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FINANCE AND PUBLIC EXPENDITURE Minister Paschal Donohoe has said he will take into account all of the advice he has received in relation to whether the government should press on with the National Broadband Plan at a cost of €3 billion.
The National Broadband Plan, first announced in 2012, aims to bring high-speed internet to parts of the country – smaller towns and one-off homes – that are unlikely to be viable business prospects for commercial providers.
The plan has since been beset by delays and setbacks, including the withdrawal of Eir and rival broadband infrastructure giant Siro, a joint venture between Vodafone and ESB, from the bidding process.
US-based investment firm Granahan McCourt is the only firm still vying for the contract for the project, which it plans to build with a group of subcontractors. SSE had been part of its consortium, however the energy giant pulled out of the group in July.
A contract had been expected to be awarded last year, with then communications minister Denis Naughten – who eventually quit his ministerial post over a series of controversial meetings with Granahan McCourt chief David McCourt – saying the network should take three to five years to complete once the deal was signed.
The Taoiseach has said the cost of providing high-speed broadband to 500,000 homes will be “many multiples” of what was anticipated originally, placing a figure of €3 billion on the project.
Advice on the project
Following speculation that the government will proceed with the project, Donohoe told reporters in Dublin today that he will “be taking account of all of the advice that is given to me in relation to the National Broadband Plan”.
“It has gone through a very very extensive debate and process within my own government and with the Department of Communications,” he said, adding:
No recommendation has been taken to government yet… but that will be happening, I believe, soon and I’ll be taking account of all the advice and views on that matter when I give my views on it.
I have got a lot of different views in relation to this project but I think the imperative thing is that we allow the work that is underway in relation to the broadband plan to come to conclusion. “That will he happening and then the Cabinet will be briefed on all of the different issues in relation to it and all of the different opportunities in relation to it.
The minister said the plan that has gone now “a very extensive tendering process”, adding that the government is now aware of the many “different costs and complexities that are involved in relation to a project of this scale and because of this, Cabinet will be well informed and well placed to make a good decision on what is a really important investment in our country’s future”.
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Tax payer pays 3 billion for another company to own it and make a profit off it. Fine little island we live on
@Opinionated: Don’t forget who one if the main shareholders will be… hint, owns half of the Radio, Print media and FFG current and previous ministers.
@Opinionated:
They’ve been arsing around with it since 2104 when Alex White first announced we’d all have it by 2019. All that’s been achieved since then is a few free dinners and a golden handshake for Denis Naughten. Back to square one. These cabbages are incapable of delivering it anytime soon.
@Opinionated: We’ve a good opportunity on the 24th of May to show FF/FG what we think of their little plan. There’s plenty of candidates opposing this farce of a plan.
@Cal Mooney: might not happen. All available money needed for that children’s hospital. Cost will continue to rise there.
@Dave Barrett: and don’t forget. In about 10 years the service will be obsolete, the infastructure will need upgrading and maybe replacing in 20 years. And the Gov will put it out for tender again. And around around we go! Weeeee!
@Opinionated: There’s no need for this, SpaceX plants to have Starlink, a global satellite based high-speed broadband up and running in 5 years…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tp7yYGLlFDo
SpaceX will launch the first 30+ mini-satellites in May.
https://www.teslarati.com/spacex-starlink-dedicated-launch-debut/
@Milk The Drones: it’s been on the go since 2012, it’s obsolete already and they haven’t even started it… All it will be is a waste of taxpayers money
@Cal Mooney: Let me guess….let me guess……oh please let me…let me….DOOH
These Monkeys will sign off on anything that makes corporate Ireland money. ” I am not going to be a public servant for ever, I’ll need a good job when I RETIRE” Anyone seen Enda lately ????? Ah look there he is in the Board Room.
@Cal Mooney: not the Maltese emigrant?
We won’t even own it. Madness
@TechBuzz Ireland: This and the metro are election gimmicks, they will never happen because if they were we would see progress by now. There is a recession due and brexit all this will be kicked into touch then…..FF and FG will be back in power collecting the big bucks in every way possible laughing at the clowns who voted for them.
@TechBuzz Ireland: FG use to call the deal with the M50 toll plaza outrageous. This is worse we fund it then a private company will bill us for it in the future, how come socialism suits FG when we collectively helping big business. Tribunal into the transaction yet.
@TechBuzz Ireland: it’s not worth doing at all at this stage, there are small scale companies delivering broadband to the middle of nowhere at this stage. The National Broadband Plan is outdated and would be an enormous waste of money and resources.
FG , sell all party…
@Willy: your right. Don’t vote them in the Local Elections. It’s a start.
I am from rural ireland and I don’t beleive u will get one person who thinks this is anything but a disaster. 3bn and never own it .
Every house in ireland has an electricity line going to it. Give them the 3bn to stick an extra cable on a pole simple.
@john s: the thing is it’s not that simple
@john s: fundamentally, my issue is for the tax payer to pay 3billion and never own it – that does not represent a good deal in any way of life
@john s: if I get fibre from it then it won’t be a disaster. as usual no one thinks anything the gov. has sticky fingers in will be delivered.
@john s: “Stick an extra cable on a pole”. You’ve just solved the whole problem. Amazing no-one has thought of it before. Tell me this though, have you also come up with a simple way of stopping the electric cable from inducing currents in the fibre optic cable, currents which could not only damage the fibre but potentially any equipment to which the fibre is attached, such as WiFi routers ?
@Tommy Roche: sorry to bust your bubble tommy but fiber optic is nonconductive so it cannot induce current and stringing an extra cable from pole to pole is exactly what the ESB and SIRO are doing at the moment through their MV and LV systems it is available in numerous towns around the country and is the option that they are using in cork city and county at this very moment
@Tommy Roche: Siro is the 1Gbps broadband being delivered by the ESB in partnership with Vodafone… The fibre optic cabling literally runs through the electric cables.
@Tommy Roche: better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than open it and remove all doubt
@ChuckE: but actually it is Chuck and more so the electricity can technically be used as a carrier even so no cables at all required…but that may not benefit yours truly so that’s that then..just like the water meters one must install hardware which one can claim ownership to then one is the owner.
@Paul Gurney: English, speak English , clown
@ObsidianShine: Nope. The fibre runs alongside the copper.
Shouldn’t the headline read: governmemt to decide whether or not to spend 3 billion to rescue Denis naughten’s reputation.
@John Mulligan: Didn’t an independent review find Naughten had done nothing wrong ?
If I was to ask would Denis O’Brien have anything to do with the broadband plan,would my comment be deleted? Asking for a friend…..
@Daithi O’Raimór: yep dirty den ‘invited’ onto the board last week – the whole project will be more crooked than a wire round a pole !!!
This Government need to go NOW! This is absolute madness! This contract needs to go back to Tender again!
@blackcoffee: €6,000 per house for culchies to have broadband…yes madder than the maddest madness.
@Chemical Brothers: thanks for that, I was trying to do the math
Of course they ‘underestimated’ the cost, it’s what FFG do to line their friends’ pockets!
@Keith O’Reilly: There’s only two real possibilities, either it will come in on budget of €3bn or it it won’t. Already there’s warnings that it’ll go significantly over budget so it’s fair to believe this is a significant possibility.
Then we have the question of not just who pays for it, but how exactly it’ll be paid for? Given that it’s all but settled this will cost upwards of €3bn it’s reasonable to say the potential customers will be expected to pay for it, in some fashion. And even at a cost of €3bn this has the potential to be, perhaps, the most expensive broadband on this island, if not in Europe.
Should the costs creep higher, which they have a tendency to do in Ireland, the price to the customer would also creep up, and it’s reasonable to say that many of those customers might not be able to pay such high costs. Or even want to.
If an insufficient amount of customers were willing to sign up to such an expensive broadband plan would it be left to the State, and ultimately the taxpayer, to underwrite it? It wouldn’t be the first time such a deal were done in this country but, in the interest of fairness and transparency, shouldn’t the taxpayer be made aware of this, prior to it being signed?
@Arch Angel: Oh I wouldn’t worry. The tax payer will be made fully aware just as soon as the report of the Tribunal Into The Awarding
Of The Contract To Deliver The National Broadband Plan (it’ll be probably be called something catchier than that) is published in 2035. Or not.
Before someone comes along mentioning 5G as the answer, you need to do a little research. Fibre is based on light, and there is nothing faster than light, meaning fibre will not be obsolete for many decades. At install it will be capable of 1Gbps speeds, but by simply changing the equipment at either end of the cable it can do 10, or even 100Gbps, so it is absolutely future proof.
5G would require many thousands of masts with the fibre infrastructure run to each of them – it would end up costing more than the NBP, and be obsolete within a decade. That’s not to even find out about planning permission on private land etc – 5G is a non runner for broadband infrastructure.
@Johnny Rotten: 5G is grand for last few miles for low density but you are correct you simply cannot beat cabling for performance & investment protection by future proofing.
@Johnny Rotten: so you can build a house on daddy’s farm in the absolute ar$ehole of nowhere and expect the taxpayer to provide you with uncontested fiber to your living room. Is that what you’re saying?
@Johnny Rotten: and how many boerenns will have a data centre at the end of it requiring enterprise data speeds?
There isn’t a country in the world that has talked itself into a similar fiasco
Probably end up costing 3 billion in brown envelopes alone
@Colm Lyons: such an informed comment
@deise: but probably a very accurate comment……
the monkeys have escaped the zoo again
The tender process was rotten in corruption, and who gets the contract, DOB.
Sadly, this still won’t be enough for people to stop voting for them.
I do wonder what it will take…
@Bill Clay:
A viable alternative that’s not socialism
@Patrick Nolan: But the auld socialism works grand for the Banks, Corporations,. Bondholders, Tax exiles, Bankruptcy tourists and the well connected. Maybe it could be tried for the rest of us.
Incredible situation where we pay for this from taxes and pay again when were billed and practicality wrap it up and give it away for nothing.
My original comment was barred. Please dont worry I am just Joe Soap with no political leanings. Mentioned lack of interest from other than one company and questioned same.also mentioned past parallels. Also mentioned what we pay for nama and insurance scandals. Too hot to handle for the journal? Oops keep your thoughts and voices down?
It should be given to the ESB and gradually phase out phone lines there is no need for them, and satellite broadband isn’t advanced enough yet.
@eoin carroll: in case you haven’t noticed – ESB are too busy providing broadband to customers in towns & cities where there is already one or more broadband providers. They are quite content to cherrypick these along with providing expensive electricity
Local elections, Euro elections, general election on the horizon. Paschal will do what he’s told by FG head office. What’s another €3 billion ? Or whatever the actual cost will eventually be. FF will swallow it, like everything else.
@Symbolism: A €6,000 per house bribe…
@Chemical Brothers: that would be the figure if every house took up the service. But experience suggests it will be 20-30% say €25 per user.
Now if the government were to refund vat on house building, it might actually do some good
Didn’t Ian Duty sing a song above this kind of caper ,”what a waste ” i think people should take to the streets before they find a nother black hole to throw money into
@Gerard Heery: i think the reason they add billions onto the public known costs of these projects is done to cover up black holes in the state finances. Who knows, they might have lost 2 billion on something like the financial markets, add it onto the national broadband costs, nobody knows any better, they might get some grief over the costs for a few days but nobody will be sacked, and they’ll still get their very generous financial rewards in politics.
More like WTF plan. 3 billion, probably the most expensive broadplan plan in the world (in size comparisons, if they were dealing in countries the size of america, the figures would be off the charts), to add to harris multi billion most expensive hospital in the world. And when people start talking about the rising costs, these idiot politicians will sack the boards and move onto their next multi billion project.
@Adrian: It’s always easy to waste other people’s money. ✉️✉️
They will make a 3 billion decision based on how it will impact their election prospects. It’s that simple.
At the end, we will be also be paying fees for non take up. Just like the tolls/motorways. Absolutely incompetent morons.
@Shayne O’Donoghue: Nothing incompetent about this at all. FG are very competent when it comes to making the public purse pay for the benefit of the private enterprise. The NCH is the most recent example.
If its a pet project that they want to get started so they can look good in the elections money is no object billions can be found. Its amazing, yet there is kids with brain damage who cant see neurologists for years.. They are a rotten lot that need to go…
There has to be some sort of financial meddling going on here. Gov not known for their money management skills, probably squandering billions of taxpayers money on things the public never hear about, easier to say billions was spent on projects like new hospitals and broadband, and at the same time these same idiots making themselves multi millionaires while in gov.
This is why there should no one off houses.
3bn for Broaddand
2bn for a children’s hospital
Can’t find 2m for 24 x 7 for over half a million citizens in South East
Can’t fund fit for purpose mortuary in UHW
Where are the priorities with this Govt.
If they gave every house in the country a couple of hundred euros per year to pay for their own broadband, they’d probably save a couple of billion, but no, let these idiot up there to announce their multi billion internet rollout.
@Adrian: the government have to take care of their chief backer languishing on a little island
Fine Gael should not be allowed spend anything over 100 euro. That 3 billion will finish up 6billion
Leap frogging technologies, exponential growth, Moore’s law. All things considered I’m sure….
From someone who works in networks…. Aka me. 5g will make this irrelevant
@Thomas Quinn: You do realise that 5G has a max speed of 300Mb/s (Slower if buildings/hills are in the line of sight?
Fiber cable has speeds around 1Gb/s to the demarcation point, so I don’t see how 5G would make it irrelevant
@Thomas Quinn: I’d find a new career, since you obviously have no idea what you’re at.
@Johnny Rotten: he must be talking about working social networks and referring to cash in a brown envelope re: 5G
Can’t be tech anyway lol
@Adam Johnson: you do realize that nobody needs 300Mbs
The national broadband should be put up fr shares so the taxpayer will get some return
@Marianne:
not a bad idea. if i recall the same idea was floated for those massive pumped hydro stations they planned for the west of ireland.
@Marianne: like eircom?
Also ironic that the state once owned the companies that morphed into eir, virgin media, Vodafone Ireland & still own ESB.
This contract cannot be signed,pump €3BN + public money into it for a private company to own it,come on for God sake we are being made fools of again,and no opposition in leinster house to protect us.
I don’t care who owns it after 30 years. All I know that is my current broadband doesn’t have the bandwidth I need to effectively work from home and I need fibre.
@John Somers: I need a motorway to my house in Donegal for work purposes. Will you pay for it or do you think I should accept that because I decided to live in a remote area, I should cope with what I have? Can I guess you pay a lot less per sq metre property tax than someone in the middle of Dublin? Would you mind paying 200 to 300 hundred euro extra per year to get decent satellite broadband to your location. If it costs more, it should be tax deductable.
@John Somers: nobody needs fibre to work from home. I’ve got 50mbs and it’s more that adequate
@Paul Lanigan: I have 3mb. Ever tried conference calling with screen sharing while trying to download 400mb files? It ain’t easy
@John Somers: You do know that you can use your phone as a hotspot and get 100mbs. You are welcome and the government can give me the money they would have spent running fibre to your home. You are welcome.
If this is to take up to twenty years, then surely by that stage the infrastructure will be redundant? 5g equivalent installed and the rest of the world are up to 20g ( I’m just using as an analogy)
Or if the argument is it’ll be up to date, then nobody can forecast costs twenty years ahead, if so the costs can/will only rise
@Michael Kelly: we need to think outside the box here and realise that while we navel gaze we are being totally out classed internationally.
Wake up all plese?
@Brian Nunan: which international government has provided fibre to every remote address in their country?
Another rip off with DOB company getting awarded contracts. It’s a skuummy cosy cartel and Irish people couldn’t give a fiddlers.
NO. NO. NO. We already have broadband, we need the €3bn to fund our health services and build AFFORDABLE houses.
“saying the network should take three to five years to complete once the deal was signed.”
By the time it’s set up and over budget, Elon Musk’s global satellite broadband, Starlink, will be operational…
They plan to launch 44 satellites per launch, every month, for 5 years. The network will be operational when 700 satellites are in orbit and will improve as more satellites are added. The full network will consist of 4,400 to nearly 12,000 satellites ad will provide global high speed broadband.
@David Jordan: Back to sleepy dreamy land there David, I think you’ve been watching too much Star Trek.
@Johnny Rotten: The first 30+ satellites will be launched next month…
https://www.teslarati.com/spacex-starlink-dedicated-launch-debut/
About 70% of satellites launched this year (see this graph –
https://i.imgur.com/x1tI1Fb.jpg) will be launched by SpaceX, and they twice launched the 3rd most powerful rocket ever flown. Not bad for a company that’s 10 years old. So this is possible.
Same as @johnsomers. Rural Ireland need broadband yesterday. Get on with it.
@sean de paore: then let rural Ireland fund it. You choose to live in the middle of nowhere
@Paul Lanigan: I guess you have never been outside the city in your life, people actually live in rural Ireland and have done so for generations, must come as a surprise for you.They actually work there too, amazing. Maybe we could take then all into the cities?
€3bn and tax payer not to own it, sounds rotten and corrupt and probably is. In any event , the whole thing will prob cost €10bn by the time it’s done with
One off homes… Seriously? Have they done the math?
€3,000,000,000 could build a lot of houses!
@Bernard McGarvey: absolutely – but FFG are against people owning houses
Better pay rent to corporate landlords all your lives.
Better still, penalise anyone with properties tax if they has the cheek to have paid for their own house over 40 years.
And make every 5 people buying a house pay for another one to be given away as social housing
Dennis o brien s little governance…
U have to ask wtf going on wit this broadband plan? First they ask eir to do it they rufuse saying no money, the ESB and Vodafone take it on put pull out saying 2 expensive, now remember government had no money to do this before, now there giving it away with nice 3 billion of our money to a foreign company and remember folks private companies have to turn profit, now I ask myself why not hand it over again to eir and ESB jointly it still stays in state hands give them the 3 billion and everyone gets cheaper WiFi etc, just a thought wata u think????
@Declan Bowe: that would make too much sense. eir have provided fibre to very remote locations for a fraction of the costs now being quoted. ESB/Vodafone are too busy cherrypicking in towns & cities.
Meanwhile our hospitals are left in a disgrace,
There is no money to be made for the government in properly looking after sick & dying people.
Are they bringing in the financial genius of Simon “Bob the builder” Harris on this project? What could go wrong?
HERE WE GO AGAIN
AN ELECTION STUNT THAT WILL COST Billions
Advance 5G instead.
have your say