Advertisement

We need your help now

Support from readers like you keeps The Journal open.

You are visiting us because we have something you value. Independent, unbiased news that tells the truth. Advertising revenue goes some way to support our mission, but this year it has not been enough.

If you've seen value in our reporting, please contribute what you can, so we can continue to produce accurate and meaningful journalism. For everyone who needs it.

RollingNews.ie

State exams are a rote learning memory test and aren't serving our children's future needs

Our education system must deliver a quality education that prepares each child for their future lives, writes Geoffrey Browne.

THE CURRENT SYSTEM primarily based on ‘one-off testing’ – namely Junior and Leaving Certificate examinations – reflects more as a memory test suited to rote learning rather than genuinely assessing a student’s learning, knowledge, ability or acumen for a subject.

Many studies and informed discussions suggest that on-going assessment has a significant value towards students learning and engagement while also being a better tool to establish the true depth of a student’s knowledge.

Through nurturing a student’s strengths and interests, our education system can create self-motivated thinkers who learn and understand the benefits of discovery through research and evaluation.

Assessment methods should enable and examine a student’s true depth of knowledge, overall ability and critical thinking on an on-going basis.

‘Exam anxiety can be devastating’ 

The current system of evaluation maximises stress on students who often memorise to regurgitate in a moment and then forget. It does little for many towards assisting their learning or retained knowledge.

Once-off examination can be brutal instruments undertaken at a particularly stressful time in most children’s lives and does not sufficiently assess a student’s overall performance and learning during their time at school.

From the calls received from parents and students it would appear that exam anxiety is a very common reality in teenagers and can be quite devastating.

Significant stress in teenage students occurs as a result of the anxiety caused by the current method of assessment and the pressurised study regime that derives from it.

Educational or work opportunities associated with the outcome of the exam, the students’ self-esteem with regards to their grades and judgements from friends, family and teachers in relation to their performance are amongst the main causes of stress in teenagers reported to us.

Comparisons to friends and siblings based on once off exam results are also feared. Let us not forget that the stress the students are under can and does reflect on their families as well.

‘Current system not fully serving our children’

Some changes have already been made and certain subjects already utilise forms of continuous assessment and project works and, where this is the case, there is wide acceptance of the benefits towards fairness and better evaluation.

Our curriculum and method of assessment should be evaluated on an on-going basis to ensure that our education system is fit for purpose and delivering fairly.

Changes, when made in subjects, curriculum and assessment methods etc need to be regularly reviewed to ensure that they actually deliver the benefits as envisaged and will require constant updating to retain relevance in today’s rapidly changing world and to ensure that Ireland remains to the fore in quality education.

The current examination methods are not fully serving our children to their maximum potential.

Our education system, curriculum and methods of assessment must be reviewed and changed where recommendations are identified to incorporate continuous assessment and to ensure that it is delivering what every child in our country deserves – a quality education that prepares them for their future lives.

The changes cannot happen overnight and significant investment will have to be injected in developing continuous assessment methods, teacher training\CPD whilst also ensuring the continuous assessments completed by students are free from plagiarism, are transferable for students changing school mid-cycle and are carried out in modern and fully equipped school environments.

For continuous assessment to be successful further investment in education is necessary. We owe it to our young people to ensure that best practice is continued to be employed in our assessment methods of their learning which ultimately benefits all the people of Ireland and our nation as a whole.

Geoffrey Browne lives in his native Donegal with his wife and five children is the President of the National Parents Council post primary  (NPCpp).

original

Close
81 Comments
This is YOUR comments community. Stay civil, stay constructive, stay on topic. Please familiarise yourself with our comments policy here before taking part.
Leave a Comment
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Charles Murr
    Favourite Charles Murr
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 6:36 AM

    It’s funny that so many of us went on to have well-adjusted normal lives and careers after it.

    458
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Andy K
    Favourite Andy K
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 6:38 AM

    @Charles Murr: Times are changing. Education needs to change too. The current system was designed for the industrial age. Time for an update.

    309
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Paul Whelan
    Favourite Paul Whelan
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 6:45 AM

    @Andy K: Agree totally. It was time for an update when I did it in the late 80s.
    Now that my kids are in the system, I just can’t believe how little has changed in 30 years.

    231
    See 11 more replies ▾
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Jack Jackson
    Favourite Jack Jackson
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 7:22 AM

    @Charles Murr: Can you provide facts and figures about our “well adjusted normal lives and careers” or is that a guess based on a wild assumption?

    59
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Paul Gurney
    Favourite Paul Gurney
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 9:16 AM

    @Charles Murr: I beg to differ…the reason this country doesnt do good planning is because of all the civil servants who qualified on a GOOD LEAVING CERT …an exam passed by learning a raft of stuff off by heart but which teaches nothing about problem solving or indeed thinking outside the box…if its not in the book they dont know what to do.

    62
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Alfred Pennyworth
    Favourite Alfred Pennyworth
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 10:12 AM

    @Charles Murr: yeah best to leave it the way it is who cares if teenage suicide is on the increase

    24
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Walt Jabsco
    Favourite Walt Jabsco
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 10:54 AM

    @Alfred Pennyworth:
    If the junior/leaving certs are the same as they always have been but teenage suicides are on the rise, then logic tells us that other factors are also at play.

    41
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Charles Murr
    Favourite Charles Murr
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 11:30 AM

    @Walt Jabsco: I don’t think Alfred could process that deduction Walt..

    10
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Dave O'Mahony
    Favourite Dave O'Mahony
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 12:10 PM

    @Paul Gurney: which subjects can you get a good result in just by ‘learning a raft of stuff’? It may have changed since 2001, but when I did the leaving there was only history & geography that required mostly recall. Languages required the ability to interpret what was being said & respond in a coherent way. Maths & science subjects require understanding, & the ability to apply that understanding to problems. English required critical analysis of literature (and yes, some verbatim learning of the poems covered was needed for paper 2).
    I get that it’s a lot of pressure for teenagers, but they do still need to grow up some time

    38
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute thatsnotme
    Favourite thatsnotme
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 1:06 PM

    @Charles Murr: and Charles so many didn’t

    6
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Ron North
    Favourite Ron North
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 7:49 PM

    @Charles Murr: Not me Charlie, I’m insane, have been for years. HAHAHAHAHAHA!!! HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! AHAHAHAHA!!

    1
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Walt Jabsco
    Favourite Walt Jabsco
    Report
    Mar 13th 2018, 12:30 AM

    @Charles Murr:
    He obviously never learned critical thinking – I blame the leaving cert….

    3
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Paul Jennings
    Favourite Paul Jennings
    Report
    Mar 13th 2018, 1:10 AM

    @Paul Whelan: 45 more like…

    1
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Dessie Deratta
    Favourite Dessie Deratta
    Report
    Mar 14th 2018, 12:42 AM

    @Walt Jabsco: Indeed.

    I guess he was one of those who struggled with exams!

    1
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Cheeky Bums
    Favourite Cheeky Bums
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 6:43 AM

    Same opinions were being peddled when i did JC in 1997 and LC in 2000. These are basic level examinations that are supposed to give the student an idea of wheat areas they would like to work in once they leave school.. They are not designed to provide all the skills they are going to need to succeed in their careers.

    As for exam pressure / stress, what’s wrong with actually giving these kids a challenge? If you’re going to cruise through the education system doing little projects, you’re not going to be prepared for life outside. Gives them a bit of a shake!

    338
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute iohanx
    Favourite iohanx
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 6:59 AM

    @Cheeky Bums: Problem = Teaching Unions. Discuss.

    71
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute TheHeathen
    Favourite TheHeathen
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 7:03 AM

    @iohanx: All Junior Cert subjects are changing. Less exams, more projects, more continuous assessment, less pressure. One level for all which is a terrible idea and really won’t prepare them for the leaving, which will be changed. Discuss.

    119
    See 6 more replies ▾
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute TheHeathen
    Favourite TheHeathen
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 7:48 AM

    @neilo: As I said the Leaving will be changed in time. You cannot change an education system overnight. You have to start at first year, just like English five years ago. Most subjects have changed now, and unfortunately some students are being left behind because of common levels. Too hard for some, too easy for others. Change should be gradual to work out issues. One thing people forget about the Leaving is how fair it is. It is totally fair because of the anonymity, a red line for teachers who will not correct their students exams.

    30
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Ian McNally
    Favourite Ian McNally
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 8:22 AM

    @Cheeky Bums: “These are basic level examinations that are supposed to give the student an idea of wheat areas they would like to work in once they leave school” Yeah that is a complete lie, these archaic exams have nothing to do with post school careers at all.

    12
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute TheHeathen
    Favourite TheHeathen
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 8:25 AM

    @neilo: It is more to do with allegations that might be made, whereas now there can never be an issue. We need to keep it like this.

    11
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Cheeky Bums
    Favourite Cheeky Bums
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 8:30 AM

    @Ian McNally: You think so? What about the languages? Construction studies? The science subjects? Accounting? Engineering? Haha sure no one works in these industries at all??

    15
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Bruce Van der Gutschmitzer
    Favourite Bruce Van der Gutschmitzer
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 8:55 AM

    @Ian McNally: it’s the case everywhere tho. Alot/most ppl don’t study subject areas in third level that they did in secondary. The idea of second level education is to give a broad knowledge of many subjects and let them decide what direction they want to go in third level. As the sunscreen song goes “The best ppl I know, still don’t know what they want to do”

    13
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Donal Knight
    Favourite Donal Knight
    Report
    Mar 25th 2018, 9:06 AM

    @TheHeathen: Fewer exams. Q.E.D.

    1
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Andy K
    Favourite Andy K
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 6:42 AM

    My Irish class was just learning a bunch of essays off by heart and how to tell which essay to use for which question. Did not have to know what the essay was about.

    This was to maximise points in the LC.

    162
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Nick Allen
    Favourite Nick Allen
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 7:16 AM

    @Andy K:

    If you were as you were saying trying to maximise points then you would have been doing higher level Irish. You simply wouldn’t get away with not understanding the Irish questions properly, that’s just BS

    98
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Bruce Van der Gutschmitzer
    Favourite Bruce Van der Gutschmitzer
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 9:00 AM

    @Nick Allen: i did higher and thats essentially what i did. Lc is a memory game. You might not get 600 points but you can do well enough.

    46
    See 3 more replies ▾
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Nick Allen
    Favourite Nick Allen
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 9:04 AM

    @Bruce Van der Gutschmitzer:

    So you are saying that you did higher level Irish and didn’t know what the question meant. LOL

    17
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Paul Gurney
    Favourite Paul Gurney
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 9:20 AM

    @Nick Allen: I recall a student in secondary school in Chemistry class reciting a verse of an english poem he was so crammed with memory information…he went on to get the highest leaving cert result in ireland that year.Having a good memory equals a good leaving ..simple as…

    22
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Nick Allen
    Favourite Nick Allen
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 1:23 PM

    @Paul Gurney:

    Its not just about having a good memory, you need to read the material first in order to memorise it. You also need to understand it in order to be able to answer a question. If it is just down to memory then why do kids find it difficult to answer questions for homework even when they have the books in front of them?

    14
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Ranty McCrank
    Favourite Ranty McCrank
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 6:43 AM

    I can never understand why basic life skills such as CPR, food preparation, plumbing, car maintenance and operation were never thought to us in school. Maybe this has changed recently? Many many years spent on English literature and Irish civil war history which in my opinion was a real wasted opportunity. I saw a report from a Russian school recently where the children were soldering an electronic board.

    110
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Tadhg
    Favourite Tadhg
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 6:55 AM

    @Ranty McCrank: None of those are done across the board, but would be achieved in particular subjects. For example home economics would look at food preparation, and in physics you complete experiments with soldering.

    48
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Breda Jennings
    Favourite Breda Jennings
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 7:18 AM

    @Ranty McCrank: basic life skills and food prep are taught in Home Economics. (Amount many other things)
    Pity it’s not seen as an “essential subjects” in terms of maltriculation purposes.

    41
    See 2 more replies ▾
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Paul Gurney
    Favourite Paul Gurney
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 9:22 AM

    @Ranty McCrank: yeah i wish!!!!sure our mob of teachers find it hard to teach music or PE never mind fancy stuff like that…good luck in getting that past the unions

    5
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute thatsnotme
    Favourite thatsnotme
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 1:09 PM

    @Tadhg: food prep yes but no HACCP training which is just ridiculous

    1
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Micheal S. O' Ceilleachair
    Favourite Micheal S. O' Ceilleachair
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 7:00 AM

    Of course we can have all the brouhaha in the world about our education system. The reality is the government will never adequately fund what they think is needed. The teachers of this country have been our greatest asset down the years. People might gripe about the Junior and Leaving Certificate exams but everyone realizes these are fair assessments that have stood the test of time. And yes, what pupil does not cram!!

    79
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Walt Jabsco
    Favourite Walt Jabsco
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 7:16 AM

    @Micheal S. O’ Ceilleachair:
    Would you be prepared to have your taxes increased to improve funding levels, and if so by how much?

    22
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Nick Allen
    Favourite Nick Allen
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 7:19 AM

    @Walt Jabsco:

    I would be happy to have a 1% ‘education levy’

    18
    See 5 more replies ▾
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Brendan Mason
    Favourite Brendan Mason
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 8:55 AM

    @Nick Allen: if it goes to education fine. Not paying bank debt and fuelling junkets like Galway tents.

    14
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Nick Allen
    Favourite Nick Allen
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 9:05 AM

    @Brendan Mason:

    Obviously! The Lib Dems came up with that idea on the UK about 30 years but it never got through

    4
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Paul Gurney
    Favourite Paul Gurney
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 9:24 AM

    @Walt Jabsco: i would gladly have my taxes spent more efficiently to fund good education

    8
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Walt Jabsco
    Favourite Walt Jabsco
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 10:59 AM

    @Paul Gurney:
    Fair enough, but where would you make the cuts?

    2
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Nick Allen
    Favourite Nick Allen
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 11:50 AM

    @Walt Jabsco:

    Social welfare
    Incentivising people to work rather than stay unemployed
    HSE
    Corporate taxation

    7
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Shane Gleeson
    Favourite Shane Gleeson
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 8:17 AM

    Every exam that I’ve done post leaving cert has been rote learning as well. University and professional. LC teed me up nicely for them.

    66
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Patrick Kearns
    Favourite Patrick Kearns
    Report
    Mar 13th 2018, 6:11 PM

    @Shane Gleeson: Little boxes, little boxes… https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XUwUp-D_VV0

    1
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Andy K
    Favourite Andy K
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 6:44 AM

    The current process does not support creativity, rather the opposite. And as we are continually moving towards a more automated society the jobs in the future will require creativity above all else. The system needs to change in order to support that.

    57
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Liam H
    Favourite Liam H
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 6:52 AM

    @Andy K: if students want to be “creative”, they can do Art, Music, DCG etc.

    Some subjects require the students to have a basic body of knowledge before they can critically assess, chemistry for example.

    How did we all learn to tie our laces?
    Did we get creative with it?
    Or did we do it 100 times til we got it right?
    Throwing the word “rote learning” around like its a negative thing is a cop out for hard work.
    Being able to work hard is a life skill.

    Some parts of some subjects need to be learned off, other parts like graphing, interpreting dont.

    Catch all statements such as the one ftom the author of this article are inflammatory.

    138
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Andy K
    Favourite Andy K
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 7:51 AM

    @Liam H: You do not seem to understand the term Creative and autonomous.

    Autonomous will basically replace ‘hard labour’.

    And creativity is not just limited to art. Inventions require creativity. New apps require creativity. Intact, anything new requires creativity. That is going to be the greatest requirement in future careers, because the ‘hard work’ will be autonomous.

    28
    See 1 more reply ▾
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Shane Gleeson
    Favourite Shane Gleeson
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 8:19 AM

    @Liam H: Spot on

    13
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Fiona Anne Ní HOibicín
    Favourite Fiona Anne Ní HOibicín
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 10:39 AM

    For god sake people! I now work in a country where people have to pay e10,000 a year just for their kids to get a decent education, never mind a practically free, top class one in Ireland. Ireland has the third highest literacy levels in the WORLD. Look at all of your writing skills, did you think you licked it off a stone? No education system is perfect, exams are a vital part of third level and beyond.

    Irish people are working, and highly sought after all over the world because of our education systems, which do teach creativity and critical thinking skills, just not in exam years. You should research rote learning in other countries, and see what it really is, where parents literally pay for the grade the students get. Where unscrupulous profit run education companies take tens of thousands a year to dole out A’s to students who go on to fail in university. Yes, the system is flawed, show me one that is perfect. You are so lucky to live in a country where education (including third level) is an option for the majority of people, and teachers are generally of a high quality. Stop complaining, do your exam, and get a life, just like all of us had to do!

    71
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Ross Horgan
    Favourite Ross Horgan
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 10:41 AM

    @Fiona Anne Ní HOibicín: amen to that

    24
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Elizabeth Gregory
    Favourite Elizabeth Gregory
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 2:01 PM

    @Fiona Anne Ní HOibicín: I’m glad you’re happy @Fiona but I learned, to my horror that the amount of money a parent spends on grinds & extra classes outside of school, is definitely proportional to the success & high grades achieved their child in the LC. Anyone serious about getting high grades to ensure sufficient points for their preferred university course, ALL did extra grinds with one on one tutors or special cramming courses run by colleges specialising in exam techniques. The child with a sole or disabled parent or part of a family under financial distress is seriously compromised as a result. Ireland, just like many other countries in the world make parents pay (a lot) to ensure their children succeed at LC. Suggesting otherwise is simply closing your eyes to reality.

    14
    See 3 more replies ▾
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Declan D'Arcy
    Favourite Declan D'Arcy
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 3:32 PM

    @Elizabeth Gregory: As a student who just graduated, I never really saw much correlation between grinds and grades, and many who did them found them to be of limited benefit. The key to success is hard work. I have many friends who are now doing medicine and did no extra classes or grinds. Certainly to say that money is essential to high points is completely untrue.

    1
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Clare Bear
    Favourite Clare Bear
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 8:47 PM

    @Elizabeth Gregory: I come from one of these one parent financially distressed families …no grinds …no one to one tuition – 570 in my leaving certificate. Grinds are not a silver bullet , a neighbour of mine has her poor daughter in grinds for 5 subjects for LC – she’s only averaging a C grade across the board because you can throw money at a problem and give them all the notes you want but if she doesn’t sit down and learn it then she’s not getting an A. Yes grinds can be an advantage but having attended a DEIS school and worked in one as well at one point I’ve seen plenty of kids from disadvantaged backgrounds do really well in our education system without grinds through hard work alone – myself among them.

    12
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Patrick Kearns
    Favourite Patrick Kearns
    Report
    Mar 13th 2018, 6:37 PM

    @Clare Bear: There are always exceptions to the norm and they don’t disprove what Elizabeth is saying. On a level playing field, there will always be those who out perform the average and those who under perform.

    Back in the 80s, we used to have a top class education system, but no longer. Everybody knows Finland has the number one education system in the world and it’s also a fact that education is the number one financial investment anyone can make. Business, Government, or personal, education is the best return for your $/€/£ etc, etc. It’s a no brainer, so the real question is, why isn’t everyone copying Finland? We obviously are in dire need of politicians with better educations…

    1
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Ross Horgan
    Favourite Ross Horgan
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 10:40 AM

    People need to be aware that continuous assessment equals continuous stress and we are starting to see that in the new junior cycle as students begin the process of rolling from 1 CBA to the next. It will undoubtedly become an issue in the media over the next 12/18 months as parents are confronted with the problem. Exams can be stressful but so is life at the best of times, you cannot shelter people forever and the vast majority take it in their stride. As for learning off, the surgeon that operates on you, the pilot that flies a plane, the qualified accountant etc. etc have had to do a hell of a lot of learning off.

    48
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Patrick Kearns
    Favourite Patrick Kearns
    Report
    Mar 13th 2018, 6:25 PM

    @Ross Horgan: Ah but there’s only so far rote learning can get you. What use a surgeon who can’t spot a problem that doesn’t fit within the texts, whose knife would you prefer to be under? Test pilots need to be able to think outside the box while under enormous stress, without them, we’d still be flying around stuck in the weather while it takes weeks to get around the world. Who wouldn’t like an accountant who can actually find ways to save you money as they audit your business? How many of them have you met? I only know of one.

    The thing is, we are a hell of a lot more intelligent than we were a hundred years ago. The mean IQ of 100 is not the same as it was even 50 years ago because as the people everywhere become more intelligent with every generation, the mean has to be shifted to keep it at 100. The fact is, the human race is more intelligent than when the current system of learning was designed. We sorely need people who can think beyond their education so education needs to evolve to create this mindset or it will hold society back.

    4
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Yogi Béar
    Favourite Yogi Béar
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 8:25 AM

    As a student I chose all science and technical subjects for my leaving cert and while there was a degree of rote learning. Understanding the subject matter was required in order to guarantee top marks. I’d argue that these subjects should largely remain unchanged.
    Language subjects on the other hand were a travesty and are in definite need of reform. It was pretty much as some commentors have said learning off essays and lines. To this day I can only talk in pigeon French, and the Irish I picked up in the Gaeltacht didn’t help much in the Lc. English always confused me, while I enjoyed the subject I always wondered about the grading of the exam itself which is primarily a series of opinion pieces in various literary works.

    32
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute The Guru
    Favourite The Guru
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 7:00 AM

    We’ve known this for decades. How many more reports are required?

    26
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Declan
    Favourite Declan
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 8:01 AM

    @The Guru: Well said, after so long seeing maths and the sciences doing no so great why is there no will for a complete overhall. Some good work done but a lot more to do.

    7
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Gary
    Favourite Gary
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 8:19 AM

    “Some changes have already been made and certain subjects already utilise forms of continuous assessment and project works and, where this is the case, there is wide acceptance of the benefits towards fairness and better evaluation.”
    Unfortunately not for science.
    Current Junior Cert science: 35% for project work done in class in the form of experiments and 65% for the written exam. Now abolished for the following
    New Junior Cycle science: 10% project work and 90% written exam. A backward step.

    25
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Sean Conway
    Favourite Sean Conway
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 6:58 AM

    Ireland will always look after educating the already rich. nothing else matters.

    17
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Nick Allen
    Favourite Nick Allen
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 7:20 AM

    @Sean Conway: maybe time to get that chip off your shoulder

    57
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Jack Jackson
    Favourite Jack Jackson
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 7:23 AM

    @Nick Allen: Chip!? It’s a massive tree trunk of entitlement he’s got.

    31
    See 3 more replies ▾
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Sean Conway
    Favourite Sean Conway
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 9:50 AM

    @Jack Jackson: Entitlement for the upperclasses. lets look after them to keep the status quo.

    4
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Nick Allen
    Favourite Nick Allen
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 11:51 AM

    @Sean Conway:

    https://susi.ie

    4
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute ForeverFeel1ng
    Favourite ForeverFeel1ng
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 2:25 PM

    @Sean Conway: Ireland has the lowest proportion of private schools in the entire OECD.

    4
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Dave barrett
    Favourite Dave barrett
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 7:57 AM

    Come on now lads! I hope i wont hear anyone knocking Peig Sayers. A really important person to study for life or your achievements. LOL

    15
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Rathminder
    Favourite Rathminder
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 8:01 AM

    These examinations also test the school and its curriculum as well as one’s ability to go on to higher education. In the US, the SAT is given for university entrance readiness. The testing movement actually came out of identifying individual abilities for military service for WWII. It is high stress, but it’s the only method to date to identify abilities and achievement in specific areas.

    9
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Damon16
    Favourite Damon16
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 6:40 PM

    Nonsense. Many courses in college rely heavily on final exams esp. in the non-humanities courses . Moreover, passing ‘high stake’ exams are necessary to qualify to enter many of the professions e.g. law, medicine, accountancy etc – these are heavily based on rote memorization as well as on higher order skills . There’s a push, it seems, to promote critical thinking at the expense of gaining a solid knowledge base. You can’t learn to think critically unless you have a knowledge base to work off of. You see this in the US where they have being doing this for a good few years and what you get is young people who know nothing about history, geography and science etc but who have no qualms about expressing strong opinions about things of which they know nothing.

    11
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Irish big fellow
    Favourite Irish big fellow
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 9:24 AM

    All students have the year out in Transition Year. Let them make the best of it as regards life skills and get on with the rest of their studies in the meantime during the other years in second level. All language subjects should give a higher % of marks to the oral section. Students should not progress directly into 3rd level and should be required to work for a year to sample the real world of work.

    8
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute
    Favourite
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 3:05 PM

    This is excusing bad teaching and non focused parents from their responsibility to ensure the children under their care have a full and complete educational experience. The present system has created a bouyant, robust and positive economic situation with the skills of our younger generation being utilised to the full. Improvements can always be made but the examination process is tough, guess what it is meant to be.

    8
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute ForeverFeel1ng
    Favourite ForeverFeel1ng
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 2:23 PM

    Just make the final written exam only worth 50% of the grade in every subject and the rest is either continuous assessment or projects.

    It would be a start.

    4
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Neuville-Kepler62F
    Favourite Neuville-Kepler62F
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 2:27 PM

    Irish Education litmus test is the success / failures in Irish economy / society.

    Education should deliver a skilled competent ethical moral person capable of making informed good judgments in their person life, work life and re the broader community / society.

    Failures point to serious lack of well educated output from our schools and colleges ….

    - Banks … clearly incapable of making basic sound judgements – Central Bank!
    - Health Service …
    - Gardai … calamity
    - Housing (Government / Civil Service / County Managers / / Local authotities
    - Teaching Profession itself unable to reflect on its own performance and adapt appropriately looking at the failures …
    - Political System .. populated by poorly educated inadequates
    -

    Lots of successes of course but far outweighed by the disastrous failures impacting on Irish Society – 300,000 forced to leave – economic collapse – no homes – 2-Tier society.

    4
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Dessie Deratta
    Favourite Dessie Deratta
    Report
    Mar 14th 2018, 12:40 AM

    @Neuville-Kepler62F: All to do with how the sheeple vote…not how they were formally schooled.
    Even now, still, over 60% will vote FF/FG/Lab/Greens….in the hope that repeating the same thing over and over will get a different result…..

    1
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Phil Swan
    Favourite Phil Swan
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 10:15 AM

    Is this a history lesson? We’ve known this since the foundation of the state FFS.

    4
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Gerry Ryan deG
    Favourite Gerry Ryan deG
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 2:38 PM

    @Phil Swan: and the Teachers have known it as well

    1
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute sean o'dhubhghaill
    Favourite sean o'dhubhghaill
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 8:35 AM

    Don’t throw the baby out with the bathwater. Dead easy to just change the style of question!

    4
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Dessie Deratta
    Favourite Dessie Deratta
    Report
    Mar 14th 2018, 12:36 AM

    Bullocks!

    Rote-learning, cramming and coping with the pressure of existential exams served me very well….so what could be wrong with them? !

    1
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Thomas Sheppard
    Favourite Thomas Sheppard
    Report
    Mar 18th 2018, 12:23 PM

    Geoffrey,
    I agree with alot of your points. I believe that education is not and cannot be about superficial memorizing of facts and essays. It is however unfair to imply that this is universal for all LC subjects. Alot of people neglect the more balanced approach that has been taken for years in the practical subjects. These subject all have a significant coursework element, a minimum of 50/50 for most with a high emphasis on problem solving and real world application. My point is that there has been alot of good work done already to move away from the wrote learning approach that you speak of. It is important to acknowledge this and not to generalise, but to take what we have learned and expand it across the entire LC.

    1
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Dessie Deratta
    Favourite Dessie Deratta
    Report
    Mar 14th 2018, 12:48 AM

    Yeah…what we need is a system that will give everyone an A+ in every subject…

    Inclusivity means never having to say you’re stupid! You are just differently abled compared to the smarter or mentally tougher folk…

    1
    Install the app to use these features.
    Mute Number 33
    Favourite Number 33
    Report
    Mar 12th 2018, 8:52 PM

    Sounds about right

    1
Submit a report
Please help us understand how this comment violates our community guidelines.
Thank you for the feedback
Your feedback has been sent to our team for review.

Leave a commentcancel