeer: please reread my previous comments regards company being mismanaged.The previous management were asleep at the wheel, neither proactive nor reactive, and should have being in for point to point routes.For some reason, they were handsomely rewarded with a huge redundency package and pension, read into that what you will. New management are in, they see that there are huge losses on some of our so called Expressway routes(glorified PSO routes), want to axe them. Unions see job losses and redundencies and obviously see that going point to point may save jobs.
    Please point out were I said that I want the rules changed for Bus Eireann?. The unions may have asked/said that, but I have said no such thing.

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    Mute John Byrne
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:31 PM

    @Gulliver Foyle: I presume you are referring to Citylink Galway-DubCity-DubAirport. I never said BE route 20 was the only route through towns, my point was that it serves these towns and that it was a glorified PSO route. I also mentioned Dub -Cork/Waterford/Belfast/Limerick, but I never mentioned Dub-Clonmel so not sure why you brought that route up?
    Anyway, lets stick and compare Dub-DAP-Galway BE service to same Citylink service. BE has 27 stops on route, Citylink has 19 stops, BE has 8 more stops, not a huge difference so. Big Difference between these services is that BE take DSP passes, Citylink do not on this route.ie all paying passengers. As I brought up before, BE have being massively underfunded by DSP regarding these passes, last figures I seen was that for every pass used/recorded BE were only recieving €4 approx, the fact that Dub- Galway or Dub – Athlone is around €13 – €15 and it is clear to see where BE are losing out.
    Your mask slipped in your last couple of sentences there with your anti- BE rant.
    Anything else I can clear up for you, feel free to ask.

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    Mute
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:41 AM

    The only solution here is for the immediate liquidation of the company and for the government to create a smaller company to provide public service buses on routes that require subvention. The Expressway business is a drain on taxpayers and is well past its useful contribution to Irish Life. Irish Rail and Dublin Bus provide a required service. In my part of this wonderful country public bus services have always been provided by the private sector efficiently every hour on the hour without problems of rude drivers and inept service at a cost people can afford and those using the Bus Pass are treated with respect. Drivers are well paid for working unlike Bus Eireann. All our school bus services are likewise provided by private sector operators.

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    Mute Gulliver Foyle
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:58 AM

    No need for smaller companies – define the routes, measures the required subsidy based on demand and put it out to tender. Hundreds of local companies would bite the hand of to get them; but yes – liquidate bus eireann.

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    Mute Benjy Dooley
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:58 AM

    @: RTE had a much larger loss of €20 million in 2016 than BE. Should Joe Duffy, Ryan Tubridy, Miriam O Callagan, Claire Byrne, Marian Finucane and the other pampered mouthpieces for the establishment also face immediate liquidation?
    The notion of running a public transport system on a for profit basis is nonsense btw. Public transport is loss making by it’s very nature.

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    Mute
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:05 AM

    @Benjy Dooley: I actually suggested running a subsidised bus services in areas and on routes that require same. RTE is a different matter, it is a bloated overrated organisation full of its own importance supported by unrealistic and unsubstantiated viewing figures. However you cannot blame the personalities for the salaries when the public service ethos behind it is not dealt with.

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    Mute Awkward Seal
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:13 AM

    @Benjy Dooley: Public transport isn’t loss making by it’s very nature. Inefficient public transport is loss making by it’s very nature. However, private companies are better suited to get profits out of routes that BÉ wouldn’t be able to in their wildest dreams.

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    Mute Ian McNally
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:20 AM

    @Benjy Dooley: Please explain how all the private operators on the exact same Expressway routes are able to make a profit then? Stop muddying the waters and trying to imply this is about all BE routes, its not, its only about Expressway and nothing else

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    Mute ktsiwot
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:26 AM

    @: They seem to be on the road to self destruction. You have to ask the question where have management been all along and now unions have there head in the sand, this is a recipe receivership.
    What I find incredible is the luas strike got way more publicity, this far more serious however it does not effect Dublin as we speak when it does, with Dublin bus and Dart and rail there will be uproar, seems this is close.

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    Mute Gulliver Foyle
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:43 AM

    @ktsiwot: where exactly do you think all the expressway buses go? Of course it affects Dublin as much as anywhere.

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    Mute Roy Dowling
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    Mar 29th 2017, 9:16 AM

    @Benjy Dooley: Wally I see you still don’t have solidarity with the RTE workers. Please explain why solidarity has abandoned the grass root workers who will lose there jobs?

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    Mute CeannairBlue
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    Mar 29th 2017, 9:50 AM

    @Roy Dowling: I’m guessing “hypocrisy” – a staple of the AAA mob.

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    Mute ktsiwot
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    Mar 29th 2017, 10:10 AM

    @Gulliver Foyle:
    No it does not. Buss still fun in Dublin as dublin bus is a separate company. There are no Busses running in Cork, Limerick ,Galway, Waterford citys as they are the same company. Local bus services have ground to a halt in rural Ireland, however there are city to city private companies operating and yes there is huge hassle for those who commute. My point being this has not effected Dublin Bus, Lusus or Dart, this strike has wiped out transport in the rest of the country.

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    Mute Roy Dowling
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    Mar 29th 2017, 10:40 AM

    @CeannairBlue: totally. Wally even said something like Rte is a parasite and should be removed from excistance on a previous journal post about it. Solidarity actually want all those people in RTE out of jobs

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    Mute CeannairBlue
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    Mar 29th 2017, 11:40 AM

    @Roy Dowling: It’s very odd, I await the placards “UP (SOME OF) THE WORKERS”

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    Mute Benjy Dooley
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    Mar 29th 2017, 2:09 PM

    @Roy Dowling:
    Here goldfish brain. The answer is the same as the one I gave you last week:

    http://www.thejournal.ie/bus-eireann-6-3301988-Mar2017/

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    Mute Benjy Dooley
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    Mar 29th 2017, 2:15 PM

    Hey, establishment hacks so deeply worried about the hard pressed taxpayer. There’s no sign of you on the article relating to the gross financial mismanagement in Garda college in Templemore:

    http://www.thejournal.ie/templemore-report-3312508-Mar2017/

    Please explain why?

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    Mute Jimmy jones
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:46 AM

    I see this as an attack against genuine workers and students by the bus drivers and train drivers . Shame on them

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    Mute gordon sandford
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:50 AM

    @Jimmy jones: yes like how dare they fight for their jobs snd financial security for themselves snd their families. Sure they should just sit back and let it all be taken from them !!

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    Mute Ian McNally
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:07 AM

    @gordon sandford: They are getting a raise, what they are striking over is changes to overtime which should never be considered a right.

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    Mute Paul Foot
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:44 AM

    @Ian McNally: absolutely correct

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    Mute Ben McArthur
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    Mar 29th 2017, 9:02 AM

    I too would like to be paid extra for sitting around instead of doing my core job. However, I live in the real world, not union fantasy land, so I’ll just get on with it.

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    Mute Derek Moean
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:32 AM

    The only way thay will get to keep their Jobs is Thake to the streets. Bus Eireann Wants the Driver’s to work for Notting…Shane Ross..he’s just waiting for his ministers pension. Should be Sacked….

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    Mute Ian McNally
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:40 AM

    @Derek Moean: no they arent being asked to work for nothing overtime rules are being chanhed and the drivers are actually getting a salary raise under the changes but i can see how you might think the equates to worling for nothing……

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    Mute Paul Foot
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:11 AM

    @Ian McNally: correct

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    Mute Paul Foot
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:20 AM

    @Ian McNally: yes, correct

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    Mute gordon sandford
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:44 AM

    Public service transport is an obligation that the government and Shane Ross have. Public service transport is not in existence to make profit but to supply a service to the public so for example people can walk out the door at almost any time of day or night and get a bus. Many many routes could never make profit but run in order to provide a transport service.

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    Mute Drew TheChinaman :)
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:52 AM

    @gordon sandford: indeed… And they could provide better, more frequent and additional subsidized services to more of the public for a cheaper ticket cost if they weren’t wasting money overpaying drivers…

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    Mute gordon sandford
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:56 AM

    @Drew TheChinaman :): overpaying drivers i dont think so, if pay cuts were to go ahead half these drivers would be claiming family income suppliment.

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    Mute Ian McNally
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:29 AM

    @gordon sandford: Theres no pay cuts, they are getting a 2% raise, they are losing their overtime which is not a right, even with overtime loss they are still the best paid bus drivers in the country and most of europe

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    Mute lavbeer
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:36 AM

    @gordon sandford: so what percentage of their earnings is overtime? That will be a measure of inefficiency

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    Mute John Weldon
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    Mar 29th 2017, 9:28 AM

    @gordon sandford: Public service routes aren’t affected. The vast majority run at break even/profit for BE. Its their Expressway service that is hemorrhaging money, that is the commercial arm. A lot of people up in arms and talking about “solidarity” don’t seem to even understand why the strike came about.

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    Mute iMoan Brutal
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    Mar 29th 2017, 12:09 PM

    @gordon sandford: Yet they are all on the higher tax band.. that doesnt add up..

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    Mute Gulliver Foyle
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    Mar 29th 2017, 12:18 PM

    @iMoan Brutal: you can get FIS if you are on €80k (if you have 8 kids). They must be the first group that claimed to be “put on the poverty line” by getting a payrise to the salary. It’s completely ridiculous, but not problem at all in the unionized public service; they need to get it sorted before the secondary teachers (average pay €45k) are due their annual strike that doesn’t also doesn’t affect any of their members, but says f*** you to the public.

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    Mute Joshua Walsh
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:59 AM

    In this whole dispute I haven’t heard what the changes to terms and conditions are?? What does a BE driver make and what are the changes to it? Might be me being cynical but may be they don’t want that information out there as it won’t further their cause.

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    Mute Red hurley
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:25 AM

    Where the hell is Shane ross?

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    Mute Tweety McTweeter
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:28 AM

    @Red hurley: what do you want him to do? Take out the ould taxpayer chequebook?

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    Mute Neal, not Neil.
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:32 AM

    @Tweety McTweeter: I’d like him to do, you know, transporty stiff and ministery stuff.

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    Mute Juan Venegas
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:38 AM

    Where is the auld check book for struggling families which are relying on out of dates rent allowances rates, they can’t find a place to leave, struggling pensioners who have to choose between keeping on the heat or eat, our homeless. That check book goes to some spoilt well paid semi-state brat then society is really f**ked up.

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    Mute Juan Venegas
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:38 AM

    Place to live, not to leave, auto-correct typo

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    Mute Seth Cheffetz
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:40 AM

    @Tweety McTweeter: it would be nice if he fought to have the public transport subvention returned to what it was. Of course the system is going to fall when the government keeps cutting it’s funding.

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    Mute Ian McNally
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:41 AM

    @Seth Cheffetz: the subvention cannot be used to support a commercial service like the Expressway which is the service thats at the core of this dispute

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    Mute Gulliver Foyle
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:54 AM

    @Ian McNally: I want the transport minister to do something, but not what the nbru tell him to do – I want home to assess the cost of providing public transport to all routes, including those not fully utilised, and put the subsidy paid to bus eireann out to tender to private operators to allow local companies take and operate these routes. It’s ironic that in Donegal, where bus eireann only chased the popular routes (letterkenny – dublin), multiple private operators have provided all small services and inter city routes that bus eireann wouldn’t touch, and they make a profit – the difference: flexible drivers that are paid for driving a bus, not being a civil servant.

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    Mute Paul Foot
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:54 AM

    @Ian McNally: agreed

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    Mute John Byrne
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:00 AM

    @Tweety McTweeter: No, unions have being calling for a debate/forum where all interested parties should be involved(government, NTA, DofT, Bus Eireann, Unions etc.). You and the invisible minister may call it opening the cheque book but to the people in the know, its called funding public transport properly.

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    Mute Chris Perrey
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:01 AM

    @Tweety McTweeter: yes a hell of a lot of taxpayers are left without transport

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    Mute Tweety McTweeter
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:07 AM

    @Chris Perrey: That’s not a good enough reason I’m afraid. They can’t just hold a good n to the country’s head and expect us to cough up. It doesn’t work in the private sector, why should it work in the public sector?

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    Mute John Weldon
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    Mar 29th 2017, 9:30 AM

    @John Byrne: The public arm of Bus Eireann is properly funded. Its the commercial arm, which the govt is NOT ALLOWED to subsidize that has brought this to a head.

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    Mute John Byrne
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    Mar 29th 2017, 9:53 AM

    @John Weldon: Thanks for that “insider information”. Please re read my comments regarding Government policy( oversaturation and DSP underfunding).This dispute has being years in the making, and yet goverment/ BE new (hatchet man) management want to solve in a matter of weeks. It fits perfectly in with FG policy to see this company go to the wall and privatise all routes. This is nothing but a raid on workers terms and conditions, and privatisation policy due to mismanagement and delibrate underfunding(ie DSP passes, oversaturation of routes, nothing to do with subvention.
    I do agree with you on one point though, there is a lot of people out there that do not know the roots of this dispute and bracket it, as simple as “sure Expressway is loss making”.

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    Mute John Weldon
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    Mar 29th 2017, 10:26 AM

    @John Byrne: There is no “oversaturation”. There are 4 buses per private route. 2 that are Inter Urban Multi stop licences, that stop off in towns and villages along the way. And 2 that are Inter Urban Expresses, that use the motorway and have limited stops.

    Amazingly on these “over-saturated” routes, private companies seem to be able to make a decent profit.

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    Mute John Byrne
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    Mar 29th 2017, 5:11 PM

    @John Weldon: They may amazingly make a profit due to some going point to point, and some of the ones that serve towns dont take DSP passes.The DSP passes have long being the elephant in the room. Bus Eireann recieve less than €4 per DSP pass, Dub Galway/Cork/Belfast would be €10, 15, 20..Do the maths, Bus Eireann are losing money at this rate.This has recently only being acknowdged by Ross and Leo.

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    Mute Joe Keogh
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:01 AM

    This strike will be solved when Dublin bus drivers withdraw services.

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    Mute Paul
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:39 AM

    @Joe Keogh: beleive they have some form of no strike clause with there pay deal so could be interesting.

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    Mute lavbeer
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:51 AM

    @Joe Keogh: would that constitute secondary picketing in some form as they are not in dispute nor employed by BE? I suspect that would end up in courts.

    Anyway Jimmy Kelly on RTÉ yesterday and they have 40m strike and willing to share. Might be a long strike yet

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    Mute Ian McNally
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    Mar 29th 2017, 10:16 AM

    @lavbeer: They are balloting to “strike”, the unions can double speak all they want but if they vote yes then the no strike clause has to activate

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    Mute Adrian
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:18 AM

    I think a lot of these protests might not occur if the personal taxation was cut. These guys are on good money pre tax but the higher tax band kicks in way too low. That combined with general high cost of living is possibly squeezing these people financially.

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    Mute Gulliver Foyle
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:44 AM

    @Adrian: chicken and egg… The high taxes go to pay their high PS level salaries. If what you say was valid, the entire private service would be out on strike.

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    Mute Gulliver Foyle
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:51 AM

    PS: there was no real claim of hardship other than by the union leaders. On prime time, the paraded their worst 2 examples : one who seemed to have taken out a mortgage the previous week after working for 30 years, and another who was struggling to support his *adult children*. These drivers are not millennials who are looking for entry level houses, if they are struggling financially, it is more likely because they stretched themselves on an apartment in kusadasi back in the 90s and they maxed their credit card with boom era limits. Nothing that we should throw money at them for.

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    Mute iMoan Brutal
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    Mar 29th 2017, 12:03 PM

    @Adrian: The fact that they are on the higher tax band for driving a bus says it all. Overpaid.

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    Mute Drew TheChinaman :)
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:44 AM

    Getting desperate now lads…

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    Mute Awkward Seal
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    Mar 29th 2017, 7:59 AM

    So they’re arguing over how broke the company is. Clutching at straws.

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    Mute Dara Smith
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    Mar 29th 2017, 9:41 AM

    I hope IR and DB do walk off the job as well. When Dublin comes to a standstill it might give a Shane Ross the kick up the a$$ he really needs. Once it’s outside Dublin, he doesn’t seem to care

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    Mute CeannairBlue
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    Mar 29th 2017, 9:54 AM

    @Dara Smith: Bollocks.

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    Mute John Sheehy
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    Mar 29th 2017, 12:19 PM

    Losses of 6m-9m, SIPTU proposed savings of 0.5m that their members might accept.
    The workers will continue to earn overtime for hours not worked and keep their bonus days.
    The strike has now cost the firm another 3m, as its reported to cost 0.5m a day.

    That is why we are in this situation.
    In SIPTU’s eyes some animals are more equal than others.

    Meanwhile UNITE says it has a 40m Euro warchest to support strikers.
    How did this charity accrue this sum? Shouldn’t they be paying tax like the rest of us?
    Unions exploit loopholes in the law to earn massive amounts.

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    Mute iMoan Brutal
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    Mar 29th 2017, 10:59 AM

    THe govt needs to stand up to these moronic unions and overpaid wasters. I feel sorry for bus drivers who dont support this shambolic strike. They are paid enough. Its not an entitlement to get a pay rise. Huge amounts of people havent had a pay rise in the last 10 years (who deserve it a lot more) We need to support workers like nurses who are paid pittance to do a far harder essential job.

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    Mute CeannairBlue
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    Mar 29th 2017, 11:42 AM

    @iMoan Brutal: Hear, hear!!!! Wally and his “we’ll only work when there are jobs that pay what we feel we deserve” will never know what it’s like to be at a train station after a ten hour day not knowing if you’ll get home because the drivers have spat their dummies out and joined a strike.

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    Mute Séa Graham
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    Mar 29th 2017, 8:04 AM

    Starting to feel like Ross is an AAA waster. Do your damn job and sort it out. A hand full of overpaid idiots are going to seriously dammage the income and living conditions of the working people while Ross scratches his ar$€ doing what he does best. Absolutely nothing!

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    Mute John Gleeson
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    Mar 29th 2017, 9:29 AM

    @Mark Murphy: o Leary , is turning into Union corpse

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    Mute Sean Fleming
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    Mar 29th 2017, 1:28 PM

    This present government fine gael and their and their muppet alliance back up need to be removed from office as soon as possible so that this country can get back to normality again

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    Mute Pauly Hughes
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    Mar 29th 2017, 11:49 AM

    a transport minister who wants nothing to do with transport issues what does he get paid for

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