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LAST UPDATE | 7 Feb
AS THE IRISH Government considers whether, when and how to proceed with the Occupied Territories Bill, with the aim of preventing imports from illegally occupied Palestinian land, two opposing points of view are being asserted.
On the one hand, many argue, based on Irish values, that the Government has no alternative to proceeding immediately with the Bill. On the other hand, others insist, based on Irish interests, that the idea should be kicked into the long grass. The truth is that each of these arguments is both valid and important.
We live in a world in which politicians increasingly promise simple solutions to complex questions with a view to appealing, often successfully, to public opinion. In an extreme form, populist leaders, have boiled entire political philosophies down to meaningless short slogans, such as “Make America Great Again”, that are so simplistic as to do immense damage.
Fortunately, in Ireland, populism is still very much a minority sport. Both sides of the argument on the Occupied Territories Bill put their cases reasonably and with a degree of sophistication. Nevertheless, it is essential to remind ourselves from time to time that complex questions need to be addressed in a way that recognizes that complexity. As Robert Bolt wrote, God “made animals for innocence, and plants for their simplicity, but men and women he made to serve him wittily in the tangle of their minds”.
For our country to ignore its values would be to render all political endeavour transactional and to impoverish our public discourse. To dismiss any concern for our interests would be an eccentric form of political sleepwalking that could have a negative impact on ordinary citizens.
We elect our Government to tease out the balance between values and interests, on this and on other domestic and international issues, not as a theoretical philosophical exercise but because, in broad terms, we want them to reflect our priorities and aspirations.
As regards values, there is no doubt that the case for the Occupied Territories Bill is not only strong but incontrovertible. Israel, supported by the US Government and opposed essentially by the rest of the world, continues relentlessly and systematically to annex Palestinian land over which it has no rights whatsoever — legally, morally, historically or biblically. It has been doing this for many years, including by military action and by tolerating Israeli settler violence. The case for rejecting imports from the Occupied Territories, insofar as they can be distinguished from Israeli exports, is clear.
President Trump’s recent proposal, as preposterous as it is monstrous, that the US should seize Gaza and expel the Palestinians, demonstrates that he has zero understanding of international law, world opinion, human motivation or basic decency. It is a reminder of why the world should stand with the Palestinians and that Ireland’s decision to recognise Palestine was timely. Americans have as much right to expel Palestinians and take over their land, as Mexican migrants have to annex California and incorporate it into Mexico.
Trump has suggested that Gaza is a great piece of “real estate” that could become the Riviera of the Middle East. Far from Rivieras, his infantile approach is more likely to ensure Rivers of Blood for many more generations to come.
Those who advocate prioritising Ireland’s values in relation to the Bill can also point out that some Irish interests could also be advanced by its adoption. In a world in which international law is under increasing threat, including from Moscow and Washington, there is a pragmatic case for supporting international law in this instance. Ireland’s standing in parts of the world would also be enhanced.
However, having said all that, the Government also needs to take account of several significant Irish interests. It needs to bear in mind how the Trump administration, however unjustifiably and capriciously, would react and what damage that could do to Irish economic and trade interests.
It will be aware that the Netanyahu Government will continue to stoke up the narrative of alleged Irish “antisemitism” essentially because it resents an Irish approach based on the conviction that all innocent lives are of equal value.
The Government has a moral as well as political responsibility to factor in the possible impact on Irish jobs. It will be aware that those who now most vociferously call for the Bill’s adoption would, as is normal in democratic politics, be the first to criticise the Government if our economy takes a hit. The responsibilities of Government are quite different from those of opposition.
The Government should also bear in mind the risks of Ireland acting alone. It should take account of EU law, of how our partners would react, and how we can best influence them – as we did in nudging them gradually towards calling for a Gaza ceasefire.
One of the characters in Evelyn Waugh’s novel Scoop, when he doesn’t agree with his boss, instead of saying “no”, always replies “Up to a point, Lord Copper”. As Chris Patten has argued, it a useful political philosophy that rejects simple assertions in favour recognising that, on complex questions, there is always another point of view.
As the Government is reflecting on the Occupied Territories Bill, it will take into account complexities that are not in the public domain, including the Attorney General’s advice and what international partners are saying privately. In responding to the reasonable arguments from both sides, it could usefully say to each “Up to a point, Lord Copper”.
Bobby McDonagh is a former Irish Ambassador to the EU, UK and Italy. He is an executive coach and commentator on subjects around EU and Brexit.
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Regarding the Multinationals . They are here to make money whilst paying a minimum in tax . They do not answer to Netanyahu / AIPAC or Trump but to their shareholders .The shareholders are interested in share price and dividends . They will all have their individual political beliefs but business is separate . I believe that the threat of economic retaliation is grossly overstated . After all it is just a negotiation tactic .
@Des Hanrahan: You’re familiar with Wall Street then I assume.
@Des Hanrahan: It’s not just global financial workings that Irish public and politicians are dangerously ignorant about. War is an experience outside the sphere of safe Irish politicians and public. Hamas is an experienced terror army that uses terror warfare strategies incomprehensible to Irish. While most male Hamas fighters are active elsewhere they pack their military offices with expendable sacrificial(martyr) women and female children as human shields. This tactic to protect the Hamas commanders is clearly working on the gullible safe western political mouths.
@Des Hanrahan: The problem with the OT Bill is it does place financial barriers on multinationals. They will have to spend resources ensuring they are compliant when sourcing products and services to ensure they were not produced in occupied territory, may be legally liable if they fail to spot something that got through, and may have to change their supply chain at great expense if they want to continue operating from Ireland. Israel will not make labeling transparent, and ensuring products sourced from an EU country doesn’t contain parts that would breach the law is another complexity.
There is also the US Anti-boycott compliance laws which can see US companies penalized for complying with boycotts the US government does not approve of. The US government is incredibly strict on how US companies can operate internationally. There is a string of countries it is illegal for them to do business with.
All of that can act as a huge disincentive to investment.
@thomas molloy: Israel is an industrial terrorist state founded by terrorists using terrorism that deploys terrorism daily against children. And they don’t confine their activities within Palestine. Hamas by comparison are in the halfpenny place compared to them and are not ‘overseas’. Read up if you disagree. I dont condone Hamas and nor do I condone terrorism btw and nor am I anti Semitic btw.
@Niall Byrne: getting our knickers in a twist about technicalities when multinationals can be given extra time to adjust while looking the other way by simply not doing the detail on components. Existing contracts need to be honoured. Ireland needs to sort the IFSC selling Israeli bonds too.
@thomas molloy: Tell me this, how do you use women and children as human shields against 1000lb bombs, Israel bombed everyone, women, children, vulnerable sick people, so what benefit was it for Hamas to use people as human shields when doesn’t care who they bomb, that’s just a little sprouted by Israeli supporting countries which is completely false, I don’t condone what Hamas done on October 7th and I don’t condone the Israeli indiscriminate carpet bombing of Gaza but to use the human shields argument is laughable.
@Seanie: *Israel
@John G: It really is not a “technicality”. US companies in Ireland would be in breach of US law if they complied with an anti-Israeli boycott. They could potentially lose US government contracts and be levied hefty fines. It’s a huge threat to investment in Ireland. It’s all in the US Anti-Boycott Act which has been passed since the Occupied Territories Bill was introduced in the Dail. The government not taking into account fallout from the US government’s strong anti-boycott provisions would be reckless and potentially devastating to industry in Ireland. I suspect most people flailing about the OT bill have not a clue about the actual ramifications of it.
We get it Bobby the government is in a tight spot with this
But let’s have some ba//s. This trump neytenhau alliance is pure evil
Let’s be on the right side of history not like old Devs disasters when he put Ireland on the wrong side..
@David Cotter: If balls means enacting a bill that does nothing for Palestinians anywhere, does nothing to promote peace, cuts €1.5 million in trade while risking billions in US corporation taxes, fdi and 300,000 irish jobs then count me out.
This would be an unprecedented act of national self-harm for literally zero benefits anywhere. Politicians demanding this are a threat to this country. Their student union level soundbites might earn social media clout, but they won’t pay the bills etc.
@honey badger: again with the money……F#€k the money
Ahh jb. Got you a beaut on the last article. Resorting to serving suggestions now are yeahahaaha
@David Cotter: Tell me why it’s right to support something that does nothing for Palestinians and risks billions that this country relies on? Fffk the money isn’t answer btw.
@honey badger: because it’s the right and moral thing to do….the Palestinians are in a dreadful situation with the might of the world powers against them…do you think the Palestinians and others in the Arab world aren’t watching this….it’s massive for them to know some of us European countries are at least sympathetic…..
@honey badger: well said
@David Cotter: the Irish gov’t in a ‘tight spot’? What a laugh. Ireland is a speck in global terms. There are at least 85 cities in the world with a greater population than Irelamd
Notions of importance & the arrogance to believe in our own bullshít
Nothing more than a pass through is this country
@David Cotter: I’d have thought that Palestinians realised we were quite sympathetic. The EU and the US have donated literally billions in aid over the years. Ireland has donated tens of millions.
Again, I ask you, why is a bill that does nothing for Palestinians worth risking billions to put economy?
@honey badger: * our
@Jim: really Jim….then why does Israel single us out if we’re irrelevant…..we’re obviously not their finance minister went for us again today
@honey badger: sigh !!!! You’re seeing everything with € £ $
Sometimes life is more than just money..
@David Cotter: right and moral thing to do. There is no such thing. Never has been when it comes to personnal self survival or interest. Grow up.
@offside again: spoken like the selfish c#%€ you’ve proven yourself to be round here
@David Cotter: they single us our because we’re one of the few countries that are stùpīd enought to do the equivalent of walking across the street to intervene in a fight between two nãsty gangs.
One of them suddenly thinks we’re best friends and wants to come and live with us.
Our main ally is a government that also cannot run their own country and are even worse at keeping the lights on.
@David Cotter: Ok the government take your advice and enact the bill, multinationals leave, unemployment soars and the tax take falls off a cliff. What are you going to do to pay dole, pensions, public sector wages etc? Being morally right won’t feed you or your family.
@David Cotter: clearly there is no cure for your immaturity. The world is too complex for you.
@The next small thing: again with the f#€k1ng money…some might go most will stay….
Can we have some ba//s and support a decimated people..
We were the Palestinians one time in history..
@offside again: let me simply it for you. “Slaughtered children bad”
@David Cotter: The Gaza (so-called) Palestinians are in a dreadful situation because they wrongly believed they could kidn@p, řápê & ƙīĺľ Israeli civilians without consequences.
Is that you in disguise bibi…
@David Cotter: F€&k the money? I am guessing you don’t have a mortgage or bills to pay? Or a job? So if myself and my husband lose our jobs, who will pay for my bills, who will pay to rear and educate my kids? No money less tax….what about health care?? Obviously not you, because you are alright and we don’t need money in Ireland??? Because of a decision made in the 1940s which Ireland had no hand in??
@Mary Kelly: aww poor Mary…go down to the welfare officer
In sure your no stranger to him…
@David Cotter: Well said David! Grow a pair is right.
@David Cotter: like I said.
Ireland is a pass through, a pawn in a game we don’t even understand. This makes Ireland (and when I reference ‘Ireland’ in this context I’m referring to our slef-important, easily manipulated pupetitions).
Insignificant in the real game that’s being played.
@David Cotter: There’s way more displaced people in The Congo (millions of children too). Let’s fix that also. Plus Tibet is occupied. Obviously there’ Crimea. We need more bills, we can solve everything if our politicians ramble on for long enough.
@David Cotter: The problem with you is that you never lived through a recession, never experienced a hungry day. Given the choice, which would you rather have, a job to feed yourself and your family and put a roof over their heads, or the high moral ground and being on the right side of history?
@Brian Hunt: lived in 2 recessions Brian….none of what you say matters when bombs are raining down on you killing 46000 civilians around you……now stop with the poor mouth there’s incredible wealth in this country
@honey badger: because your case is not proven and to appease Trump we cave in but sooner or later he will do what you fear anyway so why compromise ? Ireland has little advantages and little disadvantages that multinationals are already well aware of so won’t leave overnight and in fact will probably double down. Furthermore BRICSI are now much much bigger and will replace USA as the main economic entity in future so we should be better aligned to it by standing up for ourselves at least. Ireland is small and fairly adaptable so as long as OPW aren’t in charge of finance we will sit in the ocean in our little leaky boat and survive as usual but the Palestinians won’t and Ireland’s example may drag bigger countries to resist and join us in doing the right thing.
@Thomas Sheridan: you’re out of date there… no evidence provided so fake news. Hannibal directive. Do catch up
@David Cotter: Him? what about Her?
@honey badger: tell me how you know for certain that the knock on effect of implementing the bill won’t help Palestinians. They told the Dunnes check out girls that their actions wouldn’t help black south Africans. Honeybadger, you have consistently shown little care for the Palestinians in the comments since Oct 7, so it seems like the typical voice against actions of solidarity, voices that have been around for ever “sure there’s no point doing x, sure what’s that going to do to help y”. “Sure Moses, don’t be leading your people out of Egypt, that won’t help your people, you’ll only get everyone in trouble, you’ll probably get them killed, just stay here now like a good lad and stay sorry to Pharaoh, and your people go back to being good little slaves, yeed be better off now, good man”. Ah yes, you’re an archetype as old as time, honeybadger.
@honey badger: there is more in this world than the accumulation of wealth. Ffg are a mini of trumpism. Neo liberal agendas,making money at all cost. Why should a few hundred thousand poor people and children being murdered stand in the way of markets. I’d prefer to live in a society, when the poor are taken care of
@honey badger: how sad that you’d sell your soul so readily.
@honey badger: Would that be like the Dunnes Stores who refused to handle apartheid South African produce, sure that did nothing and surely by your measures that was also illegal. People like you expect nothing to be doblne to allow illegal settlers to claim land that isn’t theirs. I’m not sure how you’re confufused by not trading with illegal settlements other than the fact that you support them and suggest everyone else should, a conscience is a great thing to have. You appear to me to be akin to the Irish who kicked out families during the Famine, but sure you have to survive. And no name so as there are no consequences for the rubbush you type. A policy brought in in the fifties and still used but you’re economocially savvy, choosing to rely on multi-nationals.
@David Cotter: If you think for one moment that the countries of the Middle East care what Ireland does you are completely deluded. These same countries – the Sunni and Shia blocks led respectively by Saudi Arabia and Iran – have been far more interested in fighting with each other over regional influence – including the horrendous proxy war in Yemen whose tens of thousands of civilian casualties seem not to have bothered our collective conscience one bit – than standing together and standing up for their Moslem brothers and sisters in Palestine. Instead, the Saudis, Egyptians, and Jordinians, the people who are closest to and in the best position to stand up for the Palestinians, have been content to take bungs and guns from the US, and to play along with US divide and conquer policies.
@David Cotter:
Watch your mouth ye little tram p.
@Peter O’Muiri: ooohh someone knows what a sunni and Shia is. Must be an expert. It’s not about what the middle eastern nations think. It’s about setting an example for the rest of a the west.
Palestinians lives are more important than profits
@Kevin O Brien: Only certain lives are more important to our woke left.
There are numerous other wars throughout the world with horrific casualty figures but not as many paid activists.
@Thomas Sheridan: well said, no mention of civil wars or famine in African nations such as famine in Somalia which had killed unknown numbers. No nice scarf or flag
@Thomas Sheridan: It includes other places such as Western Sahara.
@Daratheprofessional 1:
What does?
All I hear is palestine included in every reference to the OTB and no other country.
Let’s be honest. This is designed to be a bill against Israel, and saying it applies to other countries is nothing less than a smokescreen.
@Thomas Sheridan: paid activists? Name and shame pls!
@Thomas Sheridan: only certain lives are worth the whataboutery commets from the likes of you.
@Thomas Sheridan: it is patently against Israel and rightfully so. Israel is an ethnocentric state practicing apartheid as well as oppressing its native population as a matter of public policy
@Kevin O Brien: Except that the potential loss to Ireland and the risks involved in pursuing this legislation under this US administration will not buy or save as much as one Palestinian life.
The risk of very considerable pain versus the certainty of zero gain.
A no-brainer!
@Thomas Sheridan:
The Irish left is akin to a disease.
Let’s cut to the chase… I personally have no strong views on the OTB. There are pros and cons… pros and cons the government are and have been well aware of.. but they unequivocally promised during their election campaign that they would sign into legislation the OTB. So they either lied to win votes or they are incompetent and hadn’t fully understood the implications of such a bill. Neither scenario looks good. Exactly the same logic needs to be applied to the discrepancy in the numbers they used for housing delivery for 2024.
@Andy Mc Laughlin: great point. Looking at it from a purely domestic perspective, it’s another election promise from government that’s not being delivered.
Presumably the Israel/Trump fans will be delighted with their suggestion that Ireland take in our fair share of Palestinians?
@Jack Hayes: Would be funny to see how the likes of Ferg Power and that Mad yoke from Kerry who have had the MAGA hats glued to their head since November if we take in thousands of Palestinians as a result of Trump’s actions.
@J B: Did you bother reading the article about it on here, no, how surprising. Maybe it was Karma for countries that took in the Irish when we were a nation that couldn’t employ the majority, the Famine, no, you only need to go back to the recession and plenty of disgusting acts by the Irish when having to emigrate to work. The fickle Irish, we’re rich now, well the majority aren’t.
Keeping in mind that this is only the beginning of the evil which the US & Israel intends to inflict on innocents whose land they wish to seize.
If Ireland isn’t willing to do anything now because of Gaza, will it do anything when the West Bank is levelled? Will it do anything when Trump invades Greenland or when a nuclear bomb is dropped on Iran?
Ireland is fundamentally at a crossroads where we need to decide if we’re a peaceful, principled nation upholding international law or if we’re economy first and will support the US , NATO and its allies regardless of the terrible moral and diplomatic cost.
Unfortunately it’s difficult to imagine FF/FG doing anything else other than selling their vote to the highest bidder.
@Rochelle Hart: NATO hasn’t been involved in what is happening in Gaza. NATO has been preoccupied in helping Ukraine to defend itself against Putin’s far bigger and just a brutal war of aggression.
I thought the Bill covered all ‘Occupied Territories’ not just Zionist occupied Palestine.
@PhiBo: yeah it’s only the settlements. It’s a compromised bill at best. If I’m not mistaken Ireland used to already have a ban of sorts on goods from the settlements, but it was scrapped maybe around 10 year’s ago.
Trump has a moral obligation to take all Palestinians from Gaza if he goes ahead with their expulsion. As for his sanctions of the international criminal court, this is pure ridiculous and childish.
Palestine belongs to Palestinians. You can’t leave your property and your descendants come back after several hundred years and expect to claim ownership.
@Con Cussed: ahh Jesus con. Moral obligation and trump in the same sentence …
@David Cotter: Yeah, I know. He, nor his Israeli counterpart have any moral or value for human life.
@John Murphy: just casually calling for forced displacement of people. Also, the fact you think all Muslim majority nations in the region are the same, kinda points to you being completely clueless to the region. Reducing it down to religion also shows this.
@John Murphy: It seems as you are just as morally corrupt if you don’t understand the impact on Palestinians lives. Maybe you should learn the meaning of love and compassion.
Maybe some of these companies don’t agree with trump and neytenhau
Maybe this monstrosity were opposed to will be remembered in history as the right thing to do,and if not we’ll then….
F#€k your money
@John Murphy: You’re evil if you seriously think like that. I hope you don’t have any children, for their sake.
This is how Trump ‘reasons’, speaks and looks now. If he makes it through 4 years, it is hard to imagine how further gone his mind, articulation and make-up will be. Also hard to anticipate how many of his great administration members and advisers he will throw under the bus to avoid having to every take responsibility. The Trump Show is a one man show. No one else can take the spotlight, unless it’s to cover Trump’s ass.
Any politician who is advocating the OTB to be enacted immediately is a direct threat to this country. If they truly believe cutting €1.5 million in annual trade with the disputed territories is worth risking billions in corporation taxes, FDI. etc. than they should be laughed at and ignored. US owned companies provide 80+% of our CT receipts and support around 300,000 jobs here. The bill will not benefit a single Palestinian either. It would be an act of monumental national self-harm, just to phuk over the Israelis. Buyer beware.
@honey badger: Sometimes you have to stand up for what is right and against evil. The 1930’s are being reenacted again, just different entities. Trump is the new Hitler.
@Con Cussed: Trump is ogre, no debate there. I’d just prefer we didn’t risk billions and jobs on a bill that does nothing for those it’s supposed to support. You can support Palestinians without risking the economy.
@honey badger: Supporting OTB sends a clear message of the importance of doing the right thing.
@honey badger: The likes of Paul Murphy and McDonald will still have their Dáil seat or a healthy pension and the unemployed will be left to fend for themselves. When the Palestinians start arriving en masse will they get a céad mile fáilte
@honey badger: badger:Alternatively, there’s being on the right side of history and not kowtowing to a psychopathic narcissist also. He has been threatening to pull the multinationals since the beginning of his first term. Signing the bill or not signing it won’t prevent that from happening if he really wants to do it. I doubt every company would up and leave at his behest either. There are a lot of other factors to consider beyond low corporation tax.
@Con Cussed: it sends a clear message that were soft supporters of Hamas.
@honey badger: well said. When jobs are lost and goods increased in price, the same do gooder lefties will complain and blame others. Most want to put their picture on social media of themselves at a March sporting a Palestinian flag shouting from the river to the sea…with no idea of economics. They also have no idea of how the people of Palestine are living, if they cared, bring them over, give them a room in your house, volunteer in Palestine with a ngo to support them in their country.
@honey badger: if this BS flies, there is no international law, the UN means nothing, the ICC means nothing, might is right, the dollar is all, the bible rules.
How far have we evolved.
You say this isn’t a threat to everyone, everywhere.
Gonna set a great precedent.
Even the crazy Austrian moustache man nor putin claimed to be creating Rivieras when they were invading / demolishing all around them.
@honey badger: Any individual, such as yourself, who ignored/excused the blatantly obvious slaughter and destruction of an entire country is a threat to humanity. You spent over a year now defending Isreali actions .. even though it was blatantly obvious, and spelt out you over and over, that it was a precursor to the this day.. The official announcement of ethnic cleansing. You can’t even bring yourself to acknowledge that. You were wrong. You continue to be wrong .. and morally bereft people like you will always be wrong. Even after the latest affront to world order in trying to sanction the ICC.. you still hold steadfast in your absolute moronic drivel. The OTB is the least of our problems with clowns like you advocating lying down to these Cnts. You’re a complete and utter headbanger
@honey badger: if Irelands wants to survive it needs to plan ahead for 20 plus years. At that stage USA will be a basket case in financial ruin having been destroyed from within, certainly a pale imitation of what it projects now whereas BRICIS will be in charge so I say we need to be brave, independent minded, creative and most importantly honest and fair so those many small weak and vulnerable nations and customers know our values mean something tangible and not the hegemonic exploiters of others. Values count and we should stand up for ours without prevarication.
@honey badger: think outside the box think positive and be brave
@Thomas Sheridan: and John Hume was an IRA man. Go back to sleep, Thomas.
Load of bollocks
@Barry Spoon: is that the best you have Barry
McDonough is respected around the world..just don’t comment anymore please
@Barry Spoon: You certain spout enough of it.
@David Cotter: he’s a virtue signalling nobody
@Barry Spoon: yes your comments are
A very balanced article on a complex and difficult issue that reinforces the need for a Government to weigh up all sides when entrusted with future of our country. I await the abuse that will now come my way…….
@Tasty k: your right but there’s a deeper game going on here..
Yea we could bend the knee to trump and the Israel powerhouses of finance and media but there’s a monstrous injustice being done and we could be on the right side of history this time
@David Cotter: any focus on Ireland and self interest has to take into account the self interest of multinationals. Why would they leave here? This assumption that they would go at the drop of a hat and create mass unemployment here is really questionable. Why would they risk their profits over Irelands attitude to genocide?
@John Murphy: I support HAMAs. Top lads. Even some of the Israeli prisoners seemed to like them.
Just STOP aligning us with that dysfunctional rabble. Some won’t be satisfied until we alienate all our civilised trading partners and flood the country with islamic militants. our economy out the window.
It’s not our dispute, and it’s not even unique in the world – apart from the fact that vast sums of wealth have been wasted on in a rutile attempt to buy peace.
@Thomas Sheridan: dysfunctional rabble… living in rubble just about. Where is your humanity? Imagine you had to exist like they have had to for 70 odd years. Irelands complains of its lengthy history of oppression and we are not comfortable enough to ignore a hideous plight because you deem them rabble. Shane on you and your horrible pro Israeli thieving murderous bias.
@John Murphy: “couldn’t give a toss about any Muslim”. So what’s the religious criteria of person for you to give a toss about them?
Controversial but Ireland has our own problems to deal with, why bring in more people who will need supports, mental, physical, emotional and money, when the country does not have adequate services for the people already here.
It has shown how out of touch that Sinn Fein are that they bring up Palestine in the first few weeks of government when our hospital services are on their knees, our education system is not fit for children who have additional needs, we have 14000 people homeless, with over 30000 aslyum seekers in state funded accommodation that is not suitable. Palestine is next to some of the riches counties in the Middle East
@Mary Kelly: yea we’ve issues Mary. But we don’t have 26000 dead civilians and 18000 dead children and a pile of rubble for a country…the richest country of all is next to Palestine…that country is Israel..
@David Cotter: the Saudi counties, Jordan all wealthy countries? The uk created Isreal with the Balfour agreement, where are UK government? The USA is funding Isreal. We can provide financial aide and support to Palestine, but the EU and other nations as a whole need to push back on Isreal.
The country is dealing with the aftermath of a storm that happened 3 weeks ago for one day, what makes our government think we can solve another countries problem when we are own country had left it’s vulnerable behind and services can’t cope with a one day storm!!
@Mary Kelly: First world problems
@John Murphy: I would love to join Hamas, do you know a way of getting into Gaza?
It’s a farcical bill that should have never happened in the first place. Simon Harris already got a clip around the ear before the election for his vitriolic anti-Israel nonsense. This government has embarrassed itself by continuously spouting uneducated pro-Hamas talking points. The bill is simply an act of legislative fiction which has no basis in either history or reality. This isn’t about international law or justice, it’s about pandering to radical Islamism while ignoring both history and reality. You cannot “occupy” land that is rightfully yours. The 1922 League of Nations (United Nations) San Remo Conference clearly outlined that Israel’s borders would stretch from the Mediterranean to the Jordan River undivided within the British Mandate in the Middle East.
@William Jennings: agree, it’s the opposition trying to appease the media and social media following.
@William Jennings: really William “the British mandate”. Maybe we should have kept the British mandate here in Ireland too. Wish we could have Had Borris and truss as our leaders…..
@David Cotter: That’s the correct term for what the area was known as after Britain took over parts of the Middle East after the Ottoman Empire was dissolved when they fought on the losing side in World War I. I don’t know why you take issue with a factual label for what the region was called. The San Remo Conference divided up the British Mandate into a Jewish State and an Arab State. The Jewish State would make up 23% of the land and would have borders from the Mediterranean to the Jordan River. The other 77% of the land in the British Mandate would make up the Arab State which would be called Transjordan and would have borders from the Jordan River to the edge of the British Mandate of Mesopotamia (now modern-day Iraq). Try to learn some basic history David before shooting your mouth.
@William Jennings: Let the history books remember this racist denier.
@William Jennings: The Bill happened because Ireland, unlike Zionist occupied Palestine is a democracy. Unlike the Zionists we are not genocidal fascists and actually care about the welfare of our fellow men. I think it’s called Christianity.
@William Jennings: League of Nations did not survive too long and has absolutely no legitimacy of any kind
@PhiBo: humane and decent but also Christian
@William Jennings: excellent post
@William Jennings: self-determination is a term applying to people who have chosen rule their own country. Ireland did it and Israel did it however the Palestinians have been prevented from establishing their own state (to which they are fully entitled) for decades by US gaslighting and complicit western states to oblige the terrorist state next door that wants their land too but without Palestinians in it. Israel is aided and abetted by the west. It’s ethnocentric, practices apartheid, supports settlers killing and stealing neighbours property, its military censors all foreign journalists and Israel is infested with psychopaths such as Ben Gvir and Smotrich who use hate speech openly.
@PhiBo: Stop embarrassing yourself, you’ve clearly never read a history book in your entire life. Jewish people cannot possibly be “occupying” the land because all Jewish people are indigenous to the land and originally come from Judea. There was never any independent country called “Palestine” and that was simply a colonial label placed on the region by the British after they took it over in 1918 when the Ottoman Empire collapsed. Before that, the region was known as Southern Syria. Once Israel gained independence in 1948, they turned the area of the British Mandate that they had been granted into a democracy with equal rights for all people. By the way, the only “genocide” going on is the imaginary one in your head. The Arab population has grown by 2% every year since 1948.
@John G: It’s decisions absolutely do have legitimacy and it’s now called the United Nations so saying that it “didn’t survive” is simply incorrect. The League of Nations is the old name for the United Nations and they served the exact same purpose. Changing your name in a structural rebranding in 1946 doesn’t diminish historical facts. Israel was granted 23% of the British Mandate and their borders were to stretch from the Mediterranean to the Jordan River. It doesn’t matter if you’re offended by that, it’s the decision that was handed down based on the fact that there should be one Arab State (Transjordan) and one Jewish State (Israel).
@John G: So many lies from you John is actually laughable. “Palestinians” do not have a right to self-determination because they are not indigenous to Israel, Jewish people are. They are a made-up ethnic group that was only created in 1964. They are really just ethnic Egyptians and Jordanians who migrated to the Holy Land primarily between the years of 1890-1935 when the territorial borders of the Ottoman Empire and later the British Mandate were completely open between provinces. Look at their surnames. The 20 most common ones are either of Egyptian or Jordanian origin. The “Palestinians” don’t have a distinct Arabic dialect as every other Arabic group does. Those in Gaza speak the Egyptian dialect and those in Judea and Samaria (West Bank) speak the Jordanian dialect.
@John G: They were already given their own Arab State in 1922. As I already mentioned above, this would make up 77% of the British Mandate. It’s called Jordan (previously Transjordan) and the “Palestinians” could easily move tomorrow if they wanted to. You don’t have a right to start demanding that a country (Israel) has to start carving up its own territory to give a country to you when you never had a proper claim to the land in the first place. The international law principle of Uti Possidetis Juris clearly outlines this fact. Israel is under no obligation to carve up any of the land inside their borders to give to a group of people that have no genuine or legitimate claim to the land in question. Israel has chosen to rule their own country just like Ireland. Why don’t you respect that?
@John G: Israel is not “ethnocentric” because 20% of its population are Arabs which enjoy the exact same rights as the Jewish, Druze, Circassian, Bedouin or any other ethnic group that lives in Israel. There’s no such thing as “settlers” because they are simply living in the land that they were ethnically cleansed from by the Jordanian army in 1948 that Israel reclaimed in 1967. Israel also does not practice “apartheid” because in order for that to be possible, there would have to be a different set of laws for different citizens, which is not the case. The claim of “apartheid” does not apply to “Palestinians” because they are not Israeli citizens by choice, just like Ireland doesn’t practice “apartheid” because non-citizens do not have the same rights as Irish citizens.
@William Jennings: no all Jewish people are not by any means indigenous to Israel and many openly acknowledge that fact. European origin Jews never came from Israel and 2000 years ago does not entitle former residents to take present residents lives or property under that mad assertion. That sort of delusional talk is for the birds
@John G:
They were offered their own state and refused it.
@John G: Yes John, all Jewish people are indigenous to Israel because they all originally come from Judea. Ashkenazi and Sephardic Jews are just as indigenous as Mizrahi Jews. They are all descended from the same Twelve Tribes. Jewish people always had a continuous presence in the Holy Land and the Arabs have no right to continually hold onto land and property that they stole from Jewish people through the hundreds of pogroms that they committed against them. The only person who is for the birds is yourself.
The Palestinians have only themselves to blame for their plight. Israel will annex the West Bank within the next five years.
@John Duggan: Really !!! the Zionist Palestinian extermination project started 76 years ago
@John Duggan: no they don’t. Israel’s founders stole Israel from the natives and set up an apartheid ethnostate which oppresses the natives who are probably equal in numbers despite the imports from other countries of the self ‘entitled’ rulers in the ‘democracy.’. Those founders have used terrorism to set up that state and their successors continue to do so. Snipers shooting children in the head and heart is official military policy don’t you know? Letting that sort of behaviour out into the world makes it a horrible place so consider Israel is a pariah and a threat to peace here and everywhere else too not just the Middle East.
If you don’t want to trade with the occupied territories then don’t trade with the occupied territories. Why do you need a law for that?
Both sides are as bad as one and other, stop taking sides. We have our own problems, and stop giving them our money let the rich Arab states look after them.
Give the Palestinians a homeland in Syria, it’s big enough. Everyone will be happy.
@Dan Murphy: So they can be attacked in Syria as well as their homeland by Israel, soft lad.
Government’s hand up you.
Ireland is getting no solidarity from other EU countries on the issue of Gaza.
This shows how weak the EU countries are when standing up to US and Israeli aggression.
Ireland should not go alone on this Bill without the support of other EU countries.
@Peter McCormack:
No, it shows that they are not stupid, and are not being led by dopes.
The bill needs tweaking so that it fits into ours and EU policy. As if he make a big stand on it, we are targeted straight away.
That has already happened with Israel constantly attacking us but Norway or Spain or South Africa who have all done and said the same thing.
A bill is needed but it has to be airtight and that take time, the original bill was rushed. Which left us isolated and easier to attack.
have your say