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LAST UPDATE | 8 Oct 2020
HEALTH MINISTER STEPHEN Donnelly is to address the Dáil today to clarify the sequence of events prior to NPHET’s recommendation that the entire country move to Level 5 of Covid-19 restrictions on Sunday evening.
This afternoon, the Taoiseach said he has full confidence in the minister.
Asked about the controversy about who might have leaked the information about the Level 5 recommendation on Sunday, Micheál Martin said it certainly wasn’t the health minister.
“In terms of the situation on Sunday evening… I don’t know who leaked that, but clearly, it is large body [NPHET] and I certainly can’t say, one way or the other who leaked, but it certainly wasn’t Stephen Donnelly,” he said.
The government expressed surprise at NPHET’s recommendation and an apparent lack of communication over the weekend.
However, Chief Medical Officer Dr Tony Holohan yesterday said he spoke to Donnelly on Saturday, on Sunday morning in advance of a NPHET meeting and again afterwards.
“We discussed my concerns, the concerns I shared with him of the conversations I had with a range of members of NPHET over the preceding 24 hours and the fact that I was going to hold a meeting of the NPHET and would brief him afterwards, which is exactly what happened.
“He didn’t set out parameters within which we would conduct our considerations. I was very clear about the level of concern that I have and had and, if anything, the level of concern I had then is less than the level of concern I have now,” Holohan said.
The government instead opted to move the entire country to Level 3.
Donnelly is set to make a statement in the Dáil later today, after calls from several opposition TDs to do so.
Tánaiste Leo Varadkar told RTÉ’s Claire Byrne Live on Monday night that NPHET’s recommendation “came out of the blue” and no one in the government knew Level 5 was being contemplated until Sunday.
'We didn’t feel #NPHET proposal had been thought through' - Tánaiste Leo Varadkar #cblive pic.twitter.com/z8YhvYgFPS
— Claire Byrne Live (@ClaireByrneLive) October 5, 2020
Speaking in the Dáil this afternoon, Varadkar reiterated that the recommendation to go to Level 5 was a shock to the government, saying there was “no inkling” this would be the advice. However, he said he has since spoken to Holohan and they “cleared the air”.
A spokesperson for Donnelly yesterday confirmed the health minister and Holohan discussed the “deteriorating epidemiological situation” before NPHET gave its Level 5 recommendation on Sunday evening.
The spokesperson said Donnelly informed Taoiseach Micheál Martin on Saturday afternoon that a NPHET meeting would be held on Sunday “arising out of concerns about escalating case numbers”.
Donnelly and Holohan “spoke before and after” the NPHET meeting on Sunday, the spokesperson confirmed. Donnelly and Martin communicated after both of the conversations between Holohan and Donnelly on Sunday.
Speaking on RTÉ’s Today with Claire Byrne, Green Party leader Eamon Ryan said: “No one knew in the country and no one knew in government until Sunday evening that it might be that proposal to go from effectively from level two to five pretty much the next day, and that would have created real difficulty.”
Ryan added that managing the Covid-19 situation is “complex” and as such it’s natural there will be “different views”.
“Those differences in the past have always been overcome and we’ve moved on and worked collectively together and we will again this time,” Ryan stated.
‘Incompetent’
Speaking to reporters this morning, Labour leader Alan Kelly said it wasn’t a matter of “who knew what and when” but rather about whether Donnelly had the “competency” to ask the right questions of Holohan.
“We need details in relation to what happened over the weekend, because there are questions here about competency and capacity. And that is the most serious issue for me. This is not about catching people out, who said what and when,” Kelly said.
Did the minister ask him on Saturday or Sunday morning: ‘Is what you’re saying to me, CMO, so serious that we could end up at Level 5? Because if so, and if that is potentially the outcome, then I need to communicate that across government, so we can prepare for it.’
Kelly called on the minister to make a statement to the Dáil said the “crux” of the question for him is whether Donnelly appreciated the seriousness of the situation.
“Level 5 or Level 4, they are nuances. The question is did he get did it. Did he get that how serious the situation was,” Kelly said.
Sinn Féin’s health spokesperson David Cullinane also last night called on Donnelly to clarify exactly what he knew and when.
“Minister Donnelly’s statement does not address the issue. He allowed the impression to be formed that NPHET went on a solo run and stayed silent as the Tánaiste attacked the CMO. This is unacceptable and he must give a full explanation in the Dáil,” Cullinane tweeted.
Social Democrats co-leader Róisín Shortall also called on Donnelly “to make a full statement of what he was told on Sunday morning and evening and what he did with that information”.
“The country was distracted by an unseemly row between the Government and NPHET at precisely the moment when all attention should have been on responding to the surge in Covid-19 cases,” Shortall said in a statement last night.
Speaking on RTÉ’s Morning Ireland today, Shortall said the “division” between NPHET and the government has taken focus away from “where it should be”, adding: “The government has shown itself to be pretty incompetent over recent days.”
Varadkar and Holohan spoke on the phone on Tuesday night, following the Tánaiste’s criticism of NPHET the previous night.
Varadkar reiterated he was “unhappy” about NPHET’s recommendation on Sunday night, but said the CMO and government are “on the same team”.
Holohan yesterday said he and Varadkar “have a long-standing good relationship over many years, we recognise we need to continue that together over the course of the next weeks and months”.
He added: “I can tell you that he understands and shares my analysis every bit as much and has as much concern about it as I do.”
NPHET is due to meet again today.
- With reporting by Rónán Duffy
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This man(Donnelly) hasn’t a clue
@Shaun Gallagher: It’s not easy being Health Minister at the best of times- but he is totally and absolutely out of his depth.
@Shaun Gallagher: Testing and tracing shocking
@Shaun Gallagher: completely. He’s shown he has completely underachieved and mishandled his portfolio
I was glad that we heard the advice firsthand from NPHET I don’t want my information massaged by politicians before I receive it…we get too much of that.
@Spartacus Ireland: exact….nphet work for US and should publish all their advice before any politician has a chance to water it down.
@Spartacus Ireland: yeah? Like NPHET hopping in the space of less than a week from recommending that the whole country should not go to level3 to saying it should go to level 5. Bit of a difference in saying 24 counties should stay at 2 and a few days later saying they should be at 5. I don’t have much time for our politicians but the seismic shift by NPHET is crazy. Either their initial diagnosis was wrong or their changed advice was wrong.
@Michael Garvey: or the virus is an extremely fluid situation, with key stats changing in a daily basis.
@Michael Garvey: What’s your particular area of expertise in this field?
@Michael Garvey: New stats and epidemiology modelling projections were very concerning to NPHET since last letter advising the Minister for Health!Things can change very quickly re the transmission of the virus and it’s NPHET’S job to review these stats on a daily basis!
The virus doesn’t wait until Government formulates the financial plans for the different Levels they introduced!!
@Spartacus Ireland: if nephet is there to give advice and nobody takes notice of it what exactly is it’s function?
@Nuala Mc Namara: ah look at you trying to pretend you understand covid with your big words taken straight of nphet report..should just copy and paste
@Spartacus Ireland: we didn’t hear it first hand from nphet unless they are responsible for leaking it on Sunday night and if they did it would make them worse, we did not elect nphet they are employed to look at things then report back to government not the electorate no one voted them into power, Tony Holohan is not leader of country last time I checked
@nelliekel: I have the intelligence to understand the stats and epidemiology reports etc ,unlike yourself it seems!!!
@Sean Salmon: are you one of the people who moans about the Children’s hospital as well? Experts recommended St James as the location for that, would you say that the advice there should have been ignored?
@nelliekel: So you want to elect experts in the medical field. Thats what they are experts. Politicians are not experts in all fields especially as one as complicated as this field
@nelliekel: Well the present part time Taoiseacht Michael Martin is certainly not up to the job. The future part time Taoiseacht Varadkar again jumped the gun in interview with Claire Byrne. Holohan has said he spoke to Donnelly Sat/Sunday.. A bolt out of the blue said Martin and Varadkar…Sweet Jesus can they do anything right.
@nelliekel: Well maybe someone should inform him of that!!!
@nelliekel: Aw what big words did Nuala use that you couldn’t understand? LOL!!!
@NotMyIreland: I’m still laughing at that comment now!
@Joe: Without any shadow of a doubt. An ever-growing money pit. It will be a miracle if it ever sees completion.
So it looks more and more likely that Leo’s team leaked the document for political advantage. The government ( Donnelly, Martin) did know about the strong concerns in advance.
There are around 40 people on NPHET – an unscheduled meeting on a Sunday was clearly a very big deal, and it should not have been a shock that they were recommending stronger restrictions.
@Mairead Jenkins: they leaked it to get an idea of the public reaction to it.
@Mairead Jenkins: exactly Leo’s ego comes first… anything for a camera.
@Mairead Jenkins: They all knew of these concerns on Saturday , Taoiseach, Tanaiste and Eamon Ryan!
They knew CMO & NPHET met on Friday and Saturday also with emergency meeting scheduled for Sunday!
They knew that things had changed re stats considerably since Minister got the last letter!
They knew that Epidemiology Modelling Advisory Group do 3day and 5 day modelling re the stats plus projections!
@Chris Mc: You seriously think that’s a crazy, paranoid theory?? You don’t seem to understand the world around you.
@Mairead Jenkins: Donelly withheld the information, that he should have reported
To the Government on Saturday.
Dr Houlihan met 3 times with Stephen Donelly.
Donelly, is a shady character, do some research on him.
@Mairead Jenkins: Martin, Stephen Donnelly did certainly not leak it, so we can safely say now he did
@Mairead Jenkins: Martin, Stephen Donnelly did certainly not leak it, so we can safely say now he did
@Mairead Jenkins: Martin, Stephen Donnelly did certainly not leak it, so we can safely say now he did
@Mairead Jenkins: Martin, Stephen Donnelly did certainly not leak it, so we can safely say now he did
Donnelly needs to go… hasn’t got a clue
@Eddie Michael: No, constantly swapping out political leaders in a time of crisis does nobody any favours. What seems to have happened is that an inexperienced politician didn’t do what he perhaps should have.
Others pounced upon his mistake for their own political gain and it’s this that’s unforgiveable, at such a time of national crisis they’re still playing politics and still stabbing one another in the back, still playing one upmanship. While the rest of are worries about this damn virus and who’s wearing masks, people like that are worried about how they can use it to their advantage. Unforgiveable.
@Arch Angel: if hes not changing party quicker than the flash he’s almost had the government in lockdown because he didn’t feel well.
He has no experience and needs to go.
@Arch Angel: Surely when the Minister for Health informed the Taoiseach on Saturday re CMO/NPHET being very concerned about the latest stats (plus Tanaiste and Eamon Ryan knew on Saturday too) that these experienced politicians should have asked questions about those concerns and offered this “inexperienced politician” advice on how to proceed,etc??!!
@Nuala Mc Namara: That sounds like a reasonable course of action for someone with the best interest of the nation and it’s people to take.
In reality what happened was the polar opposite of this. At a time when we need all of our politicians to get behind a leadership who can get across clear and cocise messages we’re getting the opposite. There’s so much infighting it’s like watching school chikldren, there’s no clear leadership and each one of them will use any opportunity for personal gain. That’s spells disaster for the country, at the worst possible time. Again, unforgiveable.
Very curious why Japan’s low death rate…less deaths than Ireland with 25 times the population…isn’t being discussed.
The only difference in approach has been a strong emphasis on ventilation and fresh air in Japan from the start. The virus is airborne so being in an enclosed space for any length of time makes 2m spacing and hand washing irrelevant….and probably masks too. And if one person is contagious it doesnt matter if there are 6 or 60 people there. Without ventilation and fresh air dissipating the virus it will build up and be shared all around. We’ve had colder weather and have been indoors more with windows shut, which can’t be helping. Kids in schoolrooms too.
Curious why this idea isn’t being considered. Our tactics seem disjointed and illogical…and locking us in again during winter seems wrong to me.
Put on sweaters and open the windows. Let the virus’ float away and dissipate rather than build up around us in rooms.
@Tom Goss: Much like most of eastern Asia they already had a culture familiar with wearing masks and a society which is generally respectful and observant towards government guidance.
The pandemic has really shown how weak the sense of societal unity is in the west, everyone is out for themselves with guidance from governments and even medical experts viewed with suspicion.
@Rochelle: We’re in the age of the individual or as Thatcher said “There is no society”
Not the best idea of the world to have during a global pandemic.
@Rochelle: We had guidance from government pressurizing people to get onto the property ladder…who were then hung out to dry when things went west. And ‘medical experts’ don’t always agree amongst themselves…nevermind there being reasonable concerns about corporate funding the last few decades influencing scientific ‘objectivity’, shall we say.
There is good reason, unfortunately, for people to be a bit suspicious here.
The focus here should be on why Leo reacted the way he did. I find it hard to think that he had no information about NPHETs meetings, even if not formally from Donnelly or Martin.
Not for the first time it seems Leo is pulling political strokes, cynic in me thinks it may have something to do with recent polls.
@An Capall Liath: i fully agree, i wonder would Leo have reacted the same if it was a FG health minister. From what i can see Leo is slowly destroying FF but he’s doing it in plain sight hoping nobody will notice. He couldn’t pick a worse time to be playing political games.
MM needs to show some real leadership because it seems like Leo is still in charge.
At this stage I couldn’t care less who leaked it. I do care that both the coalition, the opposition and NPHET are playing blame ping pong, transforming this into a measuring of force with total disregard for the population.
We have police delaying traffic on purpose, zero Covid apologists trying to push their agenda, NPHET trying to blackmail people with Christmas – as if Christmas is more important than mass unemployment- we have the CMO saying the virus loves alcohol, the government paralysing hospitality, not enough beds created in hospitals and the public asked to bailout the HSE for the second time in the same year at the cost of their jobs and sanity.
@Isabel Oliveira: The government paralysing hospitality/blackmailing with Christmas? Police delaying traffic on purpose? I honestly don’t know what planet you people are from. You really seem to believe that Holohan, the government and HSE are getting a kick out of this pandemic. If anyone is trying to push their agenda, it is you – who for months has whinged about the measures put in place to protect public health, made repeated false statements about COVID 19 and alludes to a ridiculous conspiracy that this is all to demean the populace and curtail our rights. Get a grip on yourself.
@Isabel Oliveira: that was embarrassing to read I’m sorry but I want you to use logic. Government wants reelection. How they handle covid will determine if they are in next time or out. They need people back at work, they need tax income the need building projects to show off they can’t do this with COVID in place and if they mess it up which they are by ignoring medical advice we have to lock down for longer putting the economy down for longer. There is no advantage for them to put in place a lockdown this whole thing with NPHET makes the government look like they are ignoring experts.
@Ciaran Burke: ‘The whole thing with NPHET makes them look like they are ignoring experts.’ No, that is not correct and even NPHET have continually emphasised that it is their job to advise the government and then it is the government’s job to take that expert medical advice and place it in the wider context of assessing how it will impact all of society, and from there weigh up the risks and benefits of adopting NPHET’s advice. No other European country has implemented a nationwide lockdown since the first wav. Localised restrictions are now favoured even by the WHO. Our level 5 is a national lockdown with the exception of schools remaining open
@Philip Kavanagh: you sound like a government apologist, what Isabel said is right.
@SB: What Isabel said was complete waffle. You sound like someone who wears a tinfoil hat.
Amach. Amach. Amach!
He should be sacked
@Jonnie Marre: I’m wondering if Martin told varadkar and if he did leo lied on claire Byrne monday night and leo should resign
@Jonnie Marre: that’s it you’d love it all you knockers
@Macca Attack: as if resigning would achieve anything. It certainly wouldnt stop the virus spreading.
Didn’t take him long to become a true fianna failer!!
He’s even irritating to look at, sling your ‘ook Donno !
Donnelly is so far in over his head we are all watching him drowning in his own incapacity
This controversy isn’t finished yet. Could be another FF head on the chopping block. Micheál’s sub’s bench must be looking fairly sparse at this stage.
@Handsome McWonderful: always a few developers on hand, to fill up empty accounts, I mean Dail seats.
Irish version of Trump and Fauci, politicians vs experts.
@Shengjie Xu: experts only considering the immediate health repercussions. Gov have to balance economy, public sentiment and opinion etc. There will be level 5 within two weeks. Managing our expectations
@Shengjie Xu: Nonsense. We didn’t elect NPHET to govern us. We elected politicians and we hold them accountable, not NPHET, who exist to advise the Government. Government has to consider and balance the entire of society and the economy. NPHET exist solely to provide advice about the public health implications of Covid. They don’t even have to take into consideration the health implications of a Level 5 on the treatment and diagnosis of non-Covid patients.
This is largely a storm in a teacup. Varadkar’s comments related to the leaking of a recommendation from NPHET to the Govt before the Govt had an opportunity to consider it. His criticisms were level headed and clear. You don’t have to agree with them but NPHET aren’t running the country, the elected Govt are.
@John R: CMO & NPHET didn’t leak the letter to Minister for Health cc to Department of Taoiseach on Sunday.It was a detailed analysis of the latest stats and latest epidemiology modelling report which deeply concerned NPHET& CMO.In the last paragraph,it mentioned further discussion could be had with CMO re contents.
These letters from CMO to Minister for Health have been published for several months now so it would have been in the public domain in a day or two.CMO said by this letter being leaked ,the normal procedure re subsequent discussions with CMO/NPHET could not take place!!
@John R: his comments about out of blue, not well informed is not level headed. Thats one sided story. They have been updated throughout the weekend before the meeting. That’s a stab at the back, a division within. NPHET concern public’s health only. That’s their sole goal. Politicians, in a pandemic, first concern is still don’t piss off the majority. As nphet said, they need to communicate carefully, other words talk like politicians.
@John R: NPHET had nothing to gain from leaking anything only certain people had. Thats where the leak is from.
@John R: Nonsense, Houlihan met with Donelly, 3 times.Once on Saturday, twice on Sunday.
Donelly withheld the information. Very shady person. What’s he playing at…he is a scurrilous
Opportunist.
We know both FF and FG are corrupt.
@Paul Power: Whereas SF …? And what has your comment for to do with the article?
@Paul Power: absolutely 100%
And if he’s replaced ye will say the same about the new guy/gal
Yawn
@Self Employed Anarchist: Putting yourself forward for election should be like going for a new job. Prove your credentials and experience first and then let the people decide.
At the moment we are getting college drop outs, former tea ladies, failed farmers and school teachers being put in charge of these organisations.
It’s simply not good enough.
@David Corrigan: who has us in the state we are.? Joe Public of course. I didnt vote for this government but personal attacks on peoples characters in government is not the way forward. The people need to also fight this virus as well and not expecting everything to be done for them. We have deep divisions and may require a national government if this continues.
@John Nolan: Personal attacks? Where did you read personal attacks John?
@David Corrigan: Well we had doctors put on charge of health. They still made a balls of it.
Donnelly in way over his egg head
@Alan: looks like you have more of an egg head. Only difference is he’s intelligent and you …….
@Teresa O’Halloran: is he intelligent?
@Teresa O’Halloran: intelligent seriously!!! remember trampolines:):)
He jumped ship and got into bed with FF because that was where he felt he could make a difference. Now it’s the party he left holding him to account and questioning government’s ‘incompetence’.
ALL OF MY APPOINTMENT HAVE BEEN CANCELLED IT IS A DISGRACE NO HOSPITAL STAFF WEAR PROTECTIVE MASKS. Why,
@William Southward: why wear a mask when you’ve got caps
What more is to be said about a government minister who comes out with this lunacy amongst other ridic ulous things!!
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.joe.ie/amp/news/stephen-donnelly-compares-risk-sending-kids-back-school-driving-car-702114
My hunch is Spinmeister Varadkar leaked it so he could come down on Holohan like a ton of bricks thereby courting the covidiot vote. The Blueshirts know their base….
And if he’s replaced ye will say the same about the new guy/gal
Yawn
@Self Employed Anarchist: so that makes it ok so —-gowl
Can we’ll see what he will say.
I erm well I think but can’t remember what the question was
What’s more important us WHO leaked the information and Leo seriously needs to apologize
Amazing how it’s leak after leak once FF got in
I don’t care who knew what when and how. I just want us to flatten the curve as best we can. This has become an unnecessary distraction from that goal. Can we just work together please. We need to crush the virus, there isn’t a whole heap of difference between level 3 and level 5. We know what we need to do. Social distance, sanitize your hands and wear a mask. It’s not that difficult unless you are a muppet or even a puppet for a fascist group.
@Teresa O’Halloran: It might be a good start if government started to listen and work with the health experts Teresa.
@David Corrigan: they have been though have they not? Govt would serve no purpose if it just blindly followed every single piece of NPHET advice, which it seem ls to have done up to this point. There are important socio-economic factors to take into account also that NPHET are not concerned with as part of their public health only remit. Tony H admitted this himself.
@Teresa O’Halloran: We can’t crush the virus. We locked down the entire country and had low infection rates. Then we opened up and infection rates increased. Now we are shutting down again. Let’s assume we will go to level 5 again at some point. The virus replication rate will reduce. Then we will open up again. The virus replication rate will increase. We also share a land border with NI.
This is a worldwide pandemic. It isn’t possible to crush the virus. Zero virus is a fiction. There has never been a case in history where a quarantine crushed a worldwide pandemic. We will need a vaccine to achieve that. What exactly is the NPHET strategy seeking to achieve? Is it zero virus? In the meantime we are spending scarce resources we will need for things like housing. What is the strategy?
@John R: I believe the strategy is just as you outline, control it, slow the spread, save lives, protect health resources and await the arrival of more effective health treatments and ultimately a vaccine. Twinned with this the govt wants to see as much economic activity as possible while still trying to achieve all of the above. This is why govt differed from NPHET on the current restriction level.
@GrumpyAulFella: CMO said at yesterday’s briefing on RTE, when responding to a question,that Government hasn’t always followed NPHET’S advice!!
@GrumpyAulFella: I spoke to a business owner today who said it would be much better (for businesses)to go to Level 5 for 3 weeks,strictly enforce it and reduce the transmission of the virus substantially than opening and closing down the country several times!
@Nuala Mc Namara: I think we both know that if we go to Level 5 then it won’t be for 3 weeks. It would mean that the virus is completely out of control. As it stands, it looks as though Dublin is slowing. I think level 5 should be the equivalent of Defcon 4 and held in reserve given the economic consequences of such a move.
@Nuala Mc Namara: I wouldn’t expect him to say any different given the circumstances but I’m assuming any advice not taken previously was minor enough or we would have heard about it.
@Teresa O’Halloran: we’re all doing this already Teresa, it’s not working and won’t work either, we’ll eventually get back down to a trickle of cases a day like July then open up society again and there will be another spike in cases, all lock downs do is cripple the economy and people’s mental health.
@John R: finally a man who speaks sense, well said John agree 100%
@GrumpyAulFella: The whole point of Level 5 or ‘circuit breaker’ would have been to prevent the virus going out of control and I think a strict Level 5 of 3 weeks would reduce the R number to under 1 throughout the country!There could be fines for breaches of the rules.It should be considered.You know I’ve fully supported all the public health advice and guidelines so far.
When you think of the costs of yoyo- like opening and closing down the country re businesses,PUP,etc compared to a very strictly implemented 3 weeks lockdown, wouldn’t the latter be more prudent economically?
While R rate in Dublin is just above 1,it’s a fact that people commute to work in Dublin from other counties and Professor Nolan said that R rate is 1.5 in other counties!
Do you have a link to the financial/economic plans for the 5 Levels including Level 5?
@SB: sadly, we’re not all doing this already, if we are , we wouldn’t be in the current situation. There should be penalties for people who continue to flaunt the advice.
@Mary King: I agree Mary not everyone is, it appears to fall on deaf ears on many younger people this is where the bulk of the cases are coming from , I agree there should be penalties for people who don’t practise social distancing or sanatize hands but some of the draconian stuff mentioned is ludricious , but we’ve already seen lock downs will never work, we’ve tried this approach already and it may have got cases down to a small figures, but the virus doesn’t go away and in time rises again, we need to open up and try a different approach.
@Teresa O’Halloran: there’s a big difference between level 3 and level 5. A regular weekly wage for instance.
‘This afternoon, the Taoiseach said he has full confidence in the minister.’
How many times have we heard that before a sacking…?
Everything FFG do turns into an absolute fvup up of epic proportions, have you ever in your entire life seen a government so bad, out of touch and shocking, I can’t wait for the film or book that will come in years to come, the abject failure of the coalition government of 2020.
@SB: But no alternative .
Gone
When a politician is denying something he is losing his argument
It beggars belief why some are calling for a level 5 lock down when we already know what the outcome is going to be, the economy will suffer very very badly, unemployment will rise sharply, important hospital appointments will be cancelled which could have a detrimental effect on many people.. people’s mental and physical health will suffer badly, many who lose their jobs will also lose their homes too,, and for what, so we can get back to single figures of cases like in July and the catastrophic damage that has been caused in the meantime, so the country would be in a fragile state but we open up society again, and slowly but surely watch as cases begin to rise again and a few months later another spike in cases and we’re back to square one, this is the reality of the situation.
@SB: and before anyone asks what’s the alternative, we should open up society, put measures in place to protect elderly people and those who have underlying medical conditions, strict fines or even jail for those who don’t practice social distancing, etc if large fines or jail time is handed out to some people who don’t comply then those who don’t comply would soon get the message no exceptions, sanitising points everywhere, proper ventilation indoors where people can’t social distance, ramp up testing where people can get results back within a few hours instead of waiting days , these are just a small few measures that could be introduced, but they are so stubborn they won’t try another approach.
@SB: Sorry have you not just spent the last two or three weeks claiming that putting fines in place for non compliance was not acceptable and a slide into a police state. Better to live in North Korea you said. Now your looking for jail time? What changed?
@NotMyIreland: for certain things like Gathering in large groups that’s what I meant not driving into another county just to get out of Dublin.
have your say