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ONE OF THE “radical” proposals put forward by Solidarity-People Before Profit in this general election campaign has been to introduce a free public transport system.
Yesterday, Dublin South Central TD Bríd Smith said that Ireland currently experienced poor public transport service because too many cars used the country’s roads.
“This is because there were massive cuts to our public transport system during the austerity years, most of which has not been reinstated,” she said.
“One of the radical policies we’re proposing is free and frequent public transport and that would actually help to alleviate the huge problem with our inequality, to reduce our emissions.”
However, Minister for Transport Shane Ross said last year such a measure would cost an extra €600 million a year and that the government had “no immediate plans” to look into making it a reality. He also said this figure does not count the extra cost associated for additional fleet, depots and drivers to meet the likely demand if fares were eliminated.
So, today we’re asking you: Should a free public transport system be introduced?
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Not free…taxpayer funded
@PMBinARG: Fund it with a congestion charge.
@paul kelly: agreed. And as an interim measure, have it free on all modes between the canals. Driving through the city centre should become a thing of the past, make it for people.
@Brin: true not free vote Ruth Coppinger no1 she is for for tax payer funded transport
@Matthew O’Kane: ruth is great at spending other peoples money. Tax the wealth etc.
@PMBinARG: I love the idea of a free (taxpayer funded) public transport system, only thing I would worry about, it’s awful now, it certainly won’t get any better without investment. There needs to be a few billion invested in public transport, like everything in this country, it requires a 10 and 20 year plan, not just electioneering crumbs.
@Seamus Mac: it’s all Other peoples money you blithering idiot. How do you think Varadkar payed for his spin room? You think he paid for it himself?
What about Dara Murphys expenses? 300k. Where do you think that came from?
Grow up.
@Shazam37: It’s a bit early for that amount of exclamations
@Trevor J Coonan: ah I’m so sick of hearing this will fully blind BS from these people. “Spending other Peoples Money” – of course it’s other peoples money. The question is how we spend it.
LV wants to give it all to landlords in form of HAP.
Coppinger wants free transport. I know which idea I prefer.
@Matthew O’Kane: The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of others peoples money to spend.
@Shazam37: You need to get out more
@Pascal the Rascal: troll.
@paul kelly: That’s ok for those that have a reliable option. I’m ok because I have a pretty reliable & frequent bus service.
@Shazam37: Get a job you bum
@Pascal the Rascal: Fan of Maggie Thatcher?
@Newnob: he’s just a sad little troll.
@Pascal the Rascal: So why is it that we can afford socialism for the wealthy but not for the workers?
@Shazam37: Gerry mc cabes killers lift from prison. Your spot on all taxpayers money
@Colm Curran: bla blah blah
@Brin: by canals, I presume you mean between the Atlantic ocean and the Irish sea. Lol. Rural transport in Ireland is in a shocking state and massive investment is required to bring it to a useable standard.
@Shazam37: What makes me laugh is that ireland has been the shinning light of economic progression in Europe and the world in the last 30 years under FF/FG. We have broken the power of the church, facilitate the good Friday agreement, first country to provide marriage rights to the gay community through referendum, provided liberal abortion laws, have near perfect employment. Have one of the highest industrial wages in the world but clowns say we need change!!! Idiots.
@Pascal the Rascal: ‘shining light og economic progression’? Did you sleep through the crash?
@Colm Curran: They really make me laugh these sf supporters – ‘we want change’ I don’t think they know what change they are looking for. Maybe they are looking for ‘spare change’ from the employed.
@Dave Thomas: no I went away to earn a crust with the fantastic education I was able to get in ireland. How did we get out of the crash mate?
@Shazam37: ha great reply to a tough question. Haven’t met a shinner who can explain why sf collected cop killers from prison.blah blah blah isn’t really a great reply even from a buffoon like you. Sf tough on crime lol easy on criminals ????
@Colm Curran: They cant explain anything Colm.
@Colm Curran: this a thread about public transport Colm. And I’m not a Sinn Fein supporter.
So your comment is just silly irrelevant nonsense.
@Brin: So tell me, how do restaurants, hotels and shops, that operate in the city centre get their stock?
@Brin: Why is that exactly for those people who NEED cars
@Pascal the Rascal: world recovery or did you run away from that as well
@Shazam37: when ruth has bankrupted the country she will appropriate your savings for the good of the people comrade. As for being a blithering idiot or wilfully ignorant you need look no further than the nearest mirror.
@Seamus Mac: All governments spend other peoples money. FFG are superb at it… 2 billion on a hospital ring any bells? She offers a potential solution which would have a positive impact on our capital city centre streets air quality and user experience and the best you can come up with is the comment you made? No surprise the muppets keep getting back into power. They know exactly what to say to attract your vote… Perhaps it would be a good idea to check out FFG public spending record and value for money before making idiotic comments with zero insight or value.
@Pascal the Rascal: hahahahahahahhahaha!!!!! That’s the best laugh I’ve had all day. Thanks!!!!
@Seamus Mac: the countrys already 200 billion in debt seamus and it wasn’t Ruth that did it. So who’s really guilty of spending other people money?
@Pascal the Rascal: are you a TD for FF?! It sounds like it
Yeah sure… then sit back and watch people complain about the state of the transport system when there isn’t enough money to fund it
@thomas patrick: sadly there is nothing free, someone somewhere is paying for the free stuff.
@thomas patrick: Theres loads of money
@Dom Layzell: Yup, 14 billion Apple tax we won’t take, 200m for Turas Nua and Seetec for doing precisely nothing at all, subsidies for wealthy profitable farmers, tax breaks and tax loopholes for billionaires and MNCs, billions in HAP payments to landlords who are now getting more money than local councils for social housing (first time in the history of the state).
Yes someone is being had alright, and yes you’re correct, it is the taxpayers, but it’s not because we’re getting services provided with the tax take (that would be the opposite of being had), it’s because services are being taken away, taxes being increased on workers in order to subsidize the wealthy. They’re the spongers. They’re the ones not paying their way.
We’re not going to run out of other peoples money because we already have with your model, we’ve run out of tax payers money because of this system of robbing from the poor to give to the rich, and this has had a detrimental effect not only on the average person but also on local small businesses who rely on the average person having money in their pockets to spend, but people can’t have that when we’re giving it to the very wealthy through general taxation and service cuts.
And on the environment front, who’s going to pay for the cost of ecological disaster caused, again, by those in power and those making a profit off of the destruction of the planet?
The science is repeatedly very clear on this issue and the future economic impact, never mind the whole survival of every species impact, so there’s another front where the wealthy and powerful are hitching a free ride, and in this case it’s even worse because they’re not just stealing money, they’re stealing the future of our entire species and every other.
Infinite growth + finite planet = dead planet. Find a solution to that one that fits into your groggy world view and I’m sure you’ll win a Nobel Prize.
Can’t believe we’re painted as the unrealistic ones when the very core of your economic theory is “why yes, we should destroy the planet for profit, I absolutely support that stance”, you don’t acknowledge basic reality and you have the cheek to call us unrealistic? Give me a break. Under leadership guided by your principles everything will be dead within a hundred years. That’s some ‘realistic’ platform isn’t it. Psshhh, please…
@thomas patrick: It can barely manage the capacity required at the extortionate prices it charges. They would never be able to manage the chaos if it was free!
@una dunphy: Where with disability support services underfunded by €20 million
@Seamus O Shea: That 14bn Apple tax is not ours to take. Stop spouting nonsense. Read up on it and hopefully you will learn something.
@thomas patrick: why do you think there isnt enough money to pay for it?
@Seamus O Shea: 100% accurate. People are absolutely brainwashed into thinking our current economic model is the only one that can work (it doesnt). Many respected economists are shouting out that we need to radically alter our economic model if we want to have any chance of addressing the social and economic challenges we face. But no, “some one has to pay for free stuff” is the best some people can muster. Complete denial. I have always wondered how people cant get their head around understanding that an economic model which demands constant growth is not a functioning model at all. It’s designed to make the wealthy even wealthier. I heard FF proposing a 200 euro payment per head as a suckler grant. We are basically subsiding the profit margins of meat processors (private businesses) with public money whilst at the same time giving them crazy tax breaks when we should be either changing our laws to allow for minimum pricing or putting a tax on meat processing until they get their snouts out of the trough and get real. And all the while when we are subsidising these businesses they are calling it “market forces”??? They must be in absolute stitches at just how gullible the Irish public are to accept this and accept just how corrupt our entire political culture is.
Socialism works fine … until you run out of other people’s money.
Easy to spout nonsense when you’ll never be in a position to even think about implementing it. Surely they can come up with better science fiction promises than this !
@Mark: its easy to protect private operators profit and force people into cars. 3y
1min ago
Any irish party serious about attackingclimate crisis would make public transport free long before a carbon tax. The carbon tax is regressive get rid of it the top 100 companies pollute more than 70% of world carbon its not us to blame!
@Matthew O’Kane: vote Ruth Coppinger no1 she will make it free
@Mark: Science Fiction? Luxembourg would disagree with that.
@Mark: it’s not nonsense. What is nonsense is continuing to encourage private car use. There should be no more money spent on new roads, until we get our public transport network up to scratch and put proper safe cycling infrastructure in place in all our cities. We actually had better public transport under the Brits.
@Matthew O’Kane: the lack of punctuation is hurting my head. But good point, I think
@Trevor J Coonan: thank you i couldnt say it in one breath there needs to be a period or two in there
@Trevor J Coonan: Too much punctuation and you’re complaining. Not enough and you’re complaining.
@Trevor J Coonan: full stop?
@Connoroconner: roads need to be maintained to allow safe movement of public transport, emergency services, people who don’t have the option of using public transport and as for cycle lanes, they only make sense in urban areas.
@Derek Lyster: : I agree but I didnt say don’t maintain existing roads I said let’s not build any more new ones until we sort out public transport. I also clearly said safe cycling infrastructure for our cities.
@Mark: Has worked well in over 100 cities worldwide, yet you talk about it like it doesn’t exist anywhere.
@Mark: what about the science fiction promise that we can maintain this economic model of infinite growth on a finite planet? How’s that for science fiction?
@Nicky O’Donnell: The proposal is free public transport, it is not free public transport in the cities. So that’s Dublin Bus, Luas, Irish Rail, Bus eireann and the blooming Dursey Island cable car. Cost that. As for the cycling militia, they going to build a cycle lane from Naas to Dublin docklands ? Great for those who want to arrive into the office wrecked and stinking.
@Mark: Quite a few EU countries and cities are discussing making it free – https://www.citylab.com/transportation/2018/05/estonia-will-roll-out-free-public-transit-nationwide/560648/
Socialists…great people for spending other people’s money
@John Horan: errrrr yeah…!!! That’s what happens with every government we vote in. They spend our money.
@John Horan: its spending to save the planet get rid of the carbon tx and do tax payer funded transport Ruth Coppingers for that
@John Horan: And who’s money do you think FG or FF spend….Their own????stupid statement in all fairness.
@paul gurney: yes and the socialists want more of our money to spend…aka higher taxes
@John Horan: remember that time in 2008 when capitalism crashed the world economy and stole all our money then inflicted austerity on us to make us pat for their greedy stupidity?
Capitalist system created untold numbers of unemployed, homeless, addicts, thieves, orphans, suicides, violence…
Yeah socialists are the problem… LOLZ!!!
@Trevor J Coonan: Do you remember the time a socialist created a job that wasn’t working for the government. No neither do I. Do you remember the time the communists had an economic crash? No neither do I as you cannot fall when you are already at the bottom.
@John Horan: bit of a weak counter argument there.
Banks and governments were all for the socialism when it came to the bail outs weren’t they?
Socialism is only dreadful when ordinary people
Want to benefit. Cut throat capitalism for ordinary people – socialism and protectionism for the wealthy right?
@Shazam37: If you’re a wealthy capitalist investor you can still go into your bank buddies after creating a Ltd company and take out a huge loan for property investment/development. If you win you get a tax avoidance expert in to maximize your ROI on millions.
However, if you lose company folds and bank suffers the greater losses I.e. (bank customer’s through increased fee’s/little deposit interest on savings). If the bank lend their capitalist buddies too much and a recession hit’s the taxpayer/society absorb the losses. What’s not to like if your a capitalist under this protective arrangement?
Therefore, you only lose the capital in the Ltd company if you fail and society picks up the greater losses if you lose. If you win you look to avoid tax and don’t share the profits with society to any great extent. Social capitalism for the wealthy the gift (guaranteed by society/taxpayers) that keeps on giving.
Capitalism used to be survival of the fittest in business now it’s just a protection racket!
@John Horan: Oh. Are you a billionaire tax exile by any chance? Is so, yes, we want your money to spend it on public services.
@Nicky O’Donnell: and why do billionaires become tax exiles….because we ask for too much tax. Better to have a little from then than none at all. Btw yes I have moved country to lower my tax bill. I left the UK when they were taking 51p in the pound. I went somewhere were the rate was just 17p…net result UK lost 51p because they were too greedy
@John Horan: You would swear you were the only person who paid tax. We all do.
@John Horan: you’re an absolute moron and you type of cuck idiots are dying at a fast rate, thankfully, the planet might have some chance without ye.
@John Horan: Do they not pay taxes? could have sworn they did.
@John Horan: i suggest you actually read the FG and FF manifestos to understand how they are “funding” their policies. Pure fantasy because none of them actually address enforcing a 12.5% tax rate. If the tax rates was enforced we would have many more and better public services than we have
@John Horan: As opposed to FFGL, who love to give other peoples money to failing banks, investors and unsecured bondholders. Just wanted to point that out to you. You clearly don’t have a problem, with the debt on your shoulders, yet you have a massive problem with people being provided with actual services, for the taxes they pay, into the public purse.
They should look at the Manchester model of free transport. It’s fantastic. 3 routes that do a loop around the city and, as far as I know, the business sector fund it. It covers shopping areas, major transport links to train and bus stations and most importantly it keeps people moving. Everyone uses it to get to work, shops, restaurants, theatres and transport links.
@2thFairy: they could do both but fine geal are for profit not planet
This is just usual spin, off People before profit populist politicians. Nothing in life is free somebody somewhere has to pay for it, it will be the hard pressed worker who will end up footing the bill through taxation. I wonder at times why people actually listen to these so called polliticians they spout all this nonsense about free this free that so the less well off clinging to the hope of free when we all know the cost assosiated it is not possoble.
@Clive Ellis: it would cost the same per annum as what we are going to have to pay the EU in fines for missing our emissions targets.
@Clive Ellis: The less well off already have free public transport. If anything they should reintroduce the restriction of tree transport during peak hours.
@Towger: to stop unemployed people from going to early interviews? Not sure what the motive i… Oh, you don’t want to be delayed! How about “bus connects!”
@Clive Ellis: PBP know we have a sizeable population who inhabit the same dreamland where entitlement reigns. Why should we pay for public transport, water, etc. THe tired worn out phrase “we already pay for these things in our taxes” is trotted out.
We have a societal problem not a political one.
@Clive Ellis: How do you know Ellis? I very much suspect what you know about the state finances and the costing of this proposal is non existent.
Have you read the detail? Are you familiar with the amount of money available through taxation, cuts and so on?
The truth is Ellis you don’t have a clue if this is doable or affordable. And you don’t care. You’d rather complain about the left because you’re quite happy with the right as it is.
Is the concept of free public transport a Good one? Yes of course.
Can it be paid for? None of us know. Not really.
@Clive Ellis: progressive taxation. Once you earn above a certain amount necessary for living, all the surplus should be heavily taxed. A well funded public system benefits all and ultimately Pat’s for itself in savings on healthcare, insurance, absenteeism as well as boosting tourism and attracting fdi.
@Towger: wow!! How will the less well off homeless family’s who live in hotels around the place get kids to schools if they introduce this? A lot of them are far from the schools their kids go to.
@Clive Ellis: @Dom Layzell: Copy and paste from above because I can’t really put it much better…
Yup, 14 billion Apple tax we won’t take, 200m for Turas Nua and Seetec for doing precisely nothing at all, subsidies for wealthy profitable farmers, tax breaks and tax loopholes for billionaires and MNCs, billions in HAP payments to landlords who are now getting more money than local councils for social housing (first time in the history of the state).
Yes someone is being had alright, and yes you’re correct, it is the taxpayers, but it’s not because we’re getting services provided with the tax take (that would be the opposite of being had), it’s because services are being taken away, taxes being increased on workers in order to subsidize the wealthy. They’re the spongers. They’re the ones not paying their way.
We’re not going to run out of other peoples money because we already have with your model, we’ve run out of tax payers money because of this system of robbing from the poor to give to the rich, and this has had a detrimental effect not only on the average person but also on local small businesses who rely on the average person having money in their pockets to spend, but people can’t have that when we’re giving it to the very wealthy through general taxation and service cuts.
And on the environment front, who’s going to pay for the cost of ecological disaster caused, again, by those in power and those making a profit off of the destruction of the planet?
The science is repeatedly very clear on this issue and the future economic impact, never mind the whole survival of every species impact, so there’s another front where the wealthy and powerful are hitching a free ride, and in this case it’s even worse because they’re not just stealing money, they’re stealing the future of our entire species and every other.
Infinite growth + finite planet = dead planet. Find a solution to that one that fits into your groggy world view and I’m sure you’ll win a Nobel Prize.
Can’t believe we’re painted as the unrealistic ones when the very core of your economic theory is “why yes, we should destroy the planet for profit, I absolutely support that stance”, you don’t acknowledge basic reality and you have the cheek to call us unrealistic? Give me a break. Under leadership guided by your principles everything will be dead within a hundred years. That’s some ‘realistic’ platform isn’t it. Psshhh, please…
@Clive Ellis: People listen because quite a lot of countries and cities already do it, yes it will have to be paid for via general taxation but it can be done – https://www.citylab.com/transportation/2018/05/estonia-will-roll-out-free-public-transit-nationwide/560648/
Vote SF for real change.
Enough of FFG…
@Willy Mc Entire: do you really need to troll every single article?
@Willy Mc Entire: SF is a wasted vote.
@Willy Mc Entire: are you on a retainer from them to post on every article ?
It’s getting very boring and predictable.
@Willy Mc Entire: Typical SF supporter – no job, probably still in bed, bumming off his neighbors wifui
@Pascal the Rascal: *wifi
@Pascal the Rascal: country at full employment.
@Shazam37: thanks to who? Fool.
@Shazam37: fair play .I agree with u and well done government for achieving this. Your v gracious in acknowledging that fact.
@Willy Mc Entire: Shinner Bots, Transform !
@Pascal the Rascal: can’t have it both ways Pascal. You can’t complain about all the idle layabouts and then boast about full employment.
@Pascal the Rascal: not ffg I can assure you but then you already know this being a payed up member of their supporters club….
Requires a large investment but worth it. Especially if the fleet was electric also.
@Starburst: speaking of electric, heard a story the other day where a car drove up beside an electric car to tell the driver they had no lights on. That person said they didn’t have enough juice to put the lights on and couldn’t find a charge point!! Running of fumes to get home. Definitely need to heavily invest in better long life batteries and more charge points. Mad Ted!
@Starburst: good words and abolish the carbon tax lets save the planet together not tax each other to bankrupty alonne
@Lydia McLoughlin: yeah I heard that story too. Except it was in the US. Very likely an urban legend
@Lydia McLoughlin: Certainly mad if an electric car was running on fumes. Get your point though. Came across an old model Leaf few months back which had run out of power on a roundabout a few metres from the drivers home. He had run around his neighbours borrowing enough extension cables to reach his home, had about a dozen of them slung together, then had to wait 20mins to power the car up enough to move. Bit mad that you can’t even push them to the kerb if they run out of power !!
No. This is a urban and rural divide thing. It would serve people in cities well but rural Ireland would barely benefit. Also, imagine it did work? Car tax would increase hugely which would again hit country people far more than town/city folks.
@Carm(Orange Vampire): I’m abandoned in the Styx, I can’t get to the city without the car and a few pints! Don’t be ridiculous – free public transport would benefit everyone urban and rural, and as it becomes the preferred mode of transport, stick and frequency will be increased to match demand.
@Carm(Orange Vampire): you’re looking at it the wrong way, Rural public transport needs to be reviewed. It doesn’t exist in most places but it could. Whether it be a town to down local bus service (small buses not double deckers) or in the future those autonomous 6 seaters collecting you at the gaf to bring you to the pub. Investment and thought is needed in rural transport just as much as Urban systems
@Carm(Orange Vampire):
Typical rhuuuuhral Ireland, Dublin generates over 49% of the country’s GDP, but the culchies aren’t happy when any investment goes to Dublin. They’re getting 3 billion of taxpayer money so they can get fibre-optic cable to the door, living in the middle of nowhere, while living on farming subsidies and other handouts. But still, they keep whinging whinging whinging if Dublin gets anything.
The culchies won’t be happy until we all have equally useless services, and spend half the country’s GDP on beef subsidies.
Is the LUAS not free? I seem to be the only mug who tags on, the rare occasion I use it!
@The Hairy Fiddler: Well I have an annual ticket, and I am sure many other passengers do, so don’t have to tag on. As you pointed out, you use it rarely so you have to. Don’t assume the people who didn’t tag on have no tickets.
Not free but a standard charge, get rid of free travel for oaps and others. For example Dublin bus and luas €1 for all journeys. Train Dublin to Galway €10 return. The train needs to be cheaper than driving and toll charges
If things are free people don’t respect it, but a nominal charge is fair to all
@Bleurgh: Why should old people be stopped traveling for free? Most of them have worked all their lives and paid taxes, Prsi etc. It’s not that much to give them. My dad has a free travel pass over 10 years and I think he has used it twice. They don’t abuse the system.
@Olivia Smith: Yes but they’re also passing on 200 Billion in debt to their children. So you know – maybe they’ve had all the benefits they’re entitled to
@Shazam37: umm yeah that was the ruling class, not your average working class Joe or Johanna.
@Shazam37: Well my father is not passing on any debt to his children. Grow up will you for god sake. Who paid for your education? Or do you not have parents. Stupid comment
@Seamus O Shea: He comes across as a complete gombeen. Shazam yourself out of my comments.
@Seamus O Shea: They voter for them and their policies Seamus.
Try as we and they might we cannot divorce ourselves from our electoral responsibility.
@Olivia Smith: your fathers generation are passing on 200 BILLION in debt to their children and grandchildren – the policies they voted for, the parties they voted for, the ideas they supported. That’s what led to it Olivia.
Now maybe your specific father didn’t vote for them, and mine may not have either. But their generation did. En masse.
The result is a more exposed economy, poorer services, falling educational standards and weak infrastructure. Those are the results.
Some responsibility for that needs to be taken.
@Shazam37: Do you know how voting works? Not everyone votes for the same people so that comment right there is utter b***ox. A lot of people vote morally not just to keep the rich richer and the poor poorer. Did you ask your granny and grandad who they voted for all along? My family always voted independent it unfortunately there doesn’t seem to be enough of to make changes.
@Shazam37: So what? Why should the decent old folk who didn’t vote them in be targeted? You do realise how stupid you sound? Take free travel off the old. Next it will be take the medical card off them, let them pay for everything. You do realise there are a lot of old folks living in poverty as it is and you want them to be stopped from getting out and about in a poxy free travel pass, pal your pissing into the wind with your stupid comments.
@Olivia Smith: who they voted for individually doesn’t matter Olivia.
Their generation voted for guys who bankrupted the country. They have a collective responsibility for their actions.
We cannot expect our politicians to accept responsibility if we are ourselves cannot.
Young people tend not to vote. With a result that their interests are prioritised. That’s their generations fault. You cannot dissociate yourself from the failures of your own – even if you specifically aren’t guilty of it.
Collective responsibility Olivia. Much as it seems to annoy you.
@Olivia Smith: what I want Olivia is for them to take responsibility for the choices they made.
Impoverish old people? No.
But when they come with their hands out for pensions and free travel and all the rest they might try to admit how badly they screwed up when they had their power.
Why should the younger generations bail them out if they’re not willing to accept responsibility for it?
These are fair questions Olivia much as you don’t seem to want to face up to it.
@Shazam37: No sorry your still making stupid comments. The heads of the banks and the financial ombudsman made that debt . So no the old people don’t deserve to suffer for others.
@Shazam37: You need to go take the meds the doc prescribed for you. Hand out for old age pension? Did you’re past family members not go hand out to get old age pensions? Will you not go hand out to collect yours when the time comes? Yeas there are a great number of impoverished old folk. Take your head out of your arse and shake it. Go onto some other post in the journal not and talk nonsense because that’s all you seem to do.
@Olivia Smith: the banks were bailed out by politicians.
And a significant portion of our debt wasn’t only the banks.
And the erosion of our tax base from the 70s on was rewarded by the voters.
These are all choices made by voters through their elected representatives Olivia.
Are you voting for FFFG? I suspect the answer is no. Because you don’t agree with who they are or what they’ve done. But they’ve in power for a century Olivia.
The previous generations voted for Ahearn and all the rest of them.
We all have to take responsibility for our choices Olivia. Including the older generation.
They made their bed. Now will we help them? Yes we will. But it would help if they acknowledged just how badly they governed the nation. And how appalling the debt load they’re sending on is.
Responsibility Olivia – anathema to so many Irish people. Including you it seems.
@Shazam37: Please stop typing now. I’m well aware who bailed out the banks. The ombudsman did not do the job they were employed to do. The money men in charge of the banks wrecked the financing institutions. As Iv said we voted independent so where your getting FF from Iv no idea. I’ll piss you off even more now and tell you I’m voting Sein Féin. No please go away and have a test.
@Olivia Smith: You never answered me about your older family members or yourself when the time comes with hand out looking for the old age pension.
@Olivia Smith: Olivia I appreciate how difficult it is for you and others to actual look at your own actions.
It’s so easy and so very tempting to blame EVERYONE else for EVERYTHING. Of course an awful lot of powerful people made appalling selfish decisions. They should be held accountable for those and they weren’t sadly.
But that doesn’t excuse us from making our own dreadful decisions.
You cannot escape the facts Olivia. 200 Billion debt is being passed on to the next generation to solve. It limits their ability to build schools hospitals and everything else.
Successive governments decisions are largely responsible for this and those governments were elected by the People. The People must take responsibility for that.
John Delaney bankrupted the FAI. But oh so many of the average footballing community were singing his praises. They have a certain level of responsibility for what happened there.
When you shut up and take the cash because it suits you, you are partly to blame. And thats what that generation did.
As for voting Sinn Fein. Why would that annoy me? The guy above keeps calling me a Shinner.
You’re all so blinded and unobjective you can’t actually tell I’m asking BOTH sides hard questions.
@Shazam37: where have you been that 200 bill only appeared since ffg came into power so dont blame the pensioners….
@Peter donnelly: He’s a knob
@Peter donnelly: sorry to burst your bubble
Pal but they’ve been in power for like 100 years and who do you think put them in power?
@Olivia Smith: You’re in denial Olivia.
@Olivia Smith: I would much prefer to hear you say your dad used it every day. Free travel for our elderly is a great idea’ helps to combat loneliness and isolation and fitness.
@Olivia Smith: the ombudsman did exactly the job he was supposed to do. Light touch to keep the party rolling.
Yes,, eventually. But we don’t have the rolling stock nor the infrastructure to do it right now.
@Connoroconner: and at the rate they’re building the infrastructure it’ll never be done.
100 years ago there was 3, 500 miles of railway lines in Ireland, now there is 1,300 miles of railway line!
The Country has been asset stripped!
@Connoroconner: I’d like to trial it in a smaller city to see the impact. Limerick looks like the best bet, with Galway also a runner [Waterford had a big rejig of its bus routes, which would create too much noise to evaluate]. We could see what increase in capacity could be required to support it and if we did need to hugely expand capacity, it wouldn’t be bank breaking in a smaller city. There also wouldn’t be as much revenue lost if it was a big disaster. Fare box revenue in Limerick and Galway only runs to 7 figures, as opposed to 8 figures in Cork and 9 figures in Dublin.
Yes it should be free , like the Luas , half the people using it don’t pay so why not make the whole system free
Any irish party serious about attackingclimate crisis would make public transport free long before a carbon tax. The cadbon tax is regressive get rid of it the top 100 companies pollute more than 70% of world carbkn its not us to blame!
@Matthew O’Kane:
Not us to blame? We consume the products they make, oil, plastics etc. Irish cement don’t make the cement for themselves…
Carbon taxes will be levied on these businesses to drive them to be carbon efficient.
Carbon taxes will always end up costing the consumer who consumes the product that generates the carbon.
@Nioe: So if our government believe in “free market economics” then apply the tax at source and then the “competitiveness ” of the market will keep reducing the impact of the tax to the final consumer as companies make their production processes leaner or more environmentally friendly to lower the tax paid. Oh wait…that doesnt happen because there is no such thing as free market economics. Taxing the user takes far too long to be effective because consumers habits take too long to change. Taxing the producer has much shorter time to impact because they are businesses and react immediately to financial change or become extinct. Easier to tax the public as they dont have lobby groups.
It’s there at the moment ! What we need the transport police
Nothing is free. Taxpayers pay for it.
Use sliding charges to manage demand. Charge at rush hour. Free in slack periods.
@IamSocrates: which does nothing to alleviate congestion at peak times. Which is the point.
@IamSocrates: Thats exactly the opposite to what we need to do!
Bikes should be given more of a priority in the City, it should be safer for people, people should be able to live in the city.
@Diogenes: city bikes are fantastic to get around. We use them in all major cities we visit and use them in Dublin during the working day and at weekends. They are cheap and you get to see parts of cities that you’d never get to see and enjoy.
@2thFairy: Their should be separate lanes for bikes, a livable city so parents can cycle with their kids to school safely and not inhaling a ridiculous amount of fumes, disgraceful in this day and age.
It’s shite as it is. Imagine what it would be like if it became free!
A better public transport system should be introduced. Don’t mind paying for a quality service.
I’d much prefer to see the current income used to upgrade and expand the network!
@Stingray Jones: you are !00% correct ….. they should overhaul / reform the public transport system – access to public transport in Ireland is one of the most expensive in whole of the EU and yet we get an average service and end result. No need to offer it free to shake it up . So much inefficiencies in public services we need major reform of existing systems. Not just transport , criminal justice , health , all major departments are shambolic.
Cast your mind back to the strike when bus drivers were still working but refusing to take fares. Every low life was taking advantage and there was chaos
Here’s an idea, how about free transport for all of us to get to work, and make the scroungers pay instead of handing them out travel cards!
I thought it was free,went to Cork recently,by bus,and all people getting on the bust had free travel-no one paid
Doesn’t have to be completely free to the user, €1.50 for 100 minutes like many European capitals, or €2 for the day or something. Still creates some revenue for expansion and improvement while not being enough to discourage use.
Nothing is free. Pay for what you bloody use. Pay as you go.
@A Man on a mission.: how sophisticated.
This is very much achievable in my opinion, through taxes! We could achieve free transport, free medical and free education! This would create a more equal society where everybody, regardless of their income or social status, has access to these vital services which we will be depending on for many years yet to come. Nobody should receive better treatment than the other person, we are all deserving of equally decent medical treatment, decent education and a means to remain socially mobile through public transport. It’s working in some of our neighbouring Nordic countries! Look at the revenue (profit) that eflow have made over the years, a private company at that! Had the Government held on to our tolls, need I say any more…..
@Jacqueline Flynn: free everything! Want a house? Hey, have a free one! Feeling a bit under the weather because you were on the rip over the weekend? I know, free doctors! Need to get from a to b? Wait I have an idea. Free transport! AND ONE FOR EVERYONE IN THE AUDIENCE!
Now I don’t know about you but I’m sick of paying taxes that seem to do nothing. When everything is “free” who you think pays for it? It’s not the professional dole dossiers. It’s the people Leo wanted getting up for work early that pays and I’m still waiting for the rewards of getting up early, 20 hours a week on a bus that people now want for free to make the working commuters life even more miserable.
@Sea Graham: wow. Just wow.
To start with – the country is almost at statistically full employment. More or else everyone who can work – IS. So all these “scroungers” you’re talking about? They don’t exist. It’s an ugly fantasy perpetrated by Varadkar and his ilk.
Secondly your taxes that do nothing – who’s fault is that? It’s not the lefts. It’s Varadkar and Martin and all the other neoliberals who don’t believe in good services and who have been in power literally forever.
You’re annoyed your taxes do nothing? So am I. Maybe it’s time that we actually saw something beneficial from them yes? Like public transport that’s free to the user? That would benefit you yes?
And why would the working commuters life be more miserable? There’d be less traffic. Less congestion. Cleaner air. The place would be broadly speaking quieter. All good things.
I find it astonishing that you’re moaning about what your taxes are used for and blaming the LEFT for having new ideas, when they’ve literally never been in power!!!
Unbelievable! “I’m so annoyed!!! So I’m
Voting for those people who make me that way!”
Bonkers
@Shazam37: So would that user you speak of include the elderly? They use public transport. There must be some dust floating around in that empty head of yours. You say one thing in somebody else’s post then say the complete opposite in someone else’s.
@Olivia Smith: Jesus Olivia. It’s not hard.
Transport free for everyone? Yes that’s fine. Transport free only for the elderly? No – not so fine.
Fairness please. Is that too hard a concept for you?
This actually makes sense..we pay for public transport through our taxes and then through fares with the money in our pocket. Our money has already been taxed so why not pay for all of it at source? I think we would all use PT more if it was ‘free’. The one proviso though is we would have to invest in it….more buses, more routes, keep it clean and inspected for thugs, etc.
Most dublin buses just drive past or over crowded as is,offer more buses rather than free ones
@Liam Collins: More light rail for Irish cities. That doesn’t stop in snow & ice.
That would be Unsustainable , will never happen,
I wish these politicians would realize theres life outside Dublin. Rural areas have a token bus system if they have one at all. Upgrade bus and rail systems in rural areas instead of giving yet more advantages to Dublin.
@Jes McNamara: then stop voting for the same people.
Rural Ireland voting for FFFG for 100 years and whinging because they’ve been ignored.
You want things to improve? Boot out the guys who refuse to improve it.
When I lived in Calgary Canada their version of our Luas/dart was free in the city centre. You only had to pay if you were travelling outside these zones. It was great. The train and bus were also linked, you got a monthly ticket for $99 and that gave you unlimited travel on all modes of public transport for the month. It would be great if Dublin bus, Luas and the dart could all be linked. Too expensive at the moment considering the level of service we receive.
@Róisín O’Reilly: Portland Oregon
has free travel in City centre – its great. People leave their cars further out and can move around for free once they get to centre. Really handy, friendly passengers and far less traffic.
Takes seriously limited vision to be unable to see the possibilities and huge benefits of a free public transport system. Especially in a country with just the population of an English county. Also, as ever on here, you get the impression people are not so much genuinely concerned about where the money would come from but more petrified at the thought of people getting a service without paying for it. Misery is like some tory utopia to dwell in forever. It’s a grim outlook.
@Ray Fox: seriously? Do you think that people can get to work with public transport outside Dublin?
@Patman: Yes Patman. Literally every man and woman outside Dublin can get to work by public transport. That’s exactly what I said.
@Ray Fox: i can’t
Make it free for taxpayers
@Dermot Bland: so, everyone then?
I’d rather see free education and healthcare like the uk!! equality for all not just the privileged
In dream land yes but in the real world cant see how it would work, transport in the country is terrible so cant see how it would work with the increase of demand.
A properly resourced one would be better
I’m actually on my way up to Nerja from Malaga bus station. It’s a total 80klm journey the charge????. €4 From Malaga into the bus station €3….a total of €7 in total. The prices in Ireland are outrageous.
@Maggie May: in fairness, it’s €10 from Dublin to Waterford. Which is twice that distance.
Not Free! 100 percent
Do a yearly payment of like 200€per person to choose to buy a free travel card that would let them travel unlimited in Ireland during that time it is such a little amount that everyone would probably buy it but also if there were tourist they would still have to pay normal or mabe slightly less than now price ?
@Emer Mucke: You do realise that there are people out there that wouldn’t have €200 to hand out in one go?
How about a good NATIONAL public transport system.
No, take the money and invest. We need more transport. Buses and trains are packed already. If it’s free it will become worse.
Free public transport, introduce city congestion charges and toll all routes into cities on weekdays. Create more park and ride facilities. Any money made from additional ring fenced for public charges.
Outside of Dublin most people use their own cars because its cheaper, more reliable and as fast if not faster than pubic transport.
Reduce the number of lanes for car lane and increase bus lanes and if there were no charges then public transport would be a no brainer.
Free parking at regional stations and increase park and ride throughout country.
Major problem with all this is if people stop buying petrol government loses huge income source, but it would make commuting a lot better for most people.
@Tjamr: Outside of Dublin most people use their own cars because………………………….they don’t have a choice!
@Patman: And people in cities use their cars because they have a choice. I’m not giving up my car for nobody. Iv worked to pay for it so will continue to do so as I please. Most people on this thread are moaning for the sake of moaning.
No. Make public transport available to all. Far too many areas of the country have no public transport at all, not even to/from the closest town.
@Jane Alford: public demand isn’t there .eg Dublin to Westport that goes through places like Athlone and Roscommon . (Whi can be served by Galway bus and train )
There has to be some realism .
I would be very quick to whinge about Bus Éireann and Irish Rail, more the former , but they often run services to small areas at a loss Just to serve 3-10 passengers at a time .
I totally get what you are saying, but, look at towns and villages of just under 1000 people, and the nearest town for transport (which might be limited eg Castlerea Roscommon which could cover parts of North east Galway ) is only 10-20 km away … hard to justify regular transport for those small villages etc
Yes…. for tax payers.
@Alan: So everyone then?
@Shazam37: yes because we only have a population of 1.7 million yes?
“Free Public Transport”…..brilliant idea…..imagine free buses available all round the country….in every town and village, Mullingar,Clonmel,Dundalk,Thurles,Letterkenny….with a reliable service for all….and free trains between all the major cities…..or is it only for the Dubs you mean?
The main issue is peak time especially on buses, I really don’t know how the unions ever agreed, to drivers collecting fares and issuing tickets, it slows the whole process up in the mornings and evenings when a dozen or more people get on at a stop, I have travelled on driver only buses in the US, first of all they are single Decker buses, secondly the drivers, don’t actually take fares or issue tickets, unless it’s a transfer, and many can pull one themselves, Giving the old age pensioners and disability, people, free travel, and no one else is a form of discrimination for a start, The cost of anyone travelling to work, Minimum would be €5.00, Max to anything, the leap caps at what €9 or €10, so that’s €25.00 to €50.00 a week travelling to work, on top of everything else. Maybe not free travel, but a €1,00 a trip, and maybe put conductors back on buses at least at peak times.
As regards to paying carbon tax, we are a tiny Island, surrounded by an ocean and a sea, our nearest neighbours miles away, how much can we influence the world, we are like a flea on an elephant.
His mention of reducing the dairy herd by 50%, I remember when we joined the EU, what is it now 47 years or there about’s, I worked in a slaughter house, and we had to kill a quarter more cattle than we needed ourselves, remember the beef mountain, butter mountain, wine lakes etc, the Russians I believe did Ok on that one.
If our beef trade, is suffering, and Farmers not getting a fair price, because of over production, or the dairy trade for that matter, and if we lose, trade to Britain, it may be the only real solution, to get things, to a reasonable level.
Free? No, we can’t afford that. But fares should be halved. Can’t afford to take train journeys with those prices!
Yes but not Dublin bus
How about one that works first?
No need for free anything but functioning would be a great start.
1.5 hours for 6 miles trip, if your lucky enough to get on the bus at all is unacceptable .
I’d rather they just invested in public transport ,let the driver just drive ,( like a luas )
already paying for motor insurance, car tax, so why should i pay now (through my taxes) for a service I won’t have any chance of using?
There’s a free hop on hop off bus service in Perth WA, seems to work very well.
If there was money put into electric buses, after the initial outlay, they should cost ver little to run.
Just before Christmas, there was a new city bus service introduced in Kilkenny, two routes crossing the city to and from the suburbs and the hospital, train station, bus stops etc, using electric buses. Fantastic service!
Free public transport should be a goal, but it’s impossible with the current format. DART drivers would strike until they get 150k a year as they want to be compensated for more passengers. Bus drivers would want a second pension and 50k lump sum to compensate drivers who are self conscious about their driving and the increased stress the move would bring.
Union culture in the public sector is toxic and the public sector is crippling this country, just look at their benchmarking when generating zero wealth and then refusal to adjust (or remain benchmarked) in a recession. If we fixed our social welfare public sector we could have all the houses, hospitals and free transport we need.
@Sean Fahey: As ever folks – ignore the Troll.
Dips in – posts something to annoy people – leaves.
Don’t feed the Troll!!
——Extended to even the most backward rural areas of course!
It’s buckling under the demand that exists now… only after a lonnnng period of investment could it support the demand a free service would create. Decades away from being feasible at our current investment rate.
Many other cities around the world offer this service albeit that it’s usually within the city limits/zoned.
Even if public transport is free, people will still use their cars as they still need to get to work when public transport isn’t running . We have been a 24/7 society for many decades yet the government still thinks we still all only work mon to fri ?
Introduce it for students.
Cap it at €1 for three miles, €2 at 4 to 10 miles and it €3 to the county limits and beyond.
@Twitruser2020: how are the drivers wages going to be paid ? Bread and water and never ending pot of gold that the government of the day apparently have ?
In fairness to Eg Dublin Bus and the Luas, their prices are not terrible. Though I know London n Paris have better ideas
Listen to one of David McWilliam’s recent podcasts about this. Makes a lot of sense! Not just free transport, but congestion charge for the city.
It’s not free, the drivers aren’t gonna work for free, the buses won’t be given to us for free, the maintenance won’t be free and if the money for all that doesn’t come from fares then it has to come from taxes
We have Free Transport .. for the retired (cost €75M pa) … most of whom can well afford to pay. Free Transport for students … trying to commute to college due to massive rents!
Yes it’s the only thing that will change our car culture.
Carbon tax is unfair as using a car is the only option for a huge portion of society.
Rural Transport Infastructure First Then Introduce It Nation Wide!
Ireland is More Than Dublin…….
no way. How the hell we gonna pay for a whole transport infrastructure if we’re dishing out for ‘free’ iron curtain era bus services. more “small nation” ideas from the assistant managers.
Stupid Suggestion
And whose gonna pay for it ? Ah ye, the taxpayer
Free transport for the elderly , disabled (noted public transport is hit n miss for them) sure . Everyone else, pay their own god damn way
@Christy Dolan: You know that all of the costings of each party can be found in their manifesto’s along with, where the money, to pay for it, will come from. Keep the free travel the way it is now, make it free for all school children and everyone else pay’s a nominal fee of €1 per day. That would cost less than my husband hands out on bus fare in a day.
@Christy Dolan: And everyone is a taxpayer, regardless of their working status.
How many extra buses will be needed? How many extra drivers? Where will we recruit the drivers from?
@Tom Burke: How much more carbon emissions with more buses? Makes no sense to do this and try stop people driving cars.
@Tom Burke: demand for 1 extra bus would remove how many cars off the road? And creating employment by hiring drivers, What’s wrong with that? They would be recruited from the same place as anyone would.
@Olivia Smith: Seriously?? Free travel, means fewer cars on the road, which in turn results in fewer emissions. Not to mention nobody is forcing anyone not to drive.
@Ann Reddin: Nobody but circumstances do.
@Bilbo Baggins: Maybe a few but possibly not and if the cycling brigade get there way it will be dangerous getting on and off buses too.
@Ann Reddin: Running 7 days a week would take more cars off the road more than extra capacity or cost. public transport only works if you can use it for work all the time, Can’t tell your boss that you won’t be in as there are no buses running.
@Ann Reddin: Well the way this thread is going and other threads it’s all’s out banning cars and forcing people to use public transport. I for 2 will use my car to drive wherever I want. Iv paid for it do you can all f**k off.
@Gary Kearney: go to Amsterdam and see how it’s done.
Socialism is great. Until you run out of someone else’s money. (M. Thatcher)
@MunsterPI: when you’re quoting Margaret Thatcher to support your economic philosophy youve already lost.
Reduce cost of fares perhaps, but nothing is ever really “free” in this country is it?
@Sarah-Louise Cleary: As you say, nothing is free. The people pay tax, which goes into the public purse, which pays for health, education and services. It is only free at point of use, you pay for it through general taxation. At the moment, people are paying taxes and with very little return. I spent 38 hours on a trolley, in a corridor, in James’s hospital. if you need to see your GP, you’re lucky if you get an appointment within 5 days. You send your kids off to their “free school” which, we all know is far from “free” and the prices that dentist’s charge in this country is disgusting, and like prescription charges, they should be capped. The only people I see getting “free” stuff are the politicians. Free bar, free travel, free meals, free phones
have your say