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A TD’S COMMENT that “fornication” leads to unwanted pregnancies has created some controversy today.
Michelle Mulherin, a Mayo Fine Gael TD who was elected to Dáil Éireann in 2011, said during the Dáil debate on a proposed X case bill today that “fornication, I would say, is probably the single most likely cause of unwanted pregnancies in this country”.
After Mulherin’s made her comments, the trending tag #fornicationtax appeared on Twitter, with users suggesting ways in which the tax could be implemented.
During her speech Deputy Mulherin said:
I am against abortion in any form myself. The grace of God is so liberating and provides so many options to get the best out of life despite our fall in nature, and we all have that.
Having said that it is an ideal to aim for. In an ideal world there would be no unwanted pregnancies and no unwanted babies. But we are far from living in an ideal world. An honest and a scriptural view is that things are getting harder for people, so what then for the weak in our society?
Abortion as murder, therefore sin, which is the religious argument, is no more sinful, from a scriptural point of view, than all other sins we don’t legislate against, like greed, hate and fornication. The latter, being fornication, I would say, is probably the single most likely cause of unwanted pregnancies in this country.
But at the end of the day, it is the nature of religion to fuss over appearances above the truth and the inner state of the person.
Mulherin made her comments before the Dáil voted on draft legislation which would have permitted abortions to be carried out in Ireland under limited circumstances. The legislation was rejected by 110 votes to 20 in a debate this afternoon.
This isn’t the first time Deputy Mulherin has made controversial comments – in March 2011, she criticised the Libyan National Transitional Council and said Libyan rebels “did not follow democratic means”, the Irish Times reported at the time.
Mulherin also called for National Service to be introduced for all young men, and warned against a “culture of entitlement”, the Irish Independent reported in June 2011.
- Additional reporting by Gavan Reilly
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“Sex leads to pregnancy” is a controversial view?
Think she’s using “fornication” in the literal sense of sex between unmarried people, which is a sin as bad as greed or hate, apparently.
Except that Fornication actually means “the sin of unmarried sex”, rather than just “unmarried sex” – the word itself has context embedded in it (namely that the act it describes is an absolutely immoral act). So apparently we’ve given up on the Enlightenment and the whole Seperation of Church and State thing…
(Seriously, did I fall asleep last night and accidentally wake up this morning in South Carolina or something?)
Yeah I’d say the word she was looking for was promiscuity.
That might be the word she was looking for Sean, but I think she’d be better served if she was given a few other short words instead.
After all, this is all about sex, and she represents a lot of people in a far-flung part of the country (relative to the Dail’s physical location), so perhaps an invitation to explore sex and travel would be a good thing…
Fornication defined as consenting sex involving adults who are not married to each other
Mark: We never had the enlightenment and the whole separation of church and state thing for starters.
Paul, that’s like saying we never had democracy. We certainly didn’t invent the enlightenment, but we definitely had it (we were in the UK, one of the main protestant nations at the time, don’t forget…)
Is she hinting that they might introduce a “fornication” tax.?
Disgraceful comment but then again what would elso would you expect from a right wing politician.
And no, I’m not confusing the reformation with the enlightenment, the point is that some of the enlightenment’s greatest thinkers were from the UK as well…
What century is this woman from
Assuming she meant it in the context of unmarried couples, statistically she’s probably right. But there would be a lot more to it than not being married in the religious sense. An unmarried couple are put under much more financial strain than a married couple due to the discriminatory tax laws and religious interference in this country. There is also the stigma of having a child out of wedlock and not having a baptism. Add to that the pressure on children who don’t take part in the First Communion and Confirmation.
So while she is likely statistically correct, it is the Catholic church and Revenue laws that are the cause of this.
So the people in Mayo swapped the corrupt Bev Flynn for this backward idiot. I think when Cromwell said to Hell or to Connaught those that were blessed with an iota of common sense opted for the latter.
Somebody, please tell that woman to think before she opens her mouth! There is no such thing as an ideal world! Humans have fought even since the beginning of time. It is in their genes. Sadly, yes, many die, but I feel it is a natural part of human life. Thousands of years ago when there were ‘tribes’, groups of people from the North Pole to the South Pole, they fought also, for land, food, metals etc.
There are ‘unwanted’ babies born every day, be they from an unwed couple to a married couple. No difference. There are many pregnancies that are ‘mistakes/unwanted’ within a marriage every day of the week.
Religion is a man made thing. As far as I am concerned, religion is the biggest cause of all wars that have been and will be in the future. People can be great human beings without religion. We should try it some day.
Ireland is certainly not and was probably never the christian country some wish it was. To me religion has cause untold hurt, hate, harm, rape dictatorship in Ireland than it has given in love. Ireland, like all other countries in the world, does not belong to anyone, we just have the privilege to live in it. I support abortion, where there is danger for the mother, and in cases of rape. No Government or church has the right to tell someone else what’s best for them!
How does ” would not get a kick in a stampede” sound , somehow I do not think anyone will be fornicating with her !!!!!ever !!!
Yup Sean.
Looks like Michelle was slightly hormonal today.
Seriously who voted this but job in??? I blame Mayo.!!!
I’m no pregnantologist, but I suspect fornication is also the single most likely cause of wanted pregnancies too.
So “fornication” is not just any old sex. It is specifically sex that does not involve making promises in a church before hand, accompanied by a celibate man and ritualistic cannibalism.
Now I understand.
Perhaps she is getting no fornication and is jealous.
Sex leads to pregnancy, no shit! Does she also know that you’re 100% more likely to get pregnant if you’re a woman.
Frak – thats news to me!
I’m shocked! LOL
I’m no biologist, and I know there’s been a few high-profile cases of men having babies recently, but I’m still pretty sure that the number of women getting pregnant is more than double that of men…
Bible thumping Fine Gael TD talking nonsense! Did she inherit her seat or something? Surely people like her don’t actually get elected, do they????
Yep, and we pay them for the pleasure!!
@ Mike, well her predecessor was Beverly Flynn so draw your own conclusions.
What’s wrong with the voters in Mayo? Is her constituency Knock?
@Mike Scott
Unfortunately, yes! I wonder what her opinion is on homosexuality and lesbianism? Before anyone bites my face off for the question, I feel I/we need to know ‘our’ (not) representatives beliefs and really understand why one would vote for them.
technically (i googled it as i was kinda stumped by why she would make such an obvious comment) fornication is sexual relations between 2 ppl who arent married
Narrow minded people like this are not what we need in politics!!!
@Laura Marie Purcell
Me thinks she is a ‘Sara Palin wanna be’! No thanks!
Yep, agree totally. Our answer to Sarah Palin. What century is this?
I’m not sorry the Bill was defeated though. I was dismayed that all pro-choice groups were so in favour of it. They seem to support as a “step in the right direction” but it would, I feel, have set back equitable legislation on abortion. It did not offer women any choices, merely the right of a largely paternalistc psychiatric profession to decide for them.
many people seem to suffer the delusion that the right to travel for abortion was accorded to the girl in the X Case because she was underage or because she was raped. It was purely on the basis of “risk of suicide”. This was expedient in the moment but would make a bad basis for legislation.
All that fuss over how we needed gender quotas for the political party candidates, and all along what we completely forgot was that we really needed Cop-On quotas…
Seriously, shouldn’t there be some sort of a test for TDs that eliminates you from the office if you’re too stupid to open your mouth without half the room facepalming in response?
If you’re opposed to abortion, okay, we can have a debate; but if you’re so stupid that you have no argument for being opposed to abortion other than “it says so in this book that it’s bad”, and you’re so bad at formulating your own arguments that you think sex is only the most likely cause of pregnancy, then maybe we shouldn’t be letting you vote on the laws we all have to live under for the next few decades…
Really? No way. I thought it was the stork that came along and left the baby under a bush in the garden.
Well doesn’t it??
Not according to Ms. Mulherin, Minister for stating the obvious. :D
Mother of God, talk about missing the point. IQ Quotas needed, not gender quotas!
Damn I was gonna post the exact same thing!
Twomey quotas, more like!
Christ this one is a f**king genius
A very well-paid-by-us f**king genius, especially if you add in the €1000 a week she claims on expenses (http://www.thejournal.ie/in-full-1-in-5-tds-claimed-more-than-e50k-in-expenses-344242-Feb2012/)
Well spotter Chopper
@Teddy & Chopper
I was going to apologize on behalf of her/women. But I won’t, because not all women would come out with a statement like that. Jis, give me her job, as an Independent obviously!
Can pple f off with the ‘Mayo pple’ BShit, this women does not represent every voter in Mayo, look at the rest Healy Rae,Lowry,Bertie any FF getting re elected, a broadside against all voters in these areas is insulting, I’m as disgusted as any other 2012 thinking person,at the same time I don’t rem her spouting any of this crap running up to elections. Not in my name!
Oh my god
Looks like she could do with a little fornication herself!
@ David You took the words right out of my mouth… I actually thought it was a joke when I read the headline!
We had fornication in the old days while a Shag was similar to a cormorant but smaller. Little did we know our words would be robbed by the current generation. If I had a lorry load of Cormorants I wouldn’t give her one ( or was that the smaller bird ) doooh…..
I am shocked and outraged that sex leads to pregnancy. I had no idea that’s how I ended up in my current state of being pregnant!
So who voted her in then? Maybe on the bailout she will suggest converting five barley loaves and two fish into enough money to satisfy the starving bankers!
Does anyone not find what she said offensive?
“The grace of God is so liberating and provides so many options to get the best out of life despite our fall in nature, and we all have that.”
We all have that, a “fall from nature”.. F*ck off. I’m embarrassed that this person represents us, what the hell business has “a scriptorial point of view” got in our country’s politics? I’m so sick of this waste of energy being spent on worrying what people get up to in private instead of trying to get our broken country out of the shit hole we find ourselves in.. Jesus..
Shes has the mindset of the magdeline sisters. Blind stupidity and ignorance towards the feelings of others.
I completely agree.
Also, the use of the word “weak” when, presumably, referring to people who are considering or have had an abortion is pretty awful.
Couldn’t agree with you more Rob, so angry over this, sad state of affairs :-(
I actually do , and to be honest she is not on her own out there …. Her narrow minded and cruel comments are horrible. Laughing and joking aside I feel her comments are part of a bigger ”plan”. She is nasty , and narrow minded .and I think her comments do her no favors with women.
@Susie Chester
I don’t think she’s “nasty” or “narrow minded” she just happens to have a differing opinion to your own. It’s clear from reading her speech that she took time and care to draft it and was sincere in what she said. That doesn’t mean that I agree or disagree with her points but I believe that she is fully entitled to have them and make them known without having to be personally attacked.
It was clear from her speech she has absolutely no idea what the motion today was that she was voting on and has set the health of women back …..years. She is a very immature foolish woman. I am entitled to my opinions too and she has done harm !
I am lost for words!
Religion has no place in the running of our legal system, country or schools. Who votes for these people?
@Steph Duffy
Sadly, Ms. Mulherin was not! Thankfully, she doesn’t speak for the majority of females in this country! I’d suggest she go to Alaska with her ideas!
these are the kind of revolutionary forward thinkers running the country! But lets not forget …People voted for her!
The people of Mayo have a lot to answer for…
They are not really into the fornication over there alright.
The US has the ignorant Deep South. It seems that we have the Wesht! (The Healy Rae’s, O’Cuiv and this bible thumping looney).
Is it any wonder the country’s in this mess. The phrase! “Lunatics running the Asylum” was never more appropriate!! Don’t we have the right to get her locked up? She is seriously dangerous! I hope her speech is picked up on by foreign networks! That way they can show people exactly what Ireland has become!
Only non married people fornicate, so then married couples would not need abortion, oh wait…
There are times they do, some of the most recent couples brave enough to comes forward have been married couples in tragic circumstances.
These are are elected TD’s ? People using a serious issue as an excuse to forward their personal religious views. Haven’t we had enough of religion being used as a society moderator in this country?
(btw Ronan, the word used was fornication, not sex, fornication being consensual sex between two people who are not married. )
Fornication isn’t consensual sex between two unmarried partners PWD, it’s “the sin of” consensual sex between two (or, presumably, more) unmarried partners. It’s that whole “sin” part that’s the worrying bit. When we start legislating for abortion on the basis of what is and is not a sin as defined in a book allegedly written thousands of years ago by goat herders in Palestine (but actually collated as a political power play in Rome around about the thirteenth century), then we’re in serious trouble.
You mean I can’t fornicate with my husband?? but it sounds like so much more fun than regular ol’ sex!
I wouldn’t say she’d be too energetic, sackwise, herself..
Wow, there’s nothing quite like a sprinkle of religious nonsense, to make you feel like you’re back in the 1950′s; how did this woman ever get elected?
Don.t have to go that far back, remember the 1980′s… Film, Life of Brian -Banned also amendment 8 which started all this
Sounds like a religious nut! Was hoping religious nuts didn’t get elected these days. Besides the vote was for permitting “abortions to be carried out in Ireland under limited circumstances”, my impression was that it was going to be in very extreme circumstances where this legislation would be applicable. So she isn’t really addressing the issue at all.
Another Dana!
@ Sharon Ni Riada
NNNNNNNNNNNNNNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! :(
Unmarried sex ! I wonder what her attitude would be if both people were married ,but just not to each other ? Or if one was married and the other not , or well we could go on forever … How old is this woman ? Is she for real ? All joking aside I think her comments are quite insulting and she is to be pitied , because she has set herself up to be ridiculed ! Ah well it takes all sorts , only thing is this one is in government
Surely it’s the sin of ejaculation that causes pregnancy? The 4 minutes of fornication beforehand is just a romantic preamble you have to get through. Like paperwork
4 minutes !!! At least 45 minutes please
National service for young men is a good idea, the amount of young thugs is ridiculous, the other points I disagree
Yeah lets teach them how to kill people. That will help.
Why only young men? What about young women?
So let me get this straight, you think the way to deal with thugs is to arm and train them?
Sorry of course women also, eh teach them to kill lol it’s the Irish army!! it could teach them a trade give them something to do
National service would financially cripple this country. There’s hardly enough work for the PDF as it is. Only this week we saw an enormous amount of applications for less than 100 recruit places. That’s all we need ,more public sector workers.
I still dont understand why FFG/Labour/FF voted against the motion …. Are these TDs so out of touch with reality? Only SF/ULA’s voted in favor of the legislation to allow a woman to have an abortion if a medical doctor deems that her life is in danger if she proceeds with the pregnancy. Where are all the FFg/Labour/FF apologists on this one? The Irish people have taken enough sh*t from these lying financial terrorists and hypocritcal backward looking gombeens. They will get a very loud and clear message at the next election. I am ashamed to call myself Irish today.
How many Sinn Fein TDs voted for this private member’s motion?
All the SF TDs that were present. Why?
A – because of the ridiculous whip system being applied and B – because even if it wasn’t applied a lot of them wouldn’t have the balls to follow their conscience and risk upsetting their potential “holy Ireland” voters.
And this issue aside, some people believe this lot would put the countries interest before their own? the mind boggles.
How many SF TDs were present?
Paul, did you repost the same question in error? Or are you suggesting what i said was inaccurate? The data to back up what i stated is now available on multiple web-sites. I really dont understand what your question or implication is? Please dont tell me you are going to try and defend your El Duce FG leader on this one??
SF TD Pearse Doherty wrote to the “pro life campaign” to give them a personal commitment to oppose any legislation that would make abortion available in Ireland and to support a law to protect the human embryo from deliberate destruction.
Be careful with the typing Paul if you dropped the F in your question what would you get :-)
SF TD Pearse Doherty wrote to the “Pro Life Campaign” to give them a written personal commitment to oppose any legislation that would make abortion available in Ireland and support a law to protect the human embryo from deliberate destruction.
Cal: How many SF TDs were present?
Paul, AGAIN, because you didnt hear me the first time, The Indo, Times etc have all said that SF voted in support of the bill … if you have a comment to make, please go ahead and make it. I dont think that people want to hear your defense of the FFG position today. Total religeous nut jobs.
Cal: First I asked you how many Sinn Fein TDs supported the Private Members’ Motion. You answered that all those Sinn Fein TDs who were present voted for it. I then asked you how many Sinn Fein TDs were present for the vote. These are two different questions. Two different questions with two different answers.
Get a life paul turning this into anti-sinn fein agenda. A woman should be allowed to have an abortion if they deem it necessary to do so. Its not about god its about a persons well being. God has nothing to do with it.
There are 14 Sinn Fein TDs. Were they all present for the vote?
Paul, I asked you of you were supporting your El Duce facist party leader and all the FG TDs who voted against the motion today? Please answer this? I dont have the exact numbers you asked for, but as i keep repeating, all the media outlets have stated totally unambiguously that SF voted in favor of the motion.
@Paul,
Mary Lou McDonald, Gerry Adams and Pearse Doherty have all said they personally dont support abortion… but they still voted in favor of the motion…
“Sinn Féin leader Gerry Adams said he was personally not in favour of abortion, but said he was against judging or criminalising women who opted for terminations.”
Is there any ambiguity on this?? In other words, it should be a personal choice issue, where GPs etc have made clear that there is a risk to the mother to proceed with the pregnancy.
FFg/Labour/FF do not want to give these women a choice. How sick and screwed up is that?
Sinn Fein voted against extending abortion rights to the North. Their MLAs, then including Gerry Adams, were unanimous on the subject. So while I’m glad they were on the right side of the vote today, unlike the cowards in Labour, it does look like yet another example of SF’s partitionist policies. They do one thing in the North and the opposite in the South.
@Nigel…. You are correct, that in the North, SF did vote against bringing in the wholesale abortion clinics that they have in England. But they did not advocate stopping women in the North (on medical advice) having abortions in hospitals there. Abortions take place in every Northern hospital, based on emergency. What the Northern Government voted against, was the opening of clinics dedicated to abortions like they have in England. Personally i think that this is a backward policy. Every country in Europe (to the best of my knowledge) facilitates abortion based on personal choice and not just medical grounds. We in the south dont have a clear law on either right now, and the ultra-right facist parties want to keep it that way.
I hope it was just a freudian slip of the tongue when in answer to an article about ‘fornication’ you stated ‘private members motion!’ Ooh, Missus…..that’s a bit of a cock-up! Oops! There I go again with my double entendres !
T.D.s can have their ups and downs ofcourse like anyone…..dear, oh dear!……
Cal: You lie. Pearse Doherty did not vote for the private members’ motion on abortion.
Only 9 of 14 Sinn Fein TDs voted for the private members’ motion on abortion. Pro-choice party, my foot.
Paul, i am so surprised at the accusation …
Pearse Doherty, according to the link you sent me, did not vote…
So, where did i lie?
This is a direct quote from the SF speaker during the debate…..
Deputy Aengus Ó Snodaigh: “Sinn Féin is not in favour of abortion but in the case of rape, incest or sexual abuse, or where a woman’s life and mental health is at risk or in grave danger Sinn Féin accepts that the final decision rests with the woman. We have analysed the Bill and we believe a number of serious concerns arise about aspects of it, some of which were raised by Government Deputies and others during the debate last night and previously. However, it is our view that the legislation should go forward to Committee Stage to allow those concerns to be fully discussed and addressed properly rather than putting it off to another date”
Where do you see anything that is wrong with this statement… Even though the majority of the SF TDs dont support wholesale abortion, like i mentioned in my previous comments, they still did what is right for the pregnant woman/victim. In other words, if she feels that she cannot proceed with a pregnancy for a valid medical or moral reason, then its up to the woman to decide, not the state.. I will ask you to retract your “lie” comment, as i find it deeply offensive.
You wrote that “Mary Lou McDonald, Gerry Adams and Pearse Doherty have all said they personally dont support abortion… but they still voted in favor of the motion…”
In fact, Pearse Doherty didn’t vote in favour of the motion.
Paul, if you want to be pedantic …. Pearce Doherty did not vote against the motion.. How is that? What is your preoccupation with individual SF TDs anyway? All i can say is that all the SF TDs that were present (and i said in many times in my previous posts on this thread, because you obviously dont get it), SF voted in favor of the motion. Your Il Duce leader and his facist government voted it down. They would rather see women who were raped being forced to organise flights, hospital visits etc in another country, because in our facist state, no woman should be allowed to have an abortion. I think you guys are sick.
Must be Sarah Pallin’s long lost cousin
This is another reason students need to vote! If they did, then cretins like this yoke wouldnt get voted it by their elderly catholic grandparents.
So are “elderly catholic grandparents” to be disenfranchised?
Not at all but the people who this could affect should be out there voting.
Infact, this shouldnt even require a vote. It should be a service provided like cervical screening or condoms.
Surely this must be LOL of the week.
The LOL of the whole Universe for the next 2,000 years.
She clearly represents the Vatican and not her people. She is supposed to be a servant of the people not someone playing god.
Does she even understand the motion? If so, she is even more insulting. This isn’t just a motion re abortion, it’s abortion for MEDICAL reasons ie where a foetus has no hope of survival outside the womb. It is only if there is a risk to the woman’s life that a termination will be given in Ireland. As such, there are many women who have to travel to terminate an often much wanted baby and SHOCK HORROR a lot of them are married (which has no relevance whatsoever!). Please see http://m.facebook.com/?_rdr#!/MakeTerminationForMedicalReasonsAvailableInIreland?__user=596324070
It is because of MORONIC small-minded insulting women like her that I’m glad I don’t live in Ireland anymore!
Any chance the Irish Government could actually implement a #fornicationtax so I can be classed as a tax exile. I’d like to see the Dept of Revenue investigate those offshore deposit accounts!
Maybe we should tax this Fornication practice? If you can’t stop it tax it.
sarcasm?
Indeed. News just in the Revenue Commissioners are advertising new positions ‘Fornication Inspectors’
What a crazy woman. Many of my friends are Atheist. They have very much wanted children who will not grow up thinking of sex as “dirty” and contraception as a “sin”. Along with the benefit of not worrying about burning for eternity in a lake of fire for going against one of the 2500 gods that are believed in on this planet. Keep religion out of government or you are not representing the people. Religion is dying out in most countries with an educated population, just that a lot of people deny it when they fill out their census.
It’s always the preachy ones that fornicate
I for one would like to thank Ms. Mulhern for setting aside her important work in the field of particle physics to bring us this groundbreaking information. Is there a Nobel prize for stating the obvious that we can nominate her for or something?
There’s the annual Ig Nobel Prize ceremony. Lots of categories. They don’t tend to include politicians much though, probably because they’d win them all.
@Seamus
“The foot in mouth” nobel prize!
The Earth is flat
Hope she goes for a long walk then
Personally, I blame extraterrestrials.
Poor Mayo… They have 2 gombeens.. Both from same group of headers. She must feel women know nothing. God help her sense. Seems to be another Td who hasn’t learned how society works particularly in relation to pregnancies wanted or unwanted. We need to support women no matter what the circumstances.
Who’s the other gombeen? Michael Ring or John O’Mahoney?
Whose John o Mahoney? At least Mr Ring has announced plenty for his home town when he got the chance. Might not suit the rest of us but he is right to look after his own. Mayo must have 3 gombeens so.
Why national service for just men? Is it so the lady folk can be raising the childer?
Someone should suggest to her that pregnancies could be reduced while maintaining the level of fornication merely by utilising “the little door at the back”. I’d love to see the sparks that would fly after that.
lmfao at this one…a McDonalds statement ” I’m loving it”
she could front the campaign to stop fornication. i for one would think twice about fornicating if her image was used as a deterrent.
I’m not even going to try and spin this one haha.
What a backward speech!
Jeasus David! I usually ignore you but I had to ask you to at least make a try. Or is it just the backwoodswimmin you abandon.
Go on David she’s in the Taoiseach’s constituency he obviously knows her very well.
How in hell do these people get elected?
I live in MM’s constituency and I’d love to know the answer to that… seems people are willing to vote for the party, regardless of the qualities of the candidate….. This is blue shirt, conservative Inda country – and Michelle has strong religious beliefs that seem to be a big part of her story – but she doesn’t speak for us all!
What a backward ignorant person.
This was said by a TD of Ireland.
One of the people Running our country.
The best of the best, and deserve their high pay!!
Fine Gael is a party filled with lunatics. Their backbenchers are like something out of The Tea Party Movement in the US.
Don’t let her represent everyone in our party. I don’t know a single YFGer whose agreed with what she said and most people are roundly condemning it!
David, all your party voted against the motion … if you are a real man, dont make excuses. Abandon the facist FFg approach and start up your own part with all like minded YFG. Dont make excuses.
New parties go nowhere in Ireland. Don’t get into power and you get ZERO in terms of change.
Already Young Fine Gael has changed party policy on Gay Marriage and we can do so much more. Thankfully our liberal and progressive outlook confines most of these fornication views to the fringes of our party.
Is it the year 1612 again?
Dis we flip back in time during the night in Eire.?
Easy explanation….she’s from Mayo! :D
Wait a minute everybody stop for a second, I aint got no phd but is this ‘politician’ saying sex can lead to pregnancy ? Really?
Dumb, dumb, dumb. If there really was a god, he would have given this TD some cop-on…
I assume she thinks National Service will be a form of contraception.
I didn’t read all of that statement cos I’m a non believer n js wouldn waste my time. but as a multi-cultural country in the 21st century, WHY is religion being brought into it? let the public decide never mind quotin the bible!? such a backwards view on it!!
The fact that people like her can be elected is good in so far as it shows that our electoral system is still open to any opinionated moron who chooses to put themselves forward, however it is also part of the reason why all of us and your children are going to be the bitches of the Eu for the next 50 years.
South Carolina is right. Clearly, the separation of church and state is far further away than I thought.
I feel chagrined.
I suppose women who needs their lives saved will keep having to drag their endangered asses onto planes and get and abortion in the UK.
Sex leads to pregnency?
MIND BLOWN
Look at the picture. P.
I think she wants to be the Irish Sarah Palin, god help us all
Redneck rhetoric from a pious, self agrandising, backward balloon. Go serve at The Holy See if you are that hardcore…oh I forgot your own religion are just as prejudiced against you as you are against others…what a tool!
I wonder does she even realise what she said.
The real question is, Does she care what she said …. Women being forced to travel to England to save their lives, because of the FFg/Labour/FF Pro Catholic Church attitudes is a disgrace. These women are made feel dirty and criminalised because of government attitudes. We all know that the reason they voted against it, is because they know that the older generation (who are naturally more religeous and conservative) would give them an earful. FF have zero right to claim that this is part of the troika agreement. They should have voted on conscience, rather than on cynical vote-getting platforms. I am sick of the facist approach the established parties take with our rights.
Women aren’t dying because they’re being refused treatment during pregnancy. To say such a thing is a huge slur on our brilliant pre-natal care. Doctors and obstetricians will do their best for mother and baby. I
And next up is the minister and her category is stating the bleeding obvious, and here was me thinking that thinking bad thoughts leads to pregnancy
Her statements are not controversial, they’re just plain sill!
She just needs a good !.-!
she should be banned from talking stripped of her position as t.d and should be put back in the kitchen after that comment. and wost of all this is the kind of aptitude the people who run the country have.
@Liz, Are you listening to her on The Last Word now? If not, definitely do later if it’s available on playback. Unbelievable.
I suspect she was merely trying to differentiate between that and ” immaculate conceptions”!
Whoever voted for that woman is sick in the head.
@Chopper, i can’t, i’m sick at home and i may combust if i have to listen such nausea. I am shocked that people like that get air time, and also that people vote someone like that in. Vile, ugly, bigoted and stupid she is.
and they once said there was no sex in Ireland before television .
Maybe they still haven’t got television in parts of Mayo?
She is perfectly entitled to her opinions, I’m sure they’re sincerely held. Those here who have accused her of being small minded and intolerant are in fact displaying those exact characteristics by trashing her! We want a Dail that represents all walks of life and her views will be shared by many people in the country.
Okay who went and voted the lunatics into government, hands up?!!
She’s given us a good laugh to be sure, but leaving aside the depressing moral judgement implicit in the term, the statement is probably true. A majority (but by no means all) of ‘unwanted’ pregnancies ARE probably caused by sex between unmarried people.
And?
What I don’t understand is what this observation has to do with ANYTHING in the proposed legislation that was being debated. Unless of course she’s advocating the free availability of contraceptives and comprehensive sex education from an early age as a government priority, in which case I completely agree with her. But I suspect that isn’t it…
The irony of posters here using phrases like “my God” in their condemnation of her views :D
Its no different to using the phrase ‘my ballix’.
Sean Beag – the definition of fornication is not “sex”
Actually it is, although it is used by religious folk to describe premarital sex.
Its any sex outside of marriage
I think what she meant is that things shouldn’t be illegal just because they’re a sin.
“Abortion as murder, therefore sin, which is the religious argument, is no more sinful, from a scriptural point of view, than all other sins we don’t legislate against, like greed, hate and fornication.”
To me that translates at: “We don’t make greed, hate, and unmarried sex a crime, so let’s not make abortion a crime just because it’s a sin.”
It says an awful lot about political jargon when our politicians need their english translated into english.
Conor if she meant that why didn’t she say that ? She said what she said . I would like her to answer Why did she say it ?
@Conor Farrell
That’s what I interpreted her speech to mean as well.
Mulherin is SO lucky to have SO many interpreters on here all equally as ignorant of the motion that was rejected today …..
What makes you think I’m ignorant of the motion? I only commented on the language she used.
sorry, should read…
Her statements are not controversial, they’re just plain silly!
If Michelle Mulherin thought she had something worth saying , she should at least frame her wisdom in a form free of tautology and consistent with that of a person fit to represent her constituents . If she cannot or will not , perhaps would find a more congenial place across the water in the Tea Party .
Michelle has claimed 46000 euro exspenses since the goverment was formed. She is not that daft.
Hahahahahahahahahahaha
Dream of Californication
Equating England and the enlightenment is unhistorical to say the least. It’s status as ‘a Protestant country’ relates to the reformation which is a completely different thing. In if you want to use religious labels a predominantly catholic country like France played a greater role in the age of enlightenment than England which remains wedded to an archaic monarchial system which maintains a state church
‘Down with that sort of thing’
Oliver J Flanagan has been reborn!! Serves him right it’s in a woman’s body :)
Wait till this oracle gets started on teh gays.
Fornication is only the curtain raiser, sodomy will be the main event. In Irish politics it’s always the ones with the least experience who believe they have the most to contribute on the subject of sex, sexuality and who’s allowed.
(I would)
Just sayin’
Dream of Californication !!!!
As a Mayo person I am deeply shocked by Michelle’s comment. I have to admit I gave her a 3 in the last General Election but after today she will not get my vote. I may not agree with abortion but Michelle’s comments were by far extreme
Strikes me that she has all the features of a nineteenth century middle class philanthropist. She sees it as her place in society to help only the ” deserving poor” and espouse good christian morals amongst the lower classes. “Entitlements ” took a long time to come about. They removed the stigma of having to beg for assistance from the “relieving officer ” or VDePaul. Regarding the stigmatisation of single parents by the ultra right wing religious. It’s not that long since The Joanne Hayes case and the death of Anne Lovett , maybe she thinks that’s the best way to treat those who have unprotected sex . This government is all about rolling back the clock where citizens rights have a financial cost, under any guise.
sorry iv jus read Johan’s comment more or less the same :-)
Strange I can post the previous comment and yet I was censored when I spoke of Denis O Brian on another item.
Mother church still has her talons clutching many people in this state. I can now understand the old cry of “Home rule is Rome rule”. Rome certainly controls this ignorant woman.
It’s very disappointing to hear an elected representative coming out with this kind of rubbish. Did she even think about what she was saying? Embarrassing…
Funny how those who condemn this woman go on to say things that are much worse. Ironic!
Is there another way to get pregnant? She seems to think so or is it just the lawyer in her covering all her bases
Yes, let us respond to these ignorant and publicity-baiting comments by perpetuating thick Mick stereotypes about people in the West. Newsflash: there are idiots from D4 too!
Yeah I saw them in their tent instead of one of their 21 houses!
What an intelligent observation.
Oliver J Flanagan has been reborn!! Serves him right it’s in a woman’s body
You ain’t refering to her then…
“Controversial comment”?
Ridiculous journalistic liberty-taking, rather, to describe the comment, in context, as “controversial”
have your say