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SINN FÉIN HAS proposed abolishing the local property tax which would cost the Exchequer €445 million, in its alternative Budget plans.
Against this, the party has proposed re-introducing a second home charge at a rate of €400 per-year which would raise €105 million.
Among other measures, the party has also proposed raising betting tax applied to customers to 3% which would raise €3 million, and a 7% special levy on incomes over €100,000 (which would raise €662 million).
The third largest party in the Dáil launched its alternative budget today, which party TDs said was on the side of “ordinary people”.
“In Budget 2018, Sinn Féin has chosen a side, the side of ordinary people,” said finance spokesperson Pearse Doherty.
Sinn Féin’s priority for Budget 2018 is to invest in public services and begin the process of solving the crises in health and housing.
Breakdown
Sinn Féin’s Budget would see increases in taxes across different levels of the economy.
Under the heading of “Paying a Fair Share”, the party proposes the 7% levy, increasing the Capital Acquisitions Tax by 3% to 6%, abolishing the Help to Buy scheme, and increasing PRSI for incomes of over €100,000.
All in all the party will raise €2 billion from tax methods. Offsetting this will be tax reductions of almost €600 million.
Some of these will include abolishing the property tax, taking workers under €20,280 out of the Universal Social Charge, increasing tax credits for the self-employed and increasing PRSI bands in line with a minimum wage increase.
Taking these into account, the party is proposing net tax increases of around €1.4 billion.
Doherty has stressed that in the current economic climate there is no room for significant tax cuts and that all resources must be directed towards addressing the crises in housing and health.
He said that Fine Gael and Fianna Fáil were engaged in “a sham fight over tax cuts that will disproportionately benefit those on higher incomes over those on lower to average incomes”.
Spending
The party has costed proposals which it said will tackle the main social issues in the country.
Among these are increases in capital investment in the housing sector, with additional social housing of 4,131 units costed at €702 million.
There would also be increased spending on a new affordable housing programme of €428 million.
There would also be increased capital investment in health of €100 million. The party said it would tackle the trolley crisis and caring for older people with 500 more hospital beds and two million additional home help hours.
The party also flagged increases of €4.50 for all working age social welfare payments, €4.50 for pensioners and €6 for people with disabilities.
You can view the full alternative Budget here
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I also support removal of taxes that are applicable to me and replacement with taxes that apply to people on scandalous amounts of money like €100k. Vote Tweety.
@Tweety McTweeter:
I know you’re being facetious but the depressing thing is that comment actually also applies in a serious way. An enormous proportion of the population think everything should be “free” from them and paid for by someone else, ie the middle class.
@Fred Jetson: so why not tax the better of and our multi-nationals more
@Hardly Normal: because the middle class and high earners already saddle up and pay a massive proportion of the tax returns
@Hardly Normal:
We need to make you and your ilk pay your fair share. Which is a lot more than the sweet f all you pay at the moment.
@Fred Jetson: I wouldn’t consider someone on €100, 000+ to be middle class. Especially as there may be a spouse/partner living in the same house earning the same or even half that.
LOL! Loving all the FG fraperoom accounts appearing exactly at the same time.
@Michael Geraghty: I hate segmenting people in society into classes , this is half our problem. High earners should be taxed more, people who earn less should pay a less.There are all kinds of tax incentives out there for people with some money and quite rightly they can take full advantage so why not create a few more incentives cut out loopholes so the likes of apple and Starbucks have to pay up a decent proportion of the 12.5% tax rate. They earn so much, half of that money would do incredible things for this country.
@Fred Jetson: ya true cause I live in Australia forced out because of decisions your ilk made, over the past ten years. have said I’m not a die-hard supporter of Sinn Fein. Of other parties were to take a more humane approach to the people then I’d be quite happy to endorse them.
@The Risen: mad isn’t it…
@Cindy Crawford: shall we just take all aspiration out of society? There was already a report this week detailing income tax levels, USC etc as being very prohibitive in discussions with companies looking to open office in Dublin as a result of Brexit. In fact they detailed access to schools and housing along with high levels of income tax for middle and high earners as a constant problem.
@Hardly Normal: high earners are taxed more than low earners and those who earn less pay less! That is an actual fact!
@Cindy Crawford: yeah and they could also be the only person in the house working and have 4 or 5 kids.
@The Risen: do you think anyone in government will even read that shinner nonsense PMSL
^ Ah, look who’s back. I see twitter recognised your device ID/IP and restricted your account already
oh, nearly forgot
PMSL
@Paddy: taxed at the same rate though. Id prefer to see multinationals taxed properly instead of taking away from the ordinary man/woman…
@jose mosse: I see your latest twitter account was immediately flagged and restricted LOL!
@The Risen: I see you shinners are getting a border, how does that make you feel? I am delighted :)
@jose mosse: jose the amount of shit propaganda in the journal and many of the people posting here is absurd. I’ll Tell you something. The other day I was hearing an interview in the basque radio to a SF guy and he said the plan is to make a referendum to unify Ireland and if the result is NO to repeat it every 7 years until it turns into YES. lol. These are the people supporting catalan fascism.
@Hardly Normal: let me guess. . . you’re related to Harvey Norman?
@La Massa: best to just laugh at them. SF are irrelevant
@La Massa: What you’ve done there is described the provisions in the Good Friday Agreement for reunification, which the vast majority of people on the island voted for.
I have no particular problem with people who have aspirations but high earners & multi nationals should bear the bulk of paying tax. If a married or unmarried couple are earning 200,000 per year between them then I don’t consider them to be middle class.
@Cindy Crawford: but SF are not talking about a household with 200,000 are they? They are talking about someone earning 100,000 regardless of the household circumstances. Correct me if I’m wrong and maybe I am.
@The Risen: a 100 years agreement is the way to go. Do we have a 200 years agreement ? That would work even better. It’s quite irrelevant. Voting until the result is the one i want. Joke!!
@Jane: I don’t have children as I can’t afford them.
@Fred Jetson: The last few years have fostered a great distrust among low income earners towards high earners and how deserving they are of their position and wealth. Perhaps their attitude is that somebody else should pay their share of taxes but their belief is also that higher management is making buck off the toils of lower income workers which is amounting to slavery and if the marketplace isn’t going to correct the imbalance the tax system should. Of course it’ll be the middle earner who’ll suffer the most as always.
@Jane: My personal belief is that a single persons earnings should be taxed as such. Married/Cohabiting couples earnings should be taxed as one income.
@Cindy Crawford: the high earners and multi nationals already pay the bulk of tax. In a time of Brexit, Trump pushing US protectionism, EU pushing for tax harmony and our reliance on multi nationals, any rise in higher levels of personal tax will not help our economy one bit. Be careful what you wish for.
@Fred Jetson: we do you fool who do think pays the majority of the tax in thus country, we have the best benefits of any country in europe, thats why at the height of the boom we still had 90,000 unemployment, because they were able to sit back and scratch their holes off the back of the rest of us
@Paul Fahey: We all know multi nationals don’t pay nearly as much as they should because of loopholes. If I have to pay any more tax I’ll stop working because it wouldn’t be worth my while to continue.
@Les Boyd: I thnk you should read his comments again.
@Tweety McTweeter: Let’s be honest 100k is not a scandalous amount of money. Some people work very hard to build up their career and get good salaries, making a lot of sacrifices in the process. Very often they support a few kids with a spouse maybe not even working. 100k is not 100k into the hand, there’s a lot of taxes paid out of that.
@Cindy Crawford: with respect, how about somebody living in Dublin on 100K with 3 babies / toddlers and whose partner doesn’t work because childcare for x3 kids is well over 2k per month? What if one of the kids is permanently physically and / or mentally disabled?
From taxcalc.ie, 100K is about 5400 net p/m. Subtract mortgage / rent, utilities, food, kids stuff like nappies, pension, healthcare, car, insurances, Internet, travel etc and little is left. Saving, college funds, holidays, medical, dental etc excluded. 100K is a lot of money under certain circumstances. The above circumstances also describe “ordinary people” to me.
Why doesn’t Sinn Fein look to make this smarter by further qualifying the tax by examining the family. I appreciate some of their other proposals (reducing childcare costs) but taxing people blindly like their 100K proposal is pandering to a particular facile mindset and therefore demagoguery.
@Jason: With respect, move out of Dublin. With respect, don’t have children when one can’t afford them. Like I said, I don’t have children because I’m not & never was in a position to afford them. I’m not saying I agree with Sinn Feinn’s proposals because I don’t agree with them. I also don’t think anyone should be taxed half their wages but I do think a couples income should be taxed as one & that multinationals should be paying a lot more in corporate tax but our government are too busy currying favour with them to close the loopholes that allow them to get away with it. Artists & the gambling industry should be paying a lot more in tax too. I’m not claiming to be an expert but these are things that need to be changed.
@Cindy Crawford: Thanks for the clarification. Your original comment above was about _not_ considering somebody on 100K+ to be middle class. That is what I was responding to. You further “clarified” your original post in a later comment by doubling (!) the amount to 200K. I strongly disagree with your original post and gave an example of how somebody earning 100K in a family could very easily be middle class if not stretched.
If moving out of Dublin and being told not having kids are potential solutions to the issue of the above family despite the money being earned, then I do agree that taxation and similar have to change, just how is the question. However, I am glad that we are more in agreement than I originally thought!
@Fred Jetson: don’t you think that’s more than a little presumptuous of you? How do you presume to know what others earn, pay in taxes or how they contribute to society? Accumulating wealth while fellow citizens go without is the hallmark of what passes for success in this sick economic model we are a part of. Hard to say which is more nauseating, your arrogance or your ignorance
@Jason Dolan: I doubled the amount for a couple earning 100,000 each which can happen. I’m not trying to pi*s anyone off but there are people earning a lot less than 100,000 who have to pay for all of the things you mentioned above.
@Paul P O’Sullivan: point taken paul red mist came down,
So basically if you’re lucky enough to earn 100k plus, Sinn Fein are going to take two thirds of what you earn over 100k off you. Muppets.
@Reg: 100k X 3.5 = 350k
You don’t get too many houses in Dublin for that these days. 100k isn’t that much any more
@Morgan Freeman: I shouldn’t have used the word lucky. Normally those earning 100k plus work bloody hard for it.
@Reg:
It’s petty class envy, that’s all it is. Punish those who get ahead. I really despise those Shinners and their ilk.
@Fred Jetson: I don’t earn anything near 100k but I don’t begrudge anyone who does unlike Sinn Fein and many of their supporters. The government shouldn’t take more than half your salary at any income level.
@Fred Jetson: tax the crap out of the poor so is the mantra Fred is it?
@Reg: where are you pulling the 66% tax from reg? Your arse perhaps?
@Hardly Normal: Someone on 100k already pays a marginal tax rate of 52%. Sinn Fein want to add 7% to that and also increase PRSI for those earning over 100k. That’s going to bring the marginal rate to 60% plus….not too far off the two thirds mark.
@Reg: We both know marginal rates are meaningless. The effective rate of tax is whats actually taken off you.
@Reg: with incentives, breaks and returns you’ll see a lot less than 60 taken from you.
@The Risen:
And we both know that Reg meant to say effective when he wrote marginal in that comment.
@Hardly Normal:
What incentives and breaks? A standard PRSI employee pays the full whack of tax on their income.
@Nick Allen: “And we both know that Reg meant to say effective when he wrote marginal in that comment.”
Sounding a lot like you and reg are the same person ‘nick’.
@The Risen: shinnerbot would you say that your paranoia is getting better or worse?
@Nick Allen: ship loads go have a look on the tax office website and see what you can claim back.
@jose mosse: Trollbot!
It’s easy to be in favour of taxes that won’t affect you.
@The Risen:
Surely you are the other Mensa members at SF can come up with a better retort than that. However, if your little mind wants to believe that Reg and I are the same person then that is fine with me. If you feel better having your own little conspiracy theories then I hope it makes you happy.
@Nick Allen: I’d put a few quid on it being true, yourself reg and Fred all the same.
@Nick Allen: What happened to DF?
@Hardly Normal: “tax the crap out of the poor”
An Irish resident on €18k pay 6.5 times LESS income tax than a Swedish resident on the same income.
They pay 8 times less income tax than a French person.
They pay 9 times less tax than a German.
All per the award winning Journal –
http://www.thejournal.ie/factcheck-money-tax-bills-3606473-Sep2017/
@Reg: we love to pay more tax. Banana economics
@The Risen:
I don’t know what DF is.
@Brinster: As I asked before on a Journal article, what services do the French & the Swedish & any other European citizens on low incomes get for paying higher taxes than we do in Ireland. There’s no point in saying they pay higher taxes if their garbage collection, childcare or other services are provided by the government/local authorities. You have to compare like with like.
@Brinster: the award winning journal , do you work for them haha sad….. All those countries you mentioned have a fantastic set-up , decent public transport. People get value for their money. We don’t get value for the tax at all..
@Brinster: you forget the cost of rent, petrol, public, transport , food , drink , clothes, water, your house, they’re all taxed too , did you take that into consideration??
You can say whatever you want when you don’t have to implement it. Just appeal to your base and look like you’re interested.
“Tax the rich, free stuff for the not rich”
@Morgan Freeman:
According to Revenue’s “Ready Reckoner” – and here is the link –
http://www.revenue.ie/en/corporate/information-about-revenue/statistics/ready-reckoner/index.aspx
The Top 6% of Irish earners already contribute HALF of the total Income Tax and USC collected and
The Top 1% of earners already pay ONE QUARTER all IT + USC collected.
But SF thinks they should pay more…………
@Morgan Freeman:
This “plan” would be the final nail in the Irish Health Service.
Every hospital consultant would up and leave immediately if they had to pay an extra 7% tax.
SF could increase health spending all they wanted – there’d be no doctors left.
@Brinster: Sinn Fein politicians were never good at arithmatic apart from paying their wages into the party coffers. They say that their budget is costed but we all know what that means when it comes to making the economy woek for everyo
@Chris Kirk: Funny isn’t it? That SF called out Michael ‘fiscal space’ Noonan’ figures.
@Chris Kirk: poor Chris, are you ok hun? Sinn Feins proven and costed budget (by the Department of Finance) always stack up! Have you evidence to the contrary? They certainly caught Noonan out on his comical economics.
@Brinster: Income tax is not the only way people pay revenue. Tax is taken out of everything we buy, there’s the USC & property tax. The government are now implementing a sugar tax because they’re supposedly concerned about obesity but the revenue collected from that is not going to be earmarked for health care because the government want to be able to spend it as & when they deem it necessary which just goes to show they’re not concerned about obesity levels at all.
@Father Hody Commody: Time for the history books is it, I don’t see anything at all funny about Sinn Fein….
@Ian Walsh: They can produce all the ‘costed’ budgets they like, but they still are not in government. The time to judge a budget is after it has been officially announced, not the week before….
@Morgan Freeman: Exactly, plain to see that Gerry Adams doesn’t have a clue about ecconomics so he gets his side-kick to draw up a so called ‘costed’ budget plan. Fools for being taken in by it, these people are a bunch of chancers…..
@Morgan Freeman: tax the rich, free stuff for everybody including the rich and for people who dodge taxes. And slab.
It looks good , very similar to what Corbyn came up with and look at the support he gained. It speakes to the masses.
@Hardly Normal:
Masses? SF got a whopping 13.5% of the vote in the last election. It speaks at the masses but the masses thankfully won’t listen to nonsense.
@Fred Jetson: well obviously it doesn’t apply to you… We know you won’t have anything to do with sinn féin, and we know you’ll be on these threads trying to kick down anything other than what fine Gael say and do..
@Acedeuce: the best place for shinner policies is the bin
@Fred Jetson: that figure will keep rising buddy and your fg pals will be begging them to join them in government before long.
@Fred Jetson: if you want to go to mass that’s your own business I am sure they are in your com
@jose mosse: same place as Fine Gael, Fianna Fáil and Labour election promises then?
@Hardly Normal: Corbyn is not in government and speaking to the masses is what politicians do when they want to hear themselves talk, action speaks louder than words….
How is it at a cost of €440m if it shouldn’t have been implemented in the first place. The government in this country have it like a dictatorship not a democracy
@shane: Moving from a system where we had to pay all property tax in an up front lump sup to an annual system made complete sense. It also stopped the heavy penalising of people who had to move house for work or family reasons.
@shane: you really have no idea of life, the world or society if you think Ireland resembles a dictatorship. We do know however, that if SF came to power Ireland would resemble present day Venezuela as they support and promote maduro
@Michael Geraghty:
You’re a firm believer that Irish politics delivers a form of democracy that ensures we shall be governed no better than we deserve. I.e. the Fine Gael and/or Fine Fail back slapping glitterati.
That’s the saddest part of it.
@shane: LPT is a local government tax used to pay councillors wages, better it there were only half the numbers of councillors in the first place and every household pay into it instead of just home owners.
@Chris Kirk: No Chris. It’s offloaded into Irish Water.
@Reg: Sorry Reg, can’t tax “Life Essentials” like for instance shelter i.e Family Homes. Ask a Societist or even a half educated Economist.
Italy scrapped its LPT in Dec 2015, France about to …
Logical extension of (LPT) taxing Family Homes is to tax, food, air, water, shelter, medicines, cloths, children’s shoes!, health care, education etc … notice no VAT in your Bank Charges statement … try putting LPT/VAT on banks before peoples homes. FTT badly due in Ireland.
Paying for efficiently supplied public services such as footpaths, street lighting, water services … no problem … just issue bills.
@shane: doesn’t suit you Shane. Get all the rich people to pay.
@Father Hody Commody: Is it only home owners who drink water, what about the rest of the population paying for something….
“7% special levy on incomes over €100,000 (which would raise €662 million).”
No it really wouldn’t, as the country would become uncompetitive, executives would leave the country and investment would decrease. The total tax raised would probably actually fall from such a tax rise.
A tax on betting is not a bad idea though. Betting profits should be heavily taxed.
@Fred Jetson: Exactly, companies would have to pay executives a far higher gross, costing them far more than other neighbouring countries. Sinn Fein don’t think of these things.
@Reg:
Either does any hard left party including Corbyn. They just don’t get the idea of mobile internaitonal capital at all.
@Fred Jetson: hundreds of thousands of educated folk already left the country.
@Fred Jetson: People on higher incomes tend to have more expensive larger houses and are paying large amounts of property tax. Sinn Fein budget would abolish property tax and therefore cancel out the increase of 7 cent increase in the EURO on earnings over a 100k. As for the highly paid leaving the country i doubt that would happen as most other developed countries have high taxes, but of course better management and accountability for the taxes raised. Maybe if the taxpayers were to see better more efficient use of the high taxes they pay, they might not be so reluctant to pay them. There is willful waste of taxpayers money by an incompetent political class and state apparatus, and maybe just maybe the Shinners in a Government would wake up the establishment and Status Quo, and show them up for what they are incompetent, cute hoors, not capable of running a modern technological 21 century economy.
@Mr Phil Officer: WHY
Was this on Waterfordwhispers or is it a real Sinn Fein story?
@alphanautica: Considering yourself and the usual dozen or so FG fanbois appeared together on the comments section at the same time, I’m fairly sure its a Sinn Fein story.
@The Risen: Remember when you said Government plans to increase the old age pension, etc was an attempt to buy the vote? What’s your view now SF are offering SW increases too? You must be outraged!
@Honeybadger197: now dont do that shinnerbots dont like being reminded of their hypocrisy
@Honeybadger197: everyone deserves a raise, probably the people on the breadline more so.
@The Risen: Having enough brain power to see through a Sinn Féin finance proposal does not automatically make somebosy an FG “fan boi”.
@Ne: Well then, give us the full summation of it and how you ‘saw through’ it.
The shinners will only cripple the working class with taxes and give everything to people that contribute nothing to society.no thanks
@dick dastardly: Silly comment. You know a lot of working class people on €100,000+, do you? SF will put money in the vast majority of homeowners pockets.
@The Risen: bull!
@Paddy: So, getting rid of the LPT will somehow result in homeowners being worse off?
@The Risen: why is it that as soon as it comes to numbers everyone just laughs at you shinners LOL
@dick dastardly: That seems fair, FG have crippled the middle class, so surely it has to be the working classes turn.
@jose mosse: Don’t forget to keep up to date on if you are on your final warning here for being a bold little boy with your hate speech.
@The Risen: Thats what Stalin said before he filled the gaols instead……
@The Risen: most people on 100k work very hard for it.
Bet their sums are arseways again!
@john murphy: that was FF and their back of a brown envelope calculations
@john murphy: The figures used by SF budget submissions are fully costed by the Department of Finance. They were also the people calculating the fiscal space correctly when noonan made a hames of it.
@john murphy: but if they got rid of property tax would that not attract investors and funds to invest in tax free properties in Ireland, exacerbating the housing crisis or am I missing something?
@Deborah Behan:
You’re not missing anything. Its par for the course for SF to miss implications of their financial plans. The poor lambs know they will never get an opportunity to put them into effect so they just make up some clickbait to appeal to their voting base, they don’t need to over analyse their ideas
@Deborah Behan: Nope. The vultures already used a charity loophole to avoid their tax obligations, and in relation to the LPT they can just build it into the rental price using other loopholes.
@The Risen: its a shinner budget, that’s why everyone ignores it. That will never change
@jose mosse: Come on tell us how many troll accounts do you have little boy ?
@Nick Allen: the property is a low percentage of overall cost of landlord or ownership. This is al SF are looking to drop from what I can see anyway
@Sam Bartell: And Noonan, and Coveney. And who corrected them? Why, SF.
@The Risen: jam today, jam tomorrow!
@The Risen: almost 3 years to the day more or less the same SF clowns with the same stupid smiles and glossy folders were promising the sun moon and stars underwritten by, amongst other things a 73% tax rate. I swear they couldn’t recite the 12 times tables with or without the help of the dept of finance. Wouldn’t be long shutting down the country.
http://www.thejournal.ie/sinn-fein-73-per-cent-tax-1717283-Oct2014/
@Debroah Behan..
Yes you are missing something. They are proposing a property tax for owning more than one home.
So that sorts out the vulture funds, who, by the way were welcomed in by FG/FF/LAB with dirty little tax incentives, but that was ok right?
@Hardly Normal: eh for the record in 2005 The Sinn Féin Ard Fheis Dublin passed a resolution demanding the immediate release of the killers of Garda Jerry McCabe. In 2009, pearse mccauley was released and collected by Martin mcguinness. At 2010 Sinn Féin Ard Fheis he received a standing ovation. So yes they support murders.
@Michael Geraghty: as did FF and the Blueshirts before them
@Gus Sheridan: no they didn’t.
Never going to vote for a paramilitary. Are Shinners on drugs? Ireland isn’t a failed state yet
Seems like a fairly reasonable budget that would fix a lot of the problems in the public sector and put the country on a right footing that it badly needs, fg ff and labour have destroyed ordinary people over the years with their lies and cuts
@Casper: Yeah, throwing 100 million at a health spend of over 13 billion should see overnight results. Chiggidy check yourself!
@Honeybadger197: lol
@Honeybadger197: no bit I could pay nurses decent wages and get the odd machine or two fixed..
@Hardly Normal: but it
@Hardly Normal: I thought you were offering your own cash there. :)
Property tax was the unfairest tax ever implemented in this country, I have yet to understand why. Househowners were victims by a greedy government to an easily collected tax.
@Catherine Mc: We always had a property tax in the form of high stamp duty rates which penalised people who had to move house heavily. While the current system is not perfect it is actually fairer than high stamp duty rates.
@Catherine Mc:
The property tax is probably one of the fairest taxes in the country. You only pay it if you own a property and the amount paid is related to the value of the property. Furthermore, if you don’t live in the property and have it as an investment then you a higher rate. 80% of the property tax is paid directly to the council which the property is located in and the council spend the funds raised on maintaining the local area.
@Reg:
Reg and Nick Allen,I paid stamp duty when buying my home, also had to pay ground rent to some foreign landlord. How could anyone say it’s a fair tax when two similar households in two different parts of the country pay vastly different property taxes ?
@Nick Allen: A fair tax? It would be fair if anyone that lives in a property whether council or private would pay it, now thats a fair tax.
@Catherine Mc: As I already said our property tax is not perfect and needs tweeking. But it is fairer that what preceeded it.
@Catherine Mc:
I paid stamp duty and now I pay property tax. When a new tax system in introduced there will always be people who suffer more than others.
@Reg: What preceded it?
@AJ:
The property tax should be paid for by the owner of the property. If it is a council tax then the person living will be paying rent to the council. I am assuming that people living in council houses are less well off than home owner (in theory they should be) so I have no problem not charging them property tax
@Maire: High stamp duty rates.
@Nick Allen: So a guy that pays a mortgage of lets say 1200 per month pays property tax for the upkeep of the area around his home. Guy next door pays lets say 400, uses the same roads, green areas etc yet pays nothing? People like yourself are whats wrong with this world, EVERYONE should be paying for amenities. And im betting your assumption is wrong as i know a few families that can afford to go on breaks abroad while idiots like myself struggle every month.
@AJ: i mean guy next door in council house
@AJ: I would be favour of the French system where there are two taxes, an owner and an occupier. If you’re the owner and occupier then you pay both, if you rent then you just pay one.
@AJ:
If a person is paying 1200 a month on a mortgage working their nuts off then I don’t believe that the house next door should be a council house in the first place. I am all for people paying their way and I don’t like the nanny social welfare system in this country as it is exploited by too many. However, I have sympathy for the genuine person and I am happy to not penalise them too heavily
@AJ: what amenities AJ , we’ve shocking public transport and the roads are in terrible shape, It’s communities and the likes of tidy towns that tend to the visible side of things.
@Nick Allen: Thats what i mean, sorry. I dont believe they should pay a full LPT but without doubt a contribution, 100 eur per year even. Anything!!
@Hardly Normal: I know, but if ive noe, then the guy next door hasnt any so he should contribute to nothing too ;)
@AJ:
Yes I agree a contribution would be good
@Catherine Mc: You’re right, as no other country in the world ever introduced a property tax.
@Catherine Mc: don’t forget the thugs that were let off the leash:
Phil Hogan (we will turn your water to a trickle)
Josephine Fehily (you don’t want a tax audit now do you?)
Paul McSweeney. Hogan’s Rottweiler.
Oh yes, this lot really ramped up the threats. And where are they now? Nice little earners and probably a couple of pensions as well.
@Father Hody Commody:
Precisely, simply sick of this country, tax working class people until they drop dead.
SF dont have enough power to force a fart never mind implement a policy LOL
@jose mosse: Did you have your post removed for being a bold boy talking about murder and not the budget?
@JJ Sharkey: Loving the dozen or so usual suspects running around every SF related article like headless chickens telling us how irrelevant SF are.
@The Risen: jose mosse must have a history here of being a bold little immature boy.
@The Risen: SF must be doing and saying something right. Just look at the fraperoom with their knickers in such a twist.
So “Paying a Fair Share” means increase tax on higher earners by 7% and increasing employers PRSI on these people and reducing tax for the lower earners.
@Nick Allen: Low incomes are already taxed very lightly here. Someone on 18k pays less than 3% in income tax, USC and PRSI here. Up north you’d be paying over 10%.
@Reg:
Yes, it is crazy how small the tax net is in this country and team Mensa at DF want to reduce it even further. All they promise is free stuff and they still can’t get into power. It does show the intelligence of the Irish electorate.
@Nick Allen: ‘and team Mensa at DF’
LOL!
@The Risen:
What’s DF?
Half of the people working in this country (1.3m) have an effective tax rate of only 3.68% between them.
That is just not sustainable.
SF thinks they’re in government in waiting……for sake, Ireland must not be run by thugs!
@Thosj Carroll: party full of bullies!
@Thosj Carroll: “Ireland must not be run by thugs!”
Pay twice for your water or it will be turned down to a trickle
Vote the way we want or your old age pensions are at risk
That sort of stuff?
@Thosj Carroll: Ireland has been run by thugs for years pal. Far too expensive a place to have a decent life anyway.
@Thosj Carroll: No, we don’t want the likes of Fistscuffs Feighan. Or Mr. Glass Conlon. No sirreee, we don’t want thugs in government.
There’s a big difference between a single person earning €100,000 and someone supporting a large family of 5 or 6 people on the same salary, especially if they’re also trying to put children through college.
@Steve B: The Single Person pays twice the Income Tax as a Married Couple! So, who pays the College Fees?
@Maire: the
@Maire: the married couple an additional credit- hardly twice
The family home tax was an immoral to begin with, they will get my vote.
Its like something one would read on waterford whispers PMSL
@jose mosse: PMSL LOL…Another new account? looks like its been flagged already.
I want the bank debt wrote off!
@JJ Sharkey: so do I but I live in the real world
@Paddy: I’m just putting forward my proposal, it will get as much attention from FG as shall the SF proposal.
@JJ Sharkey: think your using the wrong format, maybe you should contact a member of the Dail instead of the comment section in the journal. I do however support the idea of writing off the bank debt, be great that
@Paddy: Actually I would need to contact the Bundestag for anything to do on this matter as it doesn’t fall under the control of this government/Dail. It was also very kind of the Bundestag to oversee our budgets over the last number of years.
@JJ Sharkey: was so very nice of Merkel to help us out in our time of need. I’m sure they will be keeping a very close eye on any future budgets
@Paddy: Yes I am sure the Bundestag shall continue to keep an eye on our budgets until the stupid paddies have paid for something that has nothing to do with them – Michael Noonan
No other party will offer a fairer budget.
@Mr Phil Officer: pmsl
@Paddy: do you p1ss yourself often?
What a waste of good paper. SF will not be in power in the Dail anyway and do let them dream away. They have an opportunity to be in power in NI and they turn their backs to it. So really they are powerless at present.
@Irish big fellow: Bit of a simplistic summary there Big Fellow. People don’t lap that up anymore.
Yes, yes, yes, it’s the most unfair Tax conceivable!
Sinn Fein should be abolished for continuously coming up with ludicrous policies. They should try honesty as a policy, it would be more pertinent and they should put Mary Lulu to the back of the crass class.
Sounds great property tax is too high and takes no account of ability to pay like Thatcher poll tax….No tax for people under €20000…However no mention of promise for extra €3 billion a year for HSE that they promised last year……Like an old style FF budget what could possibly go wrong with it….???
So 702 million on social housing but only 428 on affordable housing??
My God , the FG trolls flat out…
☺☺☺☺☺☺☺☺☺☺☺☺
The Property tax was brought in to pay more money to the bank to cover the money gambled by them , you were already giving them. Disgusting tax , considering the homeless crisis .. I or my family will never give a vote to FF FG Liebour again..
Clueless Populist Shinnernomics 101.
Every socialist party in Europe supports a tax on property, the largest asset and greatest source of wealth for most people.
@Diarmuid: a tax on property (in this strict application, just a person’s home) is very regressive. It always hits the lower and middle earners the most.
Look in the US at states that have no income tax like Texas, Florida, and Alaska. They have very high and regressive property taxes.
They always complain about having to pay taxes to the federal government. Then when a tragedy happens, (like Hurricanes Harvey or Irma) they go crying to the same government looking for aid.
The majority of the super wealthy and their wealth is not in property but in stocks and bonds. Why aren’t stocks and bonds ever included in these so-called property taxes? They are property after all.
If you earn €100,000 and you’re single, you pay an effective rate of tax of 39%.
If you earn €100,000 and you’re married, you pay an effective tax rate of 36%.
At current rates, you pass the 50% threshold on income tax (including PRSI and USC) when you earn 1) €644,000 if you’re single and 2) €817,000 if you’re married.
Sinn Fein’s proposal will change it in the following way:
If you’re single, you will pass the 50% income tax threshold (including PRSI and USC) when you earn €221,000
If you’re married, you will pass the 50% threshold when you earn €260,000.
It’s a quandary because on one hand I hate paying property tax but on the other hand I am aware that Sinn Féin are economically illiterate and this a gimmick to impress the easily impressed and the lazy.
Jaysus,
Not even Fine Gael, whose supporters pay the most property tax, would suggest this!
Weren’t the Shinners supposed to be leftish?
@Ciaran O’Mara: well Mary lou was recently compared to marie le pen
SF wouldn’t run a bath. What have they achieved up The North. Nothing only chaos. The people in The North have had no major increase in living standards in the last 20 years, why trust them gown here.
Ye it’s a joke taking it from my wages it’s theft revenue is a joke
Sweet Jesus the
Special
Communications
Unit
Mangement
Are all over this like a plague of locusts!
They must be really afraid of Sinn Fein getting in!
There should be a tax on property but the LPT needs to be modified so as not to impact so severely on those with limited incomes.
LPT can play a valuable role in depressing property values and in contribution to price stability.
Traditionally, LPT type taxes are seen as having a valuable redistributive effect in an unequal society and it is social democratic to pursue equalizing measures.
What needs to be done is a root and branch assessment of where the LPT has adverse effects, for example in some cases contributing to mortgage arrears for thosde who bought at or near peak prices.
@Fiona deFreyne: Sorry Fiona, can’t tax “Life Essentials” like for instance shelter i.e Family Homes. Ask a Societist or even a half educated Economist.
Italy scrapped its LPT in Dec 2015, France about to …
Logical extension of (LPT) taxing Family Homes is to tax, food, air, water, shelter, medicines, cloths, children’s shoes!, health care, education etc … notice no VAT in your Bank Charges statement … try putting LPT/VAT on banks before peoples homes. FTT badly due in Ireland.
Paying for efficiently supplied public services such as footpaths, street lighting, water services … no problem … just issue bills.
It seems a bit of a joke Sinn Fein producing a ‘costed’ budget proposal for the Republic when they couldn’t (and wouldn’t be trusted) run a raffle in the North.
Sinn Fein are right … you can’t tax “Life Essentials” like for instance shelter i.e Family Homes. Ask a Societist or even a half educated Economist.
Italy scrapped its LPT in Dec 2015, France about to …
Logical extension of (LPT) taxing Family Homes is to tax, food, air, water, shelter, medicines, cloths, children’s shoes!, health care, education etc … notice no VAT in your Bank Charges statement … try putting LPT/VAT on banks before peoples homes. FTT badly due in Ireland.
Paying for efficiently supplied public services such as footpaths, street lighting, water services … no problem … just issue bills … rural home owners excluded.
Have to say the property tax was an own goal by the government. Landlords passed on this tax to tenants and then some which has contributed to the current housing issue particularly in Dublin. The money recouped by this tax has not been reinvested sufficiently in housing.
Id say the fg blueshirts have been creaming themselves watching the francoesque mob batter men women and teens in spain.harping back to the water debacle they lost.blueshirt murderers
Poor deluded Sinn Fein economics, always there downfall….
@Damian Clarke: What about Troika economics or the IMF economics, those are scary… Merkel told the government here to bring in property tax and they did?
I suspect there’d be a lot less support for this nonsense in the comments section if the number of comments people were allowed to post was proportional to the amount of tax they actually pay
@General Shit Talking: They already paid that through the road tax anyway lol. I think the self employed pay the most tax?
@Fred Jetson: does mass suicide count?
Wasn’t the property tax just to help out with the bill from the austerity that lay at the foot of Merkel, who turned bank debt into tax payers debt?
When you tax anything like a home then it means you never really own it, doesn’t it.
Once the property tax isn’t a gateway to the U.N. Agenda 21, we signed in the 90s to?
https://sustainabledevelopment.un.org/content/documents/25918ireland.pdf
https://sustainabledevelopment.un.org/content/documents/Agenda21.pdf
Some fear that Agenda 21 will give governments more control over peoples property under the mask of the environment and sustainability but who knows??? But how does Agenda 21 effect the property tax now and those who refuse to pay iy, is one question?
“7.9. The following activities should be undertaken: a. As a first step towards the goal of providing adequate shelter for all, all countries should take immediate measures to provide shelter to their homeless poor, ”
” People should be protected by law against unfair eviction from their homes or land;”
“Providing specific assistance to the poorest of the urban poor through, inter alia, the creation of social infrastructure in order to reduce hunger and homelessness, and the provision of adequate community services; ”
Just a thought?
http://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX:12012P/TXT
“Article 7
Respect for private and family life
Everyone has the right to respect for his or her private and family life, home and communications.”
“Article 17
Right to property
1. Everyone has the right to own, use, dispose of and bequeath his or her lawfully acquired possessions. No one may be deprived of his or her possessions, except in the public interest and in the cases and under the conditions provided for by law, subject to fair compensation being paid in good time for their loss. The use of property may be regulated by law in so far as is necessary for the general interest.
2. Intellectual property shall be protected.”
Funny really, raise taxes where people have a choice and drop the ones that are unavoidable. If betting tax goes up , less betting so how can they claim how much the raise would net? Also, make a lifestyle choice to keep your salary under 100k, avoid overtime, promotion , bonus incentives etc.
abolish the USC, after all it’s us workers most impacted by it, helping get the country back on it’s feet. We too are the 1 group of people constantly ignored and hit the most in every budget since the recession
some comments on here, still in the auled fiscal jacket there SF though with that budget, def not as bad as the crap fffg are shoveling but if you are using them as a benchmark its a low bar to jump
Is that the actual Gerry Adams, or a waxwork replica?
Rather spoils the photo op!
As for the policy, wouldn’t believe it if was signed in blood, even their own.
But let’s not go there, again.
have your say