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Column Culture was Farmleigh's answer; Dublin Castle was about quick economic wins

Of the two forums on global Irish economics, Farmleigh’s message that culture was the answer to our fiscal woes got lost along the way, writes culture business consultant Anna Walsh.

LIKE MOST IDEAS, culture and economics are interdependent. Yet in the national effort to try and restore Ireland’s reputation, political, media and public expectations of the arts are caught up in cultural gloop.

In the last three and a half difficult years, there have been two Global Irish Economic forums and one change of government. In this short time of economic disarray, quite different expectations of culture and the arts have been expressed. Political upheaval and influences apart, is it timely to examine how culture might effectively contribute to the restoration of Ireland’s damaged reputation?

Business is the activity of economics with a clear expectation of return on capital invested. The arts are one manifestation of culture, be it personal, local, national, regional or global. Historically, the unquantifiable political objectives of social cohesion, national identity and prestige justified the investment of public money in the arts.

“Discussions bypassed innovation along with research and development to focus on culture”

Consider the mindset that prevailed pre-Farmleigh. In the run up to the 2009 Forum, global financial collapse had triggered a downfall in the Irish public and private finances. The Administration was in disarray having being lulled into a false sense of surplus. Corruption, a lack of governance, bankruptcy and scandals were corroding the national reputation. Competitiveness had been eroded. Ireland had lost bureaucratic friends through arrogance and extravagance and a general election loomed.

At the first Forum, a few hundred influential business people, entertainers, cultural diplomats and politicians discussed the restoration of national reputation. Unexpectedly, these discussions bypassed Innovation along with research and development, the predictable panaceas for economic ills, to focus on culture.

So how was it that culture came to prominence at Farmleigh, billed as an economic think tank for invited guests mainly from the world of business? Was it simply a lack of political will to directly tackle the deepening national economic and fiscal crises? Or might it have been that delegates, with their international business perspective, had an innate sense of culture’s role in enhancing national reputation and prestige?

“Enhancing national prestige increases the attractiveness of Ireland as a Foreign Direct Investment location”

Professor of Economics, John O’Hagan, presented his views of the economic importance of national prestige in the 2010 Trinity College Dublin Leadership Forum. One simplistic interpretation of the argument in his paper, Arts and Culture – A Future for Ireland? goes as follows:

National prestige is a virtuous circle. Enhancing national prestige increases the attractiveness of Ireland as a Foreign Direct Investment (FDI) location and tourism as well as the perceived value of exports, all of which further enhance national prestige.

To my mind, this unsentimental economic view of the value of the arts underpinned the first Forum discussion.

After the Forum, the media presentation and the public’s perception of the discussion degenerated rapidly into terse exchanges between artists and their public pay masters. While Ireland’s pre-eminent reputation in the arts was seen by the Farmleigh gathering as an obvious means to enhance Ireland’s reputation, it was, and still is, abhorrent to the artists whose value was to be leveraged and monetised in the national cause.

After the Forum, the media presentation and the public’s perception of the discussion degenerated rapidly into terse exchanges between artists and their public pay masters. While Ireland’s pre-eminent reputation in the arts was seen by the Farmleigh gathering as an obvious means to enhance Ireland’s reputation, it was, and still is, abhorrent to the artists whose value was to be leveraged and monetised in the national cause.

“Somewhere between the House and the Castle, expectations of culture shifted”

By 2011, some economic sores had been lanced. Political and administrative minds were trained on national competitiveness. Considerations of fiscal rectitude, debt as well as the restoration of investor confidence in Ireland’s banking system and business ecosystem were paramount. The Forum, opened by Taoiseach Enda Kenny, discussed how to make Ireland “the best small country in the world in which to do business” in a crisp, business-like manner. Actions, outcomes and results of the quantifiable economic variety were the order of this Forum. In contrast to Farmleigh, where culture was a means to positively influence and engage with the wider world, Dublin Castle was all about impact and quick economic wins.

Somewhere between the House and the Castle, expectations of culture shifted. With a few notable exceptions, such as delegate affirmations of the efficacy of Culture Ireland’s Imagine Ireland promotional programme in the US and the proposed World Actors’ Forum in 2013, Dublin Castle deliberations focused on the necessary conditions to restore the markets’ confidence, regain competitiveness and attract investment. A support role for the arts in this bid to enhance competitiveness, even as Ireland’s global business calling card, was downplayed. The arts as propaganda or economic grease were no longer the issues. As a result, no artist was offended. None were engaged either. Depending on the argument, the social glue and economic grease benefits of investment in the arts were randomly combined. Cultural gloop resulted.

“Quantifiable actions with quarterly results prevailed. It’s easy to see why culture wasn’t a priority”

In this Government’s first year, restoring competitiveness was the political imperative. Efforts to support enterprise, attract FDI and drive exports were strenuous. Quantifiable actions with quarterly results prevailed. In these conditions, it’s easy to see why culture wasn’t a priority. However, with national reputation and prestige being key to maintaining high levels of FDI, tourism and exports in fiercely competitive international markets, have the arts some role in regaining national competitive advantage?

One goal in the Department of Arts, Heritage and the Gaeltacht’s Statement of Strategy 2011–2014 is “to promote and develop Ireland’s world-class artistic and creative strengths at home and abroad, maximising their societal, economic and reputational value for the country”. This goal suggests a deliberate social glue role for the arts as well as economic grease and national prestige ones too. However, the economic and societal benefits of investment in the arts should be carefully considered if the cultural gloop is not to thicken.

Taoiseach Kenny’s stated objective of “making Ireland the best small country in the world in which to do business” might well have a complementary cultural objective. The traditional argument for the investment of public money in the arts, that of social glue, the ties that bind us, one to the other, as we exchange not just goods and services but ideas, meaning and a sense of who we are at home and around the world has renewed relevance. Culture wasn’t just for Farmleigh. Creating a civil society, or more explicitly, making Ireland the best small country in the world in which to live and do business, might both be pre-requisites for success. It’s now time to reach for economic success as well as a civil society, not just one or the other.

Anna Walsh is director of Culture Business Consultancy and has an MA in Arts Management and Cultural Policy from UCD.

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3 Comments
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    Mute James Lyons
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    Aug 13th 2017, 7:52 AM

    So the man who incited the hate condemns it?

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    Mute Danny foley
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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:15 AM

    @James Lyons: did he incite hate???? Link please.

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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:17 AM

    @Danny foley: how long have you got Danny? Come on you can use Google. I have plenty of faith in you. Even Ask Jeeves about the wall Trump wants to build and you’ll get some evidence

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    Mute Francis Mc Carthy
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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:19 AM

    @Danny foley: “Did he incite hate?” Bwahahahaha

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    Mute Danny foley
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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:20 AM

    @James Lyons: so proper enforcement of the immigration law in any country is hateful and racist. Anyone who questions your type of society is racist?????

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    Mute Danny foley
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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:21 AM

    @Francis Mc Carthy: link please? More leftist hysterical behaviour. Ridiculous.

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    Mute Old Gabby Johnson
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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:22 AM

    @Danny foley: No being racist and saying racist things makes you racist… are you suggesting that the Ku Klux Klan who formed part of yesterdays protest or the ultra white militias are just misunderstood?

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    Mute James Lyons
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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:24 AM

    @Danny foley: what a way to twist words there. I said he incited hate.
    Not all Trump supporters are racist but I’d go out on a limb and say most racists are Trump supporters

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    Mute Old Gabby Johnson
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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:25 AM

    @Danny foley: Had a look at your twitter feed there danny – where does all the hate come from bud? Were you not held enough as a child… ? Harbouring some illicit thoughts about your sexuality?… come on danny have a coke and a smile.. the world is great.

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    Mute Danny foley
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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:26 AM

    @Old Gabby Johnson: the deputy mayor was tweeting about hating white culture and demanding the general Lee statue be removed and people protested as is their right. The situation is much more complicated than the media would have or like to have us believe.

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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:29 AM

    @Old Gabby Johnson: stalking me now? LOL the world is never black and white. What hate??

    56
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    Mute Francis Mc Carthy
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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:30 AM

    Hmmmm..I wonder were those protesters that were ploughed down yesterday,were they being “loud & obnoxious” like the Black Lives Matter activist who was kicked and punched at a Trump campaign rally ? Do you remember the words that he said? Let me remind you : “Maybe he should have been roughed up because it was absolutely disgusting what he was doing.” Trump also said that the man deserved the treatment because he had been “very obnoxious” and “so loud.”

    Or this beauty : “Try not to hurt him. If you do, I’ll defend you in court, don’t worry about it.”

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    Mute Old Gabby Johnson
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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:35 AM

    @Danny foley: Not stalking no – just curious – your feed is a mish-mash of anti-immigrant propaganda, brexit nonsense and a load of other sh**e. The general lee statue is a symbol of red neck racism – are you with those guys? – and before you say freedom of speech – the south in the civil war wanted to maintain slavery – and the confederate flag is a racist wolf whistle…as you well know.

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    Mute Paul Furey
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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:57 AM

    @Danny foley: just check his tweets and listen to some of his tweets.

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    Mute Danny foley
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    Aug 13th 2017, 9:00 AM

    @Paul Furey: I don’t want to see what Gabby tweets.

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    Mute domas1507
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    Aug 13th 2017, 9:58 AM

    @Danny foley: no that’s not racist, sweeping generalisations of whole nations based on a minorities actions is. You’re profile picture is a bit telling too. Can you tell me what benefit leaving the EU would be to us at a time when we finally have the upper hand when dealing with our neighbours. I presume it’s love of your country and not just uncontrolled anger has you feeling that way

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    Mute ADLynch
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    Aug 13th 2017, 10:42 AM

    @Danny foley: Be quiet you clown.

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    Mute Diarmuid
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    Aug 13th 2017, 10:46 AM

    Hiring Alt-Right fascists in his administration.

    The Orange Clown likes anyone who praises him.

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    Mute Chris Finn
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    Aug 13th 2017, 10:55 AM

    @Danny foley: you need help

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    Mute Austin Rock
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    Aug 13th 2017, 11:34 AM

    @neilo: I think it would be more democratic if rather than mouthing off like the silly Mayor and holding a referendum as they do in Switzerland to have symbols of history removed might be more democratic. Change is good but because some Mayor has an axe to grind and manages to offend the majority of people in his state – then you get conflict and conflict is not good. It brings out the worst types and America seems to be full of it.

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    Aug 13th 2017, 11:50 AM

    @Danny foley: what was this march called again? Surely the name of the event would reflect what it was about? Oh yeah, that’s right, it was called United the Right, nothing about a statue and nothing about a deputy mayor. Most marchers were out of towners

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    Mute Zx5vZulB
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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:27 AM

    What the hell are they doing, pulling down statues of heroes of times past? Do they have no respect for their own history, brief as it is? What is wrong with americans

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    Mute Chris M.
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    Aug 13th 2017, 9:27 AM

    @Zx5vZulB: that is the modern left for you, the real fascists.

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    Mute Mr Phil Officer
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    Aug 13th 2017, 10:20 AM

    @neilo: there’s no view from Nelsons column anymore.

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    Mute Diarmuid
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    Aug 13th 2017, 10:47 AM

    @Zx5vZulB: Cromwell is a hero to some people on this island.

    Pick up a history book champ.

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    Aug 13th 2017, 10:56 AM

    @Diarmuid: Hitler is a hero to some on this island as well, I never understood the contradiction of loyalists celebrating the men of WW2 in one hand while flying the swastika with the other, maybe they should read a book.

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    Aug 13th 2017, 9:56 PM

    @Zx5vZulB: only happy when they are out robbing oil.

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    Mute Dell
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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:35 AM

    This element was always there, Trump used it to win his election and now he’s lost control of it. He can’t fully condemn his alt right following because he wants another term but he has to say something because he is their president so he gives the most bland condemnation ever. These lunatics see that as an endorsement.

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    Mute Deborah Behan
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    Aug 13th 2017, 1:04 PM

    @Dell: what has Trump done to America? Is this making America great again? We’re back in the racist 60s again.

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    Aug 13th 2017, 4:12 PM

    @Deborah Behan: no Deborah he’s made America hate again..

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    Mute Francis Mc Carthy
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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:18 AM

    Trumps comments pleased a lot of his fan base,except David Puke,whom wasn’t too amused with Trumps comments..But lets’s stay with the “positive” replies of Trumps fan base..

    “Trump comments were good. He didn’t attack us. He just said the nation should come together. Nothing specific against us. … No condemnation at all. When asked to condemn, he just walked out of the room. Really, really good. God bless him.” — Daily Stormer

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    Mute Diarmuid
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    Aug 13th 2017, 10:51 AM

    @neilo: Like saying the Jewish resistance in the Warsaw Ghetto Uprising were equally as responsible for violence as the Nazis.

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    Mute John Mc Grath
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    Aug 13th 2017, 9:41 AM

    The answer to non-white identity politics must not be white identity politics, we must get back to placing the individual at the centre of our societies. Individual rights and responsibilities not group rights. This has been escalating for awhile now, people have retreated to ideological echo chambers. The Alt-right and Antifa are a mirror image of each other. Race based politics will lead to more division, if we continue down this road I do not hold out much hope for the future.

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    Mute Dean Burroughs
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    Aug 13th 2017, 10:13 AM

    @John Mc Grath: the alt right isn’t race based it’s individual based just as you described, antifa are basically militant communists that are sick of playing video games

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    Mute Dave Bruen
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    Aug 13th 2017, 10:49 AM

    @Dean Burroughs: it wasn’t only antifa who gathered to oppose the racists. Countering pathetic white supremacists is not the preserve of the far left.

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    Mute Atheos Euripides
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    Aug 13th 2017, 10:49 AM

    @Dean Burroughs: Antifa weren’t the ones playing Call of Duty with automatic weapons and beer bellies (evidence of a sedentary lifestyle) hanging out, it was the Alt-Right racists.

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    Mute Liam flag
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    Aug 13th 2017, 10:56 AM

    @Atheos Euripides: Defending antifa? Why don’t we all just agree that both sides are a bunch of violent knobs? Member the G20 protests? I member

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    Mute Dave O Keeffe
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    Aug 13th 2017, 11:58 AM

    @Liam flag: let’s just agree that one side attempted to kill as many people as possible and it wasn’t antifa

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    Mute Atheos Euripides
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    Aug 13th 2017, 12:47 PM

    @Liam flag: Where did I defend Antifa, I just said they didn’t have weapons, you’re a paranoid wreck.

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    Mute Deborah Behan
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    Aug 13th 2017, 1:13 PM

    @John Mc Grath: only one side drove a car into a crowd to kill maximum amount of people. You’re pathetic excuse to try to equate racist, sexist, homophobic arseholes with people who oppose them is a joke.

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    Mute Liam flag
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    Aug 13th 2017, 2:34 PM

    @Dave O Keeffe: Complete nonsense Dave. United the right had armed militias walking around. If they wanted to kill as many people as possible, they would have done so. Derp

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    Mute John Mc Grath
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    Aug 13th 2017, 2:45 PM

    @Deborah Behan: yet again your ability to read what was not written , or to see this is not a one sided problem is astounding.

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    Mute Seth Cheffetz
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    Aug 13th 2017, 7:46 AM

    Did Trump condemn himself?

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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:11 AM

    @Seth Cheffetz: all these antifa BLM crowd want is freedom of speech and tolerance of alternative view’s. They should never be questioned on their own behaviour cause that in its self would be racist

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    Mute Charlie Kavanagh
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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:33 AM

    @Danny foley: anti EU but pro Nazi…pull yer neck in ye muppet

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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:46 AM

    @Charlie Kavanagh: I’m pro Nazi?

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    Mute Ron North
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    Aug 13th 2017, 9:29 AM

    @Danny foley: Oh God yes.

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    Mute Charlie Kavanagh
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    Aug 13th 2017, 10:05 AM

    @Danny foley: probably more pro stupid to be fair to ye

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    Mute Diarmuid
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    Aug 13th 2017, 10:50 AM

    @Danny foley: Anti-EU avatar with a line through it…

    So you’re Pro-EU?

    Making as much sense as your beloved Orange Clown.

    24
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    Mute Warthog
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    Aug 13th 2017, 12:23 PM

    @neilo: Kettle calling kettle black there. Still in the bubble I see

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    Mute Charlie Kavanagh
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    Aug 13th 2017, 12:28 PM

    @Warthog: go back to yer cave troglodyte

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    Mute Atheos Euripides
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    Aug 13th 2017, 12:45 PM

    @Warthog: It’s actually pot calling kettle black.

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    Mute Warthog
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    Aug 13th 2017, 1:46 PM

    @Atheos Euripides: Duh

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    Mute Warthog
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    Aug 13th 2017, 2:26 PM

    @neilo: hahahaha your funny and so far off the mark. Need to to pay a visit to SpecSavers.

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    Mute gowfc@yahoo.com W
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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:05 AM

    Trump’s base supporters were on display yesterday….ignorant and violent people. America is eating itself under his leadership. And “for evil to succeed” all needs happen is for good men to do noyhing.

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    Mute Danny foley
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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:13 AM

    @gowfc@yahoo.com W: that is some wide brush your wielding there.

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    Mute Francis Mc Carthy
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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:19 AM

    @Danny foley: If the MAGA cap fits and all

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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:19 AM

    @Danny foley: Simple people have simple solutions to complex problems – that’s why they feel empowered from someone who acts and talks like an eight year old to lead them. Bigly!

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    Mute Chris M.
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    Aug 13th 2017, 9:29 AM

    Why did Barack Obama never condem the violence and murders committed by Black Lives Matter???

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    Mute Chris M.
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    Aug 13th 2017, 9:44 AM

    @neilo: it’s important to highlight the blazing double standards at work here. Black Lives Matter is a black supremacist group which is supported and endorsed by the left and members of the media and political class.

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    Mute Chris M.
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    Aug 13th 2017, 9:58 AM

    @neilo: I condemn all political violence. I will point out that the white nationalists were engaging their constitutional right to assembly when set upon and attacked by AntiFa and assorted leftist thugs. People fight back when their constitutional and civil rights are infringed upon.

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    Mute Ossi Fritsche
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    Aug 13th 2017, 10:16 AM

    @Chris M.: Get a life will you and read a history book, first of all the so called Confederate States commeted treason trying to break away from a Union while the British Empire where supporting the confederates. Also Lee broke away from his milatary rank and commeted treason himself where he supported a bunch states that still refuse to acknowledge the loss of the Civil War, which caused the loss of thousends of life to this very day that they are still calling it the aggresion from the north in their sourthern schools.

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    Aug 13th 2017, 10:19 AM

    @Chris M.: By meaning of driving a car inro the anti-racism protesters and rolling back and forth, you really are dellusional. How is that a peaceful protest Chris m tell me.

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    Mute Warthog
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    Aug 13th 2017, 12:20 PM

    @Ossi Fritsche: The original protest was not a support for Facism or Racism (Both sides can attach those labels to their collars). The march from what I read was organised to protest against the intended removal of a statue that has meeaning to an awful lot of people. The other group organized a counter protest and they would also not be the cream of the crop of American society! BOTH sides were spoiling for a fight. The authorities hardly had enough resources to manage the original protest and therefore should have banned the counter protest. So to my mind blame lies with the perp driving the car, the authorities, the counter protest and finally the members of the original monument removal protest. All by the way in that order.

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    Mute Warthog
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    Aug 13th 2017, 12:25 PM

    @neilo: LOL… He learnt that trick from you.

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    Mute Atheos Euripides
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    Aug 13th 2017, 12:50 PM

    @Warthog: The people of the town voted in favour of the removal of the statue, just because the KKK thugs you are defending don’t like democracy, doesn’t mean they can go mowing peaceful protesters down with their cars.

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    Aug 13th 2017, 1:52 PM

    @Warthog: also, the march was not about the statue, it was called Unite the Right. I’d guess most in attendance weren’t even from the area but that was the point, it was about getting far right minded people from all over the country in the same place at the same time.

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    Mute Warthog
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    Aug 13th 2017, 2:17 PM

    @Atheos: I am NOT defending the KKK and their buddies. The perp driving the car hopefully will be locked up for life. I was pointing out those responsible for this atrocity. The authorities knew the importance to this particular monument in the town, surrounding area and throughout The South. It was intentionally provocative. It was also an unnecessary provocation.

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    Aug 13th 2017, 2:21 PM

    @Warthog: There are a lot of monuments around the world which many would love to retain and many others would love to pull down. This statue wasn’t doing any harm, it was a historical connection and a reminder of the past. Where does this stop? Oh lets pull down the Vietnam memorial as we dont agree with the US involvement in indochina. This is the Governor an Co stirring the sheeite, pbly appeasing the other (Black) Supremacist group BLM. They screwed up badly and a women is dead (maybe others) and many injured.. For what?

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    Mute Warthog
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    Aug 13th 2017, 2:24 PM

    @neilo: Deflection, Redirection, Whataboutery and finally hypocritical righteous indignation…

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    Mute Warthog
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    Aug 13th 2017, 2:29 PM

    @Dave O Keeffe:… and yr point is Dave-No.8?

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    Mute Dean Burroughs
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    Aug 13th 2017, 9:05 AM

    Race identity politics were perfected by the democrats, Obama, Hillary and soros, please see the Dallas police massacres or the trump supporter shot in the head by his Hillary supporting neighbor the other day. None of you bashing trump have a leg to stand on lol

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    Mute Atheos Euripides
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    Aug 13th 2017, 10:36 AM

    @Dean Burroughs: 2 points each for Obama and Hilary and I’m going to give you a bonus 5 points for squeezing George Soros on, so 9 points in total for Bigot Bingo, go you!

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    Mute Charlie Kavanagh
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    Aug 13th 2017, 12:25 PM

    @Dean Burroughs: whataboutery is the reserves of the one without a leg to stand on. Stfu.

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    Mute Dave O Keeffe
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    Aug 13th 2017, 1:24 PM

    @Dean Burroughs: tell it to the people that were run over yesterday. Do you believe Trump when he says things have never been worse in America for black people and that he’ll save them? That’s both a lie and identity politics.

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    Mute Chris Cantwell
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    Aug 13th 2017, 1:43 PM

    @Dean Burroughs: I like how the 3 people who replied to you, didn’t bother questioning your comment, but instead attacked you instead.

    Blazing double standards.

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    Mute Dave O Keeffe
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    Aug 13th 2017, 2:03 PM

    @Chris Cantwell: would that make you the fourth? Third really though seeing as I asked him a question based on his comment.

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    Mute Chris Cantwell
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    Aug 13th 2017, 3:10 PM

    @Dave O Keeffe: I hit the “3″ by mistake, only noticed it when I pressed the post button after it. Apologises.

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    Mute failedevolution
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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:14 AM

    The Trump phenomenon shows that we urgently need an alternative to the obsolete capitalism
    http://bit.ly/2oNPIF0

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    Mute KingBen
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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:24 AM

    @failedevolution: what do you suggest? Socialism? Communism? Free sh*t for everyone?

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    Mute Michael Collins
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    Aug 13th 2017, 9:30 AM

    That country is heading to an other civil war

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    Mute Mark Jones
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    Aug 13th 2017, 7:55 AM

    The world’s gone mad. A lot of nasty individuals out there.

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    Mute John
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    Aug 13th 2017, 7:59 AM

    @Mark Jones: Bad dudes

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    Mute p kilgannon
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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:04 AM

    @Mark Jones: the world was always mad sadly. that poor girl ,

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    Mute Old Gabby Johnson
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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:20 AM

    @Mark Jones: They were always there but now they’re crawling out of the woodwork.

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    Mute Squarepeg01
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    Aug 13th 2017, 9:28 AM

    Anyone who self-identifies as alt-right owns this disgusting behaviour. It has nothing to do with traditional American conservatism which stands for limited govt, individual liberty, personal responsibilty, free enterprise, Judeo-Christian values. These people are tainting the brand

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    Mute Atheos Euripides
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    Aug 13th 2017, 10:53 AM

    @Squarepeg01: ‘Judeo-Christian’ values nearly destroyed Ireland, amazing how some consider those values to be a good thing.

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    Mute Squarepeg01
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    Aug 13th 2017, 10:58 AM

    @Atheos Euripides: there were more historical forces at work than just judeo-Christian values. Don’t murder, don’t steal, don’t worship idols, don’t be promiscuous. Sound like good ideas to me.

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    Mute Warthog
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    Aug 13th 2017, 12:04 PM

    @Atheos Euripides: Oh STFU you hypocritical Christophobe. Your like a needle stuck in the groove. Grow up.

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    Mute Atheos Euripides
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    Aug 13th 2017, 12:52 PM

    @Warthog: ‘STFU’ – tells me to ‘grow up’, lol!

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    Mute DaisyChainsaw
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    Aug 13th 2017, 1:22 PM

    @Warthog: A white christian was radicalised and comitted a terrorist act and murdered an innocent woman. Why didnt his family or pastor report him for his radical views? Where are the christian leaders telling their followers not to be violent nazi terrorists? We need a travel ban on these dangerous radicalised christians. They could kill anywhere.

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    Mute Warthog
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    Aug 13th 2017, 2:30 PM

    @DaisyChainsaw: I agree as long as it applies to your Islamic buddies as well.

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    Mute ADLynch
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    Aug 14th 2017, 8:31 AM

    @Warthog: YOU’RE

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    Mute Paul Heffernan
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    Aug 13th 2017, 9:50 AM

    Greatest country in the world!! Hmmm

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    Mute Ths Fer
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    Aug 13th 2017, 9:27 AM

    Idiots on both sides of the protest. Both as authoritarian in their views. Ironically, Robert E. Lee, whose statue they’re fighting about, would disapprove of and loathe both sides equally.

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    Mute Dave Bruen
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    Aug 13th 2017, 10:34 AM

    @Ths Fer: only one side flying swastikas, carrying automatic weapons and murdering people.

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    Mute Atheos Euripides
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    Aug 13th 2017, 10:51 AM

    @Ths Fer: Can I come to your next séance with General Lee?

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    Mute Warthog
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    Aug 13th 2017, 12:06 PM

    @Dave Bruen: Dublin Pegida march… who attacked who? Who was carrying flags that day?

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    Mute Seamus Mc Meel
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    Aug 13th 2017, 3:31 PM

    @Warthog: The Whataboutery is strong in this pig.

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    Mute Charlie Kavanagh
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    Aug 13th 2017, 8:23 AM

    Trump going out of his way not to upset his hardcore base of brain-dead supporters #sad #sickening

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    Mute Time to Wake Up
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    Aug 13th 2017, 12:21 PM

    THE BIGGEST QUESTION HERE IS: WAS THIS KILLED WOMAN A NAZI ?????

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    Mute Lorem Ipsum
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    Aug 13th 2017, 12:50 PM

    @Time to Wake Up: I can’t believe this got one thumbs-up

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