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SINN FÉIN TD Carol Nolan has been suspended from the party after she voted against legislation to allow for the upcoming referendum on the Eighth Amendment.
Sinn Féin Whip Aengus Ó Snodaigh told Nolan that she had been suspended for a period of three months.
Nolan was the only one of the party’s 23 TDs to vote against the bill passing.
“It is long standing Sinn Féin policy to support repeal of the Eighth Amendment and to campaign in a referendum to achieve that objective,” the party said in a statement.
Sinn Féin Leader Mary Lou McDonald TD that she respected the fact that people “across society have deep and sincerely held views on the Eighth Amendment”.
“Carol holds strong, personal convictions on this matter,” she said.
“At all stages, the party has acknowledged and respected her views and her right to articulate those views.
“However, Sinn Féin elected representatives are expected to respect policy decisions taken by the Ard Fheis and to vote in line with party policy.
“All Sinn Féin elected representatives, including members of the Oireachtas, are aware of this.
“Carol is a valued colleague and I very much regret this turn of events.
However, as legislators we have a responsibility to vote as we are mandated by long standing Sinn Féin policy, a policy which we strongly believe is in the best interests of women.
Suspension
This is not the first time a Sinn Féin TD has been suspended due to their voting record on issues related to abortion.
Sinn Féin TD Peadar Toibín was suspended back in 2013 for voting against the Protection of Life During Pregnancy Bill 2013, which Sinn Féin was supporting.
Senator Máire Devine has also been suspended in recent days for retweeting a post which called Brian Stack, a senior prison officer shot dead by the IRA in the 1980s, a ‘sadist’.
Earlier today the Dáil approved the second stage of the Bill which will form the basis of the upcoming referendum on the Eighth Amendment.
The passing of this stage of the 36th Amendment of the Constitution Bill 2018 now allows the Dáil to begin considering possible amendments in the committee stage.
The second stage of the Bill was passed by 110 votes to 32.
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The party where you are not allowed to have your own opinion.
@Nick Allen: Certainly you can have an opinion within the party frame work, but party policy and constituents are what you are there to represent. That’s the ticket, your elected on. Don’t like the the restriction then become an independent.Simples
@Martin Critten:
Then why is she suspended and not expelled?
@Nick Allen: No other parties with a whip I suppose.
@Nick Allen: Because they thought it was not severe enough to be worth expelling over.
@Daddy Long Legs: a party canvassing for ‘choice’ not giving their own members the right to choice. Where would you see it? Nazi Germany probably.
@Nick Allen: Party rules. They didn’t disregard them because they were facing a divisive issue like the spineless FF/FG
@Martin Critten: So only all prochoice people vote for Sinn Féin?
@The Risen: Spineless? I think a free vote on such a divisive issue shows strength actually. For or against, your opinion is respected.
@The Risen:
Oh yes. SF party rules must be obeyed at all cost, even if that is honesty and integrity. Suspensions for the members who disobey and punishment beatings for non members who disobey
@Nick Allen: ah here if the TD’s were breaking rules and not sanctioned you’d be whinging and when they break rules and get sanctioned you still whinge.. Nothing is ever good enough for you regarding SF. They’re damned if they do and damned if they don’t… Your mind is not for turning as they say. All you ever wanna do is dig the boot in. Same old same old.
@Incognito:
If you read my comments the other day you would have seen that I said Mary Lou did well to announce the suspension so swiftly and that I did not expect her to do so. I also had discussions with Catherine Simms about Mary Lou where I said that I am sceptical of her true motivation to bring the party forward but that if she is true to her word it would be very good for Ireland.
The problem is that SF screw up so regularly that there are so many negative stories about them
^
Have to laugh at these lads. Their partys broke their election promises and not a squeak. But SF keep their election promises or stick to their partys rules and it’s oh so terrible LOL!
@Nick Allen: Those were all conceited remarks you made while also sticking the boot in.. Look at your rhetoric “punishment beatings” comment above. Pathetic.. Like I said you’re mind is not for turning and you have an Anti-SF agenda.
@Nick Allen: I think you said that using the honeybadger account. It’s an easy mistake! Carry on…
@Nick Allen: That might come later !
@Nick Allen: FG.. Renua.
Of course the Hypocrite Nick will also make an excuse for FG. What pathetic excuse this time ?
@Nick Allen: People here are acting like SF enforcing the whip is something rare in Irish politics..In fact it’s the norm. I could literally fill The Journals servers with links to examples of every party enforcing it..Complaining that SF is somehow being undemocratic in enforcing it is hypocrisy of the highest order.. Especially from FG who have lost TD’s to other parties because they have enforced it
@Nick Allen: Party rules?
@Nick Allen:
She didn’t have to join the Party, she made a Choice which is exactly what the referendum will be about , having a Choice
@Nick Allen: The Party where the membership votes in the mandate and where the mandate is sacrosanct and no TD is above that.
@Mel Lloyd: Don’t expect nick to accept membership decisions. Sure didn’t his party members vote for coveney by 2 to 1 and ended up with leo.
@Incognito:
Yes I am anti SF and I will put the boot in because I wholeheartedly disagree the way they cover up their past, won’t apologize for killing innocent people and won’t say where the bodies are. The comments I made the Mary Lou had no conceit in them, look back and read them, I was very honest in what I said. The issue SF supporters have trying to debate anything here is that you just won’t engage in the debate. It’s constant deflection and avoidance. Ask me any question and I will answer it, I don’t have to hide behind my political views. Until SF change there policies on on the points i mentioned above I will actively do whatever I can to highlight all the bad things about SF and try to stop people voting for them.
@The Risen:
You really are slow. I am not a member of FG and never have been. I grew up in a FF house and starting Voting FF when I was old enough to vote. I then lived out of the county and when I returned I have voted for FF, Green, I even gave Clare Day a vote! and I have voted independent. But as per usual, you never stick to the truth
@The Risen: Very Orwellian isn’t it…
@John Dman:
You are an awful twit. Is that the best you can come up with. I have never posted under any other account than my own. But if that’s the best argument you can put forward then you carry on in your own little world where people don’t have the ability nor the confidence to argue for themselves
@Nick Allen: She gets the same punishment as that senator who reposted a pretty vile tweet. Hmmmm maybe SF don’t do conscience. I take what I said about Mary Lou. She is in the party for a reason. Nick don’t even argue with them. We shpuldnt.have bothered giving any benefit of the doubt.
@Ian Kavanagh:
Show me one post I ever made when I am hypothetical.
@Nick Allen:
Hypocritical (bloody iPhone)
@The Risen:
As you know I am not a member of FG, but if you are playing the party rules card then do you understand the party rules in FG about voting for a leader?
@John Dman: No he didn’t . The conversation is there for all to see and I am no FG groupie. Not everyone has silly unquestioning loyalty. That kind of stupidity let’s politics pic accountabity. Why dont you all try actual thinking as is free thinking for a change. Instead of waiting to be told what to think.
@Catherine Sims:
How long will it take them to say we are the same person using different accounts?
^
Nick resorting to the insults once again. The last refuge of a person with no actual point to make.
Good lad nick
@The Risen:
LOL, you have severe difficulty debating anything. You just can’t stick to the point. Is it that you know you can’t defend yourself or is it lack of ability?
@Nick Allen: So you do actually have an agenda then ? Your stated aim is to discourage people from voting Sinn Fein. At least you’ve made yourself clear, but how can any of your future Sinn Fein related comments be taken seriously ?
@Nick Allen: I’m surprised they haven’t said it already. Never mind that actually we disagree on a lot of stuff but being adults we realise you don’t agree with everyone on everything.
@Tommy Roche: They can’t be, because all they’ll ever be is bias
@Tommy Roche:
Yes, I am openly and honestly anti SF, I have never once denied that and I have stated why I am anti SF. I don’t see how that changes whether my comments are credible or not. Lots of SF people are openly anti FF or FG, does that mean what they say isn’t credible?
@Incognito:
Do you not have a bias toward SF?
@Nick Allen: On thejournal.ie?
@Nick Allen: How childish, to be anti a political party, rather than make up your mind based on their policies. You would be better suited to having a favorite and rival football team.
@Nick Allen: Nick I tried to engage you in debate yesterday. You don’t want to debate.You want to rant..You switch topics and then when people address them you accuse them of deflection. SF have engaged in helping to try locate the disappeared where possible only to have it turned against them for political purposes. The current members of SF have no more of a clue where the bodies are buried any more than current members of FG know where their founding members buried bodies in the Spanish Civil war or FF members know where Civil War disappeared are buried . Most of the people who buried them are long since dead, are not involved with SF any more having continued violent resistance, in their dotage or simply donât remember exact locations.The ones that SF can still reach out to won’t come forward because despite the families just wanting closure, the second they give information the likes of FF/FG/Lab start demanding that SF trot off to Garda station and identify them. You want full disclosure then support the Peace and Reconciliation process that SF has been calling for over two decades now. It’s been stalled so long at this stage that the original players are dying out..Stop bitching about how badly SF are treating families and do something to help everyone who’s lost family during the troubles get closure at least.There’s literally tens of thousands of family members on this island that have been demanding it for decades yet you’ve got target fixation on the few that can be used to attack your political opponents .You’re so fixated that by the time you figure out that the answer to finding the disappeared lies in a full disclosure by all sides.. the main players will be long dead and nobody will get any answers..
@Martin Critten: That’s one heck of a restriction, this lack of freedom of speech or expression.
@Vigo the Carpathian: long winded drivel!
@Unconvertible Rebel:
Read my comments. I said I am anti them because of their policies on particular issues.
@Vigo the Carpathian:
I did engage with you on the debate on Port laoise and I also agreed that I think the people should be investigated. but the debate started about the tweet and you wouldn’t discuss it.
@Vigo the Carpathian:
As long as SF continue their views on the Birmingham bombings by blaming phones and not saying sorry and covering up who did it they will not get my vote
@Nick Allen: When FFG suspend some in this manner – you say nothing. Apparently it an issue when the Shiners do it … when FFG do it you stay quite like a COWARD.
If its wrong Nick – its bloody wrong, no matter who does it and YOU are a prime example of one who wears the party blinkers. Stop this BS that you have no affiliation to FG – pure nonsense, so stop treating people like idiots.
@Paddy: You think a paragraph is long winded !?! Jesus !!! Just wait till you get to big boy school and find out about these things called books. You’re in for one hell of a shock…
@Nick Allen: Yes yesterday Nick you told me that you had no affiliation to FG ( BS of course ) and that you voted FF .. Mmmmmm even the stench of corruption surrounded that party you continued to support them ? Apparently so.
Yep SG policies should ensure they never get into government … but coming from someone who stated they supported FF in the pasts when the dogs in the street knew what they were up to, then what does that say about you ???????
@Nick Allen: Well I find that hard to believe, because I have never seen you discuss their policies in a grown up manner. It’s all snide remarks, nastiness and childishness with you.
@Nick Allen: What a surprise …not.
@Nick Allen: you knew nothing better, same as you could say you grew up in a Catholic house, went through the rituals etc…. I don’t even know how my parents voted, not that it mattered. The thing they didthat furked me up most was pandering to a religion they had become separated from , only for raising me they wouldn’t have seen the inside of a church.. apart from their own brainwashing. And it still goes on today.. brainwashing.. and accepted.. children brainwashed from school age.. Does nobody see this as crazy?
@Nick Allen: I’d say they’re absolutely heart broken at SF head offices after hearing they won’t be getting your vote.Again though you’ve just proven my point about you changing the subject.In the space of this thread alone you’ve shifted from the suspension of a SF TD to The Disappeared to the Birmingham pub bombings. That bombing by the way is a perfect example of why a Truth and Reconciliation Commission is needed and quickly.Former high ranking members of the IRA have admitted that it was indeed the IRA that carried it out. It’s believed that a man called Mick Murray was the leader of the unit responsible. He died in 1999. Due to the compartmentalised nature of an active IRA cell huge amounts of information about what happened that night died with him..Now here’s where this gets interesting..In 1994 five years before Murray died The West Midlands Police and then-Director of Public Prosecutions, Dame Barbara Mills, reopened their investigation into the Birmingham pub bombings following the release of the Birmingham Six..and almost as quickly as it had been opened the investigation was closed again with them declaring that they had done everything we could possibly have done to bring the perpetrators to justice..The DPP then sealed the files for 75 years.We won’t have full access until 2069.. Since then Michael Christopher Hayes has taken collective responsibility for the bombings and apologised yet the criminal investigation has not been reopened and as of Fri, Jan 26 the coroners court is proceeding with an inquest (despite objections from West Midlands Police?) which is a fairly good indication that it won’t be reopened. It’s cases like this one that show exactly why we need full disclosure from all sides
@Ian Kavanagh:
When pat did FFG suspend someone? Did u read my comments that day? LOL
@Vigo the Carpathian:
I hate to burst your bubble but I am not changing the discussion. I am the only one that is fully open and honest about my views on this.
@Nick Allen: Hypocrite Nick has 2 sons .. 1 supports SF the other FG. ( Neither very good choices !!! )
Both throw smash up their rooms …
Hypocrite Nick goes bananas with the shiner lad and but makes pathetic excuses for the behaviors of the FG lad.
Both nasty pieces of work but poor dad just cant say anything bad about his favorite son … Nick to a tee.
@Nick Allen: Except Nick .. you don’t post views. You post dumbassed accusations about SF that are easily proved wrong. Then when you’re called on them you either start changing the subject, calling others names or accusing others of not engaging you in fair debate. Well you’re right on the last part Nick..they are unfair debates.. you’re like a toddler in a room full of adults parroting dumb crap that you’ve overheard somewhere else and expecting a pat on the head by way of green thumbs for being a good little boy…
@Nick Allen: It’s their way or the highway.
@Martin Critten: rubbish. Carol Nolan and Peadar Toibin have the guts to defend human life in the womb.
The Sinn Fein pro aborts, O’Snodaigh, Mary Lou and the rest are too scared to even let their own grass roots debate abortion BEFORE the anti 8th referendum.
Well done courageous Carol Nolan. Pitiful to see the “men”, O Snoaigh and his ilk, too scared to defend innocent unborn life from abortion, as she bravely did.
The Mary Lou SF politbureau rules.
@Nick Allen: Absolute BS. Party members should have an absolute right to vote against matters that they disagree with. I’ll never vote for any Sinn Fein again despite the fact that I have a lot of respect for some of their members. All the party’s should just join together and form one big party since they seem to all fall the same way. One’s views might very well be in line with most of their party’s, but then when there is an issue they disagree with, they shouldn’t be suspended, or told to “just join another party.” That isn’t exactly a “pro choice” move from Mary Lou, is it? Pro choice until someone disagrees with her.
It’s very simple. If you don’t agree with party policy then stand up and leave the party.
This applies to all partys.
If she wants to be against repeal the 8th then go join Renue,
@Barry Somers: You mean like Terence Flanagan who after throwing a strop returned to FG with his tail between his legs after Renua got a kicking …
@Vigo the Carpathian: It’s strange that the majority of FF,TD’s ,voted against, but this one woman gets a whole article ,and nothing about FF,
@Barry Somers: parties
@Robert Harris: not strange at all. FF didn’t dictate to their members how they should vote. That was the right thing to do on such a personal an emotive topic. SF on the other hand thought it best to not let their members have a choice.
@Sean @114: That was voted on at Ard Fheis the delegates voted against allowing freedom of conscience votes. The delegates are the grass roots. It’s not a Conspiracy like.
@Sean @114: I think it would be fair for FF to give their TDs a free vote on legislation covering abortion should the 8th be repealed, but this relates to the holding of a referendum. So they are voting against putting the question to the electorate, not against abortion.
@Incognito: so the grass roots had not faith in what direction their elected members would vote on what is very much a conscience matter, so instead they instructed them to vote a certain way or face disciplinary action. Remove the choice from those voting for a right to choose.
@Robert Harris:
Didn’t FF TDs have a free vote, hence why none of them got suspended?
@Robert Harris: don’t mix metaphors FF are anti abortion, their way back to getting elected in the church bound rural areas, nationwide. It was the towns and cities that got the same sex marriage referendum through.
@Barry Somers: wrong. she can oppose abortion any place she likes. If SF can’t live with that, let them expell her.
Interesting to see the soft 3 month non-punishment slap on the wrist, their SF senator Devine got for insulting the memory of abrave prison officer Stack, cowardly murdered (shot unarmed from behind) by Sinn Fein/IRA gunmen.
If she had any honour, she would resign from the SEANAD, unfit to serve.
Devine won’t.— she is O’Snodaigh’s running mate in Dub S Central, being groomed for a 2nd seat.
Her comment also insulted all prolife voters, in line with SF pro abortion policy.
Disgusting. Dump them out soon.
A party should be made up of individuals with their own views and opinions, that most adhere to the party of choice. While I dont agree with her, I think she should be entitled to her opinion on the matter, a free vote should have been allocated.
@Paul Quinlan: she is entitled to her own opinion, and she can cast her own vote in May but she knew when she joined an established political party that it would be necessary to vote with the party whip. Don’t like it, don’t join. And if you really don’t like the whip system you can set about reforming the entire political structure, but that might take a while.
@Paul Quinlan: It defeats the whole purpose of party politics if individuals can act upon their own views on core issues such as this. If Carol doesn’t believe in the party view or trust the party process on issues such as these then she should leave immediately.
@Paul Quinlan: she can have her opinion at the poling stations, but she must support party policy…why did they cast a vote anyway? On a matter of party policy?
@Karen Wellington: rubbish. Carol Nolan can take her own position and the people, not Sinn Fein, can decide if they still want her as their representative.
Unlike the other shameful SF sheep, obediently toeing Mary Lous pro-abortion line, as they line up to attack unborn children with abortion legislation.
Nolan gets my vote. She has a mind of her own. Well done Carol. Dump SF pro aborts out.
What a fraud SF is– holding their abortion debate — after the Referendum ? What an insult to their members.
@Paul Quinlan but she voted against the people of Ireland to have an opinion and to vote
Loyalty over honesty, sounds familiar.
Another day another SF article.. Let’s see how many views this one gets…Must be pretty disappointing going to the trouble of writing so many in a day only for them to be view by less people than view an article on Ringo Starr getting a knighthood…
@Vigo the Carpathian:
Another day, another member of SF suspended by their leader
@Nick Allen: And guaranteed once she returns she’ll get the pro life vote for the party too…Seems more strategic than anything else…
@Vigo the Carpathian: She only ended up 170 votes ahead of FF in 3rd place at the last election. Of course its stategic on her behalf.
@Honeybadger197: What lies are you going to peddle today mate…Let me guess.. “Gerry Adams is holding onto Roger Casements real diary against the wishes of his family”..
@Vigo the Carpathian: its called la k of interest
@Vigo the Carpathian: It’s adorable when little guys like yourself do this deflection malarky.
@Honeybadger197: I’m calling you a proven liar dumbass… Now run along…
@Vigo the Carpathian: Adorable.
@Honeybadger197: What, she ended up with more votes than FF?
Those politicians who agree with the 8th amendment can vote no in the referendum in May. What’s wrong is that those 30+ TD’s who believe we don’t deserve a vote on this issue.
@Derrick McGrath: Probably more like they believe that no referendum should be held to vote on whether one sector of society should have the right to determine whether another sector has a right to life. It is actually outrageous that this referendum is being held since the Constitution only ACKNOWLEDGES a right to life that is already there.
@Sighle A. Ni Chuana: it’s called democracy
@Sighle A. Ni Chuana: The unborn can hardly be referred to as a “sector of society”…
@Brian Madden: wheres the democracy this issue has been voted on again and again by the irish people but fanitical misinformed pressure groups cant accept that the people voted for equal treatment for mother and baby protecting both lives.
An unelected chairwoman catherine noone, an unelected taoiseach,( unelected by people at least) a pro choice loaded citizens assembley. Wheres the democracy DICTATORS MORE LIKE
@Jim Kenny: the three referendums on this issue since the 8th was put in place have all had pro-choice outcomes.
@Jim Kenny: “a pro choice loaded citizens assembly”
What else would you expect in a pro choice loaded country??
@Brian Madden: yeah democracy — thats how Hitler got into power. He was elected.
Also, millions of unborn children victimised and aborted to death under laws enacted by — yes, you guessed it — democratically elected, stupid, venal politicians.
As a sinn fein voter I will be voting against abortion. If Mary Lou keeps suspending people there will be no elected representatives left. Didnt you say recently Mary Lou that the party needs to recognise and respect those with a different view as they are friends, family and other party members. But all those pro choicers have infiltrated the party and decided we shouldnt have a free vote. No vote from me for a pro choice candidate in the G.E.
@F. Wood: This is what happens when a one-issue movement is forced to develop policies on other issues.
@F. Wood: What a load of bs
@Incognito: Why? Because I have a view that isnt yours?
@F. Wood: being suspended (or expelled) from a political party does not equate to being suspended (or expelled) from government. She is still the elected representative for her constituents, she will still attend the Oireachtas, she will still get to vote as a TD and she will still get paid.
@Karen Wellington: precisely why this isn’t a punishment at all!!!
@Paddy: well she’s lost the right to speak, but you’re right; as punishments go this one is as week as we’ve come to expect from SF
@F. Wood: well said.
should be a free vote in ALL parties. Nolan and Toibin are right.
the SF whip on abortion of children, is scandalous.
we had SF Devine tweets insulting prolife voters also as well as the poor, murdered prison officer Stack.
wheres her apology to prolife voters ?
Is that the same punishment the other woman got for insulting a dead man murdered by the IRA
@Ian Parker: “Carol Nolan & Peadar Tóibín are finished in Sinn Fein” Now that’s what you’d call a big fat lie folks, or if you prefer.. Fake news!
@Ian Parker: Silly comment. Toibin was suspended before over a vote on the x case legislation and returned to be a spokesperson once again as soon as the suspension was over.
@Ian Parker: the people of Dublin Sth Central can dump Devine, O’Snodaigh and other SF, or any other, pro aborts out of office.
This will save lives from the abortion agenda which they push.
Nightmare week for SF continues. Once again showing they are unfit to govern!
@Evan Cunningham: Unfit to govern because they stuck to their party rules?
How does that one work?
@Evan Cunningham: Aa opposed to Leo nightmare week, who is Taoiseach and whose party are governing !! SF have never governed here, pity FG have always to deflect their failures by attacking SF.
If they actually done some good they wouldnt have to
I was a fool voting FG after the bust, I wont be fooled a second time.
@Evan Cunningham: Unfit to govern right now but with a zero tolerance approach to the rabble they’ll eventually clear the decks.
@Evan Cunningham: Almost as bad as Leo the Liar’s nightmare week last week. The plastic paddy eh? So bad, he had to run away to momma Merkel to escape the questioning, and then shows up in another photoshoot with yellow sockies. Dukes is right. Varadkar needs to close his twutter account. As well as his personal spin unit.
@The Risen: because they are fascists who advocate abortion on demand.
“A long standing policy” they only jumped on the bandwagon 2 months ago! They now know it will go through and scrambled to push it at their ard fheis.
@Dave O’Looney:
Yeah, but it is SF…isn’t that what they always do
@Dave O’Looney: repealing the 8th amendment was passed at a Sinn Fein are fheis in 2015 I think you meant years not months right…..
@Dave O’looney: it’s been policy to repeal since at least 2014, but yeah you go on and make sh.t up there
@Fearghal Snow: Sorry yes I take it back it was at the Ard Fheis in Derry in 2015, 3 years ago this month I believe
@Incognito: They’ve had an official position on abortion longer than FG have so… Funny that…
@Vigo the Carpathian: Yep. No FG TD could comment until Varadkar gave an interview to the BBC, and then they were all out.
@Dave O’Looney: a ha ha ha ha.. feckin hate that!!
Must admire her for standing up for her principles and not towing the party line, well done lady.
Why would a practicing Catholic in the 6 counties vote from SF when the Party excludes them for following their faith..
@Stephen Duffy: Because SF has been pretending for years to be pro-life to Catholics in Northern Ireland.
@Sighle A. Ni Chuana: they lied–SF are pro abortion.
A 7% drop in SF representation in the Oireachtas in just a few days.
@Brendan O’Brien:
It will be even bigger following the next general election
@Brendan O’Brien: Really ? You do know that suspension from the party doesn’t mean they have to leave the Dail, right ? SF still have the exact same number of bums on seats the had last week,,,
@Vigo the Carpathian: You do know that while they are suspended from the party they are effectively not members of the party? That’s what suspension means.
Their bums on the pews will not be SF bums.
@Brendan O’Brien: Jeez Brendan. You really haven’t a clue do you?
@Brendan O’Brien: The votes will be SF votes though and that’s what matters . You’re acting like she’s been expelled. This is nothing more than a minor inconvenience to her for a few weeks..
@Vigo the Carpathian: Nolan and Devine have been temporarily expelled, for three months. That’s what suspension means. Everything I have said is a plain fact, but you seem to feel an insatiable urge to put a spin on things.
@Brendan O’Brien: Really..They’re still in the party, still in the Dail ,still have a vote and are still expected to vote along party lines just like any member suspended from any other party. They’ve simply lost speaking rights and even at that any issue they want to raise can be forwarded to another member to raise.That hardly sounds like a loss of representation.
@Vigo the Carpathian: All right, then: you’ve convinced me that McDonald’s gesture in suspending Devine was completely meaningless.
@Brendan O’Brien: What’s even better is that the Blueshirts pretend to buy it..EVERY SINGLE TIME.. because they know well they too need the auld suspension ruse for when one of theirs acts up. Nobody wants the other side to actually go nuclear and start expelling members for tweets or voting against the party because as sure as god made small oranges one of theirs will be caught doing something similar a few days or weeks later. It’s all a show for the cameras mate….
@Brendan O’Brien: a 100% increase in the abortion rate if SF get power over our health service.
Pfft 3 months suspension is nothing, much better than some of the other punishments they dish out!
SF are no better than the Communists to do this. She has her principles I am glad to see her standing by them I hope she will leave this lot and move to a party who will honor her principles
@Alan Scott: probably voted for FG did you?
This pretty much sums up everything that’s wrong with party politics.
It’s gas watching party HQ attacking SF on this when you consider where RENUA came from . … of course the bluebots will say that was different.
Michael Martin went against parlementary party and ard fheis by backing how come he and other are not suspended or is it because of free vote. Michael martin made huge mistake going against his party to curry favour in media. Well done Carol Nolan, woman of principal in face of misguided opposition in her own party
Rather lacking in intelligence these SF women. Does she not understand the referendum if passed would not legalise abortion. It would simply make the Oireachtas responsible for ‘abortion law’.
@Donal Hanley:
In fairness, if the referendum is passed abortion will be legalized
@Donal Hanley: Just out of interest.. why exactly do you think the government and the majority of the house is supporting this referendum if they’re not going to change the laws ? Is it for the fun of it or something.. And you question others intelligence….
@Nick Allen: True but abortion as you well know already exists here with the pill available by post or by a quick visit to the UK. Passing the referendum would enable our legislators to control the situation properly by whatever means and to what extent they might consider appropriate.
@Vigo the Carpathian: See my very full reply to Alan. I guess you are a pro-life extremist and you are entitled to your view.
@Donal Hanley: And why, pray tell, would legislators want to “control” it?
@Father Hody Commody: Because women’s lives are at risk under the present situation and the role of doctors needs to be beyond lacking in clarity.
@Donal Hanley: Oh Dear……
Silly ‘women’, eh?
@G O’Rourke: This post say’s a lot about you!
@Donal Hanley: women’s lives will still be at risk even after repeal and legislation for abortion as outlined by the government.GPs will not be coerced into supplying abortion pills if they don’t want to or feel that they are too over-worked and under-resourced to provide yet another time-consuming service fraught with possible litigation threats. An internal survey of 500 GPs carried out by GP buddy shows that 70% of the 500 oppose a GP-led service. Claiming that it is vital to legalize abortion pills because they can be bought online is the weakest of all arguments. Following this kind of reason we should legalize all recreational drugs simply because people can and do access them.
@Donal Hanley: Actually I’m very pro-choice .I’m just curious why you think that passing this referendum has nothing to do with the very publicly touted change to the actual abortion laws. One leads to the other ..
@Donal Hanley: right.
maybe you didn’t follow the HARRIS/VARADKER action.
first discredit the 8th — DAIL sham Committes “consulting”, Cit Assembly, and pro abortion media very useful here –
THEN fool enough people to dump the 8th with glib, trite “trust women” slogans ,
– quickly followed by 12 week abortion on demand, “mental health” on demand abortion – like Britain. —
and Voila ! like Britain, in no time at all, u have 1 In 5 dead aborted babies, grieving hurt mothers, and money for abortion commercial businesses like BPAS, PP….
Voting against allowing people to vote in a referendum was a dumb thing to do.
@Cormac: really ? if the referendum ends up killing babies by abortion, how is that dumb ?
the real cowards were the TDs who went along with it.
Edna Kenny went down the expulsion road with Davina and that was over a conscience issue.
It was a big mistake as she was one of his better ministers.
An issue like this, is not exclusive to SF, the party whip system in all parties goes a long way to explain all the free thinking Independent’s that we have in Ireland.
Sinn Fein are in urgent need o dose of
cop on. Their behaviour resulting in suspensions is undermining people’s confidences in them and shows them up as mixed bag of air holes
Can someone please explain what suspension from party really mean. Does they still get paid.
@Philip Howlin: They’re still a TD they just have to be so outside the party during suspension, they don’t have the use of the party structures etc
@Philip Howlin: this isn’t a punishment at all don’t let mary Lou fool ya
@Philip Howlin: she has to hand in her badge and gun. Oh sorry it’s Sin Féin, so just her badge
@Philip Howlin: As a TD she’s not paid by the party she’s paid by the exchequer.. She’ll probably continue to vote along party lines on other things or risk expulsion, she just won’t have speaking rights in the Dail as part of the party for three months… It’s the same for other parties too..
@JimmyMc: Yeah just her badge. It’s not like she’s a Lay about Labour TD or anything…
@Incognito: what does mean for her and those who voted for her
@Philip Howlin: She’s lost speaking rights in the Dáil chamber whilst suspended, but she’s still a TD, can still vote in the Dáil and work on behalf of her constituents, she just won’t be able to use the party structures to help her.
Wow Charlie Haughey reins in Sinn Fein una duce una vuce – Dictatorial leadership
@Tim Brennan: You do know what the Party Whip is, right ?
@Vigo the Carpathian: an excuse
@Tim Brennan: it’s not something they came up with this week, party whips have been around for this woman’s entire life and she has the freedom of choice to leave the party if she can’t bring herself to vote with the party.
What does suspended actually mean? Not a pedantic trolling question I’m genuinely intrigued as to what effect it has on anything. She’s hardly going to start voting against her party for three months? It surely has 0 repercussion for anyone, if they cared enough she’d be expelled, but they can’t lose their firepower I imagine
@Eoin Collopy: No speaking rights in the Dáil and no access to party structures
@Incognito: If she has an important issue to raise I’m sure some other party member “will get wind of it” and bring it up. That’s what usually happens..
What does suspended mean in reality? Is she still paid? Does she lose out on anything? It looks like s cosmetic sanction.
Party impose ‘whip’ shocker…..
@G O’Rourke: For all the bitching that people here do about politics a lot of them are proving that they haven’t a bulls notion about the basic procedures of the Dail or how political parties work.. It’s actually quite stunning to see some of the things they’re coming out with. At least there’s one or two people who don’t understand asking questions. The rest are just displaying their ignorance…and their fellow idiots are reinforcing it….
@Vigo the Carpathian: everyone seems to have forgotten Lucinda Creighton too. Short memory of the outraged..
How many more suspensions, expulsions, resignations and bullying allegations are going to be made before this party wakes up and smells the democracy! Peter Tobin will probably be next.
Mary Loo is having a great star to her leadership
Does that mean, you are not allowed a conscience, You can toe the party line but your not a robot, Free speech is part of the universal suffrage manifesto? Maybe we are all fascist now? My party is becoming a touch out of kilter? Free vote, free speech !
Shock – imagine a party suspending someone for voting against them – should have expelled her like FG would have:
https://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/creighton-expelled-236703.html
when i see o sno i think of ink cartridges scammer.
Respecting everyone’s conscience on this emotional & personal issue important, even for politicians, fair play to Renua, Fine Gael and Fianna Fáil who have all allowed a freedom of conscience, time for Sinn Fein too?
Absolutely scandalous behaviour to try and force someone to follow the party line against all their beliefs and values..shameful
Only issue here is the use of the party whip for such an emotive personal issue. To single it out as a SinnFein issue is simply misleading. Plenty of parties have pushed the whip on other emotive topics but just because this one seems to be getting the most traction it’s making big news. To be honest it is a topic that should have been given an open vote but hey, that’s politics in Ireland.
32 cowardly TD’s
She should feel proud to be suspended!
Hat off to the Deputy – you have to admire someone who makes decisions based on what they believe in, and not what they’re being directed to believe in. Whether you agree or disagree with her viewpoint, this is a woman of steel.
have your say