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Social distancing rules mean it's inevitable students won't be back in school full-time - ASTI

Teachers’ unions will appear before the Dáil’s Covid-19 committee today.

LAST UPDATE | 2 Jul 2020

STUDENTS WILL NOT be able to return to school as normal come September if current health guidance remains in force, a teachers’ union has warned. 

Concerns are growing among trade unions about what exactly schools will look like – and how safe they’ll be – when they return at the end of summer. 

Deirdre McDonald, the President of the Association of Secondary Teachers Ireland (ASTI) told RTÉ Radio One’s Morning Ireland programme that teachers had not been involved in drafting the guidance, which was published by the Department of Education. 

Under the guidance, compiled by the Health Protection Surveillance Centre, primary school pupils from third class up and all secondary school students will be required to maintain a distance of at least one metre between each other when schools return

Teachers will also be required to maintain at least one metre of distance between themselves and students, although the guidance recognises that there will be exceptions, such as administering first aid. 

Individual desks will need to be at least one metre apart and teachers should arrange to move from classroom to classroom to avoid students moving in groups. 

Speaking on the same programme this morning, Minister for Health Stephen Donnelly said that the challenges facing secondary schools are “more complex”. 

Primary schools, he said, will return for a full week of classes, but things could look different at secondary level where students would normally move around the school.

“There’s a lot of work to be done now looking at the practicalities of that and how it can be brought to bear. The preference, obviously, is that all students go back to school. We need to look at how close to that we can get.”

Later today, General Secretary of the ASTI, Kieran Christie, will tell the Dáil Special Covid-19 Committee that there was “consternation” among its members when a department report said a “differentiated approach to physical distancing in schools” could be considered. 

“An inferior approach to physical distancing in schools from that which pertains to wider society or any deviation from the health advice available from the NPHET or the HPSC would be unacceptable,” Christie states in his opening statement.

“In fact, any deviation from the health advice available from the National Public Health
Emergency Team or the Health Protection Surveillance Centre of the HSE would be
unacceptable,” he states.

“From our perspective, there simply cannot be rules on physical distancing that apply outside a school in wider society or business that don’t apply inside a school,” he states. 

The INTO General Secretary John Boyle will also tell the committee today that it is “something of a national embarrassment, we have the largest class sizes in the Eurozone”.

“Many of our primary school classrooms have more than thirty pupils, with our European neighbours enjoying an average of just twenty in a class. This really matters when we look at applying social distancing,” says Boyle. 

In his opening statement to the committee he calls for a national media campaign so as to ensure ‘buy-in’ from the entire school community in relation to new routines.

This morning, McDonald said that, given current advice, “there will have to be some blended approach to learning”.

“Full occupancy of the school at all times will not be possible,” she said. 

This would mean that teaching would be split between in-school lessons and some online learning from home. 

Asked about whether children and teenagers would maintain a safe social distance if they returned to school, McDonald acknowledged it would be a challenge. 

“It is going to be very difficult. All anyone needs to do is walk down any street of any town,” she said. 

ASTI said that detailed information on how the guidance could be implemented is now needed. 

“The guidelines are only the guidelines. Now we have to see detailed planning about how this will operate,” said McDonald

“We have lost time, I have to say. We as teachers union have asked that detailed planning would have taken place or started to take place five weeks ago, so we have lost time.”

“But, all said and done, we have a new minister, and we will hope that the guidelines will be put in place, detailed planning, about how this will operate.”

Education Minister Norma Foley has said the interim guidance will support schools in planning for the upcoming term:

We all want to support the education system so that we can welcome our pupils and staff across our school communities back into a safe environment later in the year.  We will continue to work with the public health experts over the course of the summer to update the interim advice as necessary.

Teachers Union of Ireland

The Teachers Union of Ireland’s (TUI) statement to the committee says: 

“We are not convinced or satisfied that schools can reopen safely, given current circumstances, in the absence of some defined metric regarding social distancing.”

It’s statement goes on to say that second level schools and Youthreach centres were not built to accommodate the exigencies of a pandemic.

“Other workers are protected by social distancing, developed and comprehensive return to workplace plans carefully implemented, personal protective equipment where necessary. Teachers ask no more than to be treated with the same level of concern,” the opening statement concludes.

The TUI, which has 19,500 members, states that its members have a duty of care to their students.

“As a teachers’ trade union, we also owe a duty of care to our members. In both cases that duty consists first and foremost of seeking to safeguard their health.”

The statement concludes by stating that “post primary students have no magical immunity. Teachers as workers have no magical immunity. They must be treated as are other workers”.

With reporting from Christina Finn and Conor McCrave

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119 Comments
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    Mute IrishGal26
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 8:21 AM

    They can’t go back to school properly but they can go to summer camps and play sports where they will be mixing with their friends and other people. It doesn’t make sense.

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    Mute EMD
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 8:29 AM

    @IrishGal26: Maybe because these camps are outdoors? And the children are in groups of 15? Makes sense now?

    197
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    Mute PC
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 8:52 AM

    @IrishGal26: If the teacher’s had to sit at home on the €350 per week payment the Schools wouldn’t be long reopening fully! Yes this strategy of blended learning is a complete joke. Kids playing full contact sport all summer and then have to stay 1 metre apart when in school. The Prime Time program was very sad but confirmed what I suspected – those who were really sick were almost all over 70. The old and those with a serious underlying condition need to cocoon but the rest of us need to get on with our lives.

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    Mute CarlAnne Greene
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 8:52 AM

    @IrishGal26: that’s what is so ridiculous, they can play sports, are meeting up, can go on holidays either here or abroad, country will be fully opened but school won’t happen Fulton under these rules!!!! I get they are in the open air for sport but by September they will be well mingled with people.

    47
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    Mute Martin Moloney
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 9:11 AM

    @IrishGal26: you know that teaching doesn’t happen in a field, right?

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    Mute Martin Moloney
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 9:13 AM

    @PC: classy

    35
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    Mute 8-Bit-Relic
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 9:18 AM

    @Martin Moloney: And not all summer camps are outside either.

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    Mute IrishGal26
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 9:20 AM

    @EMD: Outside or not they are still making contact and mixing. I myself have started back football training (full contact) this week and came into contact with 20 other players yet I’m not allowed back into my office with 4 others. I’ve more chance catching the virus on a pitch then I would in my work.

    47
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    Mute 8-Bit-Relic
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 9:22 AM

    @PC: The teachers don’t make decisions about opening schools. I don’t even know how you got that idea.

    108
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    Mute TheHeathen
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 9:32 AM

    @PC: Did you miss out on the part where teachers had zero input in these ridiculous unworkable guidelines, or are you just on to bash teachers. It’s always teachers’ faults, funny how the worst department in government always gets away with little negativity. I suppose they push all blame on teachers.

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    Mute tottkingham
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 9:43 AM

    @8-Bit-Relic: His comment is really about pay over the shut down and summer break.

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    Mute Em Watson
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 10:07 AM

    @IrishGal26: I’m not sure about other camps but the one my kids are going to the children will be in groups of 6

    12
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    Mute Nell foran
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 10:12 AM

    @PC: they will be in work full time you fool just not the all the children. do you think they want to be teaching full tome and trying to also tach the ithers that are at home. remotely. This will be far harder but the safety of everyone is the most important thing. They didn’t make the rules about what is safe and didn’t make the class sizes

    36
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    Mute Damien
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 10:15 AM

    @PC: OK, so it’s OK for for shops to only allow 6 people in to protect the staff working there. But you want teachers to go back to packed class rooms? O yeah cause we always blame teachers. I for one wouldn’t be doing it if I was in that profession. Safety 1st in the work place. Reduced numbers and all students should be made wear masks.

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    Mute Damien
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 10:25 AM

    @PC: what are you talkign about?? So it’s okay for shop staff to be protected in the likes of kildare village ect.. But you want teachers to go back into over crowded class rooms. Get a grip of yourself. It’s about time we protect our public severnts.
    I for one wouldn’t expect anyone no matter what there education was to go in front of a small classroom with 35 plus teenagers who don’t social distance.
    And why would they be expected to get 350 a week when they’ve being correcting and teaching remotely on all there own personal laptops ect….

    1
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    Mute Peter Roche
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 10:39 AM

    @EMD: where as GAA matches under age are available and teams from different areas play each other 15 on 15??? Mé thinks teachers want more money.

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    Mute nelliekel
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 10:56 AM

    @EMD: half the same kids are out playing together for last few weeks with no social distancing especially in local areas so now they want them to sit apart then at end of day go home then go out to play together

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    Mute Laura White
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 11:42 AM

    @Peter Roche: The teachers are not making these rules. It will probably make their jobs harder working with two different groups of children and coordinating classwork between school and home.

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    Mute Robert Clarke
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 1:42 PM

    @EMD: soon they’ll be letting all and sundry back into the country after being on holiday god knows where, in clubs , pubs ,restaurants without any restrictions what so ever, still at least they won’t have to go through Belfast to go under the radar .
    School’s need to reopen fully if the present numbers stay the same, life continues.

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    Mute qwerty
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 1:43 PM

    @EMD: no, still doesn’t.

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    Mute Laura Healy
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    Jul 3rd 2020, 12:30 AM

    @PC: Do you realise that teachers don’t have any say in these decisions? And believe it or not, teachers can’t wait to get back to work.

    3
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    Mute Laura Healy
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    Jul 3rd 2020, 12:34 AM

    @Peter Roche: Teachers aren’t involved in any decision making in relation to when and how schools will return! Your comment re money is completely irrelevant.

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    Mute Liam Byrne
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 8:15 AM

    They better be back full time.

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    Mute 8-Bit-Relic
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 8:22 AM

    @Liam Byrne: With given rules impossible to implement. The provided education was all over the place since March. I have therefore not much hope that they come up with a working solution.

    (Kudos to the work of the teachers who were engaged…)

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    Mute Dawn Harvey
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 8:37 AM

    @8-Bit-Relic: depends on the school size and space. My youngest will be back full time, her principal has said, even with the 2 metre rule as its a small country school. My eldest is going into secondary and will probably have to do a day or 2 at home, but that’s the way it has to be and it’s being done to protect the communities health. I’ve a vulnerable person at home so I see the reasoning. Plus it’d be very hard for kids to understand one rule in school while another outside… Every eegit would be whinging about kids hanging out at weekends spreading germs but then want the kids in school full time.

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    Mute 8-Bit-Relic
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 9:20 AM

    @Dawn Harvey: Yes, it’s really does. If the classes are small enough there won’t be an issue. Whoever Ireland has on average pretty large class sizes.

    21
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    Mute Declan
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 9:24 AM

    @Liam Byrne: they better be back full time Liam is right. It’s time for politicians to manage this country. If they had no job or pay they would want to go back to work. Cant have it every way. Start in July so to make up for lost months already. Teachers laughing at everyone else here. Some at least must be embarrassed by this horse sh#t. Full contact sports resumed with same kids this week.

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    Mute TheHeathen
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 9:29 AM

    @Declan: I’m not laughing at anyone. I’m embarrassed at the Department and their policies. I have a problem with people on here giving out about teachers though. Did we make these guidelines? Did we have any input? No, but we’ll take the brunt of the public’s reaction to the worst department in government. Give it a rest with the teacher bashing, we want to be back in the classroom, remote teaching left a lot of students behind.

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    Mute Declan
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 9:57 AM

    @TheHeathen: no teacher bashing here but country rapidly losing patience. Put pressure on your unions from the bottom up so to be back full time in September. Let see teachers marching for that. Thanks

    19
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    Mute Nell foran
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 10:16 AM

    @Declan: it isnt the unions either. These guidelines are based on public health guidelines about what is safe. 30children in a small room just isnt workable. You will probably be the first to sue if your child contracts covid

    33
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    Mute TheHeathen
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 10:21 AM

    @Declan: Yeah marching during a pandemic. You missing the part where teachers had zero input into this. Did you read the article? Thanks

    32
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    Mute NotMyIreland
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 11:49 AM

    @Nell foran: It does appear that the unions are stating that they are not happy with the reduction of the 2m rule to 1m for schools. They seem to forget not all industries or workplaces have to stick to the 2m rule already. You didn’t have this reaction by hospitality workers, but only because they weren’t been paid a full wage while at home and of course are not unionized.

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    Mute Rachael Baldwin
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 11:55 AM

    @Declan: I need my son back in school asap as he needs additional help with dyspraxia, online learning was a no go for him. However, school can’t start in July. The teachers that really gave their all to the online learning aspect, with overtime and online meetings etc, then correcting the work, helping and giving feedback on a daily basis, they absolutely 100% deserve to have their summer holidays too. It’s not like the teachers have been able to go out socialising while not being in school. They had the lockdown just like the rest of us and had to use the tools they had at home to do the online teaching. While parents do teach their kids many things, I’m by no means qualified to give my son his education. It’s a tough job with plenty of restrictions.

    16
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    Mute Declan
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 1:47 PM

    @TheHeathen: you can be a smart arse about marches all you like. You know the point I was making. If teachers want this to happen they can make it happen. Alright with you so if you or your family get care in an ICU only 2 or 3 days a week or have food from the supply chain 1 or two days a week? Protected section of irish society that haven’t a clue and sheltered from the real world. You have no public support for this BS and for once need to think about others and get off your backsides and do some work like everyone else.

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    Mute Niamh Hayes
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 8:42 AM

    They need to go back full time .Parents can make up their own mind if they are not happy with the risk and the teachers can wear PPE if they are that worried .pubs open and schools half closed and teachers sitting at home for 6 months on full pay. They will have zero support from the public if they don’t go back to work .

    187
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    Mute Sorcha Ní Shúilleabháin
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 8:55 AM

    @Niamh Hayes: Sitting at home on full pay?? You’re welcome to your delusions!

    162
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    Mute Declan
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 9:20 AM

    @Sorcha Ní Shúilleabháin: explain how Niamh wrong.

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    Mute The Guru
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 9:22 AM

    @Sorcha Ní Shúilleabháin: I know a number of teachers at both primary and secondary level and they’ve been doing at most 10 hours per week of work.

    56
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    Mute Martin Moloney
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 9:25 AM

    @Niamh Hayes: it took a while, but we finally got to the old “teachers sitting at home for six months on full pay” trope!
    Working from home!! I assure you online teaching is twenty time’s more difficult than in person.
    There is no teacher that doesn’t want to get back into the classroom full time. But if other workers in every other setting require PPE etc then workers in schools have the same rights to safety.

    116
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    Mute Sorcha Ní Shúilleabháin
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 9:47 AM

    @Declan: Well I could have sworn that instead of sitting at home on full pay since March I was making Loom video totorials, devising weekly schemes and sourcing resources, liasing with staff, parents and children daily up to 10pm at night and at weekends, holding table quizzes, correcting childrens work and providing feedback and taking part in staff meetings and training all while minding a demanding two year old with another teacher also trying to work in the room. There was ZERO downtime. There’s the odd outlier who got away with the ‘one email a week’ but the vast majority of teachers went above and beyond. I never want to go through the stress or pressure I experienced while teaching from home again.

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    Mute Sorcha Ní Shúilleabháin
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 9:53 AM

    @The Guru: As both a qualified primary and post-primary teacher I’ll wager I know an exponential ‘number’ of teachers than you and am better placed to provide an accurate reflection of the level of engagement during the closures. If you think the majority of teachers only worked 10hours per week you’re deluded.

    85
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    Mute Declan
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 9:59 AM

    @Martin Moloney: Put pressure on your union so to that effect from the bottom up. Let see ya marching to that effect before September so Martin. Thanks

    18
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    Mute Nell foran
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 10:18 AM

    @Niamh Hayes: the teachers will be back full time just not all the students they didn’t make the rules public health did. It’s based on what is safe. Teachers were not just sitting at room they were working usually for longer hours than usual. Cop on

    45
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    Mute C
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 11:03 AM

    @Niamh Hayes: ‘They will have zero support from the public’ Eh, what’s new?

    30
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    Mute Martin Moloney
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 2:33 PM

    @Declan: you make all the assumptions and generalisations and sweeping statements you like there pal.
    Nobody’s going to divert you from your “teachers are overpaid and work shy” tropes.
    Rock on.

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    Mute tottkingham
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 5:49 PM

    @The Guru: BS.

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    Mute Niamh Hayes
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 7:30 PM

    @C: actually I am usually one of the first to defend teachers .I believe teachers should be a higher paid profession and should have job security and in a normal year really need the summer to recover so that they have the energy needed for the job.They have my respect and I don’t know how they do it as it is truly one of hardest and most important jobs .However the country needs them to do their duty now and not let the children down.You know as well as I do how many will fall through the cracks if you don’t.

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    Mute David Shilling
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 8:21 AM

    Large class sizes will not work if the virus is still present in the community. Denmark was able to open their schools as they hired more teachers to keep the class sizes smaller. They also installed more sinks for hand washing. Classes were moved outside whenever possible. The department of education needs to invest now for reopening in the fall.

    Isreal has large class sizes and when they opened their schools they did not address these issues. Within a few weeks after opening there were 529 teachers and students infected with the novel virus. Some 26,669 teachers and students were in isolation and 193 schools were closed.

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    Mute NotaWarder
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 8:38 AM

    @David Shilling: reopening in the what?

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    Mute Simone Hackett
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 8:38 AM

    Why don’t they look how it has been done successfully in other European countries?!? You’d swear Ireland was the only country sending kids back to school. Schools open for nearly two months in Netherlands and no problems or increases in cases. Given kids don’t spread the disease easily the main priority should be getting the kids back to school ASAP!!

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    Mute David Corrigan
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 8:49 AM

    @Simone Hackett: Your last statement is wrong Simone.

    61
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    Mute CalvinKlink
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 8:52 AM

    @Simone Hackett: @Simone Hackett: they now have one teacher for every 10 pupils (it was one teacher per 20 before the virus). In ireland we have a teacher for every 27 pupils.

    They have nearly triple the amount of staff we have and places to put them. We have tiny, cramped rooms and most schools don’t even have hot water.

    It can be done and done right but this guidance should have been out a few weeks ago when schools were opened so they could prepare.

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    Mute Sorcha Ní Shúilleabháin
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 8:53 AM

    @Simone Hackett: The Netherlands doesn’t have an average pupil:teacher ratio of 24:1 with classes packed into undersized classrooms. I’ve taught classes up to 31 pupils in rooms you couldn’t swing a cat in let alone implement 1m or 2m social distancing.

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    Mute Simone Hackett
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 8:55 AM

    @David Corrigan: no it’s not! Keeping kids home is delaying their development, keeping women out of the workforce or behind in their progress in work (as let’s face it women do most of the childcare!) causing stress on parents and family including physical and emotional abuse! If you look at other European countries reopening the schools has been handled well and there is no increase in cases. There are no excuses for keeping the schools closed. Life goes on!

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    Mute Justin Fay
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 9:03 AM

    @Simone Hackett: you should keep your sexist and outdated opinions to yourself. I thought our country had left this behind and it is unfortunate that a woman is still trying to prolong these falsehoods.

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    Mute Simone Hackett
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 9:08 AM

    @Sorcha Ní Shúilleabháin: yes they do! Average sized class in Netherlands is 24 and sometimes there are classes of 32 with one teacher!

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    Mute Simone Hackett
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 9:10 AM

    @Justin Fay: I’m not being sexist! I’m far from that. That’s why I say kids need to go back to school so that women can progress in the workforce!!! If you do a quick google search you will find loads of statistics on who does most of the childcare in a regular household.

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    Mute David Corrigan
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 9:27 AM

    @Simone Hackett: You stated “Given kids don’t spread the disease easily….”. That is not accurate.
    I agree on your views about the schools opening in a controlled way for sure.

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    Mute michael
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 9:33 AM

    @Simone Hackett: He doesn’t mean you’re being sexist against women. You’re being sexist against men. The fact you didn’t even get that proves the point

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    Mute Simone Hackett
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 9:48 AM

    @David Corrigan: it is accurate!! You can find one of the many research sources here https://www.rivm.nl/en/novel-coronavirus-covid-19/children-and-covid-19

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    Mute Simone Hackett
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 10:02 AM

    @michael: Sorry guys but its a well known fact that on average women do more in the household and do more childcare and take on the mental load that goes with that. That’s why fewer women work and there are so many initiatives to get women back into the workforce and to tackle the gender pay gap so that women can be just as great and as equal as you men!! :-D

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    Mute Sorcha Ní Shúilleabháin
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 10:20 AM

    @Simone Hackett: Incorrect.

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    Mute Nell foran
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 10:22 AM

    @Simone Hackett: you are wrong on so many fronts there. Children do spread and contract the virus they are just not super spreaders. Other countries in Europe have smaller classes and larger premises and staff wore ppe when needed. In Israel which have similar class sizes to hear large numbers of children and staff contracted covid after reopening and they had to close again

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    Mute Nell foran
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 10:24 AM

    @Simone Hackett: do you are willing to sacrafice your children for your career classy

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    Mute Simone Hackett
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 10:27 AM

    @Nell foran: it’s not me that is wrong but the Dutch government and science https://www.rivm.nl/en/novel-coronavirus-covid-19/children-and-covid-19

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    Mute Simone Hackett
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 10:38 AM

    @Nell foran: I’m going by facts! they dont wear any protective masks in nl in the classroom so I don’t know what you are talking about there… and in addition I never said kids don’t contract the disease or spread it… they just play a v limited role. We have big classes in the Netherlands as well… it doesn’t seem to be spreading… no new cases or outbreaks.. Facts!

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    Mute Nell foran
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 10:58 AM

    @Simone Hackett: if you are living and working in nl why are you commenting on this its none of your business the nl is an exception other school systems use distancing and ppe or have much smaller class sizes

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    Mute DK
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 11:54 AM

    @Simone Hackett: I agree with everything you’ve said Simone.

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    Mute O Braoin Deglain
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 8:43 AM

    Well they need to get the finger out and get the home schooling working better. 1 email a week wont work. Teachers are on full pay, they need to provide video lessons daily.

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    Mute Daniel Murray
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 9:39 AM

    @O Braoin Deglain: In fairness a lot of teachers from March to May did do video lessons every day but some had infants and toddlers of their own at home which made it very hard for them. Now that creche and schools are back on, maybe that will become easier. I was only able to give video lessons because my wife was off on maternity and so could mind the kids. My students were very nice about the newborn crying and toddler running in to show me lego every five minutes. I’d agree with you though that 1 email per week isn’t an education. What year was your child in? There certainly was a focus on exam years in most schools.

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    Mute Ross Horgan
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 9:54 AM

    @Daniel Murray: was in exactly the same position as you do I could just copy and paste this comment. Agree 100% with everything you said.

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    Mute Robert Clarke
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 1:48 PM

    @O Braoin Deglain: that sounds like bliss, I was forever running out of ink in the printer with all the stuff we we’re getting, probably my own fault for having 4.

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    Mute Mr Wilde
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 8:31 AM

    No social distancing for schools. Kids education took massive hit last few months. They need to go back. Kids at very little risk. Problem will be parents will still send kids with cold like conditions to school.

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    Mute Pedro
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 9:47 AM

    I know everyone in society needs protection but talk about living in fantasy land. They need to just tell schools social distance where possible but don’t worry about classrooms, use good hygiene and do your best. This is an essential service. You’d hope our testing and contact tracing capacity could help if a few cases developed in a school but again, we’ve been months waiting for that with very little progress it seems. Remote learning doesn’t work, it leaves behind the kids who have difficulty with technology/less motivated which creates a huge learning divide. Their personal and social development will be affected too.

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    Mute Nell foran
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 10:27 AM

    @Pedro: are you willing to work in a room with 30 people no distancing for 6 hours a day. With people coughing sneezing and worse cop on. You dont get to sacrifice peoples lives for your convenience.

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    Mute Pedro
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 11:18 AM

    @Nell foran: as I said already, I believe education is essential and I belive that it cannot function while social distancing is in place. It has nothing to do with convenience, what are you on about?

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    Mute Robert Clarke
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 1:51 PM

    @Nell foran: temperature checks on the way in to school, at the first sign of symptoms get the child home, common sense has to play a part.
    As well as all the other stuff that we’re doing already, sanitising etc

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    Mute Paul
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 8:45 AM

    Every school is like a Petri dish. Kids are young and healthy and their bodies immune system is strong. They are probably best able to deal with infections. It’s the teachers that appear to be afraid in this scenario

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    Mute Magic 8 ball
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 9:13 AM

    Well if that’s the case which I believe is rubbish then cut the summer holidays to make up for this new part time teaching idea. I would say if that idea was floated the teachers would be back to normal hours in a flash.

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    Mute Philip Keenan
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 11:13 AM

    @Magic 8 ball: absolutely.

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    Mute Luke Redmond
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 10:58 AM

    This will just cause a massive childcare issue as people return to work
    Surely unworkable

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    Mute Philip Keenan
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 11:10 AM

    Raging. So we can key planes packed like sardines in from all over Europe where the virus is active with no checks or quarantine rules, but the kids can’t go back to school full where the virus is effectively not circulating in the community. By the way kids are least affected. What are working parents supposed to do?

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    Mute Paul Power
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 8:49 AM

    Are teachers on a pandemic payment?

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    Mute Lydia McLoughlin
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 8:53 AM

    @Paul Power: no, not up to the end of the last academic year as far as I know.

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    Mute Caroline Otoole
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 10:14 AM

    For primary schools, just keep classes seperate, with different lunchtimes. Then only 33 kids and 1 teacher are mixing.

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    Mute Bríd Uí Mhaoluala
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 10:56 AM

    @Caroline Otoole: What about SNAs shared between rooms ?
    Children who attend the additional needs teachers ?

    If lunchtimes are all separate , how does that work with 8 classes ? When does the teacher get their lunch or even get to the bathroom?

    Staggered drop offs are mentioned , how can a teacher supervise their class and the drop offs ?

    It’s not as simple as you make out , which is why schools need more certainty and more resources .

    Like most teachers, I can’t wait to be back with my students , but I want it to be as safe as possible, I don’t see why that’s a “ big ask?”

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    Mute Caroline Otoole
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 3:10 PM

    @Bríd Uí Mhaoluala: That’s the list of issues, now we find the list of solutions.
    All the excellent work by my son’s resource teacher has been slowly undone. We have completed the course work but he is testing at 2 years behind emotionally.
    This pandemic will last for atleast 5 years.
    New procedures were implimented in 48hrs in a supermarket employing 10,000 staff.
    It will be hard but it may be the most important we ever do.

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    Mute CalvinKlink
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 7:39 PM

    @Caroline Otoole: are you saying you want tesco to run the denser department of education?

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    Mute Rachael Baldwin
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 12:23 PM

    In regards to secondary schools, there isn’t one bunch of teenagers in the area that I’m in that I’ve seen sticking to the 2metre restriction. They are all still hugging and standing side by side or walking down the street in the groups together. Yesterday I walked past a group of about 15 teenagers and they were taking up the whole path walking down the road. The majority won’t bother with social distancing in school when it’s time to go back.

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    Mute Neuville-Kepler62F
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 2:34 PM

    Wrong Answer: Social distancing rules mean it’s inevitable students won’t be back in school full-time.

    Right Answer: Students will be back in school full-time and we in the ASTI will help to engineer solutions to ensure that it can happen with minimum risk.

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    Mute Niall Donnelly
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 1:34 PM

    Teachers should be dropped from the payroll if they are refusing to work. Those who have underling conditions should go on the sick unpaid. They can’t hold parents and the state to ransom. They all got paid in full while others had their pay dropped. If kids can’t go to school, parents can’t work

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    Mute Bríd Uí Mhaoluala
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 2:58 PM

    @Niall Donnelly: *Sigh* Once more for those who weren’t paying attention. The HSE did these guidelines, not teachers . Class and room sizes are the issue , years of under investment in education is coming home to roost . Many classes don’t even have a sink for hand washing .Any teacher I know wants to be back , face to face, but as safely as possible. What’s wrong with that?

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    Mute Lisa Mannion
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 5:15 PM

    @Niall Donnelly: they will be in the full week. The kids will be split into groups half in one half of the week the other the other. The kids at home should be doing online lessons which will be provided.

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    Mute Niall Donnelly
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 5:43 PM

    @Bríd Uí Mhaoluala: so why are the teacher unions complaining then?

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    Mute Niall Donnelly
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 5:44 PM

    @Lisa Mannion: the days that kids are at home, who’s going to look after them?

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    Mute Heisen berg1
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 10:23 AM

    As long as the kids are off school grate, if been off since mid March full pay,

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    Mute Tom Bombdadil
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 10:57 AM

    Social distancing will be gone! This will be the case. Kids will be back to school. cue the doom experts!

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    Mute James Keogh
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 2:51 PM

    When they do go back will they agree to work an additional half hour per day on same salary.
    Teachers irrespective of COVID have too many days off and are backed by heavy handed Unions who use children as leverage.

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    Mute Bríd Uí Mhaoluala
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 3:05 PM

    @James Keogh: An extra half hour a day for what , exactly ? And tell me about all these days off ?

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    Mute James Keogh
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 4:00 PM

    @Bríd Uí Mhaoluala: Do you seriously not know about the Holiday periods ? ? The short working days as in Primary Schools 9 am to 2 pm (average 5 hours per day) Please don’t mention correcting home work.
    Actual work hours per week approx. 30 hours MAX. and the additional half hour per day would be max. 32.5 hours per week.

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    Mute Martin Moloney
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 4:07 PM

    @James Keogh: you’re embarrassing yourself dude. If the job is such a doss, I suggest you apply immediately so you don’t miss out on the worlds easiest job a minute longer.

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    Mute James Keogh
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 4:46 PM

    @Martin Moloney: Personally couldn’t bring myself to attend a workplace for 2/3 rds of the year and moan and whinge about my work stress to my assistant. You can’t justify the amount of time off and I understand that Teachers get upset when the curtains are opened and then their masks slip they get all defensive.

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    Mute Martin Moloney
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 5:02 PM

    @James Keogh: no defensiveness pal.
    You’re entitled to whatever opinions you want to carry around. It’s your baggage. Do whatever you like with it.

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    Mute Joe Kennedy
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 5:04 PM

    @James Keogh: making a right eejit of yourself Jamesie. Some ignorance in fairness.

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    Mute James Keogh
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 5:22 PM

    @Joe Kennedy: Happy to accept your opinion

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    Mute James Keogh
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 5:23 PM

    @Martin Moloney: No baggage whatsoever, an opinion with justification, Stay Safe

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    Mute Sean Dermody
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 8:58 AM

    Maybe someone needs to have a similar chat with our expert Mr Holohan!
    https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=3298373830255355&id=101043269988443

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    Mute Martin Moloney
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 4:21 PM

    @Sean Dermody: Rand Paul? Seriously?? This is the kind of person you look up to?
    If you know nothing about the calibre of this guy I suggest you look him up.
    But here’s just one recent example…he saw to it that a law which would make “lynching” a hate crime didn’t get passed.
    Classy guy.

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    Mute natalie grimes
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 12:49 PM

    I personally feel it’s a very big burden to be put onto one teacher going forward with so many new children starting,it will be extremely chaotic.

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    Mute Bríd Uí Mhaoluala
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 5:26 PM
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    Mute James Keogh
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    Jul 3rd 2020, 10:18 AM

    @Bríd Uí Mhaoluala: Any excuse,
    Why don’t you just send in a Sick Cert if you don’t want to do your job.

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    Mute Niall Hearty
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 5:02 PM

    Me thinks you full of it..

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    Mute James Keogh
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 5:22 PM

    @Niall Hearty: Hope you don’t teach English

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    Mute Martin Moloney
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 5:28 PM

    @James Keogh: Methinks vs. I Think

    An archaic verb form that survives in modern speech, thanks to its presence in a well-known quotation from Hamlet, is methinks. A Google search for “methinks” brings up more than five million hits.

    The quotation appears in the “mousetrap scene” in Hamlet. Traveling actors are performing a play written to Hamlet’s specifications. He wants to dramatize his father’s murder and produce a guilty reaction in his stepfather. The Player Queen gives a highly charged speech about her feelings for her husband, swearing that, should he die, she will never remarry. Hamlet asks his mother, “How do you like the play?” Uncomfortable with the speech because of her own remarriage, Hamlet’s mother replies, “The lady protests too much, methinks.”

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    Mute Martin Moloney
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 5:29 PM

    @James Keogh: See? Teachers are always working! LOL.

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    Mute James Keogh
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 5:55 PM

    @Martin Moloney: Me thinks he dwelleth in the past, Shakespeare would probably state that it is much Ado about nothing and alas poor Yorick wouldn’t complain. Nice to see our learned pal expounding his knowledge as an answer to his English sentence.
    Enough of that I say, let’s stick to the subject or, the possible lack of should the Teachers not return.

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    Mute James Keogh
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 5:57 PM

    @Martin Moloney: A hit Sir, a palpable hit. Stay Safe.

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    Mute Martin Moloney
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 6:02 PM

    @James Keogh: well played.

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    Mute Damien
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    Jul 2nd 2020, 11:44 AM

    I for one back teachers 100%. They do a super job and I wouldn’t expect them to go into a class of 35 teenagers packed together

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